Fruit vs the root....

Dave the Spammer said:

Ginseng is food. It cannot harm you or conflict with medications,
because it is food.

THAT IS NOT TRUE. Quoting from:
http://www.people.virginia.edu/~smb4v/pedpharm/v4n5.htm

Ginseng is contraindicated in asthma, renal failure, Stage 2 or
higher hypertension, acute inflammatory or infectious diseases,
bronchitis and emphysema, chronic diseases of the gastrointestinal
tract (i.e., diverticulitis, gastroesophageal reflux disease),
heart failure, arrhythmias, edema, insomnia, anxiety, pregnancy,
and breast-feeding. Reported adverse effects of ginseng include
insomnia, nervousness, excitation, diarrhea, and skin disorders.

Little is known about drug interactions with ginseng; however,
the literature contains two case reports describing ginseng drug
interactions. A patient previously well controlled on warfarin
therapy experienced a loss of anticoagulant control (subtherapeutic
INR) after the initiation of ginseng. In addition, a patient
taking both ginseng and digoxin experienced an elevated digoxin
level. Because objective scientific data documenting therapeutic
benefits of ginseng are lacking, the role of ginseng as a
legitimate therapeutic agent is neither established nor accepted
by the medical community.

Dave is probably too blinded by his beliefs to realize that if ginseng
can have a postive effect in diabetics, it probably has pharmaceutical
activities and is therefore a drug, not strictly a food.

In article <[email hidden]>,

Dave said:

Dave's note: they need to dig a little deeper.....

By Salynn Boyles
WebMD Medical News

May 24, 2002 -- An extract from the ginseng berry may one day help diabetics
with their two greatest challenges: blood sugar control and weight control.

"Since this berry contains agents that are effective against both obesity
and diabetes, the ginseng fruit has enormous promise as a source of new
drugs," says study director Chun-Su Yuan, MD, PhD, of the University of
Chicago's Tang Center for Herbal Medicine Research, in a news release.

For years, doctors have been looking for newer and better treatments for
obesity and diabetes. Often, the two conditions occur together. Diabetes is
the seventh leading cause of death in the U.S. Type 2 diabetes,
characterized by an inability to use the hormone insulin effectively (a
phenomenon called insulin resistance), is the most common form, affecting
nearly 6% of the population. And those numbers are rising, possibly due to
rising obesity in the U.S.

In recent years, scientists have identified a substance in the popular
supplement made from ginseng root that can help stabilize blood sugar levels
in diabetics. Now, doctors have found that an extract from the berry of the
ginseng plant is even more potent -- at least in animals.

The study is published in the June issue of Diabetes, a journal from the
American Diabetes Association.

--
Orac |"A statement of fact cannot be insolent."
|
|"If you cannot listen to the answers, why do you
| inconvenience me with questions?"

"Orac" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Dave is probably too blinded by his beliefs to realize that if ginseng
can have a postive effect in diabetics, it probably has pharmaceutical
activities and is therefore a drug, not strictly a food.

You can relax I won't be selling it in the U.S. The FDA has already stopped
it.

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>,

Dave said:

Dave's note: they need to dig a little deeper.....

By Salynn Boyles
WebMD Medical News

May 24, 2002 -- An extract from the ginseng berry may one day help

diabetics

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

with their two greatest challenges: blood sugar control and weight

control.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

"Since this berry contains agents that are effective against both

obesity

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

and diabetes, the ginseng fruit has enormous promise as a source of new
drugs," says study director Chun-Su Yuan, MD, PhD, of the University of
Chicago's Tang Center for Herbal Medicine Research, in a news release.

For years, doctors have been looking for newer and better treatments for
obesity and diabetes. Often, the two conditions occur together. Diabetes

is

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

the seventh leading cause of death in the U.S. Type 2 diabetes,
characterized by an inability to use the hormone insulin effectively (a
phenomenon called insulin resistance), is the most common form,

affecting

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

nearly 6% of the population. And those numbers are rising, possibly due

to

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

rising obesity in the U.S.

In recent years, scientists have identified a substance in the popular
supplement made from ginseng root that can help stabilize blood sugar

levels

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

in diabetics. Now, doctors have found that an extract from the berry of

the

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

ginseng plant is even more potent -- at least in animals.

The study is published in the June issue of Diabetes, a journal from the
American Diabetes Association.

--
Orac |"A statement of fact cannot be insolent."
|
|"If you cannot listen to the answers, why do you
| inconvenience me with questions?"

Then by that definition vitamin c would be a drug also.
Anth

"Orac" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Dave is probably too blinded by his beliefs to realize that if ginseng
can have a postive effect in diabetics, it probably has pharmaceutical
activities and is therefore a drug, not strictly a food.

In article <[email hidden]>,

Dave said:

Dave's note: they need to dig a little deeper.....

By Salynn Boyles
WebMD Medical News

May 24, 2002 -- An extract from the ginseng berry may one day help

diabetics

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

with their two greatest challenges: blood sugar control and weight

control.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

"Since this berry contains agents that are effective against both

obesity

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

and diabetes, the ginseng fruit has enormous promise as a source of new
drugs," says study director Chun-Su Yuan, MD, PhD, of the University of
Chicago's Tang Center for Herbal Medicine Research, in a news release.

For years, doctors have been looking for newer and better treatments for
obesity and diabetes. Often, the two conditions occur together. Diabetes

is

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

the seventh leading cause of death in the U.S. Type 2 diabetes,
characterized by an inability to use the hormone insulin effectively (a
phenomenon called insulin resistance), is the most common form,

affecting

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

nearly 6% of the population. And those numbers are rising, possibly due

to

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

rising obesity in the U.S.

In recent years, scientists have identified a substance in the popular
supplement made from ginseng root that can help stabilize blood sugar

levels

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

in diabetics. Now, doctors have found that an extract from the berry of

the

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

ginseng plant is even more potent -- at least in animals.

The study is published in the June issue of Diabetes, a journal from the
American Diabetes Association.

--
Orac |"A statement of fact cannot be insolent."
|
|"If you cannot listen to the answers, why do you
| inconvenience me with questions?"

Dave the Spammer said:

You can relax I won't be selling it in the U.S.
The FDA has already stopped it.

For very good reasons -- quintozene and tecnazene fungicide
residues which have been found in the Bing Han product
despite the "organic" claim. How did these synthetic chemicals
get into an "organic" product?

Quoted message said:

Subject: Re: Fruit vs the root....
From: "Dave" [email hidden]
Date: 9/27/2003 6:09 PM Pacific Daylight Time
Message-id: <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

You can relax I won't be selling it in the U.S. The FDA has already stopped
it.

not what you said the other day....story changes to meet the threat to you....

BTW....how about the statement you made about how it has passed all the tests
to "get into this country?"...which was proven that it hasn't...

bad news in the past 24 hours??? or got your foot in your mouth??

hawki

"Hawki63" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Subject: Re: Fruit vs the root....
From: "Dave" [email hidden]
Date: 9/27/2003 6:09 PM Pacific Daylight Time
Message-id: <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

You can relax I won't be selling it in the U.S. The FDA has already

stopped

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

it.

not what you said the other day....story changes to meet the threat to

you....

Quoted message said:

BTW....how about the statement you made about how it has passed all the

tests

Quoted message said:

to "get into this country?"...which was proven that it hasn't...

bad news in the past 24 hours??? or got your foot in your mouth??

hawki

Lets just say, it is not your affair, now is it?

In article <[email hidden]>,

Anth said:

Then by that definition vitamin c would be a drug also.

Wrong. Vitamins are essential to life and health. In contrast, Ginseng
is not necessary to maintain health. A person can go his entire life
without ingesting even a milligram of ginseng and live quite a healthy
life. Not so vitamin C.

Quoted message said:

"Orac" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Dave is probably too blinded by his beliefs to realize that if ginseng
can have a postive effect in diabetics, it probably has pharmaceutical
activities and is therefore a drug, not strictly a food.

In article <[email hidden]>,

Dave said:

Dave's note: they need to dig a little deeper.....

By Salynn Boyles
WebMD Medical News

May 24, 2002 -- An extract from the ginseng berry may one day help

diabetics

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

with their two greatest challenges: blood sugar control and weight

control.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

"Since this berry contains agents that are effective against both

obesity

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

and diabetes, the ginseng fruit has enormous promise as a source of new
drugs," says study director Chun-Su Yuan, MD, PhD, of the University of
Chicago's Tang Center for Herbal Medicine Research, in a news release.

For years, doctors have been looking for newer and better treatments for
obesity and diabetes. Often, the two conditions occur together. Diabetes

is

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

the seventh leading cause of death in the U.S. Type 2 diabetes,
characterized by an inability to use the hormone insulin effectively (a
phenomenon called insulin resistance), is the most common form,

affecting

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

nearly 6% of the population. And those numbers are rising, possibly due

to

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

rising obesity in the U.S.

In recent years, scientists have identified a substance in the popular
supplement made from ginseng root that can help stabilize blood sugar

levels

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

in diabetics. Now, doctors have found that an extract from the berry of

the

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

ginseng plant is even more potent -- at least in animals.

The study is published in the June issue of Diabetes, a journal from the
American Diabetes Association.

--
Orac |"A statement of fact cannot be insolent."
|
|"If you cannot listen to the answers, why do you
| inconvenience me with questions?"

In article <[email hidden]>,

Dave said:

"Orac" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Dave is probably too blinded by his beliefs to realize that if ginseng
can have a postive effect in diabetics, it probably has pharmaceutical
activities and is therefore a drug, not strictly a food.

You can relax I won't be selling it in the U.S. The FDA has already stopped
it.

Good. I'm glad my tax dollars are going to fund something useful--like
the FDA.

--
Orac |"A statement of fact cannot be insolent."
|
|"If you cannot listen to the answers, why do you
| inconvenience me with questions?"

Quoted message said:

"Orac" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Dave is probably too blinded by his beliefs to realize that if ginseng
can have a postive effect in diabetics, it probably has pharmaceutical
activities and is therefore a drug, not strictly a food.

You can relax I won't be selling it in the U.S. The FDA has already stopped
it.

All it took was one phone call....and I've got two lines standing by.

Also wrong, by definition anything that's used to treat a disease is a drug.
Using Ginseng to treat a specific disease means you have then crossed the
drug barrier.
Anth

http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=drug
A substance used in the diagnosis, treatment, or prevention of a disease or
as a component of a medication.

"Orac" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>,

Anth said:

Then by that definition vitamin c would be a drug also.

Wrong. Vitamins are essential to life and health. In contrast, Ginseng
is not necessary to maintain health. A person can go his entire life
without ingesting even a milligram of ginseng and live quite a healthy
life. Not so vitamin C.

Quoted message said:

"Orac" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Dave is probably too blinded by his beliefs to realize that if ginseng
can have a postive effect in diabetics, it probably has pharmaceutical
activities and is therefore a drug, not strictly a food.

In article <[email hidden]>,
"Dave" <[email hidden]> wrote:

> Dave's note: they need to dig a little deeper.....
>
>
>
> By Salynn Boyles
> WebMD Medical News
>
> May 24, 2002 -- An extract from the ginseng berry may one day help

diabetics

Quoted message said:

> with their two greatest challenges: blood sugar control and weight

control.

Quoted message said:

>
>
> "Since this berry contains agents that are effective against both

obesity

Quoted message said:

> and diabetes, the ginseng fruit has enormous promise as a source of

new

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> drugs," says study director Chun-Su Yuan, MD, PhD, of the University

of

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> Chicago's Tang Center for Herbal Medicine Research, in a news

release.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>
>
> For years, doctors have been looking for newer and better treatments

for

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> obesity and diabetes. Often, the two conditions occur together.

Diabetes

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

is

Quoted message said:

> the seventh leading cause of death in the U.S. Type 2 diabetes,
> characterized by an inability to use the hormone insulin effectively

(a

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> phenomenon called insulin resistance), is the most common form,

affecting

Quoted message said:

> nearly 6% of the population. And those numbers are rising, possibly

due

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

to

Quoted message said:

> rising obesity in the U.S.
>
>
> In recent years, scientists have identified a substance in the

popular

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> supplement made from ginseng root that can help stabilize blood

sugar

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

levels

Quoted message said:

> in diabetics. Now, doctors have found that an extract from the berry

of

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

the

Quoted message said:

> ginseng plant is even more potent -- at least in animals.
>
>
> The study is published in the June issue of Diabetes, a journal from

the

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> American Diabetes Association.

--
Orac |"A statement of fact cannot be insolent."
|
|"If you cannot listen to the answers, why do you
| inconvenience me with questions?"

Quoted message said:

"Hawki63" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Subject: Re: Fruit vs the root....
From: "Dave" [email hidden]
Date: 9/27/2003 6:09 PM Pacific Daylight Time
Message-id: <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

You can relax I won't be selling it in the U.S. The FDA has already

stopped

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

it.

not what you said the other day....story changes to meet the threat to

you....

Quoted message said:

BTW....how about the statement you made about how it has passed all the

tests

Quoted message said:

to "get into this country?"...which was proven that it hasn't...

bad news in the past 24 hours??? or got your foot in your mouth??

Its more accurate to say he has (had) his head up his ass, thus has been
talking out of the same orifice.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

hawki

Lets just say, it is not your affair, now is it?

Let's just say you can't fight truth, justice, and the FDA. Your product is
contaminated and the good people of the USA deserve better!

Quoted message said:

Then by that definition vitamin c would be a drug also.
Anth

Only if you consider scurvy a disease! *****SPLORFFFFFF*******!

Quoted message said:

"Orac" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Dave is probably too blinded by his beliefs to realize that if ginseng
can have a postive effect in diabetics, it probably has pharmaceutical
activities and is therefore a drug, not strictly a food.

Quoted message said:

Subject: Re: Fruit vs the root....
From: "Dave" [email hidden]
Date: 9/27/2003 6:34 PM Pacific Standard Time
Message-id: <[email hidden]>

"Hawki63" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Subject: Re: Fruit vs the root....
From: "Dave" [email hidden]
Date: 9/27/2003 6:09 PM Pacific Daylight Time
Message-id: <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

You can relax I won't be selling it in the U.S. The FDA has already

stopped

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

it.

not what you said the other day....story changes to meet the threat to

you....

Quoted message said:

BTW....how about the statement you made about how it has passed all the

tests

Quoted message said:

to "get into this country?"...which was proven that it hasn't...

bad news in the past 24 hours??? or got your foot in your mouth??

hawki

Lets just say, it is not your affair, now is it?

hawki must be Andrew/fake iIsa's sister.

Jan

"Ilsa9" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

"Orac" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Dave is probably too blinded by his beliefs to realize that if ginseng
can have a postive effect in diabetics, it probably has pharmaceutical
activities and is therefore a drug, not strictly a food.

You can relax I won't be selling it in the U.S. The FDA has already

stopped

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

it.

All it took was one phone call....and I've got two lines standing by.

Hey, careful or you'll make us think you are a real power broker! LOL

"Ilsa9" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

"Hawki63" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

>Subject: Re: Fruit vs the root....
>From: "Dave" [email hidden]
>Date: 9/27/2003 6:09 PM Pacific Daylight Time
>Message-id: <[email hidden]>
>

>You can relax I won't be selling it in the U.S. The FDA has already

stopped

Quoted message said:

>it.
>

not what you said the other day....story changes to meet the threat to

you....

Quoted message said:

BTW....how about the statement you made about how it has passed all the

tests

Quoted message said:

to "get into this country?"...which was proven that it hasn't...

bad news in the past 24 hours??? or got your foot in your mouth??

Its more accurate to say he has (had) his head up his ass, thus has been
talking out of the same orifice.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

hawki

Lets just say, it is not your affair, now is it?

Let's just say you can't fight truth, justice, and the FDA. Your product

is

Quoted message said:

contaminated and the good people of the USA deserve better!

Then you are in luck.

Quoted message said:

Subject: Re: Fruit vs the root....
From: [email hidden] (Ilsa9)
Date: 9/27/2003 8:05 PM Pacific Daylight Time
Message-id: <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

You can relax I won't be selling it in the U.S. The FDA has already stopped
it.

All it took was one phone call....and I've got two lines standing by.

lol lol lol

whatsamatter Daveyglowlife....

thought you'd get away with it??

told you I would get to the FDA...funny how quickly they can react,,,eh???

hawki

In article <[email hidden]>,

Anth said:

Also wrong, by definition anything that's used to treat a disease is a drug.
Using Ginseng to treat a specific disease means you have then crossed the
drug barrier.

I think you're being a bit too simplistic here, so I'll try to explain.
Vitamins can be drugs in some clinical situations, but most drugs are
NOT vitamins. Vitamins BY DEFINITION are essential to human life, and
the conditions treated by vitamins are for the most part conditions that
result from a deficiency of those vitamins, like scurvy resulting from
inadequate vitamin C intake. Drugs are not essential to human life, nor
do they perform the same functions as vitamins. Indeed, some drugs are
antagonistic to certain vitamins (for instance, vitamin K reverses the
effects of coumadin, which itself blocks the synthesis of vitamin
K-dependend clotting factors).

--
Orac |"A statement of fact cannot be insolent."
|
|"If you cannot listen to the answers, why do you
| inconvenience me with questions?"

Orac <[email hidden]> wrote in
news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

I think you're being a bit too simplistic here, so I'll try to
explain. Vitamins can be drugs in some clinical situations, but most
drugs are NOT vitamins. Vitamins BY DEFINITION are essential to human
life, and the conditions treated by vitamins are for the most part
conditions that result from a deficiency of those vitamins, like
scurvy resulting from inadequate vitamin C intake. Drugs are not
essential to human life, nor do they perform the same functions as
vitamins. Indeed, some drugs are antagonistic to certain vitamins (for
instance, vitamin K reverses the effects of coumadin, which itself
blocks the synthesis of vitamin K-dependend clotting factors).

A good example of the subtlety of the distinction is the use of high-dose
niacin to treat dyslipidemia. The cholesterol-lowering effect is actually
a drug effect, not a nutritional effect, because it's not due to increased
availability of substrate for producing NAD and NADP, whereas the
nutritional effect of niacin *is* to provide substrate for NAD and NADP.
There's also the fact that the therapeutic effect occurs only at doses that
are much larger than anyone could obtain from food alone.