Coyotes

"Diablo Scott" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:1097692590.Pg+hlVjIN1Er/iLVUjnLcA@teranews...

Quoted message said:

I've always seen coyotes on my rides around here. They usually just
watch you go by, they usually aren't frightened, they usually don't run
away, they usually hold their ground even though you come pretty close
to them. Sometimes they'll run alongside you for a while, hoping you'll
scare up a squirrel for them to catch. I've seen them easily chase down
and catch jack rabbits. I've never been scared of them but their
numbers are increasing and news stories from nearby say they're getting
more aggressive too… feeding on cats and dogs, stalking children. I
wonder what would happen in a bike-coyote collision - would the coyote
run away in a panic? or attack in defense?

Well, at least they're not mountain lions.

--
My bike blog:
http://diabloscott.blogspot.com/

Where is "around here?"

We have coyotes galore here in rural western South Carolina. The only time
you see them is every now an then around sunset. But at night, when the
trains go by on the nearby tracks, that sets them off and you can hear them
howling for miles. There must be hundreds of them. I've never seen one on
a bike ride.

They'll eat chickens, small dogs and cats. Cattlemen and horsemen hate them
because they'll kill newborn calves and colts -- if the vultures don't get
them first. I've never heard of any attacks on humans. But I wouldn't
tempt fate by walking down in my woods around here in the dark of night.

Bob C.

Diablo Scott said:

I've always seen coyotes on my rides around here. They usually just
watch you go by, they usually aren't frightened, they usually don't run
away, they usually hold their ground even though you come pretty close
to them. Sometimes they'll run alongside you for a while, hoping you'll
scare up a squirrel for them to catch. I've seen them easily chase down
and catch jack rabbits. I've never been scared of them but their
numbers are increasing and news stories from nearby say they're getting
more aggressive too… feeding on cats and dogs, stalking children. I
wonder what would happen in a bike-coyote collision - would the coyote
run away in a panic? or attack in defense?

Well, at least they're not mountain lions.

Where are you? No point in posting for info and then leaving out any
info that may help you.

Anyway, the coyote is now a danger to humans. The mountain variety goes
50lbs so it can rip your throat out just like any dog can. Here is a
good article including the warning that you may be killed by these dogs
at any moment.

http://www.desertusa.com/june96/du_cycot.html

HEre is one line:

"Children and adults being bitten by coyotes in California, Arizona and
other states."

Enjoy your ride.

Paul Cassel said:

Where are you? No point in posting for info and then leaving out any
info that may help you.

Anyway, the coyote is now a danger to humans. The mountain variety goes
50lbs so it can rip your throat out just like any dog can. Here is a
good article including the warning that you may be killed by these dogs
at any moment.

http://www.desertusa.com/june96/du_cycot.html

HEre is one line:

"Children and adults being bitten by coyotes in California, Arizona and
other states."

Enjoy your ride.

Read the article and it doesn't make the points that you do, unless I
missed a second page. The danger of being bitten was in conjunction
with the comments about coyotes begging. IOW, when you give food to a
hungry animal, there will be mistakes. I had a 30 pound mutt that left
teeth marks on me all the time once her eyesight started to fail. She
figured correctly that the treat was somewhere in the vicinity of the
hand and it was up to me to let go quickly enough.

I saw no comments about throats being ripped out - to the contrary,
the comments at several points made it clear that there is relatively
little danger to man and the increased fearlessness of the coyote is
leading to increased risk to the coyote.

50 pound predators will rarely attack 120-240 pound omnivores when
there are so many smaller animals closer in size to their natural prey
in any area with humans. Small dogs in yards with electronic fences
are a good source of food - after all, the electronic fence only keeps
the dog in. It doesn't keep other dogs or coyotes out.

Curtis L. Russell
Odenton, MD (USA)
Just someone on two wheels...

Paul Cassel said:

Where are you? No point in posting for info and then leaving out any
info that may help you.

Anyway, the coyote is now a danger to humans. The mountain variety goes
50lbs so it can rip your throat out just like any dog can. Here is a
good article including the warning that you may be killed by these dogs
at any moment.

http://www.desertusa.com/june96/du_cycot.html

HEre is one line:

"Children and adults being bitten by coyotes in California, Arizona and
other states."

Enjoy your ride.

I'm near San Francisco in the East Bay - I ride mostly on Mt. Diablo (a
state park); as much as I love it here I didn't think that was relevant
to the topic. The recent news story is from the Silicon Valley area -
large estates for wealthy people built in areas that were until recently
undeveloped. Apparently a lot of the folks there put out food for feral
cats and deer and that of course attracts the coyotes too. Lots of
controversy over whether they should deal with the coyotes or the idiots.

I'm pretty sure no one is feeding the coyotes on Diablo though, and I
haven't heard about them raiding camp sites, but they're getting bolder
and more numerous anyway. I see at least one almost every ride, but not
always near the road.

I have no doubt one could rip my throat out given the opportunity and
desire, and I can find plenty of coyote web sites on my own. I was
interested in personal stories. Since I often see them dart across the
road I figure someone must have hit one or had some other close call.

--
My bike blog:
http://diabloscott.blogspot.com/

"Diablo Scott" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:1097692590.Pg+hlVjIN1Er/iLVUjnLcA@teranews...

Quoted message said:

I've always seen coyotes on my rides around here. They usually just
watch you go by, they usually aren't frightened, they usually don't run
away, they usually hold their ground even though you come pretty close
to them. Sometimes they'll run alongside you for a while, hoping you'll
scare up a squirrel for them to catch. I've seen them easily chase down
and catch jack rabbits. I've never been scared of them but their
numbers are increasing and news stories from nearby say they're getting
more aggressive too… feeding on cats and dogs, stalking children. I
wonder what would happen in a bike-coyote collision - would the coyote
run away in a panic? or attack in defense?

I've seen cayotes, mostly around dawn near the "undeveloped park" near my
house. Like you report, they just watch you go by. I suppose there could
more more lurking in the bushes, but who knows. They've never bothered me,
I've never bothered them.

When I was in college, I used to hike out from the campus out to a foothill
of the San Gabriels for meditation at dawn. Sometimes a pack of cayotes
would come by. I was pretty dull to them -- just a human sitting there --
and again, the "I don't bother you, you don't bother me" attitude was
something we shared.

--
Warm Regards,

Claire Petersky
please substitute yahoo for mousepotato to reply
Home of the meditative cyclist:
http://home.earthlink.net/~cpetersky/Welcome.htm
Personal page: http://www.geocities.com/cpetersky/
See the books I've set free at: http://bookcrossing.com/referral/Cpetersky

psycholist said:

"Diablo Scott" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:1097692590.Pg+hlVjIN1Er/iLVUjnLcA@teranews...

Quoted message said:

I've always seen coyotes on my rides around here. They usually just
watch you go by, they usually aren't frightened, they usually don't run
away, they usually hold their ground even though you come pretty close
to them. Sometimes they'll run alongside you for a while, hoping you'll
scare up a squirrel for them to catch. I've seen them easily chase down
and catch jack rabbits. I've never been scared of them but their
numbers are increasing and news stories from nearby say they're getting
more aggressive too… feeding on cats and dogs, stalking children. I
wonder what would happen in a bike-coyote collision - would the coyote
run away in a panic? or attack in defense?

Well, at least they're not mountain lions.

--
My bike blog:
http://diabloscott.blogspot.com/

Where is "around here?"

We have coyotes galore here in rural western South Carolina.

Coyotes have invaded the entire eastern US. What I heard was that they
couldn't cross the Mississippi River in any real numbers, so they
drifted north and east through Canada and then south. We have plenty of
them in upstate NY -- when I had sheep, I shot a number of coyotes and I
had to keep a flock guardian dog (130 lb Great Pyrenees [censored] -- she was
impressive).

Hate the buggers. Them and deer. Lots of people think deer are just
cute little bambis, but farmers are more practical -- deer = rats with
hooves.

-km

--
Only cowards fight kids -- unidentified Moscow protester

http://community.webshots.com/user/blackrosequilts
proud to be owned by a yorkie

the black rose wrote:
|| psycholist wrote:
||| "Diablo Scott" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
||| news:1097692590.Pg+hlVjIN1Er/iLVUjnLcA@teranews...
|||
|||| I've always seen coyotes on my rides around here. They usually
|||| just watch you go by, they usually aren't frightened, they usually
|||| don't run away, they usually hold their ground even though you
|||| come pretty close to them. Sometimes they'll run alongside you
|||| for a while, hoping you'll scare up a squirrel for them to catch.
|||| I've seen them easily chase down and catch jack rabbits. I've
|||| never been scared of them but their numbers are increasing and
|||| news stories from nearby say they're getting more aggressive too…
|||| feeding on cats and dogs, stalking children. I wonder what would
|||| happen in a bike-coyote collision - would the coyote run away in a
|||| panic? or attack in defense?
||||
|||| Well, at least they're not mountain lions.
||||
|||| --
|||| My bike blog:
|||| http://diabloscott.blogspot.com/
|||
|||
||| Where is "around here?"
|||
||| We have coyotes galore here in rural western South Carolina.
||
|| Coyotes have invaded the entire eastern US. What I heard was that
|| they couldn't cross the Mississippi River in any real numbers, so
|| they
|| drifted north and east through Canada and then south. We have
|| plenty of them in upstate NY -- when I had sheep, I shot a number of
|| coyotes and I had to keep a flock guardian dog (130 lb Great
|| Pyrenees [censored] -- she was impressive).
||
|| Hate the buggers. Them and deer. Lots of people think deer are just
|| cute little bambis, but farmers are more practical -- deer = rats
|| with hooves.

Well, I can't see eating a rat, but I'd be happy to have deer for supper, I
think.

||
|| -km
||
|| --
|| Only cowards fight kids -- unidentified Moscow protester
||
|| http://community.webshots.com/user/blackrosequilts
|| proud to be owned by a yorkie

I see coyotes occasionally in upstate NY. They have never been aggressive.

My biggest animal fear is having some stupid deer cross the road in front of me
while I'm descending at 40 mph.

Mike Yankee

(Address is munged to thwart spammers.
To reply, delete everything after "com".)

Diablo Scott said:

The recent news story is from the Silicon Valley area -
large estates for wealthy people built in areas that were until recently
undeveloped. Apparently a lot of the folks there put out food for feral
cats and deer and that of course attracts the coyotes too. Lots of
controversy over whether they should deal with the coyotes or the idiots.

god, california. out here in idaho we have the same problem. they're
building expensive homes for rich folk into the foothills around boise
which had been completely undeveloped.

the coyotes keep killing their precious cats & dogs.

much to idaho's credit the police won't do anything about it. of course you
can shoot the coyotes if you're so inclined this being idaho and all.

but for the most part people no longer leave their pets outside after dark.

way ot, it is a little unnerving taking the telescope up into the foothills.
i've taken to leaving the car stereo on fairly loud since i can't leave the
lights on. but you can "feel" them all around you. it is truly eery.
--
david reuteler
[email hidden]

Diablo Scott said:

Lots of
controversy over whether they should deal with the coyotes or the idiots.

Can't imagine what the controversy is. It is clearly more effective to
deal with the coyotes. They are smarter.

I agree with "Mike Yankee", though. Deer are the biggest danger to a
cyclist.

--

David L. Johnson

__o | Enron's slogan: Respect, Communication, Integrity, and
_`\(,_ | Excellence.
(_)/ (_) |

Quoted message said:

Diablo Scott [email hidden]

wrote in part:

Quoted message said:

I was
interested in personal stories. Since I often see them dart across the
road I figure someone must have hit one or had some other close call.

Coyotes are amazingly adaptable animals and no doubt if cornered they would
attack but I've never heard of even one instance of a coyote attacking an adult
human, least of all attacking one on a bicycle.
True story-
My house is surrounded on three sides by woods with a river running through the
woods south of my property. We have lots of deer, raccoons, possum, ducks,
geese, a few foxes, and about 20 or so (SWAG) coyotes. Three winters ago I was
sitting quietly by a feeder creek of that river in a natural blind just
watching the ducks and geese as they returned for the night. I heard a crashing
in the woods heading towards me. Since there were no dogs barking or people
screaming, I didn't need to be Daniel Boone to figure out that coyotes were
running a deer. About 5 seconds later a doe leapt the creek no more than 15
feet away from me, heading west. There was a pair of coyotes about a second
behind the doe. I stayed still as they crossed the creek. It took the pair two
jumps to get to the west bank and they barely slowed down. Another second or
two went by and a third coyote appeared. He looked like he was going to clear
the creek in one leap until I stood up suddenly and said in a loud voice,
"No!". It was one of the funnier things I've ever seen outdoors. He looked just
like Wile E. Coyote when he runs off a cliff and tries to run back in a
Roadrunner cartoon. He'd almost managed to swap ends before he hit the water.
Not to anthropomorphize him but I'm sure if he could he'd still be telling all
his friends, "All of a sudden this *human* appeared and scared me almost out of
my skin! I'm lucky to be alive!". <g>

Regards,
Bob Hunt

Quoted message said:

[email hidden] (MikeYankee)

Quoted message said:

I see coyotes occasionally in upstate NY. They have never been aggressive.

My biggest animal fear is having some stupid deer cross the road in front of
me
while I'm descending at 40 mph.

While I agree with you completely I can't help but wonder- what if that deer
decided to cross in front of you when you are *ascending* at 40 mph? <g>

Regards,
Bob Hunt

MikeYankee said:

I see coyotes occasionally in upstate NY. They have never been aggressive.

My biggest animal fear is having some stupid deer cross the road in front of me
while I'm descending at 40 mph.

around here (boise) it's alpine cows grazing on BLM land. and they don't
so much cross as stand in the middle of. for hours on end.
--
david reuteler
[email hidden]

The following is forwarded without permission of the author (mainly
because I got it from someone else, and I don't know who the author is):

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Dave

-------------- Forwarded Message: --------------
From: cynthia
Subject: wily coyote
Date: Mon, 11 Oct 2004

this past weekend i went cycling and it was slightly more exciting than
usual. thought i'd share the story with you.

on saturday my friend Brad and i went for a bike ride in Rocky Mt.
National Park. we rode up old fall river road to the top of trail
ridge road. it was a long climb (4000'😉, cold, snow on the ground, and
windy. at around 11,400', after we passed the visitor center and were
heading up towards the pass, we were nearly attacked by a coyote. it
was extremely aggressive and one of the largest i've ever seen. for
about ten minutes it was charging both of us, dodging in and out of
cars trying to get at us and com ing up from behind with its teeth
bared. at one point when i lost sight of it and thought it had given
up, it was tucked right behind me, just a couple feet from my leg. it
appeared not to be in tune with me when i sent it peaceful thoughts.
yelling proved ineffective as well. there was a car from tennessee
which hung with us and protected us by acting as a barrier as much as
it could. in fact, all the cars behind the tennesse car were lined up
closely, forming a wall between the coyote and us. they were also
honking and swerving at it in an attempt to scare it. it appeared to
have absolutely no fear of the cars on the road. after a tiring chase
of riding as hard as we could, while looking over our shoulders to
keep an eye on it, and watching for cars in the lane of oncoming
traffic, it finally stopped chasing us right before we got to the top
of the pass. we got to the top, lungs fried, and rested a bit before
head ing down. by the end of the day the park service had 'taken care
of' the animal. it was sent to the lab for testing. we'll find out
later this week if it was rabid, hungry, or just interested in a new
bike.

i've seen plenty of coyotes in my day - both in arizona and in colorado
-
but never anything like this before. wild wily!

cyn

?? wrote in part:

<< it was sent to the lab for testing. we'll find out
later this week if it was rabid, hungry, or just interested in a new
bike. >>

Predators in this area have been feeding on
animals infected with Chronic Wasting Disease for
years. I always wondered how long it would take
for the disease to manifest itself in the coyote and
lion populations.

Robert

Diablo Scott <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<1097692590.Pg+hlVjIN1Er/iLVUjnLcA@teranews>...

Quoted message said:

I've always seen coyotes on my rides around here. They usually just
watch you go by, they usually aren't frightened, they usually don't run
away, they usually hold their ground even though you come pretty close
to them. Sometimes they'll run alongside you for a while, hoping you'll
scare up a squirrel for them to catch. I've seen them easily chase down
and catch jack rabbits. I've never been scared of them but their
numbers are increasing and news stories from nearby say they're getting
more aggressive too… feeding on cats and dogs, stalking children. I
wonder what would happen in a bike-coyote collision - would the coyote
run away in a panic? or attack in defense?

Well, at least they're not mountain lions.

News hype. Coyotes are smallish; a good male would be lucky to push
30 pounds, most are usually in the mid-20's in weight. I used to work
as a field biologist, and believe me a coyote is not going to tangle
with anything very big; they just are not that big or strong (saw one
kill a deer once, but the deer had been hit by a car and was almost
dead before the coyote got there). A hungry coyote might take out a
small to medium sized cat or a small dog but nothing much bigger.
Children are too big for a coyote, and unless the coyote is both
hungry and sick they will avoid something that large. In general
coyotes eat mice, rats, insects, and carrion (dead meat). Yes, I've
heard all the local news hyping up the 'coyote problem' but it is a
non-problem IMO - a few local yokels who cannot find their semi-feral
cat and so want to kill off all the coyotes who must be to blame. The
biggest danger *you* face in a coyote confrontation is rabies, a real
problem if you come into contact, but easy enough to avoid contact
(I've had the rabies series; you do not want it). Ignore the news
hype; just do not hit any coyotes (easy enough to avoid them),

- rick

|| this past weekend i went cycling and it was slightly more exciting
|| than usual. thought i'd share the story with you.
||
|| on saturday my friend Brad and i went for a bike ride in Rocky Mt.
|| National Park. we rode up old fall river road to the top of trail
|| ridge road. it was a long climb (4000'😉, cold, snow on the ground,
|| and windy. at around 11,400', after we passed the visitor center
|| and were heading up towards the pass, we were nearly attacked by a
|| coyote. it was extremely aggressive and one of the largest i've
|| ever seen. for about ten minutes it was charging both of us,
|| dodging in and out of cars trying to get at us and com ing up from
|| behind with its teeth bared. at one point when i lost sight of it
|| and thought it had given up, it was tucked right behind me, just a
|| couple feet from my leg. it appeared not to be in tune with me when
|| i sent it peaceful thoughts. yelling proved ineffective as well.
|| there was a car from tennessee which hung with us and protected us
|| by acting as a barrier as much as it could. in fact, all the cars
|| behind the tennesse car were lined up closely, forming a wall
|| between the coyote and us. they were also honking and swerving at
|| it in an attempt to scare it. it appeared to have absolutely no
|| fear of the cars on the road. after a tiring chase of riding as
|| hard as we could, while looking over our shoulders to keep an eye
|| on it, and watching for cars in the lane of oncoming traffic, it
|| finally stopped chasing us right before we got to the top of the
|| pass. we got to the top, lungs fried, and rested a bit before head
|| ing down. by the end of the day the park service had 'taken care
|| of' the animal. it was sent to the lab for testing. we'll find out
|| later this week if it was rabid, hungry, or just interested in a
|| new bike.
||
|| i've seen plenty of coyotes in my day - both in arizona and in
|| colorado -
|| but never anything like this before. wild wily!
||
|| cyn

Damn.

Quoted message said:

I'm pretty sure no one is feeding the coyotes on Diablo though, and I
haven't heard about them raiding camp sites, but they're getting bolder
and more numerous anyway. I see at least one almost every ride, but not
always near the road.

Last year I was seeing a group of several coyotes on a semi-regular basis
north of Livermore (an area on the south flank of Mt. Diablo). Haven't seen
them this year, though.

I know a sheep rancher between Livermore and Tracy. Coyotes took nearly 100
of his lambs a couple of years ago.

Chris Neary
[email hidden]

"Science, freedom, beauty, adventure: what more could
you ask of life? Bicycling combined all the elements I
loved" - Adapted from a quotation by Charles Lindbergh

MikeYankee said:

I see coyotes occasionally in upstate NY. They have never been
aggressive.

That has been my experience in southern CA, where I saw coyotes on almost every
MTB ride. No worries.

I've seen mountain lions too. While that initially strikes fear (especially in
the case of a mother and cubs), I quickly realized the situation was OK. Seeing
a mountain lion in the wild is a rare treat. I feel very lucky to have had the
experience.

Quoted message said:

My biggest animal fear is having some stupid deer cross the road in
front of me while I'm descending at 40 mph.

Someone my mother knew was killed in such an accident, so I guess it does
happen. I was always wary of the deer crossing the road near my house very
evening. We always warned visitors to watch for them on the way over. Car or
bike, a collision could be nasty.

But my own biggest fear is a loose dog giving chase. People's greatest fear
about dogs is being bitten. In reality, a cyclist's greatest danger from dogs
is crashing.

Last June, a dog chased me and got under my front wheel, and I went over the
handlebars at 20 MPH. It happened so quickly there was no way I could have done
anything. Fortunately I wasn't hurt beyond road rash and bruises -- though my
shoulder is just now getting back to normal, and I'll have scars for awhile. A
friend wasn't so lucky in an identical accident a year and a half ago. She's
still undergoing reconstructive dental surgeries.

If people care about their dogs (and their fellow humans), they'll keep their
dogs fenced in or tied up.

Matt O.