Cutting a steerer

Quoted message said:

Subject: Cutting a steerer
From: [email hidden] (Russ Baxter)
Date: 1/14/2004 12:00 PM Central Standard Time
Message-id: <[email hidden]>

I have installed a new threadless stem and need to reduce the length of the steerer. What is
the proper method for doing so? Please reply to the group and not to the spamcatcher address
above. thanks.

parktool.comhowfix forksize.shtmlOpen ↗

Park tool site above is a good instruction on how its done. Instead of doing the math its easier if
you just assemble everything (headset, spacers and stem). Clamp the stem down so it won't move and
mark your steerer at the top of your stem, then remove the fork, measure down 3-5mm from your mark
and make your cut. You can cut it without the guide, if you think you can cut it square. Good luck!

Steve

Steve Hambley said:

You can cut it without the guide, if you think you can cut it square.

I'd use a mitre saw with a metal cutting blade if I had to do it myself.

"Steve Hambley" <[email hidden]> a écrit dans le message de :
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Subject: Cutting a steerer

Is it permitted to cut it with a plumber's tubing cutter ?
--

Bonne route,

Sandy Paris FR

In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden] says...

Quoted message said:

I have installed a new threadless stem and need to reduce the length of the steerer. What is
the proper method for doing so? Please reply to the group and not to the spamcatcher address
above. thanks.

If the steerer is aluminum or steel, a pipe cutter works really well.
---------------
Alex

On 14 Jan 2004 10:00:00 -0800, [email hidden] (Russ Baxter)

may have said:

I have installed a new threadless stem and need to reduce the length of the steerer. What is
the proper method for doing so? Please reply to the group and not to the spamcatcher address
above. thanks.

Even if you have one, I recommend that you DO NOT use a plumber's pipe cutter to shorten the
steerer. They can compress the end of the tube and may leave you with a stem that won't
clamp properly.

The instructions given in the posts by Steve Hambley and Zog are good, in my opinion.

If you're not confident of your ability to cut the tube reasonably square, mark it and haul it down
to the lbs.

--
My email address is antispammed; pull WEEDS if replying via e-mail.
Yes, I have a killfile. If I don't respond to something,
it's also possible that I'm busy.
Words processed in a facility that contains nuts.

In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden] says...

Quoted message said:

"Steve Hambley" <[email hidden]> a écrit dans le message de : news:20040114132511.10794.00001725@mb-
m24.aol.com...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Subject: Cutting a steerer

Is it permitted to cut it with a plumber's tubing cutter ?

Steel and alumnium, yes. Carbon, no.
------------
Alex

SMMB said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Subject: Cutting a steerer

Is it permitted to cut it with a plumber's tubing cutter ?

I did this once. It worked just fine. And it's still working 2 years later.

Dave dvt at psu dot edu

In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden] says...

Quoted message said:

Even if you have one, I recommend that you DO NOT use a plumber's pipe cutter to shorten the
steerer. They can compress the end of the tube and may leave you with a stem that won't clamp
properly.

I've cut 5 steerer tube with a pipe cutter and never encountered the problem you describe. I
would also add that the part of the pipe cutter that puts pressure is about half the height of
your average stem clamp area, so even if it did compress the tube, you are only doing it to
half the area.

Quoted message said:

If you're not confident of your ability to cut the tube reasonably square, mark it and haul it down
to the lbs.

Without a guide I am not cofident I can make square cut, which is why I like the pipe cutter.
--------------
Alex

Alex Rodriguez:

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden] says...

Quoted message said:

I have installed a new threadless stem and need to reduce the length of the steerer. What is the
proper method for doing so? Please reply to the group and not to the spamcatcher address above.
thanks.

If the steerer is aluminum or steel, a pipe cutter works really well.

And easy, as well as cheap: $4 at the hardware store.

Werehatrack:

Quoted message said:

Even if you have one, I recommend that you DO NOT use a plumber's pipe cutter to shorten the
steerer. They can compress the end of the tube and may leave you with a stem that won't clamp
properly.

How so? The only thing that can happen is the edge of the cut will be slightly raised (ie OD is
slightly larger on the edge due to the cut), preventing the steerer from being inserted into the
stem, or making it a tight fit. Filing the edge, which is a good idea anyway to smooth it, will
easily eliminate this.

Since most threadless stems have two clamping bolts for the steerer, it's not an issue to clamp
properly even if the steerer tube does not have a consistent OD.

Quoted message said:

The instructions given in the posts by Steve Hambley and Zog are good, in my opinion.

More than one way to skin a cat.

Quoted message said:

If you're not confident of your ability to cut the tube reasonably square, mark it and haul it
down to the lbs.

A pipe cutter will make this a non-issue.

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----

In article said:

Werehatrack:

Quoted message said:

Even if you have one, I recommend that you DO NOT use a plumber's pipe cutter to shorten the
steerer. They can compress the end of the tube and may leave you with a stem that won't clamp
properly.

How so? The only thing that can happen is the edge of the cut will be slightly raised (ie OD is
slightly larger on the edge due to the cut), preventing the steerer from being inserted into the
stem, or making it a tight fit. Filing the edge, which is a good idea anyway to smooth it, will
easily eliminate this.

_ On soft pipe like copper, if you use a pipe cutter incorrectly you can turn a round pipe into an
oval. I guess if you really overtighten the thing the same could happen with steel. I have no idea
whether a pipe cutter properly used is okay or not, but I know you can wreck some relatively
expensive pipe with one.

_ Booker C. Bense

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.2

iQCVAwUBQAXMrmTWTAjn5N/lAQEWVwP/Zj3idppYCBWfA12pJqb9HnC8RK8CHwzc
6ltRF7gddkcJHSW1MGYlIPCxtIb7ylbt7vjSCbyb5g1AxjBHICMPe+wK72uwMd4J
JrwnAo9cgbb6rHA2OuCT5Q8v3tELjdYJIAuqclWUeftVDrujRp8Zg/EPzo+cc+cE isuQ77mrn74= =nc+D -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

Jose Rizal _@_._ may have said:

Werehatrack:

Quoted message said:

Even if you have one, I recommend that you DO NOT use a plumber's pipe cutter to shorten the
steerer. They can compress the end of the tube and may leave you with a stem that won't clamp
properly.

How so? The only thing that can happen is the edge of the cut will be slightly raised (ie OD is
slightly larger on the edge due to the cut), preventing the steerer from being inserted into the
stem, or making it a tight fit. Filing the edge, which is a good idea anyway to smooth it, will
easily eliminate this.

I had, for a while, a fork in the garage from a bike I bought cheap because the prior owner thought
it would be a neat idea to cut his steerer with a pipe cutter. I suspect the tool was in need of a
new cutter wheel; the end measured a full .028" smaller than the main body, and the length of the
squeezed section was about 12mm; more than enough to cause the stem to have an insufficient grip. If
the only purpose the stem's clamp served was as a collar to retain the bearing, I'd agree that this
would not be likely to be an issue, but since they're under significant leveraged load at times,
such a reduction in actual grip becomes a problem...as the bike owner in question had proven, by
having the stem work its way up the tube and cause the headset to get loose several times.

It should easily be possible to cut with no swedging on a good tube using a sharp cutter, but
since I can't see what the tube, tool, and skill of the user will be, my personal advice is
"don't try it".

Quoted message said:

Since most threadless stems have two clamping bolts for the steerer, it's not an issue to clamp
properly even if the steerer tube does not have a consistent OD.

Perhaps for some values of the inconsistency, but at least one instance seen has shown this to be a
potentially poor assumption.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

The instructions given in the posts by Steve Hambley and Zog are good, in my opinion.

More than one way to skin a cat.

Yes, but some may not leave you with a useful hide. ("Two, maybe three day, whole dam thing
fall off."😉

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

If you're not confident of your ability to cut the tube reasonably square, mark it and haul it
down to the lbs.

A pipe cutter will make this a non-issue.

If it leaves you with a useful tube, which is my experience is not guaranteed. That said, I have
one pipe cutter that it would probably be perfectly safe to use on a decent tube; it's quite
sharp, and doesn't even leave much of a burr on conduit. I have two others about which the same
cannot be said, and another that's really only suitable for iron plumbing pipe, where the threads
are tapered anyway.

If course, in my case, I'd just vee-block the tube on the miter saw's table and swap to the metal
cutting blade. Not everyone has that option.

--
My email address is antispammed; pull WEEDS if replying via e-mail.
Yes, I have a killfile. If I don't respond to something,
it's also possible that I'm busy.
Words processed in a facility that contains nuts.

On Wed, 14 Jan 2004 14:03:15 -0500, dvt <[email hidden]> may have

Quoted message said:

SMMB said:

Quoted message said:

>Subject: Cutting a steerer

Is it permitted to cut it with a plumber's tubing cutter ?

I did this once. It worked just fine. And it's still working 2 years later.

If it's sharp, it's probably OK. If it's not sharp, you could end up with a mess like the one that I
bought cheap from someone who used a pipe cuttter when they shouldn't.

I hesitate to recommend a procedure that has the potential for problems. A pipe cutter can be the
wrong tool if it's not in good condition. A hacksaw can't swedge the end of the tube.

--
My email address is antispammed; pull WEEDS if replying via e-mail.
Yes, I have a killfile. If I don't respond to something,
it's also possible that I'm busy.
Words processed in a facility that contains nuts.

Russ Baxter said:

Quoted message said:

I have installed a new threadless stem and need to reduce the length of the steerer. What is the
proper method for doing so?

A piece of furniture that turns into a wolf when the Moon is full said:

Even if you have one, I recommend that you DO NOT use a plumber's pipe cutter to shorten the
steerer. They can compress the end of the tube and may leave you with a stem that won't clamp
properly.

Hmmm...I always use a tubing cutter for this, neve even tried anything else. Also never had a lick
of trouble from the tubing cutter.

I do generally need to debur the inner circumference with a half-round file, mainly to facilitate
starnut installation. I've certainly never had any sort of stem clamping issue.

By the way, my two newest personal bikes, an IRO Jamie Roy and Thorn Raven both use 1 1/8
threadless, and I've put them together with no star nut at all. I've found that I can easily adjust
the headset just by loosening the stem, pushing the bars down forcefully while twisting the stem,
then clamp in place.

I don' need no steenking starnut!

If I were a weight weenie, this would save me a small amount of weight.

Since I'm not, I've found that it allows me to install a quill type stem into the top of the
steerer, with a short piece of handlebar as a "space grip" allowing me to mount stuff there. Also
allows me to have fairly low main handlebars, with the secondary, higher bars offering an alternate
position for more relaxed riding.

The IRO has a plastic Winwood fork with an aluminum steerer. It fits a 1" (7/8" diameter) quill
stem. The fork on the Thorn is steel, so the steerer walls are thinner. It fits a 1 1/8" (1"
diameter) quill stem.

I'll put some photos up when I get this setup dialed in better.

Sheldon "Pushing The Envelope" Brown +--------------------------------------+
| Without deviation from the norm, | progress is not possible | -- Frank Zappa |
+--------------------------------------+ Harris Cyclery, West Newton, Massachusetts Phone 617-244-
9772 FAX 617-244-1041 harriscyclery.comharriscyclery.comOpen ↗ Hard-to-find parts shipped Worldwide
captainbike.comcaptainbike.comOpen ↗ sheldonbrown.comnightsheldonbrown.comnightOpen ↗

<[email hidden]>:

Quoted message said:

_ On soft pipe like copper, if you use a pipe cutter incorrectly you can turn a round pipe into an
oval. I guess if you really overtighten the thing the same could happen with steel.

That'll be some pretty forceful tightening. Steel and Al steerers are usually thick enough to be
strong enough to make this unlikely, unless done intentionally.

Quoted message said:

I have no idea whether a pipe cutter properly used is okay or not, but I know you can wreck some
relatively expensive pipe with one.

Carbon steerers, yes.

Werehatrack:

Quoted message said:

I had, for a while, a fork in the garage from a bike I bought cheap because the prior owner
thought it would be a neat idea to cut his steerer with a pipe cutter. I suspect the tool was in
need of a new cutter wheel; the end measured a full .028" smaller than the main body, and the
length of the squeezed section was about 12mm;

I can't see how the end of this pipe can be compressed evenly circumferentially by a pipecutter's
rollers, or was it? The displaced metal needs to go somewhere. Had the steerer end elongated, or had
the circumference depressed in spots only?

Quoted message said:

more than enough to cause the stem to have an insufficient grip.

How high was the stem steerer clamp? Most threadless stems have clamp heights of around 40mm, enough
to make up for a smaller OD in 12mm of its length.

Jose Rizal _@_._ may have said:

Werehatrack:

Quoted message said:

I had, for a while, a fork in the garage from a bike I bought cheap because the prior owner
thought it would be a neat idea to cut his steerer with a pipe cutter. I suspect the tool was in
need of a new cutter wheel; the end measured a full .028" smaller than the main body, and the
length of the squeezed section was about 12mm;

I can't see how the end of this pipe can be compressed evenly circumferentially by a pipecutter's
rollers, or was it? The displaced metal needs to go somewhere. Had the steerer end elongated, or
had the circumference depressed in spots only?

It was relatively round; to the eye, it looked circular. I only checked the size in one spot. I've
seen this before with cheap tubing, and had measured a thickening of the tubing wall without
elongation. I didn't check the sterer to see if that's what had taken place, but the starfangled nut
was pretty much of a starmangled nut.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

more than enough to cause the stem to have an insufficient grip.

How high was the stem steerer clamp? Most threadless stems have clamp heights of around 40mm,
enough to make up for a smaller OD in 12mm of its length.

I can't say what the height was; I didn't measure it. Don't forget to add the top clearance to that
12mm, though. It was a cheap stem, in fact, the whole bike was a collection of inexpensive stuff,
down close to Mall-Wart territory. I wouldn't be too surprised if it had a clamp width in the area
of 35mm, but it could have been 40. The rest of the bike got parted out to a couple of friends for
beater spares. Eventually, I chucked the fork when it became obvious that the cost of trying to
replace the tube was going to be more than the whole thing was worth.

--
My email address is antispammed; pull WEEDS if replying via e-mail.
Yes, I have a killfile. If I don't respond to something,
it's also possible that I'm busy.
Words processed in a facility that contains nuts.

On Wed, 14 Jan 2004 21:24:19 -0500, Sheldon Brown

may have said:

Russ Baxter said:

Quoted message said:

I have installed a new threadless stem and need to reduce the length of the steerer. What is the
proper method for doing so?

A piece of furniture that turns into a wolf when the Moon is full wrote:

(Actually, that's a person who's often mistaken for furniture, even more so when the moon is full.
But it's hard to tell at this distance.)

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Even if you have one, I recommend that you DO NOT use a plumber's pipe cutter to shorten the
steerer. They can compress the end of the tube and may leave you with a stem that won't clamp
properly.

Hmmm...I always use a tubing cutter for this, neve even tried anything else. Also never had a lick
of trouble from the tubing cutter.

A *tubing* cutter, with just a knob to turn the pressure screw, probably can't develop enough force
to damage the tube. A plumber's pipe cutter, which is larger, far heavier, has a T-handle, and is a
much more forceful piece of equipment, can crush 1 1/2" plumbing pipe if the cutter's dull and/or
the tool is used incorrectly. A pipe cutter is, for that reason, not a good choice in my personal
opinion, having seen the results of either the use of a dull one (which is my guess) or the gross
*mis*use of one. A tubing cutter, which is smaller, lighter, and less forceful, should have little
chance of doing anything but shortening the tube. (And leaving an easily removed burr.)

A good, sharp pipe cutter, used with care, *should* do the job with no problem. But I would not
hand a steerer tube and a pipe cutter to J Random Newbie and depend on the end result being
right. Particularly not if the tool is one of those abysmal Chinese pipecutters that tracks in a
spiral. (Oh, the occasional random horrors of Harbor Freight.) (Well, OK, some of their stuff is
good, *but*...)

Quoted message said:

I do generally need to debur the inner circumference with a half-round file, mainly to facilitate
starnut installation. I've certainly never had any sort of stem clamping issue.

If you had seen the steerer that I saw, which had been mangled by a pipe cutter, it probably would
be on the wall of your shop as a trophy in the Wild & Crazy Screwups category. (I gave up collecting
those years ago. I still have a few of the most choice examples, though.)

I will also note that a hacksawed tube will generally need just as much deburring, if not more.

Quoted message said:

By the way, my two newest personal bikes, an IRO Jamie Roy and Thorn Raven both use 1 1/8
threadless, and I've put them together with no star nut at all. I've found that I can easily adjust
the headset just by loosening the stem, pushing the bars down forcefully while twisting the stem,
then clamp in place.

I don' need no steenking starnut!

You, too? I'll go you one better. I fished a screwed-up threadless stem out of a trash can a couple
of weeks ago, and if I have time, this weekend it's going to become the collar at the top of the
steerer on a bike with a threadless tube and a conventional quill. I can't see why it wouldn't
work...and I'm going to give it a shot. And I'm going to take the lazy way out; I'm not cutting the
tube because this way, I don't have to! (The threadless stem had stripped threads. I have helicoils.
This is not a problem.)

Quoted message said:

If I were a weight weenie, this would save me a small amount of weight.

Chase them grams!

Quoted message said:

Since I'm not, I've found that it allows me to install a quill type stem into the top of the
steerer, with a short piece of handlebar as a "space grip" allowing me to mount stuff there. Also
allows me to have fairly low main handlebars, with the secondary, higher bars offering an alternate
position for more relaxed riding.

Damn, and I thought I was being original. I should have known better than to think you wouldn't have
already tried it.

Hmm. I think I'll steal your idea, though, and put a short chunk of bar in the threadless stem to
mount the lights. Yeah, that'll solve another problem!

Quoted message said:

The IRO has a plastic Winwood fork with an aluminum steerer. It fits a 1" (7/8" diameter) quill
stem. The fork on the Thorn is steel, so the steerer walls are thinner. It fits a 1 1/8" (1"
diameter) quill stem.

Your bike stuff reminds me of my days building very strange and unusual VWs. That was a long time
ago in a galaxy far, far away.

Quoted message said:

I'll put some photos up when I get this setup dialed in better.

Sheldon "Pushing The Envelope" Brown

instantattitudes.combs331.gifOpen ↗ would seem apropos...

--
My email address is antispammed; pull WEEDS if replying via e-mail.
Yes, I have a killfile. If I don't respond to something,
it's also possible that I'm busy.
Words processed in a facility that contains nuts.

Jose Rizal _@_._ may have said:

<[email hidden]>:

Quoted message said:

_ On soft pipe like copper, if you use a pipe cutter incorrectly you can turn a round pipe into
an oval. I guess if you really overtighten the thing the same could happen with steel.

That'll be some pretty forceful tightening. Steel and Al steerers are usually thick enough to be
strong enough to make this unlikely, unless done intentionally.

With this tool, too easy to do:

harborfreight.comDisplayitem.tafOpen ↗

With the next one, unlikely. I call *this* one a tubing cutter:

harborfreight.comDisplayitem.tafOpen ↗

Note that the first one weighs 12 pounds. The second weighs about one pound.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I have no idea whether a pipe cutter properly used is okay or not, but I know you can wreck some
relatively expensive pipe with one.

Carbon steerers, yes.

And lots of other kinds. Never underestimate the power of inexperience.

--
My email address is antispammed; pull WEEDS if replying via e-mail.
Yes, I have a killfile. If I don't respond to something,
it's also possible that I'm busy.
Words processed in a facility that contains nuts.