Two wheels does it

In article <[email hidden]>,

Quoted message said:

Skip over the recumbents in this web site, they don't count as
logistical vehicles.

http://aistigave.hit.bg/Logistics/

Good grief! That's amazing stuff. I was particularly amused by the guy
carrying the car unibody on the front of his trike!

Tim McNamara said:

Quoted message said:

Skip over the recumbents in this web site, they don't count as
logistical vehicles.

http://aistigave.hit.bg/Logistics/

Quoted message said:

Good grief! That's amazing stuff. I was particularly amused by the
guy carrying the car unibody on the front of his trike!

Don't overlook the nicely paved streets. They don't have republican
roads over there as we do with potholes and cracks that can eat
bicycles. Taxes are bad, public facilities need to be privatized.

Jobst Brandt

Quoted message said:

Skip over the recumbents in this web site, they don't count as
logistical vehicles.

http://aistigave.hit.bg/Logistics/

Jobst Brandt

Perhaps not in the same league, but last spring I came back from the
auto parts store with a water pump, 2 gallons of antifreeze and various
hoses and clamps, all on my rear rack -- the parts guys were amazed. Oh
yeah, it was snowing and I had studded tires.

Quoted message said:

Tim McNamara said:

Quoted message said:

Skip over the recumbents in this web site, they don't count as
logistical vehicles.

http://aistigave.hit.bg/Logistics/

Quoted message said:

Good grief! That's amazing stuff. I was particularly amused by the
guy carrying the car unibody on the front of his trike!

Don't overlook the nicely paved streets. They don't have republican
roads over there as we do with potholes and cracks that can eat
bicycles. Taxes are bad, public facilities need to be privatized.

Jobst Brandt

Dear Jobst,

Er, the primary traffic in most of those pictures appears to be
bicycles:

http://aistigave.hit.bg/Logistics

The whole point is that people are using bicycles and motorcycles to
move loads that we would normally carry in cars and trucks.

Such roads tend to last longer than roads with heavy car and truck
traffic.

Cheers,

Carl Fogel

"Peter Cole" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Skip over the recumbents in this web site, they don't count as
logistical vehicles.

http://aistigave.hit.bg/Logistics/

Jobst Brandt

Perhaps not in the same league, but last spring I came back from the auto
parts store with a water pump, 2 gallons of antifreeze and various hoses
and clamps, all on my rear rack -- the parts guys were amazed. Oh yeah, it
was snowing and I had studded tires.

I get some pretty strange looks by the Propane vendor when I show up with
the 30lb (7 gal) tank on the back of mine. Here's a hint. Always have it
completely filled. If you don't, you will be all over the road when the
liquid shifts.

In article <[email hidden]>,

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Tim McNamara said:

> Skip over the recumbents in this web site, they don't count as
> logistical vehicles.

http://aistigave.hit.bg/Logistics/

Quoted message said:

Good grief! That's amazing stuff. I was particularly amused by the
guy carrying the car unibody on the front of his trike!

Don't overlook the nicely paved streets. They don't have republican
roads over there as we do with potholes and cracks that can eat
bicycles. Taxes are bad, public facilities need to be privatized.

Jobst Brandt

Dear Jobst,

Er, the primary traffic in most of those pictures appears to be
bicycles:

http://aistigave.hit.bg/Logistics

The whole point is that people are using bicycles and motorcycles to
move loads that we would normally carry in cars and trucks.

Such roads tend to last longer than roads with heavy car and truck
traffic.

Cheers,

Carl Fogel

Bonus explanation: does that look like a nation especially prone to
frost heave?

Bonus bonus explanation: are the potholes worse in Utah or Illinois?

--
Ryan Cousineau [email hidden] http://www.wiredcola.com/
"I don't want kids who are thinking about going into mathematics
to think that they have to take drugs to succeed." -Paul Erdos

In article <[email hidden]>,

Quoted message said:

Tim McNamara said:

Quoted message said:

Skip over the recumbents in this web site, they don't count as
logistical vehicles.

http://aistigave.hit.bg/Logistics/

Quoted message said:

Good grief! That's amazing stuff. I was particularly amused by
the guy carrying the car unibody on the front of his trike!

Don't overlook the nicely paved streets. They don't have republican
roads over there as we do with potholes and cracks that can eat
bicycles. Taxes are bad, public facilities need to be privatized.

Now that you mention it, I hadn't paid attention to the backgrounds as
much as the foregrounds. Many of those photos do show awfully nicely
paved roads.

It's an interesting set of priority discussions. Here in Minnesota, the
Governor and the Legislature (a Republican and Republican controlled
House) have done such a [censored]-poor job of dealing with roads (we like to
build new ones for subdivision developers, but not to maintain the ones
we have. Good thing the state isn't in charge of puppies). The
Governor even tried to get one of the most important road projects in
the metro area done by asking the contractors to basically accept an IOU
for hundreds of millions of dollars. Oddly enough that didn't fly.

BTW the Governor is campaigning on his fiscal record, claiming he's
actually competent. Sigh. On the one hand, we have a vapid Republican
liar campaigning for re-election and on the other we have a vapid
Democratic publicity hound challenging him. The Independence Party
candidate seems saner and smarter than both of them, but is boring and
doesn't have the peculiar razzmatazz that Jesse Ventura had.

I don't mind a boring governor. We had moderate Republican Arne Carlson
for a couple of terms, boring as could be but he did a good job. And
hilariously he won twice without having the Republican endorsement! The
first time he won, he became the Republican candidate six weeks before
the election when the endorsed candidate bowed out after his
predilection for skinny dipping with minors came out; Carlson beat the
incumbent Democrat fairly handily. The second time, the endorsed
candidate was a far right wing nutbar who lost the primary.

Hmmm, maybe if the Democrats defy my expectations and take back one or
both halves of Congress, it'd drive the Republican Party back towards
conservative ideals.

Carl Fogel said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> Skip over the recumbents in this web site, they don't count as
> logistical vehicles.

http://aistigave.hit.bg/Logistics/

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Good grief! That's amazing stuff. I was particularly amused by
the guy carrying the car unibody on the front of his trike!

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Don't overlook the nicely paved streets. They don't have
republican roads over there as we do with potholes and cracks that
can eat bicycles. Taxes are bad, public facilities need to be
privatized.

Quoted message said:

Er, the primary traffic in most of those pictures appears to be
bicycles:

http://aistigave.hit.bg/Logistics

Quoted message said:

The whole point is that people are using bicycles and motorcycles to
move loads that we would normally carry in cars and trucks.

Quoted message said:

Such roads tend to last longer than roads with heavy car and truck
traffic.

Oh! Is that why your favorite mine field has cracked eroded asphalt
and full of puncture vine, because it has heavy traffic? You might
try roads in (F), (D), (CH), (I), (SLO), (CRO), (NL),... and note that
theirs are without cracks and potholes, including mountain roads in
the Alps.

Jobst Brandt

Quoted message said:

Skip over the recumbents in this web site, they don't count as
logistical vehicles.

http://aistigave.hit.bg/Logistics/

Jobst Brandt

I found it somewhat amazing a couple of the scooter/motorcyclists were
wearing helmets. Sort of hard to reconcile wearing helmets and using
scooters/motorcycles to haul pigs or flowers and passengers or children.

Quoted message said:

http://aistigave.hit.bg/Logistics/

Dang.
--
JT
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Jobst Brandt said:

Skip over the recumbents in this web site, they don't count as
logistical vehicles.

Hatred does not become you Jobst.

--
Tom Sherman - Here, not there.

Johnny Sunset aka Tom Sherman said:

Jobst Brandt said:

Skip over the recumbents in this web site, they don't count as
logistical vehicles.

Hatred does not become you Jobst.

--
Tom Sherman - Here, not there.

C'mon, why must you put such a spin on it..'hatred'?? Stoopid,
unnecessary design, poor answer to any question, but he doesn't hate
anything.....or maybe he does..

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Skip over the recumbents in this web site, they don't count as
logistical vehicles.

http://aistigave.hit.bg/Logistics/

Jobst Brandt

I found it somewhat amazing a couple of the scooter/motorcyclists were
wearing helmets. Sort of hard to reconcile wearing helmets and using
scooters/motorcycles to haul pigs or flowers and passengers or children.

Why?

Remember that these people aren't hauling pigs around for fun -- the small
motorcycle is a way to economic advancement. You can get more to market
faster, so you can make more money.

You do see multiple people on these small motorcycles -- five is the most I
saw when I was in Thailand. These looked like family groups, and I'm
guessing this was their only vehicle.

Quoted message said:

http://aistigave.hit.bg/Logistics/

I showed this to my wife, who grew up in China, and she was
unimpressed, saying "Stuff like that is very comon where I used to
live."
--
JT
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Peter Chisholm said:

Johnny Sunset aka Tom Sherman said:

Jobst Brandt said:

Skip over the recumbents in this web site, they don't count as
logistical vehicles.

Hatred does not become you Jobst.

--
Tom Sherman - Here, not there.

C'mon, why must you put such a spin on it..'hatred'?? Stoopid,
unnecessary design, poor answer to any question, but he doesn't hate
anything.....or maybe he does..

Poor answer to ANY question? So, for example, if a person had damage to
their wrists that prohibited them from riding an upright bicycle in
comfort [1], you would suggest they live with the pain or give up
cycling instead of riding a recumbent bicycle?

[1] I am aware of actual cases of this.

--
Tom Sherman - Here, not there.

Quoted message said:

Carl Fogel said:

Quoted message said:

>> Skip over the recumbents in this web site, they don't count as
>> logistical vehicles.

http://aistigave.hit.bg/Logistics/

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> Good grief! That's amazing stuff. I was particularly amused by
> the guy carrying the car unibody on the front of his trike!

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Don't overlook the nicely paved streets. They don't have
republican roads over there as we do with potholes and cracks that
can eat bicycles. Taxes are bad, public facilities need to be
privatized.

Quoted message said:

Er, the primary traffic in most of those pictures appears to be
bicycles:

http://aistigave.hit.bg/Logistics

Quoted message said:

The whole point is that people are using bicycles and motorcycles to
move loads that we would normally carry in cars and trucks.

Quoted message said:

Such roads tend to last longer than roads with heavy car and truck
traffic.

Oh! Is that why your favorite mine field has cracked eroded asphalt
and full of puncture vine, because it has heavy traffic? You might
try roads in (F), (D), (CH), (I), (SLO), (CRO), (NL),... and note that
theirs are without cracks and potholes, including mountain roads in
the Alps.

Jobst Brandt

Dear Jobst,

My bicycle path has cracked and eroded asphalt because it's a cheap
strip of shallow asphalt laid on notoriously bad soil, often with huge
cottonwoods next to it.

Soil in this area tends toward bentonite clay, which has a nasty habit
of expanding wildly when wet and breaking the foundations of homes and
university buildings.

The cottonwood roots have broken more expensive concrete slabs
intended to fix things.

I'll try to remember to take a few pictures of the path versus the
road to illustrate the difference. I'll also try to take a picture of
the larger cracks, which were filled with asphalt recently. It will be
interesting to see if the goatheads just grow up through the new
asphalt next year.

Regrettably, some new state parks employees decided to save time by
using a full-size garbage truck instead of a pickup truck to collect
the garbage from the trash cans, so some sections of the path have
been smashed--you've mentioned how ground squirrels like to burrow
under roads because it gives them a solid roof over their heads.

As a rule of thumb, when grass and puncture vine grow in the cracks in
the middle of a desert or prairie road, there ain't enough traffic to
worry about maintaining things.

Given that I see half a dozen pedestrians and bicyclists on the path,
it's reasonable for the county not to bother spending much on the
upkeep of a path that turns into a state park halfway to the dam.

To give some idea of how little used the path is, I stop in summer to
shoo rattlesnakes off it. This afternoon, I counted 11 deer on the
path in about a mile.

And to be honest, it works fine for a bicycle. For 15 miles, I use my
touring bike's brakes only for right-angle corners.

Cheers,

Carl Fogel

[email hidden] wrote:
Taxes are bad, public facilities need to be privatized.

Quoted message said:

Jobst Brandt

Seriously, what is your solution to poor road surfaces, all toll roads?
Ted.

In article <[email hidden]>,

Johnny Sunset aka Tom Sherman said:

Peter Chisholm said:

Johnny Sunset aka Tom Sherman said:

Jobst Brandt wrote:
> Skip over the recumbents in this web site, they don't count as
> logistical vehicles.

Hatred does not become you Jobst.

-- Tom Sherman - Here, not there.

C'mon, why must you put such a spin on it..'hatred'?? Stoopid,
unnecessary design, poor answer to any question, but he doesn't
hate anything.....or maybe he does..

Poor answer to ANY question? So, for example, if a person had damage
to their wrists that prohibited them from riding an upright bicycle
in comfort [1], you would suggest they live with the pain or give up
cycling instead of riding a recumbent bicycle?

I have two friends with severe arthritis of the neck, who can ride
recumbents comfortably but not regular bicycles. So that seems to be a
good answer to their question.

In article <[email hidden]>,

Quoted message said:

Carl Fogel said:

Quoted message said:

>> Skip over the recumbents in this web site, they don't count as
>> logistical vehicles.

http://aistigave.hit.bg/Logistics/

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> Good grief! That's amazing stuff. I was particularly amused by
> the guy carrying the car unibody on the front of his trike!

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Don't overlook the nicely paved streets. They don't have
republican roads over there as we do with potholes and cracks that
can eat bicycles. Taxes are bad, public facilities need to be
privatized.

Jobst, I think many of your readers somehow missed the sarcasm.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Er, the primary traffic in most of those pictures appears to be
bicycles:

http://aistigave.hit.bg/Logistics

Quoted message said:

The whole point is that people are using bicycles and motorcycles
to move loads that we would normally carry in cars and trucks.

Quoted message said:

Such roads tend to last longer than roads with heavy car and truck
traffic.

Oh! Is that why your favorite mine field has cracked eroded asphalt
and full of puncture vine, because it has heavy traffic? You might
try roads in (F), (D), (CH), (I), (SLO), (CRO), (NL),... and note
that theirs are without cracks and potholes, including mountain roads
in the Alps.

I did find some pretty severe cracks on the Col de Vars and some rough
pavement on the Col de Sarenne, but other than that I was very surprised
by the nicely maintained roads. Not only the quality of the surface but
also the lack of broken beer bottles and the general good manners of the
drivers towards bicyclists (but not each other- French drivers have
little tolerance for each other).