Electric bicycles: Viable or not?

Quoted message said:

Anyone here have a bicycle that they converted to
electric use?

If yes... how is it working out?

A light switch is much easier to flip.

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Anyone here have a bicycle that they converted to
electric use?

If yes... how is it working out?

Just an off the peg electric bike here in the form of a Giant Twist (aka
Lite in the USA). What are you wanting to do in terms of use, with what sort
of bike and is there any particular reason why you'd rather convert your
existing bike than sell it and get a purpose made one? A recent UK CTC mag
had an article including electric drive add-ons but the real UK authority in
the field of all things electric bike related is AtoB magazine:
http://www.atob.org.uk/

Product availability will vary from country to country, where are you?

Paul

"Paul Murphy" <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Just an off the peg electric bike here in the form of a Giant Twist (aka
Lite in the USA). What are you wanting to do in terms of use, with what sort
of bike and is there any particular reason why you'd rather convert your
existing bike than sell it and get a purpose made one? A recent UK CTC mag
had an article including electric drive add-ons but the real UK authority in
the field of all things electric bike related is AtoB magazine:
http://www.atob.org.uk/

Product availability will vary from country to country, where are you?

I'm in north Missouri

And I have an unused mt bike setting around and that's
why I was thinking of a conversion

Do you feel conversions are NOT the way to go?

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Paul Murphy" <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Just an off the peg electric bike here in the form of a Giant Twist (aka
Lite in the USA). What are you wanting to do in terms of use, with what
sort
of bike and is there any particular reason why you'd rather convert your
existing bike than sell it and get a purpose made one? A recent UK CTC mag
had an article including electric drive add-ons but the real UK authority
in
the field of all things electric bike related is AtoB magazine:
http://www.atob.org.uk/

Product availability will vary from country to country, where are you?

I'm in north Missouri

And I have an unused mt bike setting around and that's
why I was thinking of a conversion

Do you feel conversions are NOT the way to go?

I can't speak from experience regarding mountain biking but if you just want
to use your mountain bike for road commuting its always best to either
modify the mountain bike to be road friendly with smoother narrower tyres,
mudguards etc (at a cost) or sell it and get a dedicated road or touring
bike. If you want to go down the selling route then it would be allot easier
to just buy a good off the peg electric bike.

I've heard of kits for mountain bikes, for mountain biking purposes but
whether the added hill climbing ability is worth the reduction in jumping
and manoeuvring ability due to the weight penalty will depend what type of
mountain biking you do. There's a video on the internet made by a person who
converted his mountain bike to be battery powered and got it up to about 38
mph under its own power (I think he was in Hawaii, certainly not the UK
where electric bikes must have the motor cut out by 15 mph to be street
legal as a bicycle).

Over here some of the electric upgrade kits e.g. SRAM Sparc are very
expensive and little savings are to be had by modification. In these cases
its very clear which way to go.

Paul

"Paul Murphy" <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

I've heard of kits for mountain bikes, for mountain biking purposes but

I would NOT be using this bike for off road use... but
instead as an electric bike for commuting purposes

In article <[email hidden]>,

Quoted message said:

Anyone here have a bicycle that they converted to
electric use?

If yes... how is it working out?

It's great but the extension cord is inconvenient.
Bam, bam, da-duh, bingggg.

--
Michael Press

It depends on how far you have to commute, what kind of hlls and how fast
you need to go.
Most electric bikes have about a 20 mile range, and you need to recharge
them prety quickly then too.
Plus the batteries usually have about 200 recharges in them with sometime
after 100 charges you may notice the capacity getting less as time goes on.
Then if the motors have brushes you need to replace them every 3,000 miles
or so.
Brushless motors are the way to go but they are expensive, and the motor
controllers for brushless motors are expensive.

But now if you only need to ride a couple of miles or so, not really any
hills to speak of, and you have some nice side streets or routes to and from
wherever you are going, they are pretty neat then. You could probably go all
week on a charge in those cases.
If your office lets you, you could always take in inside and recharge it at
work too.
Most states in trying to promote alternatives to motor vehicles will let
electric bikes ride on the slow speed roads no problem too. They usually put
in law amendments stating this in their traffic codes too.

Now for me it is a problem, as I have to ride my commuter bike 23 miles one
way to work. Thus a 20 mile range doesn't quite get me there. But you can
get the range bossted to 30 miles or so with bigger batteries too.
It would have to look like a bicycle else I cannot bring it inside to my
office either. If I rode a electric bike to work everyday and it had the
range to get there, i could recharge it at work for the ride home no
problem. But that means I am recharging the batteries 25 times a week, 100
times a month, so sometime after two months I may need new batteries. Then
the motor brushes last about 3,000 miles which is a little over three months
for me riding 5 days a week.

But this last hot summer had me seriously considering one too. I mean I have
like ten miles of riding home in over 100 degree heat, hot headwinds, no
shade, lots of hot heat rising off the pavement, and cars etc. An electric
boost during that hot part riding home, just might make it workable to
commute in 100 degree heat. Of course the morning ride into work is not a
problem. It is riding home in the hottest part of the day going home that
gets you.

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Paul Murphy" <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

I've heard of kits for mountain bikes, for mountain biking purposes but

I would NOT be using this bike for off road use... but
instead as an electric bike for commuting purposes

I am commuting to work on a Tres Terra Europa, which is an off the shelf
Electric Bike. My commute is 12.5 miles each way. I bring my charger and
recharge the battery (which easily removes from the bike). I am capable of
doing the ride on a non electric bike, but the ride home is a slight uphill
grade and usually into a head wind. I would get home exhausted. Instead, I
cut some time off my commute and find that the riding translates into much
better conditioning for my non electric bike.

Check out www.visforvoltage.com and groups.yahoo.com/group/power-assist.
Also, www.electric-bike.com which is a bit dated but basically good.

There are starting to be a number of LiOn and Nimh battery options for
electric bikes that enable the bikes to be considerably lighter and have
more range. The batteries also have a longer life. However Lead Acid
batteries are relatively cheap albeit heavy and not as long lasting.

You can get a Wilderness Energy front wheel kit for $349 from a number of
vendors on Ebay. It would have a brushed motor and Lead Acid batteries.
For $500 or a bit more you can get a Crystalyte kit and add Nimh batteries
for a couple hundred more. Many people would recommend that you start with
the cheap Wilderness Energy kit. The motor is in a front wheel that comes
in the kit so it is relatively easy to install. The brushed motor does,
theoretically, wear out sooner, and it has a bit less range, but it is also
faster.

Another option for a cheap first electric bike is to get a Currie motor
equipped Mongoose. They sell them at www.target.com for around $400.

I love commuting on an electric bike. It enables me to commute once again
on a bike. Makes the trip home bearable. Puts a 12.5 mile commute within
reasonable reach. My bike can go 20 mph and gets a range of about 20 miles.
I always pedal as well as use the motor and can easily go 22 mph (yes that
is possible on a road bike on the flats but so what). I can carry whatever
stuff I need in my saddlebags without worrying that it will slow me down.

It's not for everyone and the purists will put you down. But, as an
alternative to driving a car while getting some exercise, it's great. The
technology is improving everyday. You can start with a basic kit and
upgrade the batteries and the controller as the technology improves and
becomes less expensive.

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Anyone here have a bicycle that they converted to
electric use?

If yes... how is it working out?

"Earl Bollinger" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

It depends on how far you have to commute, what kind of hlls and how fast
you need to go.
Most electric bikes have about a 20 mile range, and you need to recharge
them prety quickly then too.

If the bike has lead acid batteries, then quick recharging is recommended.
If the bike has Nimh or LiOn batteries, you don't need to recharge them
right away.

Quoted message said:

Plus the batteries usually have about 200 recharges in them with sometime
after 100 charges you may notice the capacity getting less as time goes
on.

Depends on the battery. Some batteries have 500-1000 recharges.

Quoted message said:

Then if the motors have brushes you need to replace them every 3,000 miles
or so.

The brushed motors themselves are quite cheap. The brushes or the motors
might need to be replaced in 3000-5000 miles or so, but that's a lot of
miles on a bike and the motors aren't expensive.

Quoted message said:

Brushless motors are the way to go but they are

expensive, and the motor

Quoted message said:

controllers for brushless motors are expensive.

The brushless kits start at about $500 vs. $349 for the inexpensive brush
motor kit. That's a kit too, not the motor. Just the motor is less.

Quoted message said:

But now if you only need to ride a couple of miles or so, not really any
hills to speak of, and you have some nice side streets or routes to and
from wherever you are going, they are pretty neat then. You could probably
go all week on a charge in those cases.
If your office lets you, you could always take in inside and recharge it
at work too.

Every electric bike I know, and all the kits let you take the battery off
the bike to recharge it. I recharge at work, very easy.

Quoted message said:

Most states in trying to promote alternatives to motor vehicles will let
electric bikes ride on the slow speed roads no problem too. They usually
put in law amendments stating this in their traffic codes too.

There's a federal law that says that electric bikes that are limited to 20
mph are to be treated as bicycles. It supercedes any state laws.

Quoted message said:

Now for me it is a problem, as I have to ride my commuter bike 23 miles
one way to work. Thus a 20 mile range doesn't quite get me there. But you
can get the range bossted to 30 miles or so with bigger batteries too.

You should be able to get 23 miles out of a kit or bike with a 20 mile range
by pedaling as well as using the electric assist.

Quoted message said:

It would have to look like a bicycle else I cannot bring it inside to my
office either. If I rode a electric bike to work everyday and it had the
range to get there, i could recharge it at work for the ride home no
problem. But that means I am recharging the batteries 25 times a week, 100
times a month, so sometime after two months I may need new batteries.

Again, batteries can be cycled more than 200 times. Lead acid batteries are
pretty cheap. This is still way cheaper than gas for your car.

Then

Quoted message said:

the motor brushes last about 3,000 miles which is a little over three
months for me riding 5 days a week.

If you are so worried about brush motors, get brushless. As I said they
aren't that much more expensive.

Quoted message said:

But this last hot summer had me seriously considering one too. I mean I
have like ten miles of riding home in over 100 degree heat, hot headwinds,
no shade, lots of hot heat rising off the pavement, and cars etc. An
electric boost during that hot part riding home, just might make it
workable to commute in 100 degree heat. Of course the morning ride into
work is not a problem. It is riding home in the hottest part of the day
going home that gets you.

Yep, I find commuting feasible even in 110 degree heat. That's one of the
main reasons I got an electric bike. I take high blood pressure medication
and last summer I had some problems with dehydration when cycling in the
heat. At one point I ended up in the hospital. With my electric bike I can
ride home in 110 degree heat, uphill, into a headwind and the commute is
feasible. Believe me, under those conditions I'm tired when I get home from
a 12.5 mile commute but it is quite feasible.

Quoted message said:

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Paul Murphy" <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

I've heard of kits for mountain bikes, for mountain biking purposes but

I would NOT be using this bike for off road use... but
instead as an electric bike for commuting purposes

Quoted message said:

And I have an unused mt bike setting around and that's
why I was thinking of a conversion

Do you feel conversions are NOT the way to go?

While I personally bought an off the shelf bike, it was partly out of
ignorance. The bike I bought is an excellent commuter, but there are some
advantages to the kits. And the kits are reasonably priced. If you read
the forums (I already gave the urls in a different post) you'll see that
most of the guys who've been into electric bikes for a while recommend that
you start with something like the entry level Wilderness Energy kit and go
from there. The kits are very modifiable and upgradeable and there are lots
of knowledgeable people on the net willing to share ideas. I'm thinking of
kitting an old mountain bike of mine even though I've already got an
electric bike, because the kits have some advantages (mostly that they can
be modified for more speed or range).

You have a point there. About the replacement costs for the batteries and
motors is less than what gasoline costs would be to do the same thign via a
car.
Something to think about. But if I only do that in the summer when it is so
hot, it might be a workable solution too.Normally when the temperatures are
cooler, riding a bike to and from work is not a problem for me at all.
Does anyone sell a motor already laced up to a 700c rim?

"OldGirl" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Earl Bollinger" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

It depends on how far you have to commute, what kind of hlls and how fast
you need to go.
Most electric bikes have about a 20 mile range, and you need to recharge
them prety quickly then too.

If the bike has lead acid batteries, then quick recharging is recommended.
If the bike has Nimh or LiOn batteries, you don't need to recharge them
right away.

Quoted message said:

Plus the batteries usually have about 200 recharges in them with sometime
after 100 charges you may notice the capacity getting less as time goes
on.

Depends on the battery. Some batteries have 500-1000 recharges.

Quoted message said:

Then if the motors have brushes you need to replace them every 3,000
miles or so.

The brushed motors themselves are quite cheap. The brushes or the motors
might need to be replaced in 3000-5000 miles or so, but that's a lot of
miles on a bike and the motors aren't expensive.

Quoted message said:

Brushless motors are the way to go but they are

expensive, and the motor

Quoted message said:

controllers for brushless motors are expensive.

The brushless kits start at about $500 vs. $349 for the inexpensive brush
motor kit. That's a kit too, not the motor. Just the motor is less.

Quoted message said:

But now if you only need to ride a couple of miles or so, not really any
hills to speak of, and you have some nice side streets or routes to and
from wherever you are going, they are pretty neat then. You could
probably go all week on a charge in those cases.
If your office lets you, you could always take in inside and recharge it
at work too.

Every electric bike I know, and all the kits let you take the battery off
the bike to recharge it. I recharge at work, very easy.

Quoted message said:

Most states in trying to promote alternatives to motor vehicles will let
electric bikes ride on the slow speed roads no problem too. They usually
put in law amendments stating this in their traffic codes too.

There's a federal law that says that electric bikes that are limited to 20
mph are to be treated as bicycles. It supercedes any state laws.

Quoted message said:

Now for me it is a problem, as I have to ride my commuter bike 23 miles
one way to work. Thus a 20 mile range doesn't quite get me there. But you
can get the range bossted to 30 miles or so with bigger batteries too.

You should be able to get 23 miles out of a kit or bike with a 20 mile
range by pedaling as well as using the electric assist.

Quoted message said:

It would have to look like a bicycle else I cannot bring it inside to my
office either. If I rode a electric bike to work everyday and it had the
range to get there, i could recharge it at work for the ride home no
problem. But that means I am recharging the batteries 25 times a week,
100 times a month, so sometime after two months I may need new batteries.

Again, batteries can be cycled more than 200 times. Lead acid batteries
are pretty cheap. This is still way cheaper than gas for your car.

Then

Quoted message said:

the motor brushes last about 3,000 miles which is a little over three
months for me riding 5 days a week.

If you are so worried about brush motors, get brushless. As I said they
aren't that much more expensive.

Quoted message said:

But this last hot summer had me seriously considering one too. I mean I
have like ten miles of riding home in over 100 degree heat, hot
headwinds, no shade, lots of hot heat rising off the pavement, and cars
etc. An electric boost during that hot part riding home, just might make
it workable to commute in 100 degree heat. Of course the morning ride
into work is not a problem. It is riding home in the hottest part of the
day going home that gets you.

Yep, I find commuting feasible even in 110 degree heat. That's one of the
main reasons I got an electric bike. I take high blood pressure
medication and last summer I had some problems with dehydration when
cycling in the heat. At one point I ended up in the hospital. With my
electric bike I can ride home in 110 degree heat, uphill, into a headwind
and the commute is feasible. Believe me, under those conditions I'm tired
when I get home from a 12.5 mile commute but it is quite feasible.

Quoted message said:

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Paul Murphy" <[email hidden]>
wrote:

>I've heard of kits for mountain bikes, for mountain biking purposes but

I would NOT be using this bike for off road use... but
instead as an electric bike for commuting purposes

Earl Bollinger said:

Now for me it is a problem, as I have to ride my commuter bike 23 miles one
way to work.

Wow that's quite a commute by bike!

where do you live and commute to?

Earl Bollinger said:

You have a point there. About the replacement costs for the batteries and
motors is less than what gasoline costs would be to do the same thign via a
car.

Agree. Do the numbers crunch out so that an electric
bike really is cost effective??

Earl Bollinger said:

Does anyone sell a motor already laced up to a 700c rim?

Good question

I have a MT bike with 26" rims but would really like to
get an electric conversion kit for say a touring bike
instead

OldGirl said:

The bike I bought is an excellent commuter, but there are some
advantages to the kits. And the kits are reasonably priced. If you read
the forums (I already gave the urls in a different post) you'll see that
most of the guys who've been into electric bikes for a while recommend that
you start with something like the entry level Wilderness Energy kit and go
from there.

The Wilderness Energy kit is the one I was thinking of
using

is it any good?

OldGirl said:

You can get a Wilderness Energy front wheel kit for $349 from a number of
vendors on Ebay.

That's what I was thinking of getting for my old mt
bike

Are they any good?

You can get motors laced to any sized wheel from 12,16, 20,24, 26 to 700.

Keep in mind that there are a lot of variables. Smaller wheels will provide
more torque. Speed is largely a function of amps. Putting more power into
your motor is going to make you go faster than skinny tires. You can't use
a quick release on a powered hub so changing tires is a bit of a pain.

Overwhelming you'll see electric bikes on mountain bike frames because the
frame is durable or small folders for the torque. However, 700cc hubs are
easy enough to come by, you can email many of the vendors on ebay even if
they don't say in their ad. If you look around the web you can find them.
It might cost a bit more because they make the 26 inch hub wheels in large
quantities.
<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Earl Bollinger said:

Does anyone sell a motor already laced up to a 700c rim?

Good question

I have a MT bike with 26" rims but would really like to
get an electric conversion kit for say a touring bike
instead

OldGirl said:

Overwhelming you'll see electric bikes on mountain bike frames

That's what I've noticed as well.... mt bikes are used
the most with conversion kits

OldGirl said:

From what I've read the Crystalyte based kits, like the Go Hub, while a bit
more expensive are higher quality.

Higher quality than Wilderness Electric?