Worthing AUK Killed

  • Thread starter Helen Deborah Vecht
  • Start date



In article <[email protected]>,
[email protected] says...
> Roads like the A24 have excellent surfaces, wide lanes and good sight lines.
>
> I think I read that more cyclists are killed per mile in the country, on
> any kind of road, than in towns. I'm sure speed is a factor.
>

The death rate per km is much higher on A roads than on other roads -
about 8 times according to Road Casualties Great Britain 2005 (Table
42). It is also 3.6 times higher on rural roads than urban roads.

In terms of serious injuries though rural and urban roads are about the
same although there is still a factor 4 difference between A roads and
other roads.

Which would tend to confirm your suggestion about speed.

--
Tony

"The single biggest problem in communication is the illusion that it has
taken place"
George Bernard Shaw
 
In article <[email protected]>,
[email protected] says...
> Roads like the A24 have excellent surfaces, wide lanes and good sight lines.
>
> I think I read that more cyclists are killed per mile in the country, on
> any kind of road, than in towns. I'm sure speed is a factor.
>

The death rate per km is much higher on A roads than on other roads -
about 8 times according to Road Casualties Great Britain 2005 (Table
42). It is also 3.6 times higher on rural roads than urban roads.

In terms of serious injuries though rural and urban roads are about the
same although there is still a factor 4 difference between A roads and
other roads.

Which would tend to confirm your suggestion about speed.

--
Tony

"The single biggest problem in communication is the illusion that it has
taken place"
George Bernard Shaw
 
mb wrote:
> Helen Deborah Vecht wrote:
>
>> http://www.worthingherald.co.uk/worthing/Worthing-cyclist-killed-on-A2
>> 4.3439845.jp
>>
>> :-( :-(
>
> That looks like a fast dual carriageway, is it normal for people to
> cycle there?
> I have to say, I'd avoid that sort of road like the plague.
>

It is on some time trial courses and while the traffic is fast its not
particularly dangerous with good visibility. Its not a scary road to be
on, except maybe at rush hour. I cant see how an 'overtaking' lorry
could have hit him at that point as there is armco on the centre divider
and no crossing points. I have a nasty feeling I might know him but
would need to see a photo to be sure. Sympathies to all who do know him.

Stan Cox
 
mb wrote:
> Helen Deborah Vecht wrote:
>
>> http://www.worthingherald.co.uk/worthing/Worthing-cyclist-killed-on-A2
>> 4.3439845.jp
>>
>> :-( :-(
>
> That looks like a fast dual carriageway, is it normal for people to
> cycle there?
> I have to say, I'd avoid that sort of road like the plague.
>

It is on some time trial courses and while the traffic is fast its not
particularly dangerous with good visibility. Its not a scary road to be
on, except maybe at rush hour. I cant see how an 'overtaking' lorry
could have hit him at that point as there is armco on the centre divider
and no crossing points. I have a nasty feeling I might know him but
would need to see a photo to be sure. Sympathies to all who do know him.

Stan Cox
 
Garry from Cork <[email protected]> wrote in
news:[email protected]:

>
> I myself was struck on a quiet country road. I try to avoid main roads
> when possible, as per mile, 6 times as many cyclists are killed on
> main roads as on minor roads. An international statistic.

I'm not sure I see your logic - you were struck on a 'quiet country
road' but you try to 'avoid main roads' - curious!?
Almost all of my 'problems' I've had as a cyclist have been on narrow
country roads. Main roads may seem intimidating, and are unpleasant, but
are not, I think, dangerous.


> What we really need is completely dedicated cycle roads, as they have
> in many places in Germany etc.

What we* need is respect - respect of all road users toward all other
road users; this will lead to acknowledgement of the rights and
responsibilities of all those using the highway.
*we - I think there is a need for inclusiveness among cyclists,
pedestrians, horse riders, and all kinds of motor vehicle users here.
 
"Mike the unimaginative" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...

>
> What we* need is respect - respect of all road users toward all other
> road users; this will lead to acknowledgement of the rights and
> responsibilities of all those using the highway.
> *we - I think there is a need for inclusiveness among cyclists,
> pedestrians, horse riders, and all kinds of motor vehicle users here.
>

Sensibly put.
 
On Nov 10, 10:18 pm, "Pete Biggs"
<[email protected]> wrote:
> Garry from Cork wrote:
> > Awful news.
>
> > A friend was cycling behind myself and Mick, my friend, when we were
> > hit recently, fortunately with minor but most annoying injuries (to
> > myself).
> > He is an insurance man and his comment was "I always wondered how
> > people didn't avoid collisions. I couldn't believe how fast it
> > happened".
>
> > I myself was struck on a quiet country road. I try to avoid main roads
> > when possible, as per mile, 6 times as many cyclists are killed on
> > main roads as on minor roads. An international statistic.
>
> Are there more cyclists on main roads?
>
> How is main road defined? How much data is there specifically for dual
> carriageways, and how big are the samples? These are very different from
> urban high roads. You could call them both "main roads".
>
> > What we really need is completely dedicated cycle roads, as they have
> > in many places in Germany etc.
>
> I'm not sure I need or want them.
>
> ~PB

The statistic is that per mile cycling, a cyclist is six times as
likely to be killed on a main road. An A or B road would fulfil it in
Britain, I imagine. It's apparently a reflection of the amount of
passing traffic. I read it in an article years ago on cycling safety.
If Tony Raven is reading this, I didn't make it up, I can't quote
where I read it, but I did, so there's no point in accusing me of, or
inferring that I'm lying!
 
On Nov 11, 4:22 pm, Mike the unimaginative <[email protected]>
wrote:
> Garry from Cork <[email protected]> wrote innews:[email protected]:
>
>
>
> > I myself was struck on a quiet country road. I try to avoid main roads
> > when possible, as per mile, 6 times as many cyclists are killed on
> > main roads as on minor roads. An international statistic.
>
> I'm not sure I see your logic - you were struck on a 'quiet country
> road' but you try to 'avoid main roads' - curious!?
> Almost all of my 'problems' I've had as a cyclist have been on narrow
> country roads. Main roads may seem intimidating, and are unpleasant, but
> are not, I think, dangerous.
>
You think incorrectly. Almost every cyclist I know of who's been
killed has been killed on a main road or a city street.




> > What we really need is completely dedicated cycle roads, as they have
> > in many places in Germany etc.
>
> What we* need is respect - respect of all road users toward all other
> road users; this will lead to acknowledgement of the rights and
> responsibilities of all those using the highway.
> *we - I think there is a need for inclusiveness among cyclists,
> pedestrians, horse riders, and all kinds of motor vehicle users here.

Those wishes are all very fine, but they unfortunately are pie in the
sky.
 
In article <[email protected]>,
[email protected] says...
>
> The statistic is that per mile cycling, a cyclist is six times as
> likely to be killed on a main road. An A or B road would fulfil it in
> Britain, I imagine. It's apparently a reflection of the amount of
> passing traffic. I read it in an article years ago on cycling safety.
> If Tony Raven is reading this, I didn't make it up, I can't quote
> where I read it, but I did, so there's no point in accusing me of, or
> inferring that I'm lying!
>

You really should see someone about your paranoia. I have already
posted current statistics from the UK Department of Transport that
confirm you statements (actually 8 times in the UK). You really don't
need to rely on half remembered articles that are years out of date -
the current data is usually available courtesy of Mr Google.

--
Tony

"The single biggest problem in communication is the illusion that it has
taken place"
George Bernard Shaw
 
"Garry from Cork" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Nov 11, 4:22 pm, Mike the unimaginative <[email protected]>
> wrote:
>> Garry from Cork <[email protected]> wrote
>> innews:[email protected]:
>>
>>
>>
>> > I myself was struck on a quiet country road. I try to avoid main roads
>> > when possible, as per mile, 6 times as many cyclists are killed on
>> > main roads as on minor roads. An international statistic.
>>
>> I'm not sure I see your logic - you were struck on a 'quiet country
>> road' but you try to 'avoid main roads' - curious!?
>> Almost all of my 'problems' I've had as a cyclist have been on narrow
>> country roads. Main roads may seem intimidating, and are unpleasant, but
>> are not, I think, dangerous.
>>
> You think incorrectly. Almost every cyclist I know of who's been
> killed has been killed on a main road or a city street.
>

Shock news. Everyone dies. Sorry if that sounds insensitive, but you need to
start getting risk into perspective. Start looking at benefitrs of
activities and risk *in proportion*. Nothing, but nothing is completely
safe, everything has risk and one day, you will die - just as one day, I
will die. The health benefits of cycling far, far outweigh the health risks
and the stats do show that cycling on road is safer than cycling on
'farcilities. Here's one example of looking at it:-

http://www.cyclecraft.co.uk/digest/sustrans1.html
 
On 2007-11-11, Stan Cox <[email protected]> wrote:
> on, except maybe at rush hour. I cant see how an 'overtaking' lorry
> could have hit him at that point as there is armco on the centre divider
> and no crossing points.

"Sorry mate I didn't see you", i.e. overtaking by driving *over* the
unfortunate cyclist. Or misjudging how much room is being given instead
of moving over to the other lane to overtake. "SMIDSY" happened to me
this year when a driver smashed into the back of my bike at around 50mph
- but I got lucky, and got away with only minor cuts and bruises and a
a couple of uncomfortable, painful, sleepless nights due to not being
able not lie on a bruise or a scrape of some sort!

--
From the sunny Isle of Man.
Yes, the Reply-To email address is valid.
 
Garry from Cork <[email protected]> wrote:

> On Nov 11, 4:22 pm, Mike the unimaginative <[email protected]>
> wrote:

> > Main roads may seem intimidating, and are unpleasant, but are not, I
> > think, dangerous.

> You think incorrectly. Almost every cyclist I know of who's been
> killed has been killed on a main road or a city street.

How does that compare with motorists you know of who have been killed?

> > > What we really need is completely dedicated cycle roads, as they have
> > > in many places in Germany etc.

> > What we* need is respect - respect of all road users toward all other
> > road users; this will lead to acknowledgement of the rights and
> > responsibilities of all those using the highway.

> > *we - I think there is a need for inclusiveness among cyclists,
> > pedestrians, horse riders, and all kinds of motor vehicle users here.
>
> Those wishes are all very fine, but they unfortunately are pie in the
> sky.

No, they're not. They are reasonably wishes. Very few people actually
intend to kill or injure when driving.

Cheers,
Luke


--
Red Rose Ramblings, the diary of an Essex boy in
exile in Lancashire <http://www.shrimper.org.uk>
 
On Sun, 11 Nov 2007 23:36:44 -0800, Garry from Cork wrote:

> On Nov 10, 10:18 pm, "Pete Biggs"
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>> Garry from Cork wrote:
>>> Awful news.
>>
>>> A friend was cycling behind myself and Mick, my friend, when we were
>>> hit recently, fortunately with minor but most annoying injuries (to
>>> myself).
>>> He is an insurance man and his comment was "I always wondered how
>>> people didn't avoid collisions. I couldn't believe how fast it
>>> happened".
>>
>>> I myself was struck on a quiet country road. I try to avoid main roads
>>> when possible, as per mile, 6 times as many cyclists are killed on
>>> main roads as on minor roads. An international statistic.
>>
>> Are there more cyclists on main roads?
>>
>> How is main road defined? How much data is there specifically for dual
>> carriageways, and how big are the samples? These are very different from
>> urban high roads. You could call them both "main roads".
>>
>>> What we really need is completely dedicated cycle roads, as they have
>>> in many places in Germany etc.
>>
>> I'm not sure I need or want them.
>>
>> ~PB
>
> The statistic is that per mile cycling, a cyclist is six times as
> likely to be killed on a main road. An A or B road would fulfil it in
> Britain, I imagine. It's apparently a reflection of the amount of
> passing traffic. I read it in an article years ago on cycling safety.
> If Tony Raven is reading this, I didn't make it up, I can't quote
> where I read it, but I did, so there's no point in accusing me of, or
> inferring that I'm lying!

Translation:

"Trust me, I'm a pathologist. You can trust pathologists because they
never lie. You can be sure they never lie because I am one, and I say they
never lie."
 
Dylan Smith wrote:
> On 2007-11-11, Stan Cox <[email protected]> wrote:
>> on, except maybe at rush hour. I cant see how an 'overtaking' lorry
>> could have hit him at that point as there is armco on the centre divider
>> and no crossing points.
>
> "Sorry mate I didn't see you", i.e. overtaking by driving *over* the
> unfortunate cyclist. Or misjudging how much room is being given instead
> of moving over to the other lane to overtake. "SMIDSY" happened to me
> this year when a driver smashed into the back of my bike at around 50mph
> - but I got lucky, and got away with only minor cuts and bruises and a
> a couple of uncomfortable, painful, sleepless nights due to not being
> able not lie on a bruise or a scrape of some sort!
>
I must admit I assumed the story meant the lorry was overtaking
something else.

Stan Cox
 
In article <[email protected]>,
[email protected] says...

>
> Translation:
>
> "Trust me, I'm a pathologist. You can trust pathologists because they
> never lie. You can be sure they never lie because I am one, and I say they
> never lie."
>

You've never heard of the term "pathological liar" then? ;-)

--
Tony

"The single biggest problem in communication is the illusion that it has
taken place"
George Bernard Shaw
 

> Shock news. Everyone dies. Sorry if that sounds insensitive, but you need to
> start getting risk into perspective.

I think that I should be aware of that! I'm a pathologist godammit!

Of course risk has to be kept in perspective. I'm back cycling after
all.
 

> Tony
>
> "The single biggest problem in communication is the illusion that it has
> taken place"
> George Bernard Shaw

Another quote from GBS.

There is no more pathetic sight in the universe than an Englishman
standing on a point of principle. ;>)
 
"Garry from Cork" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
>> Shock news. Everyone dies. Sorry if that sounds insensitive, but you need
>> to
>> start getting risk into perspective.
>
> I think that I should be aware of that! I'm a pathologist godammit!
>

Which means you're surrounded by death at work? Perhaps seeing too much of
it means you are over-sensitised to the horrors of death?


> Of course risk has to be kept in perspective. I'm back cycling after
> all.
>
 
On 13 Nov, 18:51, Garry from Cork <[email protected]> wrote:
> > Tony
>
> > "The single biggest problem in communication is the illusion that it has
> > taken place"
> > George Bernard Shaw
>
> Another quote from GBS.
>
> There is no more pathetic sight in the universe than an Englishman
> standing on a point of principle. ;>)

What are all of these English put downs about Sir? There is no anti
Irish sentiment on this ng. A
 
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