Woops!

[email hidden] wrote on 01/05/2007 16:34 +0100:

Quoted message said:

Tony Raven said:

Being rather taller than average in the days of yore...

....but not these days? You must have hit your head pretty often to
wear away the excess height!

No, I took the simpler solution. I stopped wearing a helmet ;-)

--
Tony

"The most savage controversies are those about matters as to which there
is no good evidence either way."
- Bertrand Russell

Peter Clinch proclaimed to uk.rec.cycling ...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Indeed, had you been wearing it, it might have been more than the mirror
which struck you.

??

I assume a somewhat speculative point about drivers generally riding
closer to helmeted riders than unhelmeted ones.

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net [email hidden] http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/

Ta, I missed the hidden meaning 🙂

On Tue, 01 May 2007 12:44:15 +0100, Paul Boyd

usenet.dont.work@plusnet said:

naked_draughtsman said the following on 01/05/2007 11:12:

Quoted message said:

I remember it but from the way it was presented it seemed like someone did
it out of curiosity. Didn't he also don a mini skirt and blonde wig and
found drivers gave him *much* more room?

If you saw a bloke wearing a mini-skirt and a blonde wig wouldn't you
give him more room? :-)

I recall the findings concluding that drivers passed closer depending
upon how 'professional' a cyclist they took the rider to be, so the
wig & mini-skirt would almost certainly pass as a full time occupation
making it less than advisable.

Marc Brett said:

Tom Crispin said:

My body will repair itself; my bike won't. :-(

JPEGs!!!

Pervert!

I've uploaded the mutilation jpegs to:
www.johnballcycling.org.uk/photos/mutilation/

It looks as if WVM drove right over my front wheel with his front
wheel before stopping. No wonder I lost control!

Look how the wheel has been wrenched from the forks, destroying the
SON hub dynamo, and how the front rack is mangled. The tyre has been
forced around the rim, pushing the valve to an angle from the
perpendicular. The ceramic rim itself has held up remarkably well
considering the damage to the rest of the front, but is still a
write-off.

Estimates for the repair bill?

Quoted message said:

Best wishes that you and your bike are soon reunited, both shiny and
new.

Tom Crispin said:

Marc Brett said:

Tom Crispin said:

My body will repair itself; my bike won't. :-(

JPEGs!!!

Pervert!

Not guilty, m'lud.

Quoted message said:

I've uploaded the mutilation jpegs to:
www.johnballcycling.org.uk/photos/mutilation/

Ouch, ouch, ouch, ouch, ouch.

I must confess I have followed your posts with great interest, and have
regaled my children with tales of your wisdom and derring do, and
marvelled at the pictures of your students. This latest chapter in the
tale of "our favourite cycle instructor on the net" has had a sobering
effect on them, but thankfully hasn't dampened their enthusiasm for the
cycling school run.

Thanks for sharing, and get well soon.

Daniel Barlow said:

Quoted message said:

This group does make me laugh -- any mention of an accident
immediately turns into a rabid anti-helmet-fest.

I think you may have failed to spot the invisible smiley.

(Yes, it might very well have saved a lump on the bonce. But so might
American Football-style shoulder pads have saved his shoulder, and I
don't see anyone arguing for that. Lump on the head will probably go
down in days, shoulder injuries can take weeks and interfere
significantly with day-to-day life - I had to learn to drink
left-handed - in the meantime)

-dan

Ah yes, I remember a fall, three stitches in my eyebrow that were out
in a week. Six weeks later the sholder still bothered me.

John Kane, Kingston ON Canada

(Ziggy) said:

On Tue, 01 May 2007 13:05:14 +0100, Peter Clinch

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Some of the anti-helmet arguments do strike me as silly though. "You
shouldn't wear a helmet; you should learn to ride safely!"

Quoted message said:

That's a stupid argument, granted, and the fact I'm happy to say so is
hopefully an indication that I'm not "anti helmet".

Why is it stupid?

Which do you think would be more likely to save a rider from death or
injury?

It's only silly in that the two are not mutually exclusive, but
depending on the context the argument may be saying: "You won't make
yourself appreciably safer just by throwing some money at the problem,
but with a little application and effort you probably will".

You also have to factor in risk compensation. A false sense of
security from wearing a helmet may slightly increase dangerous
behaviour.

John Kane, Kingston ON Canada

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

It seems that if you have an accident while helmetless, either you get
hurt, in which case wearing a helmet "could have made it worse
anyway", or you escape uninjured, in which case who needs helmets? 😉
(Or of course you get killed, and as we all know helmets are no use at
preventing fatalities...)

Quoted message said:

This is, ISTM, to counter the exact opposite arguments that /usually/
come out. We have seen an example very recently of an accident that
didn't involve the head at all being used as a platform for compulsory
helmet wearing. That sort of thing needs to be countered to show how
stupid it is.

Although almost certainly not a useful campaign, it isn't actually
particularly stupid.

A great many people do promulgate the idea that 'helmets save lives' -
including doctors groups whom the public may mistakenly think know what
they are talking about. So unless someone has been exposed to the
arguments that this is not (or only very rarely) the case, working from
that premise (and given that body armour is not actually readily
available for cyclists), someone who has suddenly become sensitive -
indeed probably over-sensitive - to the dangers of cycling and decided
that they want to do something about it is likely to pick on the most
high profile supposed 'safety campaign' available to support.

Blame the people who should know better - those who have been exposed to
counter arguments - not someone who just wants to 'do her bit' to
prevent tragedies and has innocently been taken in by the pro-helmet
machine.

Tom Crispin wrote on 01/05/2007 18:53 +0100:

Quoted message said:

Estimates for the repair bill?

Not too bad. Looks like new forks, new front wheel with hub and extra
bits - say £250-300 plus labour.

--
Tony

"The most savage controversies are those about matters as to which there
is no good evidence either way."
- Bertrand Russell

In article said:

I've uploaded the mutilation jpegs to:
www.johnballcycling.org.uk/photos/mutilation/

It looks as if WVM drove right over my front wheel with his front
wheel before stopping. No wonder I lost control!

Look how the wheel has been wrenched from the forks, destroying the
SON hub dynamo, and how the front rack is mangled. The tyre has been
forced around the rim, pushing the valve to an angle from the
perpendicular. The ceramic rim itself has held up remarkably well
considering the damage to the rest of the front, but is still a
write-off.

Estimates for the repair bill?

No idea, but it looks like wheel being wrenched from the fork has
killed the fork as well, so do check the frame carefully for cracking
or distortion at the headtube joints.

On 30 Apr 2007 23:40:13 GMT, Mark Thompson

pleasegivegenerously@warmmail*_turn_up_the_heat_to_reply*.com said:

Quoted message said:

My body will repair itself; my bike won't. :-(

You know you're a cyclist when after you've crashed your first thought is
of the bike. I'm glad you came off better than it did. Good luck on your
recovery.

Do I get a waiver for first wondering if the woman driving that
monster was going to stop before she ran over me? (She did...)

Pat

Email address works as is.

in message <[email hidden]>, Tom Crispin

(') said:

Marc Brett said:

Tom Crispin said:

My body will repair itself; my bike won't. :-(

JPEGs!!!

Pervert!

I've uploaded the mutilation jpegs to:
www.johnballcycling.org.uk/photos/mutilation/

It looks as if WVM drove right over my front wheel with his front
wheel before stopping. No wonder I lost control!

Look how the wheel has been wrenched from the forks, destroying the
SON hub dynamo, and how the front rack is mangled. The tyre has been
forced around the rim, pushing the valve to an angle from the
perpendicular. The ceramic rim itself has held up remarkably well
considering the damage to the rest of the front, but is still a
write-off.

Estimates for the repair bill?

Whoooh!

Bet the WVM's insurance people will get a shock when they discover that
damage to a bike could cost that much! You'll need to send the frame back
to Thorn to be checked for true, presumably?

£1200, I'd say, more or less. New wheel, new fork, new pannier racks, new
lighting rig, check frame, workshop time.

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/
; ... of course nothing said here will be taken notice of by
; the W3C. The official place to be ignored is on www-style or
; www-html. -- George Lund

Quoted message said:

(Ziggy) said:

On Tue, 01 May 2007 13:05:14 +0100, Peter Clinch

Quoted message said:

> Some of the anti-helmet arguments do strike me as silly though. "You
> shouldn't wear a helmet; you should learn to ride safely!"
That's a stupid argument, granted, and the fact I'm happy to say so is
hopefully an indication that I'm not "anti helmet".

Why is it stupid?

Because, like the man said, they're not exclusive to one another. The
*argument*, a implies b, is what's stupid. That's why I said it's a
stupid *argument*.

Why don't you just read what's been written, rather than build on a load
of stuff that hasn't?

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net [email hidden] http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/

Well you see... If you had a h*lm*t on Mr WVM would not had pulled over in the first place! ;-)

Tom Crispin said:

On Mon, 30 Apr 2007 21:43:25 GMT, [email hidden] (Ziggy)

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

My body will repair itself; my bike won't. :-(

Ooops, forgot the mandatory questions:

Were you wearing a helmet?

No helmut.

Quoted message said:

Did it save your life?

It would've saved me a bloody great lump, but as I told the nurse as
she tutted, it may have twisted my neck.

Peter Clinch said:

Quoted message said:

(Ziggy) said:

On Tue, 01 May 2007 13:05:14 +0100, Peter Clinch

<[email hidden]> wrote:
>> Some of the anti-helmet arguments do strike me as silly though. "You
>> shouldn't wear a helmet; you should learn to ride safely!"
> That's a stupid argument, granted, and the fact I'm happy to say so is
> hopefully an indication that I'm not "anti helmet".
Why is it stupid?

Because, like the man said, they're not exclusive to one another.

Erm, if you look back *carefully*, you'll see that the man who said that
was me ;-)

Quoted message said:

The
*argument*, a implies b, is what's stupid. That's why I said it's a
stupid *argument*.

I don't see 'implies' anywhere.

I see:

| "You shouldn't wear a helmet; you should learn to ride safely!"

Which is do 'b', rather than 'a'.

Would you not consider that learning to ride safely would be a *far*
better use of resources than buying a helmet?

If so, I can't see that it's a stupid statement. Interpreting English
the way I was taught, it isn't an argument. YMMV.

Quoted message said:

Why don't you just read what's been written, rather than build on a load
of stuff that hasn't?

ROFLMAO!

Given that your own reading of the thread was so superficial and lacking
that you quoted what I said back at me as words of wisdom I really think
you need to take your own advice ;-)

Simon Brooke said:

Quoted message said:

Estimates for the repair bill?

Whoooh!

Bet the WVM's insurance people will get a shock when they discover that
damage to a bike could cost that much! You'll need to send the frame back
to Thorn to be checked for true, presumably?

£1200, I'd say, more or less. New wheel, new fork, new pannier racks, new
lighting rig, check frame, workshop time.

Wheel front - Mavic EX721 26in (559) 32 hole CD Ceramic sidewall rim
with Schmidt 28 Dynohub - £219.99

Thorn 531 Steel 1 1/8inch Twin Plate fork - £99.99

Shimano Deore XT M760 V Brake - Front - £24.95

Thorn MkV Cro Mo Steel Low Loader in Black Powder Coat - £69.99

Busch & Muller Lumotec Round Switchable Headlamp ONLY for Schmidt
dynohub 3w bulb included - £19.99

Cateye CC-RD300W Strada Wireless Cycle Computer - £39.99

Tyre - £19.99

Tube - £4.99

My trousers - £39.99

Bent key ring - 50p

Total £540.37

Which, by your estimate, leaves £659.63 for a frame check and service,
which, from the Bandits of Bridgewater, is probably about right.

In news:[email hidden],
Tom Crispin <[email hidden]> tweaked the
Babbage-Engine to tell us:

Quoted message said:

Busch & Muller Lumotec Round Switchable Headlamp ONLY for Schmidt
dynohub 3w bulb included - £19.99

Are you /sure/ it wasn't a Solidlights 1203D that was so utterly destroyed
you couldn't even find it ;-)

--
Dave Larrington
<http://www.legslarry.beerdrinkers.co.uk>
My liver is evil, and must be punished.

Dave Larrington wrote on 02/05/2007 11:41 +0100:

Quoted message said:

In news:[email hidden],
Tom Crispin <[email hidden]> tweaked the
Babbage-Engine to tell us:

Quoted message said:

Busch & Muller Lumotec Round Switchable Headlamp ONLY for Schmidt
dynohub 3w bulb included - £19.99

Are you /sure/ it wasn't a Solidlights 1203D that was so utterly destroyed
you couldn't even find it ;-)

Not a very Solid Light if its destroyed that easily ;-)

--
Tony

"The most savage controversies are those about matters as to which there
is no good evidence either way."
- Bertrand Russell

I recall an unscheduled stop en-route and a subsequent trip in an
ambulance about five years ago now. They never asked about a helmet -
my injuries were to my back, legs and arms, but they did say, when
asked how often they see cyclists in A&E, that they hadly ever saw
any, but that they saw many more injured motorcyclists.

Tony Raven said:

Tom Crispin wrote on 01/05/2007 18:53 +0100:

Quoted message said:

Estimates for the repair bill?

Not too bad. Looks like new forks, new front wheel with hub and extra
bits - say £250-300 plus labour.

SON dynamo, ceramic rim and building =200GBP alone.

Thorn expedition forks, low rider pannier rack and mudguards should be
another 200 GBP.

Plus labour.

Plus a full check on the frame, bar tape etc.

...d

Quoted message said:

--
Tony

"The most savage controversies are those about matters as to which there
is no good evidence either way."
- Bertrand Russell

On May 2, 2:48 pm, David Martin <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Tony Raven said:

Tom Crispin wrote on 01/05/2007 18:53 +0100:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Estimates for the repair bill?

Hmm.. not bad guesstimate. Remind me to not run you over any time
soon.

...d