Gout, Dammit!

Steve Pope said:

My ultimate conclusion was gout-sufferers are in an information
vacuum, and most/all dietary advice is anecdotal or simply made up.

Agreed, Steve. Purine lists are hard to find and worse, usually
contradictory. That's why I'm so verbose on the subject. Most of it
is from my own painful experiences. I had a severe attack that lasted
3 wks where I was bedridden with a foot the size of a football
(originated in my ankle). I was on crutches for the next 6 wks, a
cane for the next 6 mos, and could feel it come and go for the
remainder of that first year. The allupurinal therapy took over 2 yrs
before I could eat/drink anything without a noticable reaction.

Now I can eat pretty much anything with no problem. This includes
anchovies, asparagus, liver pate, etc. I drink beer, bourbon and red
wines with no reaction. I even lost 30 lbs on the Adkins diet. As I
said, the build up of uric acid in the blood occurs over a long time.
It follows it takes as long to reduce it.

If any of you decide to opt for the allipurinol therapy, make sure you
start out with a specialist, preferably a rheumatologist with a good
track record. My doctor watched me closely and adjusted my dosage
accordingly. Turns out too much allipurinol effected me badly.
Initial high doses had the side effect of leaving all my muscles
feeling like when you exercise a muscle after being out of shape. You
know, painfully sore for a few days. Only this was most of my muscles
for months on end. At one point it was almost too painful to just
raise my arms high enough wash my head. After several months, the
dosage was reduced to a point eliminating this discouraging side
effect and I've suffered no problems since.

This website gives a good rundown of the common meds prescribed for
gout:

http://www.goutcure.com/new1.html

Make no mistake. Some of these cures can be worse than the
affliction. This website says there is no real evidence any of them
really work. On that point I disagree. I went through 4 doctors, 3
of them specialist, and even changed medical plans. But, in the end,
the proof is in the pudding. In my case, I can truly say allipurinol
has given me back my life.

nb

notbob said...

Quoted message said:

I had a severe attack that lasted
3 wks where I was bedridden with a foot the size of a football
(originated in my ankle). I was on crutches for the next 6 wks, a
cane for the next 6 mos, and could feel it come and go for the
remainder of that first year.

The podiatrist gave me some sort of hospital shoe with a stiff bottom, with
two soft cloth overlayers that velcro together to keep my foot snug. It makes
me walk flat-footed but at least my foot doesn't bend and pull on the bruise
as much. A little pain relief!

Andy

Andy q said:

me walk flat-footed but at least my foot doesn't bend and pull on the bruise
as much. A little pain relief!

A full-blown attack allows for no such options. When I say "the size
of a football", I mean it. I was afraid my flesh was going to
literally burst open. The pain was severe.

The doc said I'd have to give up drinking. I said, "No way, doc!".
He said, "OK, you can stay like that". I didn't touch a drop for six
months! 😉

nb

Gregory Morrow said:

And some of those "bad" foods are *good* foods, in my case I can't even
*look* at healthful and tasty vittles like asparagus, spinach, and
sardines...all things I adore :-(

One of the ones that really got me was beans. If I can't eat meat and I can't
eat beans, what am I supposed to eat? As it turns out beans don't seem to have
any effect on me.

One thing that seems to set me off is mushrooms. The really bad attack in early
March was right after I ate an enormous quantity of mushrooms, with beer on the
side. I was making a stir fry using dried mushrooms for the first time. I had no
idea how much bigger they got after rehydrating. I wasn't going to let them go
to waste, so I threw the whole batch in. Big mistake. Who knows if there wasn't
an additional problem caused by the dried mushrooms... after all, they did come
from China! ;-)

A few weeks later when my foot was largely back to normal, I put four button
mushrooms on a pizza and ate that over three days. Got another attack as a
result, but not too bad and I had medicine then. I think I have a fear of
mushrooms now.

Things I like that are on the bad list: anchovies, herring, sardines, mussels,
shad roe, asparagus, mushrooms, beans, red meat, red wine, beer. I know a lot of
people would see avoiding most of those as no problem.

There is a genetic component in gout. I have one brother who has it much worse
than I do, and another brother who has high uric acid levels, but no gout. My
uric acid levels (at least at the time they were checked) were in the normal
range. There are so many factors.

When I first found out drinking lots of water was recommended, I wondered how I
could drink any more than I already did. I found out I could drink way more
water, but I have to remember. When you're off your normal schedule at home and
work (and at places where water might not be readily available), you tend to
forget to drink enough.

--
wff_ng_7 (at) verizon (dot) net

notbob said...

Quoted message said:

The doc said I'd have to give up drinking. I said, "No way, doc!".
He said, "OK, you can stay like that". I didn't touch a drop for six
months! 😉

And THAT'S why he's the doctor and you're not.

But seriously, nb, glad you smartened up and took a break from alcohol.

I'll miss my wine and occassional Bud lights.

My bruise is nowhere near as severe as yours, thankfully!!!

Andy

notbob said:

Andy q said:

me walk flat-footed but at least my foot doesn't bend and pull on the bruise
as much. A little pain relief!

A full-blown attack allows for no such options. When I say "the size
of a football", I mean it. I was afraid my flesh was going to
literally burst open. The pain was severe.

I got the funny shoe also. Not just to keep my foot from bending, but also
because I couldn't get a regular shoe on. My foot swelled up dramatically,
although not the size of a football. The skin was stretched so tight it seemed
it might tear. One of the complications some people get if the gout isn't
treated is skin infections. The skin on my foot started peeling off like a bad
sunburn at one point (after the swelling had largely come down).

--
wff_ng_7 (at) verizon (dot) net

Ted shuffled out of his cave and grunted these great (and sometimes not
so great) words of knowledge:

Quoted message said:

Dammit!

Saw the podiatrist this morning. Thought I re-split the bone behind my big
toe. Hurt like hell for days, I couldn't stand it any longer.

Podiatrist: Ever have gout?

Andy: No.

Podiatrist: You do now!

Dammit!

I'll bet it was all the buffalo.

Frantically throwing diet in reverse.

Dammit!

Am on a prednisolone 6-day pak. See family doc on Wed.

Andy
Browsing the Gout threads now.

I have had several bouts of gout. I am now on Alpurinal 300 mg (for
life ). Haven't had any flare ups since I started the Alpurinal. Talk
to your doctor and see what he says.

Andy <q> wrote in news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

Dammit!

Saw the podiatrist this morning. Thought I re-split the bone behind my
big toe. Hurt like hell for days, I couldn't stand it any longer.

Podiatrist: Ever have gout?

Andy: No.

Podiatrist: You do now!

Dammit!

I'll bet it was all the buffalo.

Frantically throwing diet in reverse.

Dammit!

Am on a prednisolone 6-day pak. See family doc on Wed.

Andy
Browsing the Gout threads now.

If'n I was you, I'd shoot myself right about now.

No red wine???!!!!! Screw that for a life!!

Andy said:

Dammit!

Saw the podiatrist this morning. Thought I re-split the bone behind
my big toe. Hurt like hell for days, I couldn't stand it any longer.

Podiatrist: Ever have gout?

Andy: No.

Podiatrist: You do now!

Dammit!

I'll bet it was all the buffalo.

Frantically throwing diet in reverse.

Dammit!

Am on a prednisolone 6-day pak. See family doc on Wed.

Andy
Browsing the Gout threads now.

Andy, my friend.... a few words of advice for you....

Take alfalfa tablets (you can find them at any grocery store that carries
supplements), and eat strawberries and blueberries. All three help aleviate
gout. Avoid high protein (as you know), avoid shellfish, and avoid most
green veggies (as you know). I'm kind of on the same diet with my
hemochromatosis. I can't eat meat ( pork being the lowest in iron so I do
eat that), I'm not supposed to eat green veggies, so I stick with fish (try
not to eat shellfish, but dang, that's difficult) and I eat corn, peas,
beans, tomatoes, onions, garlic, ginger, etc. All those would work for you.

If you need help with recipes, give me a shout. I think we're on the same
diet, now.

kili

wff_ng_7 said:

treated is skin infections. The skin on my foot started peeling off like a bad
sunburn at one point (after the swelling had largely come down).

Yeah, this after it being all red and purple and looking like it's
dying out there on the end of your leg. It's gross.

nb

Andy said:

Dammit!

Saw the podiatrist this morning. Thought I re-split the bone behind my big
toe. Hurt like hell for days, I couldn't stand it any longer.

Podiatrist: Ever have gout?

Andy: No.

Podiatrist: You do now!

Dammit!

I'll bet it was all the buffalo.

Frantically throwing diet in reverse.

Dammit!

Am on a prednisolone 6-day pak. See family doc on Wed.

FWIW I have heard that sour cherry juice is a good remedy for gout. I
used to work with a guy who had gout and he used it. The local cherry juice
producers and vendors claim to sell a lot of it to gout sufferers. It's
worth a try because it tastes so good.

In article <[email hidden]>, Andy <q> says...

Quoted message said:

Dammit!

Saw the podiatrist this morning. Thought I re-split the bone behind my big
toe. Hurt like hell for days, I couldn't stand it any longer.

Podiatrist: Ever have gout?

Andy: No.

Podiatrist: You do now!

Dammit!

I'll bet it was all the buffalo.

Frantically throwing diet in reverse.

Dammit!

Am on a prednisolone 6-day pak. See family doc on Wed.

Andy
Browsing the Gout threads now.

Sorry to hear about your gout. As with others in this thread, I've had
success with Allopurinol. I've been taking 300mg daily for 18 years.
I did my doctor's recommended diet for a couple years first, but we
went to the allopurinol after repeated attacks, including one that left
both feet swollen, shiny and purple (ouch).

With allopurinol, I'm able to eat beans, asparagus, sardines, beer,
wine, etc....just nothing in excessive amounts. If I go too far with
any of them, I get 'warning twinges' in my toes, but nothing like the
attacks I used to have.

Good luck with whatever strategy you take.

steve s

"Andy" <q> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Dammit!

Saw the podiatrist this morning. Thought I re-split the bone behind my big
toe. Hurt like hell for days, I couldn't stand it any longer.

Podiatrist: Ever have gout?

Andy: No.

Podiatrist: You do now!

Dammit!

I'll bet it was all the buffalo.

Frantically throwing diet in reverse.

Dammit!

Am on a prednisolone 6-day pak. See family doc on Wed.

Andy
Browsing the Gout threads now.

Big Bummer!

I am prone to gout because of the BP meds I take. As a matter or course I take
Allopurinal (anti gout med)

In my experience there are several things that might help.

1. Drink more water then usual to help dilute the uric acid in your system.
2. I know this sounds gross but your urine should not be concentrated in both
color and odor. Drink water so that it is as close to clear as possible
3. reduce or eliminate coffee & tea they tend to dehydrate as does alcohol.
4. Cherry juice is supposed to help.
5. The Arthrites website is a good source of info.
6. For me, Ice reduces the pain.
7. See below about the "purines" which cause the uric acid to crystilize in
the joint(s)

From : http://arthritis.about.com/cs/goutdiet/a/goutpurines.htm
Purine-Rich Foods
According to the American Medical Association, purine-containing foods include:
Beer, other alcoholic beverages.
Anchovies, sardines in oil, fish roes, herring.
Yeast.
Organ meat (liver, kidneys, sweetbreads)
Legumes (dried beans, peas)
Meat extracts, consomme, gravies.
Mushrooms, spinach, asparagus, cauliflower.

Beneficial Foods
Foods which may be beneficial to people with gout include:
Dark berries may contain chemicals that lower uric acid and reduce inflammation.
Tofu which is made from soybeans may be a better choice than meats.
Certain fatty acids found in certain fish such as salmon, flax or olive oil, or
nuts may possess some anti-inflammatory benefits.

Avoiding purine-rich foods is only one aspect of treatment however. It is
important to take prescribed medications as directed, maintain a
healthy/balanced diet, drink plenty of fluids/water, exercise and maintain a
healthy body weight. Diets designed for quick or extreme weight loss will work
against you though -- they increase uric acid levels in the blood.

Good luck

Dimitri

kilikini said...

Quoted message said:

If you need help with recipes, give me a shout. I think we're on the same
diet, now.

kili

kili,

Thanks, I will.

Andy

notbob said:

http://www.goutcure.com/new1.html

I apologize for posting the above website. I disavow and pointedly
dispute most of the stuff printed therein. I was careless and just
glanced at the list initially, not reading it in depth. It's actually
one of those health food sites that tells you doctors don't know [censored]
about anything, but glassy-eyed New Ager's and aging hippies eating
garlic, thistles, and cactus know how to cure what ails you ....for a
price. Buncha friggen' quacks.

nb

steve s said...

Quoted message said:

Sorry to hear about your gout. As with others in this thread, I've had
success with Allopurinol. I've been taking 300mg daily for 18 years.
I did my doctor's recommended diet for a couple years first, but we
went to the allopurinol after repeated attacks, including one that left
both feet swollen, shiny and purple (ouch).

With allopurinol, I'm able to eat beans, asparagus, sardines, beer,
wine, etc....just nothing in excessive amounts. If I go too far with
any of them, I get 'warning twinges' in my toes, but nothing like the
attacks I used to have.

Good luck with whatever strategy you take.

steve s

steve s,

From yours and other posts in the thread, I'm very interested in the
Allopurinol, a good safeguard med it sounds like. I'll ask doc about it
next week. I hope it's available in generic and not at designer drug
prices.

Thanks,

Andy

"notbob" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

notbob said:

http://www.goutcure.com/new1.html

I apologize for posting the above website. I disavow and pointedly
dispute most of the stuff printed therein. I was careless and just
glanced at the list initially, not reading it in depth. It's actually
one of those health food sites that tells you doctors don't know [censored]
about anything, but glassy-eyed New Ager's and aging hippies eating
garlic, thistles, and cactus know how to cure what ails you ....for a
price. Buncha friggen' quacks.

nb

You forgot to mention wearing crystals around the neck and various limbs.

Andy q said:

next week. I hope it's available in generic and not at designer drug
prices.

Yes, it is. It's been around for long time and you can get a 90 day
supply from Costco for about $15. That leaves you plenty of dough to
spend on beer and wine! 😉

nb

Dimitri said...

Quoted message said:

Big Bummer!

I am prone to gout because of the BP meds I take. As a matter or course
I take Allopurinal (anti gout med)

<snipped good info for brevity>

Quoted message said:

Good luck

Dimitri

Dimitri,

It sure was a bummer! I'm glad I got to see the podiatrist on such short
notice. A private practice benefit!

I read the past threads and saw many of your contributions about it and
have seen your pasted document in a few places.

I plan to ask doc about allopurinol.

Thanks,

Andy
NOW what's a mother to do?

"Andy" <q> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Steve Pope said...

Quoted message said:

My ultimate conclusion was gout-sufferers are in an information
vacuum, and most/all dietary advice is anecdotal or simply made up.

Podiatrist wrote out this plan for me:
Lower protein
Lower alcohol
Lower caffeine
Raise water
Andy

My brother has gout, bad news for a beer fiend. And he has to stay away from
preserved meats like ham & salami & beef jerky. So you'll be eating lots of
white meat stir fry with brown rice & herbal tea? Good news, you can
probably eat homemade strawberry jam. My brother does.
Edrena