broken clavicle...surgery or not?
- Thread starter James Thomas
- Start date
Believe what you want. It's wrong and irresponsible for unqualified people to dispense medical advice. Full stop. It certainly raises questions when someone opts to take medical advice from a complete, anonymous stranger online, but people will do what they do. As I've said before, sharing experiences are fine. Dispensing medical advice isn't. Doc ***** is dispensing medical advice as if he is an orthopod, as if he has the requisite education and training to do so, and he most certainly does not have the requisite training and education. No matter what he thinks, he's not a doctor. As for getting bad information from doctors. Yup. It happens. Fortunately, patients can get second opinions from other doctors. You got lucky getting info online. Don't mistake luck for smart.drydock said:
Sam, the point is not what we say but what is the best way to treat a broken Clavicle and for an athlete, an active person and of course a woman the best way is to find an experienced Doctor and have the surgery. I don't believe you as a woman want to have your trunk deformed for the rest of your life.drydock said:
Yes the point it to find the best treatment for the broken clavicle, and that's something for which you have zero expertise, Doc *****. Why don't stop assuming that you are a clavicle expert? You misuse terminology, like "deform", while at the same time using that terminology to scare. You made the definitive statement:willy81 said:
That is a completely irresponsible statement since you are not a doctor. Quit pretending to be a doctor. All that you are is someone who broke their clavicle. In terms of this thread, that's it.Doc ***** said:
Hey y'all, figured I should join the club. This happened 9 days ago on my commuter bike. I hit a pothole and endo'd, landed on my shoulder - could have been worse. Like a lot of you, I've got contradictory recommendations from multiple doctors. I'm leaning towards surgery because I'm worried that the length will be shortened enough to affect other parts of me (shoulder, back). And of course I'm very active in cycling, running, and rock climbing.
I think some terminology being used on here is ambiguous and I'm not sure what is correct as we aren't med professionals. I heard somebody say that this type of fracture isn't displacement because there is still a union. According to google searches, displacement refers to loss of alignment which can be accompanied by angulation, which I would say I have. Rather, displacement is a broader term which can include angulation. Source. Of course, other sources say it is when there are two are more parts so you can interpret it how you like.
Anyways, any comments? I know this will heal on its own, but it will be misaligned. Anybody out there let a break like this one heal on its own and can comment? Thanks y'all.
I think some terminology being used on here is ambiguous and I'm not sure what is correct as we aren't med professionals. I heard somebody say that this type of fracture isn't displacement because there is still a union. According to google searches, displacement refers to loss of alignment which can be accompanied by angulation, which I would say I have. Rather, displacement is a broader term which can include angulation. Source. Of course, other sources say it is when there are two are more parts so you can interpret it how you like.
Anyways, any comments? I know this will heal on its own, but it will be misaligned. Anybody out there let a break like this one heal on its own and can comment? Thanks y'all.
Hi panqueques, I am sorry you had to find us but I am glad you did. We are here to share our experience and learn from each others case. Yes, you are right, even an angulation is a displacement even when the two ends hold to each other, as it appears to be your case. Of course the most of us had very clean, perfect fractures where the two ends moved away to each other as much as 2-3 cm or more. Theoretically speaking, even an angulation will change the geometry of the clavicle which will result in the change of your shoulder muscle geometry and this will be felt in the long run. If you are an active athlete it will be also noticeable in your performance. Yes, most of us have received contradictory opinions about the surgery from Doctors with different backgrounds, medical experience and skills. I followed the opinion of a Doctor who specializes in these kind of surgeries and treats mainly professional athletes. I have heard that in cases like yours experienced doctors use a different technique which is less invasive. You must find a doctor who can do both kind of surgeries and he will decide which one will perform to you. PS: from your Xrays it is noticeable that your shoulder has somehow "collapsed", moved down several centimeters and it will stay there if it is not fixed surgically.panqueques said:Hey y'all, figured I should join the club. This happened 9 days ago on my commuter bike. Â I hit a pothole and endo'd, landed on my shoulder - could have been worse. Â Like a lot of you, I've got contradictory recommendations from multiple doctors. Â I'm leaning towards surgery because I'm worried that the length will be shortened enough to affect other parts of me (shoulder, back). Â And of course I'm very active in cycling, running, and rock climbing. I think some terminology being used on here is ambiguous and I'm not sure what is correct as we aren't med professionals. Â I heard somebody say that this type of fracture isn't displacement because there is still a union. Â According to google searches, displacement refers to loss of alignment which can be accompanied by angulation, which I would say I have. Rather, displacement is a broader term which can include angulation. Source. Â Of course, other sources say it is when there are two are more parts so you can interpret it how you like. Anyways, any comments? Â I know this will heal on its own, but it will be misaligned. Â Anybody out there let a break like this one heal on its own and can comment? Â Thanks y'all.
Yup, but not a collarbone. I had a wrist rebuilt a year after it was broken. In general, such orthopedic repairs done after significant time has passed since the initial injury have the potential to be more painful because any soft tissue that has accommodated the new position after the fracture can be significantly stretched when the repair is done. Also, after some time has passed, the bone ends might have to be roughed up in order for raw ends to be in contact and to reinitiate growth of a callus around the bone ends. Of course what you actually experience will depend on the specifics of your injury, the condition of your soft tissue, and a number of other things. Your surgery could be easy; you could feel like **** for a while after; or you could experience something in between. After 16 orthopedic surgeries, what I've learned is that it's tough to predict the outcome and how one will feel afterward. The only thing that is certain is that if the doctor says, "This will suck for you," believe him/her. Your doctor or doctors are the ones best qualified to answer these questions.steven ss said:
this explains the feeling of super-extreme-mega PHOBIA you have against surgical procedures, it is very understandable and I am really sorry that your personal experience was so awful. But most of us had 1 or 2 or none at all minor surgeries in the past and our psychological state is not as yours. A Phobic person like you is the most unsuitable to advise for or against surgery.alienator said:
Wow. You presume a lot. I have no phobia about surgeries, and it's pretty stupid of you to assume as much. You are not suitable to advise anyone to have a surgery. Only an idiot presumes to be able to give medical advice when they are not trained to do so. You're not very smart at all, Doc *****, not at all.willy81 said:
Ah, because I'm not so stupid as to tell people to have surgery, like you, I have a phobia. Interesting. You have nothing of substance to support your positions so you resort to this pathetic game. No matter, what you say, Doc *****, you ain't a doc. You're just some schmuck who broke his collarbone. It's time to grow up and get over it. Alas, if you had actually read any of my posts you'd find nowhere did I say I was against surgery. Rather, I'm for getting sound medical advice, something you don't offer and don't understand. I'm not for doing surgery just because someone else had it. I'm for surgery when it's medically required or recommended. Alas, Doc *****, your comprehension skills are as pathetic as your attempts at pretending to be a doctor. How someone handles surgery is entirely personal. I think it's pretty much a doddle. After all, you get to sleep through the whole thing, and you get powerful narcotics to manage the pain after and during PT. Now major abdominal surgery, that's a different story. Come on over some time, Doc *****, and we can tip beers and share surgery stories. I'm sure your stories will be quite quaint. I'll invite my friends in orthopedics, and you can share with them your voluminous orthopedic knowledge. Surely, you can hold your own among surgeons, right? I can't wait to hear the tale of your clavicle surgery. I bet it's riveting and a true tale of bravery. Now, Doc *****, if you ever sat in on an orthopedic surgery or two, your legendary bravery might waiver a bit. It's a lot like construction and can be pretty brutal.willy81 said:
Follow up 20 days later..... I'll leave the images in the quote to paint the picture...
August 23rd 2013:
They were discussing a hook plate, which wasn't too keen on as it'd give me very limited forward/hunch shoulder movement on the TT rig. Left it up to them to decide on the best solution once they'd opened me up. Ended up with another screw. Weighs 5g for anyone playing at home.
It was a day procedure so I was in and out pretty quickly. Sore as hell as it would have taken them some work to get the original screw removed.
(*I'm no expert. Not looking for opinions. Just wanting to share my experience(s) so others can be more informed if they're facing the same issues)
Two weeks later after a "We'll see how it goes by itself" diagnosis, the broken end floated down a little. No real drama, we could have twiddled our thumbs waiting for it to heal... however the specialist here in Melbourne who put the original Herbert screw in there back in 2007 was happy to fast-track my recovery.... out came the screw, in went a new one today:Originally Posted by gplama .
4th collarbone break yesterday..... thought I'd pop in with a pictorial as I was in here back in May 2007 when I first got this one pinned. I always wondered what'd happen to a pinned clavicle if I fell hard on it again. Wonder no more! Never had a problem with the surgery/pin... (or the plating and plate removal of my left break)
May 2007:
May 2007 post op:
August 2013......
Stay tuned........ off to the specialist tomorrow to get mobile and back on the bike asap.
August 23rd 2013:
They were discussing a hook plate, which wasn't too keen on as it'd give me very limited forward/hunch shoulder movement on the TT rig. Left it up to them to decide on the best solution once they'd opened me up. Ended up with another screw. Weighs 5g for anyone playing at home.
It was a day procedure so I was in and out pretty quickly. Sore as hell as it would have taken them some work to get the original screw removed.(*I'm no expert. Not looking for opinions. Just wanting to share my experience(s) so others can be more informed if they're facing the same issues)
well, because the doctors in the public hospital keep delaying my surgery im paying $10k to have it done privately. sad but thats the way it is i guess. My broken clavicle moved and displaced more than 2cm. im really sick of the hospital and not getting anywhere. doctors there dont even ask me what kind of lifestyle i lead and for some reason just ignore my concerns about reduced functionality of shoulder. i dont believe them when they tell me that a visibly lowered shoulder is not a problem. i had one orth doc tell em that my shoulder is just lower cause the muscles are loose. really ??? well if my shoulder sits lower with loose muscles doesnt that mean i need unbalanced tight muscles on one side to pull them up? i know my body and its frustrating as hell to deal with them. when was the last time they treated an athlete or someone that isnt totally sedentary?
it's very wise to get your health back asap. Doctors in public hospitals don't treat you the way you want, when I told them that I was a very active athlete, they replied that it was time to stop being one. Of course it is not them who will say what I am gonna be. As it has been said several times, a broken cb will create an asymmetrical trunk and all muscles need to re-arrange in order to adapt to the new geometry. Your shoulder is not going to be only lower but our affected side will be less wide compared to the healthy one. and it is lower because the bones are different from the other side Find a good experienced Doctor and go ahead Good luck and update us laterdrydock said:
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