Armstrong Tour Blood Values Suspicious?

[doctorSpoc]

i agree with Mørkeberg reasoning with regards to respecting the athletes privacy before definitive proof is found. Armstrong posting the values there like they mean something, like they are proof of not doping begs for scrutiny and comment.. to do otherwise would be an abdication of responsibility...

“As scientists, I think our job in this matter is that when something gets posted on the internet and is not normal, we need to say that this is the case,” said Belhage. “Otherwise, if you let it sit there and it is unchallenged, then it would [otherwise] be seen as perfect.

“After that, our job is done,” he added. “Any other action should be evaluated by the usual councils that are sitting and evaluating blood profiles and putting the data together.”

c'mon.. how do your values stay flat like that for the duration of the whole 3 weeks of the tour and even blip up a couple times?

 

[No_Positives]

This latest witch hunt apparently can be explained in one word: diarrhea

“If he had, for example, diarrhea, and was dehydrated, it could lead to an increase in blood values," he answered.

 

[poulidor]

This latest witch hunt apparently can be explained in one word: diarrhea

“If he had, for example, diarrhea, and was dehydrated, it could lead to an increase in blood values," he answered.

You felt in the trap!

Diarrhea should have left traces on Armstrong' s pants that we would have seen so it wasn't diarrhea!

 

[jimmypop]

This latest witch hunt apparently can be explained in one word: diarrhea

“If he had, for example, diarrhea, and was dehydrated, it could lead to an increase in blood values," he answered.

Yeah, he was ****ting all over his hotel floor on the rest days.

Just give up the farce. If you're OK with the fact that he doped and dominated, say so. Just don't pretend that the rest of the world is toting around an extra chromosome because they can't fathom in the glory that is Lance.

 

[slovakguy]

This latest witch hunt apparently can be explained in one word: diarrhea

“If he had, for example, diarrhea, and was dehydrated, it could lead to an increase in blood values," he answered.

fine. let's accept your latest "belief." don't you think if he had diarrhoea or was dehydrated, it would have prevented him from keeping up with the peloton? don't you also think it would be a medical case study for all scientists if trouduc had the malady for so many days/weeks and still managed to ride up mt. ventoux? grasping at straws is one thing, but you really have taken it to a new level. you make clowns shake their heads in dismay.

 

[No_Positives]

You tools are looking for any opportunity. Get over it. Lance has never tested positive and never will. How can you believe a researcher who has a ø thing in his name. He was probably doing 'shrooms (legally) as he was conducting his research.

Moreover, after reading that exhaustive article and in-depth analysis on Cycling News, the stunning conclusion was that Armstrong may have doped or he may not of. Also, Armstrong may have had irregular blood patterns due to natural causes or because he doped. Brilliant analysis.

 

[doctorSpoc]

fine. let's accept your latest "belief." don't you think if he had diarrhoea or was dehydrated, it would have prevented him from keeping up with the peloton? don't you also think it would be a medical case study for all scientists if trouduc had the malady for so many days/weeks and still managed to ride up mt. ventoux? grasping at straws is one thing, but you really have taken it to a new level. you make clowns shake their heads in dismay.

yeah, but maybe the diarrhoea was used as some sort of a motivational tool... you know... gave him geat desire to get to the finish line faster so he could relieve himself without the embarrassing skid marks and smell..

 

[jhuskey]

You felt in the trap!

Diarrhea should have left traces on Armstrong' s pants that we would have seen so it wasn't diarrhea!

No s**t!

 

[doctorSpoc]

fine. let's accept your latest "belief." don't you think if he had diarrhoea or was dehydrated, it would have prevented him from keeping up with the peloton? don't you also think it would be a medical case study for all scientists if trouduc had the malady for so many days/weeks and still managed to ride up mt. ventoux? grasping at straws is one thing, but you really have taken it to a new level. you make clowns shake their heads in dismay.

i think/hope he was being tongue–in–cheek.. seems to be somewhat of a troll as well..

 

[slyjackson]

ah man, not another one of these "Lance does drugs" threads. I have not read any of this, but I'll bet you my next pay check that "Bro Deal" has posted some internet based anti-Lance gossip in here somewhere.....

 

[doctorSpoc]

ah man, not another one of these "Lance does drugs" threads. I have not read any of this, but I'll bet you my next pay check that "Bro Deal" has posted some internet based anti-Lance gossip in here somewhere.....

nah, no one has said that any of this proves that Lance has cheated... only that Lance has posted his numbers, presumably to some how demonstrate that he rode clean, but it turns out that the numbers he has posted are what you'd typically see of someone who is taking blood transfusions... just a bunch of scientist setting the record straight.. Lances numbers show nothing and if anything should raise some eye brows... but absolutely, they don't demonstrate by any stretch of the imagination that he rode clean... that's all.

 

[jimmypop]

Lance dopes. This isn't even up for debate.

 

[Bro Deal]

ah man, not another one of these "Lance does drugs" threads. I have not read any of this, but I'll bet you my next pay check that "Bro Deal" has posted some internet based anti-Lance gossip in here somewhere.....

Of course you have not read any of it. You have shown a clear determination not to let the facts get in the way of your beliefs. Stupid is as stupid does. Let's just hope, for the sake of your employer, that the paycheck you mention does not come from a job that requires thinking.

 

[Bro Deal]

nah, no one has said that any of this proves that Lance has cheated... only that Lance has posted his numbers, presumably to some how demonstrate that he rode clean, but it turns out that the numbers he has posted are what you'd typically see of someone who is taking blood transfusions... just a bunch of scientist setting the record straight.. Lances numbers show nothing and if anything should raise some eye brows... but absolutely, they don't demonstrate by any stretch of the imagination that he rode clean... that's all.

People's hematocrits often rise 10% during a three week GT even as their reticulocytes, which are required to increase hematocrit, drop to half their normal values. It is also well known that increases in hematocrits often come after rest days, and such increases are equivalent to what would happen with one unit of transfused blood. It is all coincidence, I am sure. Pure coincidence. It is not like someone who has been proven to have used EPO in 1999 would dope, would they?

 

[doctorSpoc]

People's hematocrits often rise 10% during a three week GT even as their reticulocytes, which are required to increase hematocrit, drop to half their normal values. It is also well known that increases in hematocrits often come after rest days, and such increases are equivalent to what would happen with one unit of transfused blood. It is all coincidence, I am sure. Pure coincidence. It is not like someone who has been proven to have used EPO in 1999 would dope, would they?

as i said... his numbers ARE indicative of someone who is cheating and it's good the people have been brave enough to come out and call a spade a spade, but for him to be sanctioned he needs to be shown to be taken through the accepted process, be shown to be exceeding thresholds etc..

 

[slyjackson]

Nope. There has to be a B sample to have a sanction; but since six of Armstrong's samples tested positive for EPO, there is no question that he was using drugs. Whether the UCI decides to pursue sanctions is irrelevant to the fact that Armstrong has been proven to have doped. Armstrong making a $500K under the table payment to the UCI in 1999 tends to give the UCI a reason to look the other way.[/QUOTE]

See I told you that you had inserted some internet based gossip in a post somewhere in this thread. I knew it !!! Typical "Sniffer"

 

[Cobblestones]

as i said... his numbers ARE indicative of someone who is cheating and it's good the people have been brave enough to come out and call a spade a spade, but for him to be sanctioned he needs to be shown to be taken through the accepted process, be shown to be exceeding thresholds etc..

And let's not forget, we haven't seen numbers for Contador or the Schlecklet. Who knows how that looks like.

 

[Bro Deal]

See I told you that you had inserted some internet based gossip in a post somewhere in this thread. I knew it !!! Typical "Sniffer"

This is just so typical of a saddle sniffer it is hilarious. Once again a moron proves that he does not know what he is talking about. One wonders whether you have to be born this stupid or whether it takes years of practice.

Armstrong admitted paying the UCI in his deposition during the SCA arbitration. Sylvia Schenk, when she was running for UCI president, revealed that Armstrong had made an undisclosed payment to the UCI.

 

[slovakguy]

easy, bro. it could be that sly simply didn't follow the livestrong bracelet instructions and decided to wear it as a necklace. you might be explaining things too fast for sly to understand.

 

[Leafer]

Nope. There has to be a B sample to have a sanction; but since six of Armstrong's samples tested positive for EPO, there is no question that he was using drugs. Whether the UCI decides to pursue sanctions is irrelevant to the fact that Armstrong has been proven to have doped. Armstrong making a $500K under the table payment to the UCI in 1999 tends to give the UCI a reason to look the other way.[/QUOTE]

See I told you that you had inserted some internet based gossip in a post somewhere in this thread. I knew it !!! Typical "Sniffer"

This has been known for years and was confirmed publicly by Armstrong.

Six-time Tour de France champion Lance Armstrong quietly gave money to the UCI to help in the fight against doping. According to a report by Eurosport, Armstrong gave the UCI a “fair amount of money” several years ago to help discover new anti-doping methods...Armstrong wouldn’t disclose the amount of money or what it was specifically spent on.

Thursday's Eurofile: Giro dispute settled; Armstrong aids in anti-doping effort - VeloNews

So I'm a little confused as to where the "internet based gossip" part comes in?