SWT bus refuses Brommie

On Sun, 26 Nov 2006 19:25:38 +0000 someone who may be John B
<[email hidden]> wrote this:-

Quoted message said:

Ms Jobsworth decided that a Brompton was a 'Bike' and its "No bikes".
Despite protestations by the SWT Asssistant, she was adamant. While
loading cases which were twice the size of the Brommie, she repeated "No
bikes, and 'that's' a bike".
She drove her coach off.

The Assistant got the Station Manager, who came down and spoke to me.
He was pleasant and very concerned that a folding bike had been refused.
He promised I could go on the next coach (1hr later) and that if the
driver was "awkward", he would give me a bin-bag, explaining that's the
way cyclists got around the 'Southern ban'.

Contact Passenger Focus and start stirring.

--
David Hansen, Edinburgh
I will *always* explain revoked encryption keys, unless RIP prevents me
http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts2000/00023--e.htm#54

John B said:

Ms Jobsworth decided that a Brompton was a 'Bike' and its "No bikes".
Despite protestations by the SWT Asssistant, she was adamant. While
loading cases which were twice the size of the Brommie, she repeated "No
bikes, and 'that's' a bike".
She drove her coach off.

Sounds about right. The best one I had was when I boarded a
replacement coach at MK Central with a cup of coffee in my hand (which,
of course, is sold on trains, never mind just being allowed). The
driver then had a row with a member of station staff about the "idiot"
who had just got on with a cup of coffee that "of course" wasn't
allowed, and that the station staff should go and throw the "idiot"
off. He didn't have the guts to do so, just as the bus driver didn't
have the guts to say anything to my face[1] when I actually got on.

However, I do remember seeing someone loading a normal non-folding bike
into the luggage space of a replacement coach at Preston a couple of
years ago, so it does go both ways.

I think if I owned a Brompton, I'd just keep a bin bag (as noted below)
attached somewhere to deal with jobsworths. If it's in a bag, it's
luggage, and nobody would know any different.

[1] "Please don't bring coffee on the coach" would have been perfectly
acceptable. If that approach had been used, the coffee wouldn't have
been brought on the coach; I'd have finished it before boarding.
Politeness can get you a long way.

Neil

Neil Williams said:

However, I do remember seeing someone loading a normal non-folding bike
into the luggage space of a replacement coach at Preston a couple of
years ago, so it does go both ways.

That has been happenning regularly on the replacement buses at Basingstoke,
and the railway staff and coach drivers have been helping load.
That's what makes today's episode all the more annoying.

Quoted message said:

I think if I owned a Brompton, I'd just keep a bin bag (as noted below)
attached somewhere to deal with jobsworths. If it's in a bag, it's
luggage, and nobody would know any different.

That's what the Station Manager recommended.

The big problem is inconsistecy. All year they have been accepting brommies
a- and other bikes - and today a Ms Jobsworth decides to throw a strop.

Quoted message said:

[1] "Please don't bring coffee on the coach" would have been perfectly
acceptable. If that approach had been used, the coffee wouldn't have
been brought on the coach; I'd have finished it before boarding.
Politeness can get you a long way.

Unfortunately politeness is not a concept that comes naturally to bus
drivers.

Next Easter may be even more fun.
They are closing the main lines for a full consecutive 10 days.

John B

Maybe you could ask them why they have such a poor policy. According to the
we their public email address is

[email hidden]

:-)

Josey said:

Maybe you could ask them why they have such a poor policy. According to the
we their public email address is

[email hidden]

Unless someone is hit in the pocket no one will notice.

I suggest:-
Making a small claims court claim for inconvenience and racial
discrimination.
Presumably someone of another race was premitted to ride and you were
not
in that case you have them by the nuts.

If you ask for £100 then the bus [censored] are unlikely to be bothered

to resist.

You should formally request that the rail company explain their
position.
You should request that they assure you that they will not use this
unsatisfactory bus company in the future and ask then for compensation
too.

Refusal to transport you on what I consider to be public transsport
is utterly indefensible. My own reaction would I think have been to
sit on the road in front of the bus and to have called the police on my
mobile citing any discriminatory thoughts that I could muster. Race,
age, weight, sex, I have a ticket and they have a duty to carry me,
anything to create a fuss.

As already stated, a couple of bin bags and some tape could save
you a whole lot of bother.

About a year ago I was refused entry to an empty Tesco store
since I had a bicycle that I was unwilling and unequiped to
leave outside. I just picked it up and said repeatedly - "I do not
have a bicycle this is just some metal stuff" and eventually
I was let in.

Satisfyingly, I (yes truely) accidentally bashed
into a display that would not have been damaged if the
bike had been on it's wheels. It is a LOT harder to manage
a bike in a congested environment when it is being
carried,

I have no idea if the above might assist or not but,
discrimination against cyclists is in my view a national
pastime which I am prepared to be counted on to resist.

Post if you want some money to fight this.

Quoted message said:

Post if you want some money to fight this.

I want some money to fight this.[1]

[1] Honest.

Quoted message said:

Josey said:

Maybe you could ask them why they have such a poor policy. According to the
we their public email address is

[email hidden]

Unless someone is hit in the pocket no one will notice.

I suggest:-
Making a small claims court claim for inconvenience...

I've informed them I am considering this.

John B

John B said:

Unfortunately politeness is not a concept that comes naturally to bus
drivers.

You can hardly blame some of them, being faced with abusive passengers
day after day is enough to turn anybody grumpy.
--
Phil Cook looking north over the park to the "Westminster Gasworks"

On Mon, 27 Nov 2006 14:05:35 +0000 someone who may be Phil Cook
<[email hidden]> wrote this:-

Quoted message said:

You can hardly blame some of them, being faced with abusive passengers
day after day is enough to turn anybody grumpy.

If all passengers were abusive and all bus drivers started off a
saints you would have a point.

--
David Hansen, Edinburgh
I will *always* explain revoked encryption keys, unless RIP prevents me
http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts2000/00023--e.htm#54

David Hansen said:

If all passengers were abusive and all bus drivers started off a
saints you would have a point.

Perhaps. It is notable, though, that to encounter a seriously
bad-tempered bus driver in MK is quite rare (off-hand I can think of
only one occasion when I have), and the reason for this may be
connected with the kind of people using the service.

Other evidence of this is that protective screens are not fitted to
most buses in MK, and where they are fitted as standard on some of the
very new buses they're always left open. This is because assaults on
drivers and thefts of the float are pretty much unheard of, so they are
not required.

Neil

In article said:

On Mon, 27 Nov 2006 14:05:35 +0000 someone who may be Phil Cook
<[email hidden]> wrote this:-

Quoted message said:

You can hardly blame some of them, being faced with abusive passengers
day after day is enough to turn anybody grumpy.

If all passengers were abusive and all bus drivers started off a
saints you would have a point.

It only takes a small percentage of passengers being abusive for drivers
to be faced with them day after day. That it is unfair that the majority
of passengers who aren't abusive also have to deal with a grumpy bus driver
isn't relevent to his point.

On Mon, 27 Nov 2006 13:52:55 +0000, John B <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Josey said:

Maybe you could ask them why they have such a poor policy. According to the
we their public email address is

[email hidden]

Unless someone is hit in the pocket no one will notice.

I suggest:-
Making a small claims court claim for inconvenience...

I've informed them I am considering this.

I just happened to pick a South West Train timetable today. Inside
there is a section on bicycles:

==========

CYCLES ON TRAINS

The services in this timetable have limited room for cycles and we
have to apply some restrictions. The * symbol with train times
printed in red show restricted trains - these restrictions are
explained in the 'Notes' section.

We will carry folding cycles on any train as long as they can be
folded small enough to be carried safely in the luggage rack. Cycles
are not allowed on Rail-link busses or busses that replace trains
during engineering work.

==========

Tom Crispin said:

On Mon, 27 Nov 2006 13:52:55 +0000, John B <[email hidden]>
wrote:

I just happened to pick a South West Train timetable today. Inside
there is a section on bicycles:

==========

CYCLES ON TRAINS

The services in this timetable have limited room for cycles and we
have to apply some restrictions. The * symbol with train times
printed in red show restricted trains - these restrictions are
explained in the 'Notes' section.

We will carry folding cycles on any train as long as they can be
folded small enough to be carried safely in the luggage rack. Cycles
are not allowed on Rail-link busses or busses that replace trains
during engineering work.

I am very aware of that.
I use trains and buses with many different types of cycle several times a week.

The interpretation of the word 'cycles' according to the Station Manager at
Basingstoke, and other staff I have spoken to, does not refer to 'folding bikes'.
As I've said, all buses and coaches have been happily accepting folding bikes - and
the occasonal non-folder.

The station staff even told the driver that folding cycles were permitted, but she
decided otherwise :-(

Bus driving seems to attract the pig-headed brigade.

Here's another that has acted in a similar 'Jobsworth' vein this weekend that
caused gridlock in Winchester...

<quote starts>
Stubborn bus driver leaves town centre traffic in chaos

A FAULTY traffic light and a stubborn bus driver brought chaos to the roads of
central Winchester.

The driver refused to take his Stagecoach vehicle through the light which was stuck
on red.

For more than 30 minutes he refused to move as at least ten other buses and taxis
queued up behind him by the lights at the junction of St Georges Street and Upper
Brook Street.
<quote ends>

Full article:
http://www.thisishampshire.net/news/hampshirenews/display.var.1041842.0.stubborn_bus_driver_leaves_town_centre_traffic_in_chaos.php

John B

On Mon, 27 Nov 2006 19:29:46 +0000, John B <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Tom Crispin said:

On Mon, 27 Nov 2006 13:52:55 +0000, John B <[email hidden]>
wrote:

I just happened to pick a South West Train timetable today. Inside
there is a section on bicycles:

==========

CYCLES ON TRAINS

The services in this timetable have limited room for cycles and we
have to apply some restrictions. The * symbol with train times
printed in red show restricted trains - these restrictions are
explained in the 'Notes' section.

We will carry folding cycles on any train as long as they can be
folded small enough to be carried safely in the luggage rack. Cycles
are not allowed on Rail-link busses or busses that replace trains
during engineering work.

I am very aware of that.

My point is that any claim in a small claims court may fail becuase of
the regulation.

I am convinced that the bus driver was a pig-headed nincompoop.

Tom Crispin said:

My point is that any claim in a small claims court may fail becuase of
the regulation.

I'm sure you are right, but its worth the threat .

Quoted message said:

I am convinced that the bus driver was a pig-headed nincompoop.

John B

John B said:

Quoted message said:

Josey said:

Maybe you could ask them why they have such a poor policy. According to the
we their public email address is

[email hidden]

Unless someone is hit in the pocket no one will notice.

I suggest:-
Making a small claims court claim for inconvenience...

I've informed them I am considering this.

John B

I'm pretty sure the SCC can't be used to arbitrarily claim a sum of money.

--
Mike

"John B" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Tom Crispin said:

On Mon, 27 Nov 2006 13:52:55 +0000, John B <[email hidden]>
wrote:

I just happened to pick a South West Train timetable today. Inside
there is a section on bicycles:

==========

CYCLES ON TRAINS

The services in this timetable have limited room for cycles and we
have to apply some restrictions. The * symbol with train times
printed in red show restricted trains - these restrictions are
explained in the 'Notes' section.

We will carry folding cycles on any train as long as they can be
folded small enough to be carried safely in the luggage rack. Cycles
are not allowed on Rail-link busses or busses that replace trains
during engineering work.

I am very aware of that.
I use trains and buses with many different types of cycle several times a
week.

The interpretation of the word 'cycles' according to the Station Manager
at
Basingstoke, and other staff I have spoken to, does not refer to 'folding
bikes'.
As I've said, all buses and coaches have been happily accepting folding
bikes - and
the occasonal non-folder.

The station staff even told the driver that folding cycles were permitted,
but she
decided otherwise :-(

Bus driving seems to attract the pig-headed brigade.

OI !!!!

Quoted message said:

Here's another that has acted in a similar 'Jobsworth' vein this weekend
that
caused gridlock in Winchester...

<quote starts>
Stubborn bus driver leaves town centre traffic in chaos

A FAULTY traffic light and a stubborn bus driver brought chaos to the
roads of
central Winchester.

The driver refused to take his Stagecoach vehicle through the light which
was stuck
on red.

For more than 30 minutes he refused to move as at least ten other buses
and taxis
queued up behind him by the lights at the junction of St Georges Street
and Upper
Brook Street.
<quote ends>

Full article:
http://www.thisishampshire.net/news/hampshirenews/display.var.1041842.0.stubborn_bus_driver_leaves_town_centre_traffic_in_chaos.php

John B

ian henden said:

"John B" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Bus driving seems to attract the pig-headed brigade.

OI !!!!

I think you left off the N and the K ;-)

I'll get me coat.

John B

ian henden said:

"John B" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Bus driving seems to attract the pig-headed brigade.

OI !!!!

What? Like those too pig-headed to share 'their' bus lanes with cyclists?