Weird Hamburger

Maverick said:

Ok, this is where being a novice in the cooking world comes to life for
me. I know what I'm doing when it comes to, say, sauteing (or sweating)
some diced onions for my sauce but I don't know the correct culinary terms
for what I'm doing. What the hell is the difference between a saute and a
sweat? About the only difference I can see between them is the temp
difference. Is there more to it than that?

Besides the difference in cooking temperatures, a sauté is done in an open
pan, while a sweat is done in a covered pan.

The aims of the two are very different: In a sauté, your intent is to cook
the ingredients quickly, with a bit of crispness occurring around the edges.
When you sweat ingredients, you're generally trying to get them to exude
juices and soften.

Bob

Ellie C said:

I cooked up some American Chop Suey for lunch today, using hamburger
from the local market. I've now come to the conclusion that this

ground

Quoted message said:

beef is just weird. It's 15% fat, so I generally add a small amount

of

Quoted message said:

olive oil to the pan before I start to brown the meat. But, as is

usual

Quoted message said:

with this ground beef, it never browns. Here's the sequence of

events: I

Quoted message said:

heat the olive oil in the frying pan, then I add the beef. For a few
seconds it sizzles normally and then it starts releasing water,

enough

Quoted message said:

so that it's actually boiling and it never browns again. Does this

mean

Quoted message said:

the meat has been watered? If I cook it for a really long time the
"water" boils off, but the meat by this time has turned into little
crumbles and never becomes browned - the crumbles just get harder.

This reminds me of when I used to try buying "unwatered beef" when
living in rural China. IME many PRC butchers inject several liters of
water directly into the cow's heart several minutes before slaughter,
the H20 gets pumped into the muscle and then stays there when slaughter
stops the heart. That way there is extra weight when selling the meat.

Hopefully your local butcher isn't indulging in these practices, but
there is always the possibility that a bit of extra water is getting
into the meat somewhere somehow. Maybe you need to find a new source
of ground beef?

Cheers,

Adilah

"Bob" <virtualgoth@die_spammer.biz> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Maverick said:

Ok, this is where being a novice in the cooking world comes to life for
me. I know what I'm doing when it comes to, say, sauteing (or sweating)
some diced onions for my sauce but I don't know the correct culinary
terms
for what I'm doing. What the hell is the difference between a saute and a
sweat? About the only difference I can see between them is the temp
difference. Is there more to it than that?

Besides the difference in cooking temperatures, a sauté is done in an open
pan, while a sweat is done in a covered pan.

The aims of the two are very different: In a sauté, your intent is to cook
the ingredients quickly, with a bit of crispness occurring around the
edges. When you sweat ingredients, you're generally trying to get them to
exude juices and soften.

Bob

Thanks Bob! This is what the ignoramus cook needs! And, being an
ignoramus, I need to know this stuff!

I've been doing saute(can't do the little ' sign) then since I never cover
the pot but I don't do it over high heat. Is there an in-between? Or am I
just doing something totally new to the cooking world?

I think I'll take up Underwater Basket Weaving. It seems easier.

Bret

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"Maverick" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

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"Bob" <virtualgoth@die_spammer.biz> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Maverick said:

Ok, this is where being a novice in the cooking world comes to life for
me. I know what I'm doing when it comes to, say, sauteing (or sweating)
some diced onions for my sauce but I don't know the correct culinary
terms
for what I'm doing. What the hell is the difference between a saute and

a

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

sweat? About the only difference I can see between them is the temp
difference. Is there more to it than that?

Besides the difference in cooking temperatures, a sauté is done in an

open

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

pan, while a sweat is done in a covered pan.

The aims of the two are very different: In a sauté, your intent is to

cook

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

the ingredients quickly, with a bit of crispness occurring around the
edges. When you sweat ingredients, you're generally trying to get them

to

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

exude juices and soften.

Bob

Thanks Bob! This is what the ignoramus cook needs! And, being an
ignoramus, I need to know this stuff!

I've been doing saute(can't do the little ' sign) then since I never cover
the pot but I don't do it over high heat. Is there an in-between? Or am

I

Quoted message said:

just doing something totally new to the cooking world?

I think there is a bit too much of the pedantic in some areas of cooking.,
and pan work borders on being one.

Think of it like cooking/frying onions - you cook so you get a certain
flavor, not to saute or steam or braise onions.
So if you want sweet, you cook slow and medium until you get that sweet
smell -more for a richer, more caramel smell, longer and a little hotter -
for the dark with the flavor from crisped onion, hotter and longer. Or any
combo in between, by nose.

The terms are kind of a general guideline to get to where your nose and
eye and feel can take over to determine when you want to stop the heating,
and if its the flavors you want-

Take ground beef - slow and steamy meat in the pan to get a liver, blood
sausage smell is fine if that's the flavor you are after for the dish you
are making.
Uncover it to change the flavor slightly and lose more water.

A little hotter and quicker at the meat than you did steaming, and get
drier cooked beef for mixing in a sauce, grey and crumbly, cooked slow
enough to pull out the water so the sauce doesn't get diluted. That's a more
common meat taste, and you determine how long you cook the water out
depending on the mouth feel you want from it in the mix and by watching the
water evaporate.
Get the meat a little hotter and smaller batches so it stays hotter and
keeps moisture, and you get some brown on the grey meat, a different flavor
and generally more juice. If that is what you want for your recipe.
Get the pan hotter still, and small batches moving in a heavy pan with a
little extra hot oil before the meat goes in, and you can have yet another
flavor, that steak-like flavor - which might overwhelm your tomato sauce, or
enhance another - and be just the ticket with some sauces, and the juice may
make another runny.

What do you call each of them? I don't know - I used to, but after I used
them a while and got the hang of it, I found there were a lot more
variables than just sauteing, braising, searing, and cooking.

I do know what flavor I want from the cut of meat when I put the heat to
it, and what it looks like in each of the stages, and what end I want from a
new recipe, so the terms aren't that much use to me anymore.

(As you might tell, I am not a real strict follower of the measurements in a
recipe as much as I am getting the idea and following basic theory so as to
get the same end result.)

Quoted message said:

I think I'll take up Underwater Basket Weaving. It seems easier.

Bret

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aem said:

Ellie C wrote:
[snip]

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Ellie C <[email hidden]> wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>I cooked up some American Chop Suey for lunch today, using
>hamburger from the local market. [snip]

Okay, you've established that you have cooking skills and the consensus
seems to be that the butcher/market did you a bad deed, now on to the
important question: What in the world is "American Chop Suey"?

-aem

WHere I come from (Massachusetts) it's a mixture of elbow pasta, ground
beef, onions, green peppers (which I leave out) and some sort of tomoato
sauce. Funny, when I was googling this recipe name some time ago I came
across a version on a web site for Indian cooking (dot, not feather) and
it was a sort of curry. So opinions vary, obviously. :-)

Quoted message said:

Ellie C said:

I cooked up some American Chop Suey for lunch today, using hamburger
from the local market. I've now come to the conclusion that this

ground

Quoted message said:

beef is just weird. It's 15% fat, so I generally add a small amount

of

Quoted message said:

olive oil to the pan before I start to brown the meat. But, as is

usual

Quoted message said:

with this ground beef, it never browns. Here's the sequence of

events: I

Quoted message said:

heat the olive oil in the frying pan, then I add the beef. For a few
seconds it sizzles normally and then it starts releasing water,

enough

Quoted message said:

so that it's actually boiling and it never browns again. Does this

mean

Quoted message said:

the meat has been watered? If I cook it for a really long time the
"water" boils off, but the meat by this time has turned into little
crumbles and never becomes browned - the crumbles just get harder.

This reminds me of when I used to try buying "unwatered beef" when
living in rural China. IME many PRC butchers inject several liters of
water directly into the cow's heart several minutes before slaughter,
the H20 gets pumped into the muscle and then stays there when slaughter
stops the heart. That way there is extra weight when selling the meat.

Wow, you'd think having water injected into the heart would accomplish
the slaughter in itself. Yuk.

Quoted message said:

Hopefully your local butcher isn't indulging in these practices, but
there is always the possibility that a bit of extra water is getting
into the meat somewhere somehow. Maybe you need to find a new source
of ground beef?

Yes, I do. This came from a small chain grocery store, maybe a bit like
what would be called a convenience store in the US, except that it has
fresh produce and meat. I haven't happened to buy any ground beef yet
since that incident, but next time I'll try the larger supermarket up on
the highway (Hah! I'm really getting used to it here - I called that
road a highway!), or maybe even go to the butcher shop two doors down
the street. I've been sort of avoiding the butcher because he annoyed me
when I wanted to buy veal bones to make stock and he tried to convince
me I should make a stock with pork instead. This, I'm sure, was because
he had pork bones and not veal.

Quoted message said:

Cheers,

Adilah