vortex recumbent

In article
<rcousine-437702.11383816122007@[74.223.185.199.nw.nuvo
x.net]>,

Ryan Cousineau said:

Einstein's first papers, by contrast, were wild, from a complete
outsider, but submitted in the usual way, and most importantly, they
made sense on the face and offered several ways to test the theories.

You can download an English translation of
Zur Elektrodynamik bewegter Körper.
<http://dbserv.ihep.su/~elan/src/einstein05b/eng.pdf>
On the Electrodyamics of Moving Bodies.

As you say it is pure mainstream physics.
Well worth reading. Some of it is only
accessible with a year of classical electrodynamics.

--
Michael Press

ST LOUIS PADUCAH MOBLIE AND POITNS SOUTH NOOOOOOOOWWWWWWWWWW BOARDING!

In article
<[email hidden]
egroups.com>,

Quoted post said:

Ryan Cousineau said:

I was having a pretty grumpy day until I sat down on my couch to eat
some chicken soup and absorb some Usenet.

Tell me,

What kind of life did your chicken have before you ate it? Was it a
healthy happy chicken? You have any rational arguments for you and me
to treat those chickens this way? Should a chicken not be something
that makes you happy when you see one? Why would we put them in
torture chambers? Because it costs less coupons like this? Treating
them in some normal way would require faces of George Washington
printed on trees?

Those Asian sweatshop workers are not allowed to say anything bad
about their company. Iike having a 36 hour shift then 2 hours off then
8 hour shift then 8 hours "freedom" and starting from the beginning
again. They are not allowed to say all this bad things about the
company to our western production control squads. It makes perfect
sense to them.

We are the high class slaves of our fascist dictators. Every kind of
"something for nothing" has been replaced with slavery. Suggesting
elsewise makes the person a crackpot.

It's crackpot this, crackpot that... truthy?, conspiracytheorist?,
extreamist, moving on to terrorists.... Al kaydah! jajajajaja

I want to talk about my vortex recumbent idea here. With your
offending [censored] waxed onto the topic this becomes increasingly less
likely to happen.

As-if that little tuf tuf of yours could push my train of thought to
the scrapyard.

Let me put a swastika sticker on it for you.

ROFL!

I am absolutely convinced that you are not a crackpot.

--
Michael Press

Michael Press said:

In article
<rcousine-437702.11383816122007@[74.223.185.199.nw.nuvo
x.net]>,

Ryan Cousineau said:

Einstein's first papers, by contrast, were wild, from a complete
outsider, but submitted in the usual way, and most importantly, they
made sense on the face and offered several ways to test the theories.

You can download an English translation of
Zur Elektrodynamik bewegter Körper.
<http://dbserv.ihep.su/~elan/src/einstein05b/eng.pdf>
On the Electrodyamics of Moving Bodies.

As you say it is pure mainstream physics.
Well worth reading. Some of it is only
accessible with a year of classical electrodynamics.

I have a classic Electrolux. Would that help? -- Jay Beattie.

Quoted post said:

You still don't want a self-propelled bike?

I wish you'd self-propel yourself in front of a truck and put us all
out of your misery.

R

On Dec 19, 6:51 pm, "Kerry Montgomery" <[email hidden]> wrote:
"We are a group of alternative energy enthusiasts who want to spread
the message that It's EASY to make your own power FROM SCRATCH.
Otherpower.com's headquarters is located in a remote part of the
Northern Colorado mountains, 15 miles past the nearest power pole or
phone line. All of our houses and shops run on only solar, wind, water
and generator power...not because we are trying to make some sort of
political or environmental statement, but because these are the only
options available. And we refuse to move to town."

I like it how you apologise in advance for having a political opinion.

Anyway thanks for your comment on my windmill idea Kerry Montgomery.

It was really worth reading.

RicodJour said:

Quoted post said:

If vortexes are really 100% undesirable we could fix 2 rotors on the
thing and have em spin in opposite direction.

[snip baby brain fart]

It's part of the original idea now.

This idea allows me to make the vortex as big as I like without
changing the size of the rotors.

I know you are afraid of change.

But you can stick with the 1800 style bicycle.

It looks good on primates.

http://gabydewilde.googlepages.com/vortex-recumbent
gabydewilde - vortex recumbent

Jay Beattie said:

I have a classic Electrolux. Would that help?

I hear those really suck!

--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
"Localized intense suction such as tornadoes is created when temperature
differences are high enough between meeting air masses, and can impart
excessive energy onto a cyclist." - Randy Schlitter

datakoll aka gene daniels said:

not only was that outburst on RC uncalled for but believe you me no
one reads that BS. If we did that when would we have time for
productive activities?

Like posting to Usenet?

--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
"Localized intense suction such as tornadoes is created when temperature
differences are high enough between meeting air masses, and can impart
excessive energy onto a cyclist." - Randy Schlitter

aka Gaby de Wilde said:

...
Look if a guy wants to climb the Himalaya in his wheelchair then I
wish him all the best....

I think this would be a better choice for the mountain climbing
paraplegic than a wheelchair: <http://www.mobilityeng.com/snowpod1.htm>.

--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
"Localized intense suction such as tornadoes is created when temperature
differences are high enough between meeting air masses, and can impart
excessive energy onto a cyclist." - Randy Schlitter

Quoted message said:

On Dec 19, 5:45 pm, dabac <dabac.31u...@no-
mx.forums.cyclingforums.com>

Quoted message said:

Going OT is accepted,

Quoted message said:

fascist
Nazi
-snip blah blah on and on blah-

Godwin. OK, let's move on already
--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

Quoted post said:

RicodJour said:

Quoted post said:

If vortexes are really 100% undesirable we could fix 2 rotors on the
thing and have em spin in opposite direction.

[snip baby brain fart]

It's part of the original idea now.

This idea allows me to make the vortex as big as I like without
changing the size of the rotors.

I know you are afraid of change.

Okey dokey, Sparky, answer this:
How do you reconcile the vectors to eliminate the components that
_don't_ go in the direction you're intending to travel? Ever notice a
sailboat has to tack back and forth? Ever hear of leeway?

Let me guess, you're going to be pulling so much energy out of the
wind that you'll be able to make the bike a lot heavier so it won't
get blown off of the road. That's what I've always wanted - a two ton
vehicle that I don't have to pedal. Oh, wait, I already have one!

If you can diagram the vectors, including reasonable numbers, and it
works, I'll personally open up my coffers and pay for whatever
development expenses you incur. When you're done, ask for Mr. Blue.
That's what color I will have turned holding my breath waiting for
your balanced equation.

R

PS I'll help get you started: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vector_%28spatial%29

RicodJour said:

Quoted post said:

On Dec 19, 6:18 pm, RicodJour <[email hidden]> wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

On Dec 19, 2:57 am, "[email hidden]" <[email hidden]> wrote:
> If vortexes are really 100% undesirable we could fix 2 rotors on the
> thing and have em spin in opposite direction.
[snip baby brain fart]

Quoted message said:

It's part of the original idea now.

Quoted message said:

This idea allows me to make the vortex as big as I like without
changing the size of the rotors.

Quoted message said:

I know you are afraid of change.

Okey dokey, Sparky, answer this:
How do you reconcile the vectors to eliminate the components that
_don't_ go in the direction you're intending to travel? Ever notice a
sailboat has to tack back and forth? Ever hear of leeway?

Think of it like this:

The rotor blades tack up wind.

They are not moving straight into the wind but sidewards relative to
the vehicle. They may spin much faster sidewards then the bike is
moving forwards.

Quoted message said:

Let me guess, you're going to be pulling so much energy out of the
wind that you'll be able to make the bike a lot heavier so it won't
get blown off of the road. That's what I've always wanted - a two ton
vehicle that I don't have to pedal. Oh, wait, I already have one!

hehehe

Quoted message said:

If you can diagram the vectors,

my math cant possibly be good enough for you.

There are enough website where you can read how much energy a windmill
generates.

Quoted message said:

including reasonable numbers,

Doubling the speed of a vehicle costs 4 times as much energy.

Doubling the wind blown onto a windmill generates 8 times as much
energy.

Assume:

moving at : 20 km/hr

wind:10 km/hr

total drag: 30 km/hr

Thats 5600% of the original wind power.

At those wind speeds a small mill can do usefull work.

Of course you would have to go really fast to make this self run with
a small propellor/rotor/windmill/sail. The point was for it to assist
cycling.

The wind force does not drop off when one accelerates into it.
Accelerating is more like cycling into a moving wall.

Quoted message said:

and it works, I'll personally open up my coffers and pay for whatever
development expenses you incur.

I'm 100% convinced it works but not sure what size and for what speed
it should be engineered. Not at all sure about creating a useful
vortex with a prop.

you can help figure out how to build it.

Going down the wind it doesn't work but there a rotor would be a good
means of propulsion. One can convert energy from the wheels onto the
rotor and use that to push against the wind.

This topic is about using the vacuum and the pressure from the
centrifugal forces.

I want to do more with the whirly air.

If you ask around you can conclude people don't know about sailing up
the wind and Ærodynamics treats both drag and vortexi as problems.
There is loads of documentation on making wind and vortexi go away.
Same goes for resonance, and Æroflutter.

It's far far from an inspired mindset. It's like playing a victim
role. It's problem~thinking, looking for problems means you will find
them. It's just like looking for solutions. I prefer to look for the
fun of looking and develop the skill of looking. :-o)

Things are not what they seem! I can tell you that much already! If I
wouldn't be so busy looking at things I would see enough problems to
spend lifetimes complaining about. lol

lets give an example. I was looking into this.

I see a tire drags air along it's rim, this airstream becomes thicker
and more violent when you go faster.

http://gabydewilde.googlepages.com/wheel-cover-turbine

I'm not complaining about how Aerodynamics works I'm merely observing
how a mindset doesn't try to create that what it refers to as
"problems".

Lots of people think propelling up the wind is impossible.

But it's forces not work, so it's just a mater of gearing.

It makes me think there is lots to be discovered here.

:-)

Quoted post said:

A vortex it will always have some vacuum at it's center, it will also
have some pressure towards it's edges. Using some drag and the wind
to rotate a cone we can have it suck an aerodynamic body into this
"hole" then squeezing it forwards.

I tried to illustrate it a bit below.

Enjoy.

http://gabydewilde.googlepages.com/vortex-recumbent

This is a great page with the amazing Helica devices on it.

http://www.dself.dsl.pipex.com/MUSEUM/TRANSPORT/helica/helica.htm

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ducted_fan

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Centrifugal_fan

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Impeller

http://gabydewilde.googlepages.com/vortex-recumbent
gabydewilde - vortex recumbent