vampires strike

Hobbes@spnb&s.com said:

MagillaGorilla said:

Dan Gregory said:

MagillaGorilla wrote:

>So then how come some riders are allowed exemptions (i.e. Vaughters)?
>How can the UCI prove they have a naturally high hematocrit?

Not 100% proof but Wegelius had family members tested

Did you see the test results or are you going by what Wegelius said?
Because if you go by what a cyclist says, then 60% of pro cyclists have
clinical asthma.

Yet the rate of clinical asthma in the normal adult population is
probably like 0.4%. In cycling it's like 60%.

I have asthma, but if I didn't race or train to race I would never need
treatment for it. Never even got diagnosed until mid life.

Guys who simply amble through life don't have EIA.

That 0.4% thing, you just made that up.

You have asthma because you WANT to have asthma. It gives you an excuse
for why you got dropped or aren't as good as you want to be. That's
where the diagnosis of asthma comes from in cyclists.

At the pro level it comes from riders who think inhalers will give them
a steroidal effect and 'open up their lungs.'

Your doctor rubber stamped your diagnosis.

Thanks,

Magilla

Phil Holman said:

"Bill C" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Phil Holman' piholmanc@yourservice said:

<Hobbes@spnb&s.com> wrote in message

news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

On Sat, 29 Mar 2008 16:17:41 -0400, MagillaGorilla <[email hidden]>
wrote:

Quoted message said:

>Dan Gregory wrote:

Quoted message said:

>>MagillaGorilla wrote:

Quoted message said:

>>>So then how come some riders are allowed exemptions (i.e.
>>>Vaughters)?
>>>How can the UCI prove they have a naturally high hematocrit?

Quoted message said:

>>Not 100% proof but Wegelius had family members tested

Quoted message said:

>Did you see the test results or are you going by what Wegelius said?
>Because if you go by what a cyclist says, then 60% of pro cyclists
>have
>clinical asthma.

Quoted message said:

>Yet the rate of clinical asthma in the normal adult population is
>probably like 0.4%. In cycling it's like 60%.

Quoted message said:

I have asthma, but if I didn't race or train to race I would never
need
treatment for it. Never even got diagnosed until mid life.

Quoted message said:

Guys who simply amble through life don't have EIA.

Quoted message said:

That 0.4% thing, you just made that up.

Right, according to the Summary Health Statistics for U.S. Adults:
National Health Interview Survey, 2003, about 10% of the adult
population has been diagnosed with asthma at some point and 6% still
have it. One might expect the incidence to be less in professional
cyclists but probably not as low as 0.4%.

Phil H- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Why would anyone expect it to be less? Given the ties of air pollution
to Asthma, and the amount of polluted air endurance athlete's move
through their lungs I'd expect incidents and cases to be higher.
Bill C

Purely my opinion. I would expect asthmatics less likely to choose
cycling as a profession.

Phil H

What you're really saying is that about 65 pro cyclists are liars. I agree.

Thanks,

Magilla

Phil Holman said:

"Michael Press" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>,

Phil Holman' piholmanc@yourservice said:

<Hobbes@spnb&s.com> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

>On Sat, 29 Mar 2008 16:17:41 -0400, MagillaGorilla
><[email hidden]>
>wrote:
>
>
>>Dan Gregory wrote:
>>
>>
>>>MagillaGorilla wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>So then how come some riders are allowed exemptions (i.e.
>>>>Vaughters)?
>>>>How can the UCI prove they have a naturally high hematocrit?
>>>
>>>
>>>Not 100% proof but Wegelius had family members tested
>>
>>
>>Did you see the test results or are you going by what Wegelius
>>said?
>>Because if you go by what a cyclist says, then 60% of pro cyclists
>>have
>>clinical asthma.
>>
>>Yet the rate of clinical asthma in the normal adult population is
>>probably like 0.4%. In cycling it's like 60%.
>
>I have asthma, but if I didn't race or train to race I would never
>need
>treatment for it. Never even got diagnosed until mid life.
>
>Guys who simply amble through life don't have EIA.
>
>That 0.4% thing, you just made that up.

Right, according to the Summary Health Statistics for U.S. Adults:
National Health Interview Survey, 2003, about 10% of the adult
population has been diagnosed with asthma

Does this mean the a large segment have undiagnosed asthma
and that if everyone were examined the fraction of the
population with diagnosed asthma would be noticeably greater
than 10%?

I'm not sure that would be a large segment but what I think they were
getting at was the percentage of adults previously diagnosed with asthma
(in childhood) is greater than those suffering from it today i.e. some
manage it by avoiding triggers or grow out of it in adulthood.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Phil H

If you want your child to be diagnosed with asthma all you have to do is
tell your pediatrician he was wheezing the other day and had difficulty
catching his breath and you s/he will get the diagnosis. There will be
no other objective criteria used.

This is how pathetic diagnostics are in a clinical setting. And this is
why those statistics are [censored].

The doctor just wants you out of the office and will prescribe an
inhaler and put down "asthma" on the insurance form because he knows he
will get good reimbursement for that.

That's how the medical profession works. But to actually conclude your
child now has asthma because of that circus act is hilarious. What your
child has, in reality, is a doctor who wants to get the new Porsche.

Thanks,

Magilla

"Phil Holman" <piholmanc@yourservice> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Bill C" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Phil Holman' piholmanc@yourservice said:

<Hobbes@spnb&s.com> wrote in message

news:[email hidden]...

Right, according to the Summary Health Statistics for U.S. Adults:
National Health Interview Survey, 2003, about 10% of the adult
population has been diagnosed with asthma at some point and 6% still
have it. One might expect the incidence to be less in professional
cyclists but probably not as low as 0.4%.

Why would anyone expect it to be less? Given the ties of air pollution
to Asthma, and the amount of polluted air endurance athlete's move
through their lungs I'd expect incidents and cases to be higher.
Bill C

Purely my opinion. I would expect asthmatics less likely to choose cycling
as a profession.

Actually the statistics I saw one time about track runners showed that
asthmatics were MORE likely to be athletes since it seemed exercise helped
the condition.

Hobbes@spnb&s.com said:

On Sat, 29 Mar 2008 16:17:41 -0400, MagillaGorilla <[email hidden]> wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

MagillaGorilla wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Yet the rate of clinical asthma in the normal adult population is
probably like 0.4%. In cycling it's like 60%.

I have asthma, but if I didn't race or train to race I would never need
treatment for it. Never even got diagnosed until mid life.

Guys who simply amble through life don't have EIA.

That 0.4% thing, you just made that up.

He surely did if the UK is anything to go by:-
# 5.2m people in the UK are currently receiving treatment for asthma.
# 1.1m children in the UK are currently receiving treatment for asthma.

http://www.asthma.org.uk/all_about_asthma/asthma_basics/index.html
that seems to be approaching 10%
http://www.asthma.org.uk/news_media/media_resources/for_1.html

put somebody on a road with exhaust fumes and they have to be effected

On Mon, 31 Mar 2008 11:42:31 -0400, MagillaGorilla <[email hidden]>
wrote:

[---]

Quoted message said:

Most people in UK don't exercise and haven't exercised their entire life
once

Well, coming from such an authoritative source, that must be true...

MagillaGorilla said:

Asthma is a mentality.

Check this out
http://www.nhs.uk/Tools/Pages/Asthma.aspx?Tag=
and this is from the people NICE tells not to prescribe any medecines
unless they are necessary & effective

Andrew Price said:

On Mon, 31 Mar 2008 11:42:31 -0400, MagillaGorilla <[email hidden]>
wrote:

[---]

Quoted message said:

Most people in UK don't exercise and haven't exercised their entire life
once

Well, coming from such an authoritative source, that must be true...

So you think most people in the UK exercise regularly?

What if I told you that most Americans don't exercise? Would you call
me a liar too?

Just go to your local shopping mall and count the number of people who
are over 40 pounds overweight and let me know what percentage that is.

It should be around 60-70%...the same percentage in your extended family
that you visit over the holidays.

Magilla

Beta(2)-agonists used to treat asthma do not confer any performance
advantage in athletes

http://www.pponline.co.uk/encyc/asthma-is-more-common-in-elite-athletes-35947

so why is the monkey so stressed about this?
Is he a closet asthmatic?

Dan Gregory said:

Beta(2)-agonists used to treat asthma do not confer any performance
advantage in athletes

http://www.pponline.co.uk/encyc/asthma-is-more-common-in-elite-athletes-35947

so why is the monkey so stressed about this?
Is he a closet asthmatic?

I hate to tell you but having a slight burn in your lungs after a 3 hour
bike ride isn't called asthma. It's called LIFE.

Cyclists call it asthma (and their doctors rubber stamp the diagnosis)
only to get the TUE to use inhalers and cortisone.

So called "asthmatics" are basically dopers who have medicalized their
doping behavior.

Citing a medical study doesn't change that fact.

Magilla

Dan Gregory said:

MagillaGorilla said:

Asthma is a mentality.

Check this out
http://www.nhs.uk/Tools/Pages/Asthma.aspx?Tag=
and this is from the people NICE tells not to prescribe any medecines
unless they are necessary & effective

When I post, you read only. You don't respond.

Magilla

Phil Holman' piholmanc@yourservice said:

<Hobbes@spnb&s.com> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

On Sat, 29 Mar 2008 16:17:41 -0400, MagillaGorilla <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Dan Gregory wrote:

> MagillaGorilla wrote:
>
>> So then how come some riders are allowed exemptions (i.e.
>> Vaughters)?
>> How can the UCI prove they have a naturally high hematocrit?
>
>
> Not 100% proof but Wegelius had family members tested

Did you see the test results or are you going by what Wegelius said?
Because if you go by what a cyclist says, then 60% of pro cyclists
have
clinical asthma.

Yet the rate of clinical asthma in the normal adult population is
probably like 0.4%. In cycling it's like 60%.

I have asthma, but if I didn't race or train to race I would never
need
treatment for it. Never even got diagnosed until mid life.

Guys who simply amble through life don't have EIA.

That 0.4% thing, you just made that up.

Right, according to the Summary Health Statistics for U.S. Adults:
National Health Interview Survey, 2003, about 10% of the adult
population has been diagnosed with asthma at some point and 6% still
have it. One might expect the incidence to be less in professional
cyclists but probably not as low as 0.4%.

I'd expect it to be higher in pro cyclists than in the general population. The
testing of xc skiers shows the rate goes up over the years. Cycling isn't as
rough on the airways as xc skiing, but it still does damage.

Dan Gregory said:

Hobbes@spnb&s.com said:

On Sat, 29 Mar 2008 16:17:41 -0400, MagillaGorilla <[email hidden]> wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> MagillaGorilla wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Yet the rate of clinical asthma in the normal adult population is
probably like 0.4%. In cycling it's like 60%.

I have asthma, but if I didn't race or train to race I would never need
treatment for it. Never even got diagnosed until mid life.

Guys who simply amble through life don't have EIA.

That 0.4% thing, you just made that up.

He surely did if the UK is anything to go by:-
# 5.2m people in the UK are currently receiving treatment for asthma.
# 1.1m children in the UK are currently receiving treatment for asthma.

http://www.asthma.org.uk/all_about_asthma/asthma_basics/index.html
that seems to be approaching 10%
http://www.asthma.org.uk/news_media/media_resources/for_1.html

put somebody on a road with exhaust fumes and they have to be effected

Don't I remember reading of killer smogs in London as recently as the 1960s?

I don't imagine coal burning is common anymore and I'd assume (hope) the power
plants have scrubbers on them by now. Still, I remember how long severe
pollution was a major problem in American cities and it still has its effects.

Hobbes@spnb&s.com said:

Phil Holman' piholmanc@yourservice said:

<Hobbes@spnb&s.com> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

On Sat, 29 Mar 2008 16:17:41 -0400, MagillaGorilla <[email hidden]>
wrote:

>Dan Gregory wrote:
>
>
>>MagillaGorilla wrote:
>>
>>
>>>So then how come some riders are allowed exemptions (i.e.
>>>Vaughters)?
>>>How can the UCI prove they have a naturally high hematocrit?
>>
>>
>>Not 100% proof but Wegelius had family members tested
>
>
>Did you see the test results or are you going by what Wegelius said?
>Because if you go by what a cyclist says, then 60% of pro cyclists
>have
>clinical asthma.
>
>Yet the rate of clinical asthma in the normal adult population is
>probably like 0.4%. In cycling it's like 60%.

I have asthma, but if I didn't race or train to race I would never
need
treatment for it. Never even got diagnosed until mid life.

Guys who simply amble through life don't have EIA.

That 0.4% thing, you just made that up.

Right, according to the Summary Health Statistics for U.S. Adults:
National Health Interview Survey, 2003, about 10% of the adult
population has been diagnosed with asthma at some point and 6% still
have it. One might expect the incidence to be less in professional
cyclists but probably not as low as 0.4%.

I'd expect it to be higher in pro cyclists than in the general population. The
testing of xc skiers shows the rate goes up over the years. Cycling isn't as
rough on the airways as xc skiing, but it still does damage.

This conversation is pseudo-intellectual [censored].

Answer this question: how come women pro cyclists don't have asthma then?

Did Lance breathe different air than the other cyclists? He never got
asthma? Neither did LeMond, Hinault, Indurain, etc.

Who told you exercise is "rough on the airways?"

Nice of you to quote cross-country skiiers - s sport known for its
pervasive doping culture that rival cycling's.

All you people are members of the Manson Family.

Magilla

Hobbes@spnb&s.com said:

Dan Gregory said:

Hobbes@spnb&s.com said:

On Sat, 29 Mar 2008 16:17:41 -0400, MagillaGorilla <[email hidden]> wrote:

Quoted message said:

>>MagillaGorilla wrote:

Quoted message said:

>Yet the rate of clinical asthma in the normal adult population is
>probably like 0.4%. In cycling it's like 60%.

I have asthma, but if I didn't race or train to race I would never need
treatment for it. Never even got diagnosed until mid life.

Guys who simply amble through life don't have EIA.

That 0.4% thing, you just made that up.

He surely did if the UK is anything to go by:-
# 5.2m people in the UK are currently receiving treatment for asthma.
# 1.1m children in the UK are currently receiving treatment for asthma.

http://www.asthma.org.uk/all_about_asthma/asthma_basics/index.html
that seems to be approaching 10%
http://www.asthma.org.uk/news_media/media_resources/for_1.html

put somebody on a road with exhaust fumes and they have to be effected

Don't I remember reading of killer smogs in London as recently as the 1960s?

I don't imagine coal burning is common anymore

This gives some insight into your knowledge. Coal-burning power plants
are the number one source of electricity in the world.

Now everything else you said makes perfect sense.

Magilla

In article <[email hidden]>,

MagillaGorilla said:

All you people are members of the Manson Family.

You make that sound like a bad thing.

--
tanx,
Howard

Whatever happened to
Leon Trotsky?
He got an icepick
That made his ears burn.

remove YOUR SHOES to reply, ok?

Howard Kveck said:

In article <[email hidden]>,

MagillaGorilla said:

All you people are members of the Manson Family.

You make that sound like a bad thing.

Atta boy, now you're thinking outside the box. This is what I like to see.

Magilla

MagillaGorilla said:

All you people are members of the Manson Family.

Can I be Marilyn ?

MagillaGorilla said:

How did you get diagnosed with asthma?  Wait, let me guess....you went
to your doctor and told him something and then he gave you a
prescription.  In other words, you diagnosed yourself.

You need asthma inhalers like Nathan O'Neil needs diet drugs.

Magilla- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

No actually they put my kid on a treadmill and ramped up the effort
over about half an hour until it kicked in, and then had to hit him
with an inhaler while he was gasping like a fish out of water.
Bill C

Bill C said:

MagillaGorilla said:

How did you get diagnosed with asthma? Wait, let me guess....you went
to your doctor and told him something and then he gave you a
prescription. In other words, you diagnosed yourself.

You need asthma inhalers like Nathan O'Neil needs diet drugs.

Magilla- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

No actually they put my kid on a treadmill and ramped up the effort
over about half an hour until it kicked in, and then had to hit him
with an inhaler while he was gasping like a fish out of water.
Bill C

I'm not sure why you would that to a baby goat.

But the way I see it, an inhaler would make ANYBODY breathe easier,
which is why pros use it and claim to have asthma.

As to your kid, you say they ramped up the treadmill for 30 minutes
until it kicked in....how does your doctor know that he's just not out
of shape or tired from what was a normal aerobic effort?

Also, the idea that most children diagnosed with asthma get a 30 minute
stress test on a treadmill is simply not true.

So you're basically telling me your kid doesn't have breathing
difficulties until AFTER doing aerobic exercise for 30 minutes, which is
the equivalent of running 4-5 miles. And then they call this asthma?

Sounds like 99% of the population to me, including most high school
cross country runners. This also sounds like a fitness test, not an
asthma test.

When I run 4 miles, I'm out of breath too. I don't call it asthma. I
call it LIFE.

Your son's condition doesn't sound serious if it can only be induced
after he runs 4-5 miles given that the rest of his classmates would also
be out of breath if they did that same test.

Like I said, asthma is a fabricated diagnosis, and stuff like this just
proves it. If you want to find asthma, you will.

Magilla