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Cycling Equipment
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30 April 2006
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jim beam
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  1. On 01 May 2006 15:41:09 GMT, [email hidden]

    Quoted message said:
    Carl Fogel said:

    Dear N.G.,

    Quoted message said:

    We at Well-Written Purists, Inc., are appalled by the hideous and
    unnecessary space betwixt a person's initials, but will not stoop to
    insisting on the comma demanded by common decency before Inc., much
    less the period that signifies that viz. is the modern abbreviation
    for the Latin videlicit.

    Quoted message said:

    John Dacey would inform us that the ancient Greek and Latin authors
    scorned punctuation.

    Quoted message said:

    Two further remarks of interest will follow this lengthy excerpt
    from The Devil's Dictionary:

    Quoted message said:

    FLY-SPECK, n. The prototype of punctuation. It is observed
    by Garvinus that the systems of punctuation in use by the
    various literary nations depended originally upon the social
    habits and general diet of the flies infesting the several
    countries. These creatures, which have always been
    distinguished for a neighborly and companionable familiarity
    with authors, liberally or niggardly embellish the
    manuscripts in process of growth under the pen, according to
    their bodily habit, bringing out the sense of the work by
    a species of interpretation superior to, and independent of,
    the writer's powers. The "old masters" of literature --
    that is to say, the early writers whose work is so esteemed
    by later scribes and critics in the same language -- never
    punctuated at all, but worked right along free-handed,
    without that abruption of the thought which comes from the
    use of points. (We observe the same thing in children
    to-day, whose usage in this particular is a striking and
    beautiful instance of the law that the infancy of
    individuals reproduces the methods and stages of development
    characterizing the infancy of races.) In the work of these
    primitive scribes all the punctuation is found, by the
    modern investigator with his optical instruments and
    chemical tests, to have been inserted by the writers'
    ingenious and serviceable collaborator, the common house-fly
    -- _Musca maledicta_. In transcribing these ancient MSS,
    for the purpose of either making the work their own or
    preserving what they naturally regard as divine revelations,
    later writers reverently and accurately copy whatever marks
    they find upon the papyrus or parchment, to the unspeakable
    enhancement of the lucidity of the thought and value of the
    work. Writers contemporary with the copyists naturally
    avail themselves of the obvious advantages of these marks in
    their own work, and with such assistance as the flies of
    their own household may be willing to grant, frequently
    rival and sometimes surpass the older compositions, in
    respect at least of punctuation, which is no small glory.
    Fully to understand the important services that flies
    perform to literature it is only necessary to lay a page of
    some popular novelist alongside a saucer of
    cream-and-molasses in a sunny room and observe "how the wit
    brightens and the style refines" in accurate proportion to
    the duration of exposure.

    Quoted message said:

    --Ambrose Bierce

    Quoted message said:

    First, note the antique beauty of the double-spaces after the
    periods in the passage scanned above, a typist's habit long since
    abandoned in the efficient computer age, but sometimes retained in
    the early writings on RBT of Jobst Brandt.

    Quoted message said:

    Second, note that Bierce, a writer noted for his elegant style and
    careful diction, has happily penned a lengthy exegesis that likens
    punctuation to fly [censored].

    Quoted message said:

    C.F.

    Hard to imagine such a text being written without paragraph breaks. I
    am told this is "modern" but I doubt it. How did this piece become
    one solid "thought" so to speak. When I encounter such writing, my
    first impression is that I can't hold my breath long enough survive
    with an idea that must be contained therein.

    http://www2.actden.com/Writ_Den/tips/paragrap/index.htm

    Jobst Brandt

    Dear Jobst,

    Your paranoia is showing again.

    No need to imagine or doubt.

    That's how Bierce wrote the passage.

    (Forgive my frequent paragraphing and short sentences.)

    (I gather that it may be necessary.)

    It's just like his other definitions in "The Devil's
    Dictionary," which had no paragraph breaks.

    You may confirm this amazing feat by examining the text:

    http://www.gutenberg.org/dirs/etext97/dvldc10.txt

    Or visit a library, flip open a copy of "The Devil's
    Dictionary," and search for "fly-speck."

    Bierce's definitions began in newspaper columns in 1881 and
    were eventually collected after 1906.

    (That era is considered reasonably modern.)

    (My grandfather read some of them, hot off the presses.)

    Bierce's definitions were published in Hearst newspapers not
    far from your home.

    Readers of that long-ago time were able and happy to follow
    Bierce's elaborately phrased satire and invective.

    In that more literatre age, Bierce was able to quote from
    what were then well-known poems and authors without
    footnotes, explanations, or the gift of Google.

    For example, his readers were expected to know that the
    quotation "how the wit brightens and the style refines" is
    from Alexander Pope's famous poem "Essay on Criticism":

    What woful stuff this Madrigal wou'd be,
    To some starv'd Hackny Sonneteer, or me?
    But let a Lord once own the happy Lines,
    How the Wit brightens! How the Style refines!
    Before his sacred Name flies ev'ry Fault,
    And each exalted Stanza teems with Thought!

    How much was expected from the readers of the Nevada and
    California newspapers was wonderfully explained by Twain:

    "Once, while editor of the Union, he had disposed of a
    labored, incoherent, two-column attack made upon him by a
    contemporary, with a single line, which, at first glance,
    seemed to contain a solemn and tremendous compliment--viz.:
    'THE LOGIC OF OUR ADVERSARY RESEMBLES THE PEACE OF
    GOD,'--and left it to the reader's memory and after-thought
    to invest the remark with another and 'more different'
    meaning by supplying for himself and at his own leisure the
    rest of the Scripture--'in that it passeth understanding.'"

    --"Roughing It, Chapter LI

    (Note in passing the proper punctuation of "viz." by the
    unlettered Twain, who, like Bierce, had scarcely any formal
    education.)

    In 1871, Bierce offered the following comment, which might
    be apropos to your anguished complaint concerning the lack
    of paragraph breaks.

    "A list of two hundred books which it is proposed to
    purchase for the library of the Lincoln School has been
    referred to a committee of the Board of Education, with
    power to reject any objectionable volumes. As it is not
    probable that the members of the committee are familiar with
    a half-dozen volumes comprised in this list or any other, it
    may be reasonably affirmed that a conscientous performance
    of their duty will require the first intellectual labor they
    have ever done in all their lives. It is to be hoped the
    works are printed in large, clear type, with the syllables
    properly estranged."

    --"The Ambrose Bierce Satanic Reader," editor Ernest Jerome
    Hopkins, p. 103

    Thanks for the opportunity to use Bierce's cruel comment
    concerning the properly estranged syllables.

    In the event that Bierce's meaning is mysterious to my
    modern readers, the elegant phrase refers to the careful
    sep-ar-a-tion of long words into their individual parts for
    the easier comprehension of children.

    Cheers,

    Carl Fogel

  2. Quoted message said:

    Dear N.G.,

    We at Well-Written Purists, Inc., are appalled by the
    hideous and unnecessary space betwixt a person's initials,
    but will not stoop to insisting on the comma demanded by
    common decency before Inc., much less the period that
    signifies that viz. is the modern abbreviation for the Latin
    videlicit.

    John Dacey would inform us that the ancient Greek and Latin
    authors scorned punctuation.

    Well, he might have, had he but known it. Perhaps this lack of
    punctuation you cite is what seemed to confer greater measures of
    prestige upon the best orators of this era than to its authors.

    This being RBT and all, perhaps you could offer some proofs about this
    paucity of punctuation. It has never occurred to me that the warhorses
    of classic Latin wanted for more commas. Vide:

    "GALLIA est omnis divisa in partes tres, quarum unam incolunt Belgae,
    aliam Aquitani, tertiam qui ipsorum lingua Celtae, nostra Galli
    appellantur. Hi omnes lingua, institutis, legibus inter se
    differunt."
    (More of Caesar's "De Bello Gallico" at
    http://digilander.libero.it/jackdanielspl/Cesare/gallico/liber_1.htm)

    Alternately, from Cicero:

    "Quo usque tandem abutere, Catilina, patientia nostra? quam diu etiam
    furor iste tuus nos eludet? quem ad finem sese effrenata iactabit
    audacia? Nihilne te nocturnum praesidium Palati, nihil urbis vigiliae,
    nihil timor populi, nihil concursus bonorum omnium, nihil hic
    munitissimus habendi senatus locus, nihil horum ora voltusque
    moverunt?"
    (Toxic levels of orations against Cataline can be found at
    http://cicero.missouristate.edu/~cicero/orationes/in_catilinam1.htm).

    -------------------------------
    John Dacey
    Business Cycles, Miami, Florida
    Since 1983
    Our catalog of track equipment: online since 1996
    305-273-4440
    http://www.businesscycles.com
    -------------------------------

  3. John Dacey said:
    Quoted message said:

    Dear N.G.,

    We at Well-Written Purists, Inc., are appalled by the
    hideous and unnecessary space betwixt a person's initials,
    but will not stoop to insisting on the comma demanded by
    common decency before Inc., much less the period that
    signifies that viz. is the modern abbreviation for the Latin
    videlicit.

    John Dacey would inform us that the ancient Greek and Latin
    authors scorned punctuation.

    Well, he might have, had he but known it. Perhaps this lack of
    punctuation you cite is what seemed to confer greater measures of
    prestige upon the best orators of this era than to its authors.

    This being RBT and all, perhaps you could offer some proofs about this
    paucity of punctuation. It has never occurred to me that the warhorses
    of classic Latin wanted for more commas. Vide:

    "GALLIA est omnis divisa in partes tres, quarum unam incolunt Belgae,
    aliam Aquitani, tertiam qui ipsorum lingua Celtae, nostra Galli
    appellantur. Hi omnes lingua, institutis, legibus inter se
    differunt."
    (More of Caesar's "De Bello Gallico" at
    http://digilander.libero.it/jackdanielspl/Cesare/gallico/liber_1.htm)

    Alternately, from Cicero:

    "Quo usque tandem abutere, Catilina, patientia nostra? quam diu etiam
    furor iste tuus nos eludet? quem ad finem sese effrenata iactabit
    audacia? Nihilne te nocturnum praesidium Palati, nihil urbis vigiliae,
    nihil timor populi, nihil concursus bonorum omnium, nihil hic
    munitissimus habendi senatus locus, nihil horum ora voltusque
    moverunt?"
    (Toxic levels of orations against Cataline can be found at
    http://cicero.missouristate.edu/~cicero/orationes/in_catilinam1.htm).

    -------------------------------
    John Dacey
    Business Cycles, Miami, Florida
    Since 1983
    Our catalog of track equipment: online since 1996
    305-273-4440
    http://www.businesscycles.com
    -------------------------------

    Dear John,

    I may be wrong, but . . .

    I suspect that you have been misled by modern editors, who
    silently include our familiar punctuation and capitalization
    in classical texts.

    As far as I know, the Romans used no comma, quotation mark,
    question mark, exclamation mark, or period as we know it:

    http://omega.cohums.ohio-state.edu/mailing_lists/LATIN-L/2003/01/0036.php

    As the brief page above explains, the Romans used a dot
    somewhat like a period, but used it just about everywhere
    except at the end of a sentence.

    That is, the texts that you're citing seem to be edited for
    modern eyes in the same fashion that Shakespeare is
    improved. For example, here's how we moderns see "Hamlet":

    SCENE I. Elsinore. A platform before the castle.
    FRANCISCO at his post. Enter to him BERNARDO
    BERNARDO Who's there?
    FRANCISCO Nay, answer me: stand, and unfold yourself.
    BERNARDO Long live the king!
    .. . . and so on.

    Here's how it actually appears in the First Folio:

    http://dewey.library.upenn.edu/sceti/printedbooksNew/index.cfm?TextID=firstfolio&PagePosition=759

    Kick the magnification up to 8x and scroll around--you'll
    soon see how much silent editing is going on in most
    Shakespearean texts.

    As I understand it, the same sort of thing is routinely done
    to Caesar's works.

    Cheers,

    Carl Fogel

  4. Quoted message said:

    I may be wrong, but . . .

    I suspect that you have been misled by modern editors, who
    silently include our familiar punctuation and capitalization
    in classical texts.


    <snip>

    Quoted message said:

    That is, the texts that you're citing seem to be edited for
    modern eyes in the same fashion that Shakespeare is
    improved. For example, here's how we moderns see "Hamlet":

    SCENE I. Elsinore. A platform before the castle.
    FRANCISCO at his post. Enter to him BERNARDO
    BERNARDO Who's there?
    FRANCISCO Nay, answer me: stand, and unfold yourself.
    BERNARDO Long live the king!
    . . . and so on.

    Here's how it actually appears in the First Folio:

    http://dewey.library.upenn.edu/sceti/printedbooksNew/index.cfm?TextID=firstfolio&PagePosition=759

    Kick the magnification up to 8x and scroll around--you'll
    soon see how much silent editing is going on in most
    Shakespearean texts.

    As I understand it, the same sort of thing is routinely done
    to Caesar's works.

    Fuch Knaverie to practife vpon my credvlovs Fimplicitie!

    "Firft, we'll kill all the Edittorf." - Fhakefpear
    -------------------------------
    John Dacey
    Business Cycles, Miami, Florida
    Since 1983
    Our catalog of track equipment: online since 1996
    305-273-4440
    http://www.businesscycles.com
    -------------------------------

  5. an interesting method of judging for bearing preload or postload
    is plugging your auditory channels with -33db ear plugs available at
    ungungungh
    placing your forehead against a nearby frame member (the cycle frame)
    and then rotating, the assembly up for inspection.
    try going thru your rig from one end to the other.
    re-vealing

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