Tut, Tut

there is one you know... said:

http://icnorthwales.icnetwork.co.uk/weeklynews/news/tm_headline=gran-...

I know there is a painted section for the cycle path and the prom in
most parts is 10 meters.

But what's your point?

Tut-ing about anti-social cycling or shared facilities is hardly
controversial on this NG.

The incident as described sounds like deplorable behaviour by the
cyclist but the type of language used makes me wonder how objective a
description it is. FWIW a collision between an adult cyclist and a
group of children and adults would be pretty hard to justify whatever
the behavior of the pedestrians IMO and wherever it took place so any
bias in the report may well not be material

best wishes
james

there is one you know... said:

http://icnorthwales.icnetwork.co.uk/weeklynews/news/tm_headline=gran-...

I know there is a painted section for the cycle path and the prom in
most parts is 10 meters.

That's my local cycle track. I hardly ever use it because it is so
dangerous. Maybe now the police are taking the incident seriously
they will uncover just how many cyclists have complained about how
dangerous it is and how Conwy county council (the ones who didn't grit
the road in Abergele despite being told it was dangerous possibly
resulting in the death of 4 cyclists) have done absolutely nothing
about it.

If the incident occurred at Toad Hall where the lady's walk started,
this is a particularly nasty section of the cycle route: the cycle
path narrows to about 0.75m wide and passes between railings and a
lamp post and the widest section of footpath disappears so pedestrians
have to cross (or more frequently wander) over the cycle lane. There
is also a pedestrian crossing here so there can be a lot of
pedestrians wandering around all over the place and it's also very
common for people to step out or swing their limbs into the path of
cyclists along there.
Although this might be as malicious as the injured lady claims, I
would guess that the cyclist had just gone between the railings and
lamp post and had nowhere to swerve around the pedestrians without
hitting either of these nasty metal things.
I'm surprised the cyclist seems to have come away from such a crash
apparently unscathed!

peter

there is one you know... said:

http://icnorthwales.icnetwork.co.uk/weeklynews/news/tm_headline=gran-...

I know there is a painted section for the cycle path and the prom in
most parts is 10 meters.

And as a follow up to my last post/rant here's an aerial photo of the
site described showing the narrowing (the curved white thing is a
private slipway)
http://local.live.com/default.aspx?v=2&cp=53.300271~-3.732099&style=a&lvl=19&tilt=-90&dir=0&alt=-1000&encType=1

peter

"The other view point, there is one you know..."
<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

http://icnorthwales.icnetwork.co.uk/weeklynews/news/tm_headline=gran-8217-s-off-the-beaten-track%26method=full%26objectid=19475578%26siteid=50142-name_page.html

I know there is a painted section for the cycle path and the prom in
most parts is 10 meters.

That really is [censored] behaviour, but I guess we should be grateful that she
wasn't driving a motor vehicle.

spindrift said:

John Hearns said:

spindrift wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

My friend was left dead in the Cromwell Road by a Range Rover driver,

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Errr, not the asian Imperial lab technician? I understood they traced
the woman driver who had been drinking that day>

Quoted message said:

My friend did work at Imperial, but he was German and worked in the ICT
department. I also have fond memories of meeting with him at Linux LUG
meetings and conferences. Thomas Sippel-Dau - only saying this as it is
well worth keeping people's memories alive when we can.
He was a lovely, gentle man who had a fund of knowledge, always ready to
help people. He rode a Farrhad Manufaktur bike, which he was very proud of.

I beg your pardon, that's who I meant.

I heard a woman had been traced. She had attended a drinks party at
Parliament that day and had previous drink-driving convictions.

http://www.felixonline.co.uk/articles/2413/Imperial_staff_member_kill...

http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/news/article-17343490-details/Police+pl...

In case anyone is interested, Thomas was killed by a hit and run
Range
Rover.

The car was eventually traced through parts of bumper left on the
road
and a response to BBC Crimewatch.

It was found for sale on e-bay in a damaged condition with no papers
or
license plates.

At the time of the killing it belonged to a wealthy, female ex-
diplomat
with a reputation for driving drunk, who had been at a function in
the
Houses of Parliament the night Thomas was killed.

After many months of her evading arrest and then the CPS deliberating
about whether to bring cherges, the owner has been charged with
causing
death by dangerous driving and also perverting the course of justice.

There is still no guarantee that the case will come to court but
thankfully it was not dropped entirely, as looked likely a few months
ago because it was too "complex".

That would have set an unhappy precedent for cyclists.

spindrift said:

It was found for sale on e-bay in a damaged condition with no papers
or license plates.

Despicable doesn't even begin to describe this.

Quoted message said:

After many months of her evading arrest and then the CPS deliberating
about whether to bring cherges, the owner has been charged with
causing
death by dangerous driving and also perverting the course of justice.

Thankyou for that news.

On 20/07/2007 15:39, Simon Brooke said,

Quoted message said:

Yes, but I doubt the report can be taken at face value. It's a one sided
report by a clearly incensed witness, with no corroboration, and has
clearly been exaggerated to fill column inches on a slow news day.

Yup - I wouldn't dream of calling the victim a liar or blatantly
exaggerating because I wasn't there. Being fully aware of the general
anti-cycling nature of the media though, I thought I would hedge my bets
with the "if taken at face value" phrase :-)

An example - yesterday the Queen visited the helicopter museum at
Weston-super-Mare. Her visit coincided with my passing on the way home
from work, and the segregated footpath/cyclepath was clogged with people
walking away, parked cars and mopeds. I worked my way through, bell
clanging like mad, voice used where appropriate. I bet someone
somewhere said something like "bloody cyclists swerving about all over
the pavement."

--
Paul Boyd
http://www.paul-boyd.co.uk/

Tony Raven said:

John Hearns said:

The other view point said:

http://icnorthwales.icnetwork.co.uk/weeklynews/news/tm_headline=gran-...

Quoted message said:

Not a nice incident, and the cyclist should not have done this.

Please don't feed the troll. Since its local to Dewi I wouldn't even
put it beyond him being the mystery cyclist so he could come back here
and troll.

Tony

Lol, I am a male and the rider was a female but I guess you can be
different, and i'm not a troll, just a poster with a different
viewpoint and this is a hobby ;-)

A.C.P.Crawshaw said:

The other view point said:

Not reported so not recorded as a statistic

"North Wales Police said they were aware of the incident and are investigating"

And?

You can report things to NWP and they don't actualy do anything. They
even misslead you, they give you a referance number, which is their
internal one and not a crime number etc, so it's not recorded as there
is no Crime No. Ask how Mersyside police reduced serious Crime by 26%.

On 20 Jul, 19:07, naked_draughtsman <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

On Jul 20, 11:45 am, "The other view point, there is one you know..."

Quoted message said:

http://icnorthwales.icnetwork.co.uk/weeklynews/news/tm_headline=gran-...

Quoted message said:

I know there is a painted section for the cycle path and the prom in
most parts is 10 meters.

That's my local cycle track. I hardly ever use it because it is so
dangerous. Maybe now the police are taking the incident seriously
they will uncover just how many cyclists have complained about how
dangerous it is and how Conwy county council (the ones who didn't grit
the road in Abergele despite being told it was dangerous possibly
resulting in the death of 4 cyclists) have done absolutely nothing
about it.

If the incident occurred at Toad Hall where the lady's walk started,
this is a particularly nasty section of the cycle route: the cycle
path narrows to about 0.75m wide and passes between railings and a
lamp post and the widest section of footpath disappears so pedestrians
have to cross (or more frequently wander) over the cycle lane. There
is also a pedestrian crossing here so there can be a lot of
pedestrians wandering around all over the place and it's also very
common for people to step out or swing their limbs into the path of
cyclists along there.
Although this might be as malicious as the injured lady claims, I
would guess that the cyclist had just gone between the railings and
lamp post and had nowhere to swerve around the pedestrians without
hitting either of these nasty metal things.
I'm surprised the cyclist seems to have come away from such a crash
apparently unscathed!

peter

Should the cyclist have slowed down then, in anticipation of having to
stop or do cyclists have the right of way?

On 20 Jul, 19:23, naked_draughtsman <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

On Jul 20, 11:45 am, "The other view point, there is one you know..."

Quoted message said:

http://icnorthwales.icnetwork.co.uk/weeklynews/news/tm_headline=gran-...

Quoted message said:

I know there is a painted section for the cycle path and the prom in
most parts is 10 meters.

And as a follow up to my last post/rant here's an aerial photo of the
site described showing the narrowing (the curved white thing is a
private slipway)http://local.live.com/default.aspx?v=2&cp=53.300271~-3.732099&style=a...

peter

Where does the cycle path start again after the Cayley towards
Llandudno?

Summer holidays and schools out, need a further ride...

The other view point said:

Should the cyclist have slowed down then, in anticipation of having to
stop or do cyclists have the right of way?

Should you get lost?

John Hearns said:

The other view point said:

Should the cyclist have slowed down then, in anticipation of having to
stop or do cyclists have the right of way?

Should you get lost?

Nah, I know my way around here...

How about you?

The other view point said:

Nah, I know my way around here...

How about you?

So where are your ten news reports today then?

On Jul 21, 7:49 pm, "The other view point, there is one you know..."

Quoted message said:

Where does the cycle path start again after the Cayley towards
Llandudno?

Summer holidays and schools out, need a further ride...

Has always gone as far as the tourist information centre where is
stops in the middle of the pavement with no access to the road. A new
bit has been built from Rhos Point to Llandudno and it's probably best
to get between the two by going on the road, despite the traffic and
need to turn right twice - AFAIK there has always been a byelaw
allowing cycling on the pavement between the two although the police
and the council cannot agree on this.

If the weather's grey and miserable like it has been today you might
get an enjoyable ride as the tourists will stay at home and you'll
have a clear run without having to stop every 5 minutes and ask people
to let you through. Just watch out for people walking dogs on
imaginary leads...

peter

there is one you know... said:

On 20 Jul, 19:07, naked_draughtsman <[email hidden]>
wrote:
Should the cyclist have slowed down then, in anticipation of having to
stop

Possibly, depends whether or not the pedestrians stepped out in front
of her and didn't give enough time to stop/swerve.

Quoted message said:

or do cyclists have the right of way?

The blue signs along the route say "cyclists only" but in nearly all
cases that isn't quite true as pedestrians are allowed on there.
Interestingly the promenade is not a public highway according to North
Wales Police so even though the cycle lane is signed and marked as if
it is a mandatory lane, cyclists don't actually have any legal right
to go on there - the council "allows" them to. The police are also
unable to prosecute anyone (for a traffic offence anyway) who drives
on or obstructs any part of it.

peter

John Hearns said:

The other view point said:

Nah, I know my way around here...

Quoted message said:

How about you?

So where are your ten news reports today then?

I never said I would ;-)

I will post all events involving cycles and pedestrians, that i come
across. Only because many in here seem to think there are none, only
those involving nice cyclists and nasty drivers.

On 21 Jul, 21:50, naked_draughtsman <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

On Jul 21, 7:49 pm, "The other view point, there is one you know..."

Quoted message said:

Where does the cycle path start again after the Cayley towards
Llandudno?

Quoted message said:

Summer holidays and schools out, need a further ride...

Has always gone as far as the tourist information centre where is
stops in the middle of the pavement with no access to the road. A new
bit has been built from Rhos Point to Llandudno and it's probably best
to get between the two by going on the road, despite the traffic and
need to turn right twice - AFAIK there has always been a byelaw
allowing cycling on the pavement between the two although the police
and the council cannot agree on this.

If the weather's grey and miserable like it has been today you might
get an enjoyable ride as the tourists will stay at home and you'll
have a clear run without having to stop every 5 minutes and ask people
to let you through. Just watch out for people walking dogs on
imaginary leads...

peter

Thank you.

On Sun, 22 Jul 2007 04:30:49 -0700, "The other view point, there is one

you know... said:

I will post all events involving cycles and pedestrians, that i come
across. Only because many in here seem to think there are none, only
those involving nice cyclists and nasty drivers.

To spare this group the distress of having to read the Daily Mail or the
Sun too often, please limit your reports to fatalities.

Marc Brett said:

On Sun, 22 Jul 2007 04:30:49 -0700, "The other view point, there is one

you know... said:

I will post all events involving cycles and pedestrians, that i come
across. Only because many in here seem to think there are none, only
those involving nice cyclists and nasty drivers.

To spare this group the distress of having to read the Daily Mail or the
Sun too often, please limit your reports to fatalities.

Oh dear a newspaper elitist, lol...