Some questions, thoughts, comments

In article <[email hidden]>,

sherry said:

1 - Can a person live on 20gm/day indefinitely, rather than gradually
increasing it? Reasons I'm asking: a) I'm doing fine as is and am almost
afraid to change anything; b) if not increased then I hit a stall and it
would be hard to go down from only 20gm/day - or is that illogical LC
logic? c) a friend of mine stayed at 20 for 6 weeks for max loss, but
suggests going no longer than that - is that the consensus?

Some say you shouldn't stay at or below 20g for a long time, I think it
doesn't matter, personally. Some find that they stall if they _don't_
increase carbs. Eventually calories start to matter, and increasing
carbs by replacing some meat and cheese with low-carb vegetables can
lower calories.

Luna <[email hidden]> wrote in
news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

Some say you shouldn't stay at or below 20g for a long time, I think
it doesn't matter, personally. Some find that they stall if they
_don't_ increase carbs. Eventually calories start to matter, and
increasing carbs by replacing some meat and cheese with low-carb
vegetables can lower calories.

I'm mostly doing meat and veggies now, having reduced the dairy/cheese/eggs
(eggs because they were never a favorite to begin with) and adding more
veggies. My meats of choice are ground turkey, chicken breast, tuna, and
baked fish which are lower in calories anyway, although I do have a steak
on Sundays. I just don't want to do anything now that may cause me issues
in a few weeks or months...

Thanks for your input, Luna 🙂.

Sherry
360/?/195 (day 16)

"sherry" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

1 - Can a person live on 20gm/day indefinitely, rather than gradually
increasing it? Reasons I'm asking: a) I'm doing fine as is and am almost
afraid to change anything; b) if not increased then I hit a stall and it
would be hard to go down from only 20gm/day - or is that illogical LC
logic? c) a friend of mine stayed at 20 for 6 weeks for max loss, but
suggests going no longer than that - is that the consensus?

2 - Wraps with romaine lettuce are my FAVORITE! I'm afraid to use a LC
wrap because I've been flour-free for 16 days now and worried about
setting
up a craving for bread or something...but with 3 romaine leaves, a can of
tuna or a chopped chicken breast, and a couple TBSP of mayo (which I count
as a carb even though the label says 0), I feel like I've really eaten a
LOT, having 3 wraps - and hardly any carbs.

3 - I'm finding that I haven't been getting 20gms/day, even with
vegetables, maybe not enough of them I'm guessing? But having one of my
rare sweet tooths (?) the other day, I needed chocolate. So I put 2
scoops
of chocolate-flavored disgusting protein powder (3 gm) in the blender with
a spoonful of instant coffee, a tsp of baking cocoa (1 gm), a shake of
Splenda, 2 TBSP cream (1 gm), a bunch of ice cubes, and some water, and
now
I am addicted 🙂. Iced coffee is a big favorite drink of mine in the
summer anyway...but this feels more like a meal. And I've read that I
should get off caffeine also - but my heart would stop <G>.

4 - My family is eating LC meals with me, because that's what I make.
Occasionally my daughter will have a can of corn with her meal because she
loves it...but I haven't bought rice or potatoes or bread since I started
this. My husband's bread ran out a week ago, and he's agreed to eat only
rye if he gets more, because I don't like rye... Anyway, if I could think
of things to put into his lunchbox that are LC he'd pretty much be eating
better too - although he doesn't need to lose weight...I believe it would
be healthier for my family also.

5 - Today felt so different from the last couple of weeks, as I hit a wall
of exhaustion, had NO energy, legs feel like heavy weights, etc. Since
I've not done anything differently it surprises me but maybe tomorrow it
will be gone...also spiked a fever so maybe I'm just coming down with
something...surprised but not alarmed...

Those are just some idle thoughts/experiences/questions that have occured
to me 🙂.

Sherry
360/?/195 (day 16)

I think the jury is still out on that one, Sherry. I don't think anyone
really knows how many carbs you should intake daily to stay healthy. I'm
sure there are a lot of opinions, but no real science to back it up.

I do think the main thing is to derive your limited carb intake from fresh
(or else frozen) veggies, and avoid the starches and sweets found in
processed and sweetened foods.

I don't think it has to be an "all or none" thing. If you want a candy bar
or ice cream now and then, go for it. Just realize that these foods will
work against you in the long run.

Sherry

I stayed on Induction for the entire time that I did the diet (about 7-8
months)! I started off the first week with 12lbs gone, second week was 8,
the third was 6 and after that, my weekly weight lost was anywhere for 3-4
per week. Most will disagree on this board that you are not suppose to do
this, however anyone can also read the book where it states "persons who
need to lose a lot of weight CAN stay on Induction for 6 months up to a
year"! Yet even though these same people have read this, they will still
say it's wrong. If you go off Induction you will lose slower, that was NOT
a goal of mine. Once I found out that Atkins actually worked, I wanted the
weight off of me as fast as I could possibly get it off of me. So that is
what I did. If Induction is working for you, honestly I say stick with it
as long as you can handle it, trust me, you won't regret it!

--
STARTED ATKINS AS A 31 Y/O WM: 3-1-04 @ 6'1", 310 lbs!
COMPLETED ATKINS AS A 32 Y/O WM: 10-30-04 @ 6'1", 168 lbs!
TOTAL WEIGHT LOSS: 142 lbs!
*NO EXCESS FLAB OR SKIN - 100% COMPLETELY TONED WITHOUT ANY 'COSMETIC'
SURGERY*! (Yeah, I was VERY lucky)!

To this day, I STILL eat 'low carb', I just don't 'count'!

"sherry" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

1 - Can a person live on 20gm/day indefinitely, rather than gradually
increasing it? Reasons I'm asking: a) I'm doing fine as is and am almost
afraid to change anything; b) if not increased then I hit a stall and it
would be hard to go down from only 20gm/day - or is that illogical LC
logic? c) a friend of mine stayed at 20 for 6 weeks for max loss, but
suggests going no longer than that - is that the consensus?

2 - Wraps with romaine lettuce are my FAVORITE! I'm afraid to use a LC
wrap because I've been flour-free for 16 days now and worried about
setting
up a craving for bread or something...but with 3 romaine leaves, a can of
tuna or a chopped chicken breast, and a couple TBSP of mayo (which I count
as a carb even though the label says 0), I feel like I've really eaten a
LOT, having 3 wraps - and hardly any carbs.

3 - I'm finding that I haven't been getting 20gms/day, even with
vegetables, maybe not enough of them I'm guessing? But having one of my
rare sweet tooths (?) the other day, I needed chocolate. So I put 2
scoops
of chocolate-flavored disgusting protein powder (3 gm) in the blender with
a spoonful of instant coffee, a tsp of baking cocoa (1 gm), a shake of
Splenda, 2 TBSP cream (1 gm), a bunch of ice cubes, and some water, and
now
I am addicted 🙂. Iced coffee is a big favorite drink of mine in the
summer anyway...but this feels more like a meal. And I've read that I
should get off caffeine also - but my heart would stop <G>.

4 - My family is eating LC meals with me, because that's what I make.
Occasionally my daughter will have a can of corn with her meal because she
loves it...but I haven't bought rice or potatoes or bread since I started
this. My husband's bread ran out a week ago, and he's agreed to eat only
rye if he gets more, because I don't like rye... Anyway, if I could think
of things to put into his lunchbox that are LC he'd pretty much be eating
better too - although he doesn't need to lose weight...I believe it would
be healthier for my family also.

5 - Today felt so different from the last couple of weeks, as I hit a wall
of exhaustion, had NO energy, legs feel like heavy weights, etc. Since
I've not done anything differently it surprises me but maybe tomorrow it
will be gone...also spiked a fever so maybe I'm just coming down with
something...surprised but not alarmed...

Those are just some idle thoughts/experiences/questions that have occured
to me 🙂.

Sherry
360/?/195 (day 16)

In article <[email hidden]>,
[email hidden] says...

Quoted message said:

1 - Can a person live on 20gm/day indefinitely, rather than gradually
increasing it? Reasons I'm asking: a) I'm doing fine as is and am almost
afraid to change anything; b) if not increased then I hit a stall and it
would be hard to go down from only 20gm/day - or is that illogical LC
logic? c) a friend of mine stayed at 20 for 6 weeks for max loss, but
suggests going no longer than that - is that the consensus?

There IS no consensus. Dr. Atkins recommended a maximum of six months,
but also said that one of his patients went 2 years without any
problems. I think the biggest problem with keeping carbs at 20/day is
boredom. Eventually you'll get tired of the lack of variety. He
picked 20 for only two weeks because at 20 carbs, EVERYONE will go into
ketosis. After that, as long as you are in ketosis, you are burning
fat for fuel. It's not a matter of how MUCH you are in ketosis, just
that you ARE (kind of like being pregnant -- you either are or you
aren't). Anything less than 100 is considered to be low-carb, although
from what I see, long-termers tend to stay around 40-50 carbs/day.

It's hard to mentally take the plunge and chance increasing the carbs,
and many people make the mistaking of thinking that the customary post-
induction "stall" is due to increasing the carbs when it actually has
nothing to do with that -- it's just that fat takes longer to lose than
water. As long as you are still in ketosis, I recommend increasing the
carbs (cautiously, of course) in the form of more vegetables or
possibly by adding some berries or nuts.

Quoted message said:

4 - My family is eating LC meals with me, because that's what I make.
Occasionally my daughter will have a can of corn with her meal because she
loves it...but I haven't bought rice or potatoes or bread since I started
this. My husband's bread ran out a week ago, and he's agreed to eat only
rye if he gets more, because I don't like rye...

I'm with you -- I HATE rye :-) I also hate custard and beets. If
someone served me a rye-flavored custard with beet chunks in it, I'd
probably hurl (of course, MOST people would probably hurl at THAT).

Quoted message said:

5 - Today felt so different from the last couple of weeks, as I hit a wall
of exhaustion, had NO energy, legs feel like heavy weights, etc. Since
I've not done anything differently it surprises me but maybe tomorrow it
will be gone...also spiked a fever so maybe I'm just coming down with
something...surprised but not alarmed...

Could be either. I went through a period of fatigue around that time,
too, but I perked up within a couple of weeks. There's still some
adjusting going on then.

--
Saffire
205/142/125 - 5'1.5"
Atkins since 6/14/03
Progress photo: http://photos.yahoo.com/saffire333

"Atkins Changed My Life!"
<AtkinschangedmylifeATalt.support.diet.low-carbDOTcom> wrote in message

Quoted message said:

I stayed on Induction for the entire time that I did the diet (about 7-8
months)! I started off the first week with 12lbs gone, second week was 8,
the third was 6 and after that, my weekly weight lost was anywhere for 3-4
per week.

You are so full of [censored]. Why don't you post your progress photos?

Quoted message said:

Most will disagree on this board that you are not suppose to do this,
however anyone can also read the book where it states "persons who need to
lose a lot of weight CAN stay on Induction for 6 months up to a year"!

Yes, the book states this... in ONE section. Dr. Atkins spends a lot more
time asking to trust the diet and move on to OWL even though we might feel
that we don't want to mess up what's already working. The diet was set up
so that most of the time losing weight would be in OWL.

Quoted message said:

If you go off Induction you will lose slower,

That is absolutely false.

Quoted message said:

STARTED ATKINS AS A 31 Y/O WM: 3-1-04 @ 6'1", 310 lbs!
COMPLETED ATKINS AS A 32 Y/O WM: 10-30-04 @ 6'1", 168 lbs!
TOTAL WEIGHT LOSS: 142 lbs!
*NO EXCESS FLAB OR SKIN - 100% COMPLETELY TONED WITHOUT ANY 'COSMETIC'
SURGERY*! (Yeah, I was VERY lucky)!

Where are your photos?

"sherry" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

Quoted message said:

1 - Can a person live on 20gm/day indefinitely, rather than gradually
increasing it? Reasons I'm asking: a) I'm doing fine as is and am almost
afraid to change anything;

You do have the option of staying at 20/day.. but I would advise moving on
to OWL. It seems that more of Atkins book, after evaluating induction,
encourages people to trust the diet the way it was intended and move on to
OWL to continue weight loss. Adding 5 more carbs/day next week does not
mean it will slow your weight loss or bring back cravings.

Quoted message said:

b) if not increased then I hit a stall and it would be hard to go down from
only 20gm/day -

Reducing carb intake does not necessarily break a stall (unless the problem
was eating too many carbs, which wouldn't be the case at 20g/day). Often
when people stall they have to look at their overall food intake and make
sure they're getting plenty of veggies, getting daily exercise, and not
eating too many calories.

c) a friend of mine stayed at 20 for 6 weeks for max loss, but

Quoted message said:

suggests going no longer than that - is that the consensus?

Atkins suggestions no longer than 6 months to a year in his book.

I'll add a letter D for you, as I feel this one is very important.
d) By moving on to OWL, you will slowly discover which foods work for you
and which do not. As you add in more variety, you will now notice how your
body reacts because you have been on induction. Over the course of upcoming
months, you will find out which foods you may want to limit for the rest of
your life, and you will also discover which foods are perfectly fine for you
personally. The best part is that you will find out how many carbs a day
you can personally eat and remain in ketosis. Then you eat at that level or
below it. For me, this is the best part of Atkins. Adjusting it the way
that Atkins set it up is personal, it works for me and my body personally.

Quoted message said:

2 - Wraps with romaine lettuce are my FAVORITE! I'm afraid to use a LC
wrap because I've been flour-free for 16 days now

Here's something else to think about... if you choose to stay at induction
levels of 20g/day, but add other foods such as LC wraps... any non-induction
foods you add will be taking the place of what would have been your daily
vegetable intake. If you're in OWL, then you eat carbs you ate during
induction, plus some more (so it doesn't mess with your veggies).

Quoted message said:

3 - I'm finding that I haven't been getting 20gms/day, even with
vegetables, maybe not enough of them I'm guessing?

I would guess that you are not eating enough veggies. Try to work them into
every meal. Many of my meals have two different veggies along with my
protein portion.

Good luck.

--
Spring
LC since 1/1/04
260/197/170

"Before" & "current" pics at link below:
http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/sprgsnow/my_photos

Luna <[email hidden]> wrote in
news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

Some say you shouldn't stay at or below 20g for a long time, I think
it doesn't matter, personally. Some find that they stall if they
_don't_ increase carbs. Eventually calories start to matter, and
increasing carbs by replacing some meat and cheese with low-carb
vegetables can lower calories.

That makes sense to me, thanks 🙂. Now that it is getting warmer there
will be more fresh vegetables to be had (for better prices!) here so that
will be easy to do.

Sherry
360/?/195 (day 17)

"Jim Bard" <[email hidden]> wrote in
news:uuj9e.2141$MY5.281@okepread03:

Quoted message said:

"sherry" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

1 - Can a person live on 20gm/day indefinitely, rather than gradually
increasing it? Reasons I'm asking: a) I'm doing fine as is and am
almost afraid to change anything; b) if not increased then I hit a
stall and it would be hard to go down from only 20gm/day - or is that
illogical LC logic? c) a friend of mine stayed at 20 for 6 weeks for
max loss, but suggests going no longer than that - is that the
consensus?

2 - Wraps with romaine lettuce are my FAVORITE! I'm afraid to use a
LC wrap because I've been flour-free for 16 days now and worried
about setting
up a craving for bread or something...but with 3 romaine leaves, a
can of tuna or a chopped chicken breast, and a couple TBSP of mayo
(which I count as a carb even though the label says 0), I feel like
I've really eaten a LOT, having 3 wraps - and hardly any carbs.

3 - I'm finding that I haven't been getting 20gms/day, even with
vegetables, maybe not enough of them I'm guessing? But having one of
my rare sweet tooths (?) the other day, I needed chocolate. So I put
2 scoops
of chocolate-flavored disgusting protein powder (3 gm) in the blender
with a spoonful of instant coffee, a tsp of baking cocoa (1 gm), a
shake of Splenda, 2 TBSP cream (1 gm), a bunch of ice cubes, and some
water, and now
I am addicted 🙂. Iced coffee is a big favorite drink of mine in the
summer anyway...but this feels more like a meal. And I've read that
I should get off caffeine also - but my heart would stop <G>.

4 - My family is eating LC meals with me, because that's what I make.
Occasionally my daughter will have a can of corn with her meal
because she loves it...but I haven't bought rice or potatoes or bread
since I started this. My husband's bread ran out a week ago, and
he's agreed to eat only rye if he gets more, because I don't like
rye... Anyway, if I could think of things to put into his lunchbox
that are LC he'd pretty much be eating better too - although he
doesn't need to lose weight...I believe it would be healthier for my
family also.

5 - Today felt so different from the last couple of weeks, as I hit a
wall of exhaustion, had NO energy, legs feel like heavy weights, etc.
Since I've not done anything differently it surprises me but maybe
tomorrow it will be gone...also spiked a fever so maybe I'm just
coming down with something...surprised but not alarmed...

Those are just some idle thoughts/experiences/questions that have
occured to me 🙂.

Sherry
360/?/195 (day 16)

I think the jury is still out on that one, Sherry. I don't think
anyone really knows how many carbs you should intake daily to stay
healthy. I'm sure there are a lot of opinions, but no real science to
back it up.

I do think the main thing is to derive your limited carb intake from
fresh (or else frozen) veggies, and avoid the starches and sweets
found in processed and sweetened foods.

I don't think it has to be an "all or none" thing. If you want a
candy bar or ice cream now and then, go for it. Just realize that
these foods will work against you in the long run.

Golly, I hope I didn't hit send on my incomplete reply when the phone just
rang...but it disappeared off my screen...

What you're saying is what my "gut feeling" is also - avoid the processed
foods and sweets. I have a sense about myself that, just like if I were to
light up a cigarette the last 14 years since I quit smoking would go down
the tubes, if I were to allow myself to indulge I'd give it up completely.
As long as I have my black-and-white list of what I can and can't have, I
can stick to it, and having accepted that this is how things will be from
now on, I'm ok - even great! - with that 🙂. If anything, as I increase my
carb intake it will be the veggies as seems to be the consensus 🙂.

Sherry
360/?/195 (day 17)

On Wed, 20 Apr 2005 02:01:25 -0000, sherry <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

1 - Can a person live on 20gm/day indefinitely, rather than gradually
increasing it? Reasons I'm asking: a) I'm doing fine as is and am almost
afraid to change anything; b) if not increased then I hit a stall and it
would be hard to go down from only 20gm/day - or is that illogical LC
logic? c) a friend of mine stayed at 20 for 6 weeks for max loss, but
suggests going no longer than that - is that the consensus?

Hi Sherry,

Personally, I stayed at 20g net carbs for like 9 months before upping
it to 25g. Then another 3 months at 25g. Just now upping to 30g. I
don't *always* get that many carbs in 1 day, either. As soon as the
strawberries are looking good, I'm sure I'll hit that *every* day. I
miss fruit.

Nicole
290.5/168.5/137 monthly-goal: 6 month-start: 175 since: 19/04/2004

In article <[email hidden]>,

sherry said:

Luna <[email hidden]> wrote in
news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

Some say you shouldn't stay at or below 20g for a long time, I think
it doesn't matter, personally. Some find that they stall if they
_don't_ increase carbs. Eventually calories start to matter, and
increasing carbs by replacing some meat and cheese with low-carb
vegetables can lower calories.

I'm mostly doing meat and veggies now, having reduced the dairy/cheese/eggs
(eggs because they were never a favorite to begin with) and adding more
veggies. My meats of choice are ground turkey, chicken breast, tuna, and
baked fish which are lower in calories anyway, although I do have a steak
on Sundays. I just don't want to do anything now that may cause me issues
in a few weeks or months...

Thanks for your input, Luna 🙂.

Sherry
360/?/195 (day 16)

I think you'll be fine. I wish I preferred lower calorie meats myself.
Would make this a lot easier, lol. Damn that delicious, evil pork
sausage!!!

In article <[email hidden]>,

sherry said:

"Jim Bard" <[email hidden]> wrote in
news:uuj9e.2141$MY5.281@okepread03:

Quoted message said:

"sherry" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

1 - Can a person live on 20gm/day indefinitely, rather than gradually
increasing it? Reasons I'm asking: a) I'm doing fine as is and am
almost afraid to change anything; b) if not increased then I hit a
stall and it would be hard to go down from only 20gm/day - or is that
illogical LC logic? c) a friend of mine stayed at 20 for 6 weeks for
max loss, but suggests going no longer than that - is that the
consensus?

2 - Wraps with romaine lettuce are my FAVORITE! I'm afraid to use a
LC wrap because I've been flour-free for 16 days now and worried
about setting
up a craving for bread or something...but with 3 romaine leaves, a
can of tuna or a chopped chicken breast, and a couple TBSP of mayo
(which I count as a carb even though the label says 0), I feel like
I've really eaten a LOT, having 3 wraps - and hardly any carbs.

3 - I'm finding that I haven't been getting 20gms/day, even with
vegetables, maybe not enough of them I'm guessing? But having one of
my rare sweet tooths (?) the other day, I needed chocolate. So I put
2 scoops
of chocolate-flavored disgusting protein powder (3 gm) in the blender
with a spoonful of instant coffee, a tsp of baking cocoa (1 gm), a
shake of Splenda, 2 TBSP cream (1 gm), a bunch of ice cubes, and some
water, and now
I am addicted 🙂. Iced coffee is a big favorite drink of mine in the
summer anyway...but this feels more like a meal. And I've read that
I should get off caffeine also - but my heart would stop <G>.

4 - My family is eating LC meals with me, because that's what I make.
Occasionally my daughter will have a can of corn with her meal
because she loves it...but I haven't bought rice or potatoes or bread
since I started this. My husband's bread ran out a week ago, and
he's agreed to eat only rye if he gets more, because I don't like
rye... Anyway, if I could think of things to put into his lunchbox
that are LC he'd pretty much be eating better too - although he
doesn't need to lose weight...I believe it would be healthier for my
family also.

5 - Today felt so different from the last couple of weeks, as I hit a
wall of exhaustion, had NO energy, legs feel like heavy weights, etc.
Since I've not done anything differently it surprises me but maybe
tomorrow it will be gone...also spiked a fever so maybe I'm just
coming down with something...surprised but not alarmed...

Those are just some idle thoughts/experiences/questions that have
occured to me 🙂.

Sherry
360/?/195 (day 16)

I think the jury is still out on that one, Sherry. I don't think
anyone really knows how many carbs you should intake daily to stay
healthy. I'm sure there are a lot of opinions, but no real science to
back it up.

I do think the main thing is to derive your limited carb intake from
fresh (or else frozen) veggies, and avoid the starches and sweets
found in processed and sweetened foods.

I don't think it has to be an "all or none" thing. If you want a
candy bar or ice cream now and then, go for it. Just realize that
these foods will work against you in the long run.

Golly, I hope I didn't hit send on my incomplete reply when the phone just
rang...but it disappeared off my screen...

What you're saying is what my "gut feeling" is also - avoid the processed
foods and sweets. I have a sense about myself that, just like if I were to
light up a cigarette the last 14 years since I quit smoking would go down
the tubes, if I were to allow myself to indulge I'd give it up completely.
As long as I have my black-and-white list of what I can and can't have, I
can stick to it, and having accepted that this is how things will be from
now on, I'm ok - even great! - with that 🙂. If anything, as I increase my
carb intake it will be the veggies as seems to be the consensus 🙂.

Sherry
360/?/195 (day 17)

There ya go. I don't do so well either, having "just a little" of some
sugary treat or other. I do respond well when I include some
moderately carby vegetables like onions and green peppers.

"Atkins Changed My Life!"
<AtkinschangedmylifeATalt.support.diet.low-carbDOTcom> wrote in
news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

I stayed on Induction for the entire time that I did the diet (about
7-8 months)! I started off the first week with 12lbs gone, second
week was 8, the third was 6 and after that, my weekly weight lost was
anywhere for 3-4 per week. Most will disagree on this board that you
are not suppose to do this, however anyone can also read the book
where it states "persons who need to lose a lot of weight CAN stay on
Induction for 6 months up to a year"! Yet even though these same
people have read this, they will still say it's wrong. If you go off
Induction you will lose slower, that was NOT a goal of mine. Once I
found out that Atkins actually worked, I wanted the weight off of me
as fast as I could possibly get it off of me. So that is what I did.
If Induction is working for you, honestly I say stick with it as long
as you can handle it, trust me, you won't regret it!
--
STARTED ATKINS AS A 31 Y/O WM: 3-1-04 @ 6'1", 310 lbs!
COMPLETED ATKINS AS A 32 Y/O WM: 10-30-04 @ 6'1", 168 lbs!
TOTAL WEIGHT LOSS: 142 lbs!
*NO EXCESS FLAB OR SKIN - 100% COMPLETELY TONED WITHOUT ANY 'COSMETIC'
SURGERY*! (Yeah, I was VERY lucky)!

To this day, I STILL eat 'low carb', I just don't 'count'!

I'm glad that you did so well for yourself 🙂. Not sure if it is the same
with LC as with other "diets", that men seem to lose faster and easier than
women? Not that it matters to me, I'm glad that you did what you set out
to do and had such great results! I'm not worried about how long it takes,
for me...just that it keeps coming off.

I've read about quite a few people who "eat low carb" but "don't count"
after the weight is off. Apparently just avoiding carb-laden foods is
enough to keep them at their goal weight - but I've got a LONG time before
I need to worry about that 🙂.

Sherry
360/?/195 (day 17)

I'm in the group that believes you can stay at induction level of carbs
for an extended period and do just fine. In fact, everything that
Atkins wrote that I am aware of is consistent with the premise that the
lower the level of carbs, the faster the weight loss. He said it was
perfectly fine for those with a lot to lose to stay on induction
longer. There is also the concept that as you increase your level of
carbs, your weight loss gradually slows. This is the process of
finding your CCL. He also wrote about how some resistant people may
need to keep carb levels near 20g to lose at all. Never once did I see
him say that one should increase carbs if they are having difficulty
losing.

You have to do what is right for you. If you're at 20g, feeling fine,
not getting bored, have a lot more to lose, then holding carbs at that
level is fine. I would certainly expand the list of foods after the
initial 2 weeks, even if you chose to stay close to 20g, you can have
more variety. I've stayed at close to induction levels for months
with no problems. Ultimately, the goal is to introduce more good
carbs, gradually taper off the weight loss as you get close to your
goal weight, and transition to an eating style that you will live with
for the long term. That's an area where those saying you need to move
off induction have a point. You eventually do need to do this, however
it's up to you to do it as it's appropriate for your own situation.

In Sherry's case, she indicated that at 2+ weeeks she's now feeling
tired, but it might be a cold. If it's not a cold, then this to me
would be an indication to increase the carbs to 25g and see what
happens. I'd also monitor tuna/similar fish consumption in terms of
mercury, as when going LC it's easy to start eating a lot more of a
food like this that you may have consumed in moderation before.

I also woudn't put too much faith in self reported short term stories
of how increasing carbs, reducing carbs, eliminating this, eliminating
that, resulted in weight loss. Weight loss is never linear. People
stop losing temporarily for reasons we don't understand. I've gone
through periods where I didn't lose much, if anything for several
weeks. Then all of a sudden, in the next week, like 5 lbs goes
quickly. And this happens without changing anything. Without
controlled studies, which we desperately need more of, it's impossible
to really figure out what slight differences and approaches really work
best.

Saffire <[email hidden]> wrote in
news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

There IS no consensus. Dr. Atkins recommended a maximum of six
months, but also said that one of his patients went 2 years without
any problems. I think the biggest problem with keeping carbs at
20/day is boredom. Eventually you'll get tired of the lack of
variety. He picked 20 for only two weeks because at 20 carbs,
EVERYONE will go into ketosis. After that, as long as you are in
ketosis, you are burning fat for fuel. It's not a matter of how MUCH
you are in ketosis, just that you ARE (kind of like being pregnant --
you either are or you aren't). Anything less than 100 is considered
to be low-carb, although from what I see, long-termers tend to stay
around 40-50 carbs/day.

It's hard to mentally take the plunge and chance increasing the carbs,
and many people make the mistaking of thinking that the customary
post- induction "stall" is due to increasing the carbs when it
actually has nothing to do with that -- it's just that fat takes
longer to lose than water. As long as you are still in ketosis, I
recommend increasing the carbs (cautiously, of course) in the form of
more vegetables or possibly by adding some berries or nuts.

GREAT information here, I guess that are aren't degrees to ketosis thing
never clicked with me before. I have started to add nuts; still having
this issue with not being able to stomach food until I've been up for
several hours, which I know isn't good...so before I go to bed I put 2 TBSP
of roasted/unsalted peanuts with 1 TBSP of sunflower seeds in a med cup,
and have those when I first get up. It gives my stomach something to do
until lunch <G>.

Quoted message said:

I'm with you -- I HATE rye :-) I also hate custard and beets. If
someone served me a rye-flavored custard with beet chunks in it, I'd
probably hurl (of course, MOST people would probably hurl at THAT).

I love beets 🙂. And custard - with lots of nutmeg. And probably hate
some things you love - lol. But your "recipe" would indeed make me hurl
🙂.

Quoted message said:

Could be either. I went through a period of fatigue around that time,
too, but I perked up within a couple of weeks. There's still some
adjusting going on then.

This is good to know. Fever's gone today, fatigue remains. I have company
coming for the weekend and was REALLY counting on the energy level of the
last couple of weeks to get some spring cleaning done this week. That's
what I get for counting my chickens - lol...

Sherry
360/?/195 (day 17)

"Sprgtime" <[email hidden]> wrote in
news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

You do have the option of staying at 20/day.. but I would advise
moving on to OWL. It seems that more of Atkins book, after evaluating
induction, encourages people to trust the diet the way it was intended
and move on to OWL to continue weight loss. Adding 5 more carbs/day
next week does not mean it will slow your weight loss or bring back
cravings.

My worst fear - bringing on cravings!

Quoted message said:

Reducing carb intake does not necessarily break a stall (unless the
problem was eating too many carbs, which wouldn't be the case at
20g/day). Often when people stall they have to look at their overall
food intake and make sure they're getting plenty of veggies, getting
daily exercise, and not eating too many calories.

Oh I hate that "E" word - lol - but have been doing it anyway, and as my
weight gets down to where I'm not out of breath and most movement causes
pain, I will be doing more of it. I do look forward to our walks along the
river with the dogs though 🙂.

Quoted message said:

I'll add a letter D for you, as I feel this one is very important.
d) By moving on to OWL, you will slowly discover which foods work for
you and which do not. As you add in more variety, you will now notice
how your body reacts because you have been on induction. Over the
course of upcoming months, you will find out which foods you may want
to limit for the rest of your life, and you will also discover which
foods are perfectly fine for you personally. The best part is that
you will find out how many carbs a day you can personally eat and
remain in ketosis. Then you eat at that level or below it. For me,
this is the best part of Atkins. Adjusting it the way that Atkins set
it up is personal, it works for me and my body personally.

Another concept that finally "clicked" for me the way you worded it 🙂.

Quoted message said:

Here's something else to think about... if you choose to stay at
induction levels of 20g/day, but add other foods such as LC wraps...
any non-induction foods you add will be taking the place of what would
have been your daily vegetable intake. If you're in OWL, then you eat
carbs you ate during induction, plus some more (so it doesn't mess
with your veggies).

OK, I understand what you're saying here...I still think I'm going to stay
away from flours and such, just a gut feeling I have. But will add more
veggies 🙂.

Quoted message said:

I would guess that you are not eating enough veggies. Try to work
them into every meal. Many of my meals have two different veggies
along with my protein portion.

Good luck.

Thanks very much Spring! Lots of good info and advice here 🙂.

Sherry
360/?/195 (day 17)

Nicole {Freezing in Wisconsin} <[email hidden]> wrote in
news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

Personally, I stayed at 20g net carbs for like 9 months before upping
it to 25g. Then another 3 months at 25g. Just now upping to 30g. I
don't *always* get that many carbs in 1 day, either. As soon as the
strawberries are looking good, I'm sure I'll hit that *every* day. I
miss fruit.

Nicole
290.5/168.5/137 monthly-goal: 6 month-start: 175 since: 19/04/2004

Nicole you've got some great numbers there! Very inspiring!

mmmmmmm.......strawberries......

Sherry
360/?/195

"[email hidden]" <[email hidden]> wrote in
news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

I'm in the group that believes you can stay at induction level of carbs
for an extended period and do just fine. In fact, everything that
Atkins wrote that I am aware of is consistent with the premise that the
lower the level of carbs, the faster the weight loss. He said it was
perfectly fine for those with a lot to lose to stay on induction
longer. There is also the concept that as you increase your level of
carbs, your weight loss gradually slows. This is the process of
finding your CCL. He also wrote about how some resistant people may
need to keep carb levels near 20g to lose at all. Never once did I see
him say that one should increase carbs if they are having difficulty
losing.

You have to do what is right for you. If you're at 20g, feeling fine,
not getting bored, have a lot more to lose, then holding carbs at that
level is fine. I would certainly expand the list of foods after the
initial 2 weeks, even if you chose to stay close to 20g, you can have
more variety. I've stayed at close to induction levels for months
with no problems. Ultimately, the goal is to introduce more good
carbs, gradually taper off the weight loss as you get close to your
goal weight, and transition to an eating style that you will live with
for the long term. That's an area where those saying you need to move
off induction have a point. You eventually do need to do this, however
it's up to you to do it as it's appropriate for your own situation.

In Sherry's case, she indicated that at 2+ weeeks she's now feeling
tired, but it might be a cold. If it's not a cold, then this to me
would be an indication to increase the carbs to 25g and see what
happens. I'd also monitor tuna/similar fish consumption in terms of
mercury, as when going LC it's easy to start eating a lot more of a
food like this that you may have consumed in moderation before.

I also woudn't put too much faith in self reported short term stories
of how increasing carbs, reducing carbs, eliminating this, eliminating
that, resulted in weight loss. Weight loss is never linear. People
stop losing temporarily for reasons we don't understand. I've gone
through periods where I didn't lose much, if anything for several
weeks. Then all of a sudden, in the next week, like 5 lbs goes
quickly. And this happens without changing anything. Without
controlled studies, which we desperately need more of, it's impossible
to really figure out what slight differences and approaches really work
best.

To know that I can stay at 20 for a while is good because, other than the
fatigue thing, I've been doing great at that level. Never thought of the
mercury - but I plan to roast a turkey breast tomorrow and that'll keep me
in meat for a few days...

Experiences are so different...reading who does what, and how it has worked
for them is at least as helpful to me as Atkins' (and others'😉 books - no,
probably more helpful 🙂. The beauty of usenet: lots of experiences from
which to draw my conclusions and make my choices. My impression has been
that the short-term loss/no loss cycles as you describe them may vary, but
as long as the diet/exercise remains constant, the overall result will be
similar...and my impression is consistent with your experience 🙂.

Thanks for your input, it's valuable and appreciated!

Sherry
360/?/195 (day 17)

"sherry" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

1 - Can a person live on 20gm/day indefinitely, rather than gradually
increasing it? Reasons I'm asking: a) I'm doing fine as is and am almost
afraid to change anything;

You can stay on induction for 6 months. If it is working and you feel
fine, then I would do it for the longest period that you can, given the
amount of weight you have to lose. At some point you will have to adjust
your diet. The whole point of increasing the carbs at 5 gr increments is to
find the right ( for you ) amount that will still maintain weight and be
able to do it for a life time.

b) if not increased then I hit a stall and it

Quoted message said:

would be hard to go down from only 20gm/day - or is that illogical LC
logic?

If you stall for more than 6 weeks, then it is likely that you would be
taking in too many calories.

c) a friend of mine stayed at 20 for 6 weeks for max loss, but

Quoted message said:

suggests going no longer than that - is that the consensus?

As long as your getting enough nutrients and vitamins, it's ok to go
longer. Some people have lost a lot of weight by staying on induction until
they have reached goal. I don't think it is a good idea for you. If you were
to do that, you would likely be on induction for 2 years at 2 lbs per week.
It is better to find your levels by increasing slowly with healthy natural
foods.
I stayed on induction until I lost all the weight that I needed to. But I
only had 30 lbs to lose. It took me only about 3 months.

Quoted message said:

2 - Wraps with romaine lettuce are my FAVORITE! I'm afraid to use a LC
wrap because I've been flour-free for 16 days now and worried about

setting

Quoted message said:

up a craving for bread or something...but with 3 romaine leaves, a can of
tuna or a chopped chicken breast, and a couple TBSP of mayo (which I count
as a carb even though the label says 0), I feel like I've really eaten a
LOT, having 3 wraps - and hardly any carbs.

It's good if you feel you are full, but remember that calories do count.
Lo carb helps you to eat less by controlling your hunger. Don't stuff
yourself. Don't think that it's only about the amount of carbs.

Quoted message said:

3 - I'm finding that I haven't been getting 20gms/day, even with
vegetables, maybe not enough of them I'm guessing?

3 cups of 50% lettuce and the rest allowable veggies is about right. 1
cup at lunch and 2 cups at dinner worked good for me. Also remember that
even meat has a little bit of carbs, and anything else that would normally
be counted as zero per serving adds up.

But having one of my

Quoted message said:

rare sweet tooths (?) the other day, I needed chocolate. So I put 2

scoops

Quoted message said:

of chocolate-flavored disgusting protein powder (3 gm) in the blender with
a spoonful of instant coffee, a tsp of baking cocoa (1 gm), a shake of
Splenda, 2 TBSP cream (1 gm), a bunch of ice cubes, and some water, and

now

Quoted message said:

I am addicted 🙂.

Watch the cravings.

Iced coffee is a big favorite drink of mine in the

Quoted message said:

summer anyway...but this feels more like a meal. And I've read that I
should get off caffeine also - but my heart would stop <G>.

If your not stalling because of the caffeine, it's not that big of a
deal. Worry more about the chocolate.

Quoted message said:

4 - My family is eating LC meals with me, because that's what I make.
Occasionally my daughter will have a can of corn with her meal because she
loves it...but I haven't bought rice or potatoes or bread since I started
this. My husband's bread ran out a week ago, and he's agreed to eat only
rye if he gets more, because I don't like rye... Anyway, if I could think
of things to put into his lunchbox that are LC he'd pretty much be eating
better too - although he doesn't need to lose weight...I believe it would
be healthier for my family also.

It's good to see your family is working with you.

Quoted message said:

5 - Today felt so different from the last couple of weeks, as I hit a wall
of exhaustion, had NO energy, legs feel like heavy weights, etc. Since
I've not done anything differently it surprises me but maybe tomorrow it
will be gone...also spiked a fever so maybe I'm just coming down with
something...surprised but not alarmed...

There could be many reasons for low energy. I'm thinking you might be
eating too little fat because of choosing the leaner/less calorie meats. You
need to get your energy from either carbs or fat, not protein. A lot of
people can't get over the mindset of the low fat days, so end up trying to
reduce both. You can also increase fat by eating nuts, avocados, olives.

Quoted message said:

Those are just some idle thoughts/experiences/questions that have occured
to me 🙂.

Sherry
360/?/195 (day 16)