Soldering Cable ends

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Stainless wires are easily silver soldered but most of us don't have
the flux or oxy-acetylene torch to do it.

Jobst Brandt

Thanks. I have the acetylene torch and some silver solder and flux, but I
like the shrink wrap solution better. I've already done one to test and am
about to go out into my garage to finish. ...not sure that I would want to
get my acetylene torch near my bike.

J

--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

Quoted message said:

Stainless wires are easily silver soldered but most of us don't have
the flux or oxy-acetylene torch to do it.

A plain old air-propane or air-butane flame will easily do silver solder on
such a small part.

For that matter, so will an alchohol flame with a blowpipe.

Kerry Montgomery said:

Peter,
Brilliant, thanks for the idea. Used to solder old cables OK, resorted to
crimp-ons for modern cables, but didn't like the frayed ends when removing
'em to regrease.

Note that a heat gun is a better heat source than a lighter. In the U.S.
they are available for about $10 on sale at Harbor Freight.
"http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/Displayitem.taf?itemnumber=35776"

I use heat shrink for a wide variety of household tasks. I did surgery
on my dishwasher racks where the plastic had come off and the metal was
rusting. I use it on a variety of clamps on the bicycle to prevent
scratching. Of course it also is useful for covering electrical
connections, for which it was designed.

one more time. cut cables? use a $2 walmart diagnol new and 'sharp'
place diagnol cutter on hardwood block (from skid) with cable between
jaws
hit upper (!) jay hard with 11 pound engineeers hammer from HDepot.
wear eye protection.
use also for housings

now how about some brake fluid chain lube?

Jeff said:

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Stainless wires are easily silver soldered but most of us don't have
the flux or oxy-acetylene torch to do it.

Jobst Brandt

Thanks. I have the acetylene torch and some silver solder and flux, but
I like the shrink wrap solution better. I've already done one to test
and am about to go out into my garage to finish. ...not sure that I
would want to get my acetylene torch near my bike.

J

don't do that - excess heat removes the temper from the cable. use
ordinary soft solder, an electric soldering iron, and the magic
ingredient, liquid acid flux, available in the plumbing department of
your local hardware store. neutralize with baking soda solution afterwards.

Quoted message said:

Doug Cimper said:

Quoted message said:

...could someone tell me what the tricks are to soldering brake and
derailleur cable ends? I've now tried with a few different types
of solder and flux and different amounts of heat and the solder
just seems to bead up and fall off. I've degreased the cable,
sanded it, but nothing seems to work.

Quoted message said:

I have tried to solder them and got nowhere too. The cables in
question appeared to be stainless steel, which would explain a lot
of may failure.

Quoted message said:

What I prefer to do is cut them with an emery cut-off wheel in a
Dremel moto-tool on high speed. The wires are cut so easily that
they still stay straight and the cut end can still easily be fed
through a jacket, where a "normal" pair of cable cutters (otherwise
known as 'the right tool for the job'😉 leaves the end all bent up a
mess.

A good pair of diagonal cutters will cut good control and brake cables
off without a splayed end because these cables are made of hard
strands that spring back to their original shape after cutting.

rubbish. use "piano wire" cutters.

Quoted message said:

The
real problem is anchor bolts on derailleurs and brakes that crimp the
wire and cause it to splay.

rubbish. it's cutting cable too short that's the problem. it needs a
number of twists to retain shape.

Quoted message said:

I was always impressed by the brake cable
clamp on Campagnolo Record brakes that clamped the cable with no
damage regardless of how tight it was camped.

Today, with liability claims as they are (with technically impractical
juries)

eh???

Quoted message said:

non-crimping clamps are hard to find. Cable crimp sleeves are
not the solution because the cable cannot be pulled out of holes into
which they were threaded.

rubbish.

Quoted message said:

Stainless wires are easily silver soldered but most of us don't have
the flux or oxy-acetylene torch to do it.

some of you don't have the knowledge you mean. tin/lead solder,
electric soldering iron of sufficient wattage and acid [chloride] flux
work just fine.

"Jeff" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

...could someone tell me what the tricks are to soldering brake and
derailleur cable ends?

(snip)

Ahh...the perennial 'how to solder cut cable ends' issue. I bypass all that
fooling around with the simple expedient of a few cents worth of heat-shrink
PVC wire insulation. If you look around you can probably find it in a color
that will even coordinate with your bike's paint scheme. Just put an inch
or so over the cut cable end, leaving it sticking beyond the cable about
1/4" and heat it up with a match - too easy.

Cal

"Jeff" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Stainless wires are easily silver soldered but most of us don't have
the flux or oxy-acetylene torch to do it.

Jobst Brandt

Thanks. I have the acetylene torch and some silver solder and flux, but

I

Quoted message said:

like the shrink wrap solution better. I've already done one to test and

am

Quoted message said:

about to go out into my garage to finish. ...not sure that I would want

to

Quoted message said:

get my acetylene torch near my bike.

J

I used to solder all of my cable ends with a high power soldering gun
using standard 60/40 lead-tin rosin core solder.

I've been using stainless steel cable for a number of years so I no long
solder the ends.

Are you trying to solder the cable ends installed on the bike or the bare
cables off the bike?

Brazing or soldering the cables on the bike with a torch can damage the
plastic on and inside the cable housing because heat will travel up the
cable into the housing.

The problem with using silver solder is the high melting temperature of
many silver solder/brazing alloys. Many of these alloys have a melting
temperature of 1100° F to 1650° F. I have some low silver content solder
that melts at under 900° F but that may still be too hot for use on the
bike.

Using so called hard solder with a high melting temperature seems like a
lot of work to go through considering the other options available.

Chas.

On 2007-10-30, jim beam <[email hidden]> wrote:
[...]

Quoted message said:

rubbish. it's cutting cable too short that's the problem. it needs a
number of twists to retain shape.

Interesting, so how much cable should be left protruding from the clamp?
I normally leave a couple of inches.

jim beam said:

Jeff said:

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Stainless wires are easily silver soldered but most of us don't have
the flux or oxy-acetylene torch to do it.

Jobst Brandt

Thanks. I have the acetylene torch and some silver solder and flux, but
I like the shrink wrap solution better. I've already done one to test
and am about to go out into my garage to finish. ...not sure that I
would want to get my acetylene torch near my bike.

J

don't do that - excess heat removes the temper from the cable. use
ordinary soft solder, an electric soldering iron, and the magic
ingredient, liquid acid flux, available in the plumbing department of
your local hardware store. neutralize with baking soda solution afterwards.

Useless advice.

The strength of the end of the cable is of no concern.

Go ahead and use your flame - "jim beam" is being an alarmist again.

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I was always impressed by the brake cable
clamp on Campagnolo Record brakes that clamped the cable with no
damage regardless of how tight it was camped.

Yes, agree with the Campagnolo Record calipers clamp, at least with the
older style. There is no damage to the cable when tightening and removing.

Quoted message said:

Stainless wires are easily silver soldered but most of us don't have
the flux or oxy-acetylene torch to do it.

What I used to do when tinning the brake cables with silver solder, is tin
the iron with the solder and touch the end of the brake cable, just enough
to get the solder to flow. No flux is necessary.

Today I just use the small alumn end cap crimps. Really, how often does
one need to remove and replace brake cables?
-tom

Jeff said:

...could someone tell me what the tricks are to soldering brake and
derailleur cable ends? I've now tried with a few different types of solder
and flux and different amounts of heat and the solder just seems to bead up
and fall off. I've degreased the cable, sanded it, but nothing seems to
work.

I've been successful using a torch type cigarette lighter and melting
plastic into/onto the cable end.

_ said:

Quoted message said:

Stainless wires are easily silver soldered but most of us don't have
the flux or oxy-acetylene torch to do it.

A plain old air-propane or air-butane flame will easily do silver solder on
such a small part.
For that matter, so will an alchohol flame with a blowpipe.

Absolutely. I have lots of silver and an oxy rig-I build frames-but a
hand torch, acid flux and plumber's solder really work OK even on
stainless. And of course will do silver just fine.
Phil Brown

Ben C said:

On 2007-10-30, jim beam <[email hidden]> wrote:
[...]

Quoted message said:

rubbish. it's cutting cable too short that's the problem. it needs a
number of twists to retain shape.

Interesting, so how much cable should be left protruding from the clamp?
I normally leave a couple of inches.

On rear derailleur cables, I've taken to leaving a lot - maybe four
inches, which I coil into a little loop.

Why? Because once on a tour, my rear cable broke at the ball end (at
the barcon shifter) and I had no spare. I was _just_ able to put a
knot in the broken end to replace the ball and keep riding. I now
carry a spare cable, but I leave the extra length to make knotting
easier, for a belt-n-suspenders approach.

BTW, I run my cables under the handlebar tape. This makes a standard
length cable just a bit too short to use. That's another sad fact I
learned on the road, the hard way. The knot saved me again.

- Frank Krygowski

Tom Nakashima said:

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I was always impressed by the brake cable
clamp on Campagnolo Record brakes that clamped the cable with no
damage regardless of how tight it was camped.

Yes, agree with the Campagnolo Record calipers clamp, at least with the
older style. There is no damage to the cable when tightening and removing.

Quoted message said:

Stainless wires are easily silver soldered but most of us don't have
the flux or oxy-acetylene torch to do it.

What I used to do when tinning the brake cables with silver solder, is tin
the iron with the solder and touch the end of the brake cable, just enough
to get the solder to flow. No flux is necessary.

perhaps with old style galvanized cable, not with stainless. need the
right ingredients to solder that.

Quoted message said:

Today I just use the small alumn end cap crimps. Really, how often does
one need to remove and replace brake cables?
-tom

_ said:

jim beam said:

Jeff said:

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

> Stainless wires are easily silver soldered but most of us don't have
> the flux or oxy-acetylene torch to do it.
>
> Jobst Brandt
Thanks. I have the acetylene torch and some silver solder and flux, but
I like the shrink wrap solution better. I've already done one to test
and am about to go out into my garage to finish. ...not sure that I
would want to get my acetylene torch near my bike.

J

don't do that - excess heat removes the temper from the cable. use
ordinary soft solder, an electric soldering iron, and the magic
ingredient, liquid acid flux, available in the plumbing department of
your local hardware store. neutralize with baking soda solution afterwards.

Useless advice.

The strength of the end of the cable is of no concern.

if the "end of the cable" means the heat affected part of the cable is
guaranteed to be outside of the is clamp, that would be fine. but
that's not guaranteed, especially with someone that doesn't understand
the problem.

to understand the problem, one has to understand that excess heat /does/
remove the temper of the cable. and an electric soldering iron, which
is not hot enough to affect the cable, is more than adequate to do the
job in the presence of the correct flux.

Quoted message said:

Go ahead and use your flame - "jim beam" is being an alarmist again.

i never can understand why some people have such a problem with being
exposed to information from which they could in fact learn. especially
in matters that potentially affect safety.

Ben C said:

On 2007-10-30, jim beam <[email hidden]> wrote:
[...]

Quoted message said:

rubbish. it's cutting cable too short that's the problem. it needs a
number of twists to retain shape.

Interesting, so how much cable should be left protruding from the clamp?
I normally leave a couple of inches.

theoretically, three twists, but i find about 1-1.5" usually works ok.

jim beam said:

_ said:

jim beam said:

Jeff wrote:
> <[email hidden]> wrote in message
> news:[email hidden]...
>
>> Stainless wires are easily silver soldered but most of us don't have
>> the flux or oxy-acetylene torch to do it.
>>
>> Jobst Brandt
> Thanks. I have the acetylene torch and some silver solder and flux, but
> I like the shrink wrap solution better. I've already done one to test
> and am about to go out into my garage to finish. ...not sure that I
> would want to get my acetylene torch near my bike.
>
> J
>
>
don't do that - excess heat removes the temper from the cable. use
ordinary soft solder, an electric soldering iron, and the magic
ingredient, liquid acid flux, available in the plumbing department of
your local hardware store. neutralize with baking soda solution afterwards.

Useless advice.

The strength of the end of the cable is of no concern.

if the "end of the cable" means the heat affected part of the cable is
guaranteed to be outside of the is clamp, that would be fine.

What part of the cable would you be soldering? Most of us just do the end
- as would the op.

"_" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

jim beam said:

_ said:

On Mon, 29 Oct 2007 19:49:57 -0700, jim beam wrote:

> Jeff wrote:
>> <[email hidden]> wrote in message
>> news:[email hidden]...
>>
>>> Stainless wires are easily silver soldered but most of us don't have
>>> the flux or oxy-acetylene torch to do it.
>>>
>>> Jobst Brandt
>> Thanks. I have the acetylene torch and some silver solder and flux,
>> but
>> I like the shrink wrap solution better. I've already done one to test
>> and am about to go out into my garage to finish. ...not sure that I
>> would want to get my acetylene torch near my bike.
>>
>> J
>>
>>
> don't do that - excess heat removes the temper from the cable. use
> ordinary soft solder, an electric soldering iron, and the magic
> ingredient, liquid acid flux, available in the plumbing department of
> your local hardware store. neutralize with baking soda solution
> afterwards.

Useless advice.

The strength of the end of the cable is of no concern.

if the "end of the cable" means the heat affected part of the cable is
guaranteed to be outside of the is clamp, that would be fine.

What part of the cable would you be soldering? Most of us just do the end
- as would the op.

Really, it's only the tip of the cables, 1/16" is all you need to solder to
keep the ends from fraying. Tin the iron with silver solder, then quickly
touch the cable with the iron and the solder...."DONE!"
No flux, baking soda, or cleaner is necessary.
-tom

Tom Nakashima said:

Really, it's only the tip of the cables, 1/16" is all you need to solder to
keep the ends from fraying. Tin the iron with silver solder, then quickly
touch the cable with the iron and the solder...."DONE!"
No flux, baking soda, or cleaner is necessary.
-tom

You can solder the entire length of cable, but only if it is a straight
run between the brake lever and the brake.
,,,
Alternately you could switch to rod brakes.
,,,
~