Shimano again

"MartinM" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

A few months ago I posted about how Shimano rear cassettes seemed to be
getting cheaper and nastier; now it is STI shifters. I have just fitted
some Tiagra shifters to a friend's bike, and they are mostly plastic and
steel, nowhere near as good as the alloy RSX units I have on my other
bike.
Anyone else
noticed this? What is 105 like these days, as I certainly would not use
anything less now with this quality? (I know cheap Campag stuff is all
plastic)

I read that Campag Mirage Ergolevers were plastic in some review, but I
tested mine with a multimeter and mine are definitely alloy. My bike is an
02 model, so maybe Campag Mirage has gone over to plastic as well now.

--
Simon M.

MartinM said:

A few months ago I posted about how Shimano rear cassettes seemed to
be getting cheaper and nastier; now it is STI shifters. I have just
fitted some Tiagra shifters to a friend's bike, and they are mostly
plastic and steel, nowhere near as good as the alloy RSX units I have
on my other bike. Anyone else
noticed this? What is 105 like these days, as I certainly would not
use anything less now with this quality? (I know cheap Campag stuff
is all plastic)

Have you tried taking the train? ;-)

MartinM said:

"dwb" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

MartinM said:

A few months ago I posted about how Shimano rear cassettes seemed to
be getting cheaper and nastier; now it is STI shifters. I have just
fitted some Tiagra shifters to a friend's bike, and they are mostly
plastic and steel, nowhere near as good as the alloy RSX units I
have on my other bike. Anyone else
noticed this? What is 105 like these days, as I certainly would not
use anything less now with this quality? (I know cheap Campag stuff
is all plastic)

Have you tried taking the train? ;-)

??

Just in reference to your accidental post in UKR 🙂

"Simon Mason" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"MartinM" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

A few months ago I posted about how Shimano rear cassettes seemed to be
getting cheaper and nastier; now it is STI shifters. I have just fitted
some Tiagra shifters to a friend's bike, and they are mostly plastic and
steel, nowhere near as good as the alloy RSX units I have on my other
bike.
Anyone else
noticed this? What is 105 like these days, as I certainly would not use
anything less now with this quality? (I know cheap Campag stuff is all
plastic)

I read that Campag Mirage Ergolevers were plastic in some review, but I
tested mine with a multimeter and mine are definitely alloy. My bike is an
02 model, so maybe Campag Mirage has gone over to plastic as well now.

I think Xenon is all plastic including the levers

"dwb" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

MartinM said:

A few months ago I posted about how Shimano rear cassettes seemed to
be getting cheaper and nastier; now it is STI shifters. I have just
fitted some Tiagra shifters to a friend's bike, and they are mostly
plastic and steel, nowhere near as good as the alloy RSX units I have
on my other bike. Anyone else
noticed this? What is 105 like these days, as I certainly would not
use anything less now with this quality? (I know cheap Campag stuff
is all plastic)

Have you tried taking the train? ;-)

??

Simon Mason said:

I read that Campag Mirage Ergolevers were plastic in some review,
but I tested mine with a multimeter and mine are definitely alloy. My
bike is an 02 model, so maybe Campag Mirage has gone over to plastic
as well now.

Mirage levers have been described as "composite" for some years now, since
before 2002, I thought. The ones I've got seem like plastic (and I don't
mind them).

~PB

MartinM said:

I think Xenon is all plastic including the levers

It's certainly not ALL plastic. Just bits of plastic here and there,
including the lever blades.

~PB

MartinM said:

Quoted message said:

Just in reference to your accidental post in UKR 🙂

Oh you spotted that as well did you? I got a reply as well, from a
cyclist!

Joined up transport!

"dwb" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

MartinM said:

"dwb" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

MartinM wrote:
> A few months ago I posted about how Shimano rear cassettes seemed to
> be getting cheaper and nastier; now it is STI shifters. I have just
> fitted some Tiagra shifters to a friend's bike, and they are mostly
> plastic and steel, nowhere near as good as the alloy RSX units I
> have on my other bike. Anyone else
> noticed this? What is 105 like these days, as I certainly would not
> use anything less now with this quality? (I know cheap Campag stuff
> is all plastic)

Have you tried taking the train? ;-)

??

Just in reference to your accidental post in UKR 🙂

Oh you spotted that as well did you? I got a reply as well, from a cyclist!

MartinM said:

"Pete Biggs" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Simon Mason said:

I read that Campag Mirage Ergolevers were plastic in some review,
but I tested mine with a multimeter and mine are definitely alloy.
My bike is an 02 model, so maybe Campag Mirage has gone over to
plastic
as well now.

Mirage levers have been described as "composite" for some years now,
since before 2002, I thought. The ones I've got seem like plastic
(and I don't mind them).

There's nothing wrong with plastic as such, just that my old STI
units (RSX and RX100, bottom and next up of the range at the time)
are all alloy, and Sora and Tiagra, the modern equivalents, are
mostly plastic. Is it a case of cutting costs or trying to justify
the higher price for the (presumably alloy) top end stuff?

I don't know about 105 but Ultegra has plastic parts and always has done
AFAIK. I have some original Ultegra 9 speed.

MartinM said:

There's nothing wrong with plastic as such, just that my old STI
units (RSX and RX100, bottom and next up of the range at the time)
are all alloy, and Sora and Tiagra, the modern equivalents, are
mostly plastic. Is it a case of cutting costs or trying to justify
the higher price for the (presumably alloy) top end stuff?

Good question. I never know what the answer is, really.

Top end Campag now has carbon fibre levers, which is afterall another sort
of composite material. Alloy for middle stuff.

~PB

"Pete Biggs" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Simon Mason said:

I read that Campag Mirage Ergolevers were plastic in some review,
but I tested mine with a multimeter and mine are definitely alloy. My
bike is an 02 model, so maybe Campag Mirage has gone over to plastic
as well now.

Mirage levers have been described as "composite" for some years now, since
before 2002, I thought. The ones I've got seem like plastic (and I don't
mind them).

There's nothing wrong with plastic as such, just that my old STI units (RSX
and RX100, bottom and next up of the range at the time) are all alloy, and
Sora and Tiagra, the modern equivalents, are mostly plastic. Is it a case of
cutting costs or trying to justify the higher price for the (presumably
alloy) top end stuff?

"Pete Biggs" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

MartinM said:

There's nothing wrong with plastic as such, just that my old STI
units (RSX and RX100, bottom and next up of the range at the time)
are all alloy, and Sora and Tiagra, the modern equivalents, are
mostly plastic. Is it a case of cutting costs or trying to justify
the higher price for the (presumably alloy) top end stuff?

Good question. I never know what the answer is, really.

and the Sora rear mech has large placcy bit where the RSX was alloy

in message <[email hidden]>, MartinM

(') said:

"Pete Biggs" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Simon Mason said:

I read that Campag Mirage Ergolevers were plastic in some review,
but I tested mine with a multimeter and mine are definitely alloy.
My bike is an 02 model, so maybe Campag Mirage has gone over to
plastic as well now.

Mirage levers have been described as "composite" for some years now,
since
before 2002, I thought. The ones I've got seem like plastic (and I
don't mind them).

There's nothing wrong with plastic as such, just that my old STI units
(RSX and RX100, bottom and next up of the range at the time) are all
alloy, and Sora and Tiagra, the modern equivalents, are mostly
plastic. Is it a case of cutting costs or trying to justify the higher
price for the (presumably alloy) top end stuff?

It's conceivable that the plastic is lighter, stringer and more durable.
2004 Campagnolo Record Ergos are described as 'composite body and
lever' and I bet that's not because it's cheap.

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

;; I'd rather live in sybar-space

"Simon Brooke" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

in message <[email hidden]>, MartinM

(') said:

"Pete Biggs" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Simon Mason wrote:
> I read that Campag Mirage Ergolevers were plastic in some review,
> but I tested mine with a multimeter and mine are definitely alloy.
> My bike is an 02 model, so maybe Campag Mirage has gone over to
> plastic as well now.

Mirage levers have been described as "composite" for some years now,
since
before 2002, I thought. The ones I've got seem like plastic (and I
don't mind them).

There's nothing wrong with plastic as such, just that my old STI units
(RSX and RX100, bottom and next up of the range at the time) are all
alloy, and Sora and Tiagra, the modern equivalents, are mostly
plastic. Is it a case of cutting costs or trying to justify the higher
price for the (presumably alloy) top end stuff?

It's conceivable that the plastic is lighter, stringer and more durable.
2004 Campagnolo Record Ergos are described as 'composite body and
lever' and I bet that's not because it's cheap.

Well my experience of a million (ish) plastic toys is that the pivot points
are not as strong as metal (and car components)
Talking of carbon levers, I don't think I would like them ; I have visions
of little bits getting in my fingers like fibreglass (the only carbon fibre
item I own in the whole world is a pair of painted forks) although I'm sure
it's not like that.

MartinM said:

Well my experience of a million (ish) plastic toys is that the pivot
points are not as strong as metal (and car components)
Talking of carbon levers, I don't think I would like them ; I have
visions of little bits getting in my fingers like fibreglass (the
only carbon fibre item I own in the whole world is a pair of painted
forks) although I'm sure it's not like that.

Carbon fibre products tend to have a dead smooth glossy finish. Plenty of
resin is used over and between the layers of woven fibres.

www.campagnolo.com/pics/CH-Ergopower_1.jpg

~PB

"Simon Mason" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

I read that Campag Mirage Ergolevers were plastic in some review, but I
tested mine with a multimeter and mine are definitely alloy. My bike is an
02 model, so maybe Campag Mirage has gone over to plastic as well now.

Yup, Mirage uses plastic levers these days. I have 1999-model Mirage
Ergos on my road bike, which are alloy; I think '99 may have been the
last year that alloy was used. However, some bike makers
supply/supplied Mirage-equipped bikes with Veloce levers as standard,
possibly mindful that quite a few people prefer metal to plastic
levers (I've tried both, but much prefer alloy).

David E. Belcher

David E. Belcher <[email hidden]> wrote:

: Yup, Mirage uses plastic levers these days. I have 1999-model Mirage
: Ergos on my road bike, which are alloy; I think '99 may have been the
: last year that alloy was used. However, some bike makers
: supply/supplied Mirage-equipped bikes with Veloce levers as standard,
: possibly mindful that quite a few people prefer metal to plastic
: levers (I've tried both, but much prefer alloy).

The Mirage plastic levers aren't very nice IMO. The higher end
carbon stuff is very nice indeed.

Arthur

--
Arthur Clune http://www.clune.org
"Technolibertarians make a philosophy out of a personality defect"
- Paulina Borsook

"David E. Belcher" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Simon Mason" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

I read that Campag Mirage Ergolevers were plastic in some review, but I
tested mine with a multimeter and mine are definitely alloy. My bike is
an
02 model, so maybe Campag Mirage has gone over to plastic as well now.

Yup, Mirage uses plastic levers these days. I have 1999-model Mirage
Ergos on my road bike, which are alloy; I think '99 may have been the
last year that alloy was used. However, some bike makers
supply/supplied Mirage-equipped bikes with Veloce levers as standard,
possibly mindful that quite a few people prefer metal to plastic
levers (I've tried both, but much prefer alloy).

Mine say Mirage on the brake hoods. Is it likely that I've got Mirage
hoods, but Veloce levers? Do they get mixed up like that?

--
Simon M.