Re: WHY???

Pete C. said:

limey said:

Becca said:

jmcquown wrote:

> The thing is, this was a teenager. And sadly, her parents didn't
> teach her these basic rules. Mine did. I feel for the family.
>
> Jill

Jill, I am glad you are cautious, this is probably why you have been
safe. This girl's father was in law enforcement for 16 years, so I
have a hard time believing that her father did not teach her to be
careful. Parents teach kids a lot; do not take drugs, do not drink,
do not smoke, wear your seatbelt, etc., but teenagers have a mind of
their own.
Becca

I'm having a hard time with this young girl's death today. She had
just graduated, was bright and pretty and her life has been wrenched
away. At the same time, we have the news reporters concentrating
on spoiled Paris Hilton and her having served five days of her
original 45 days in prison "but will wear an ankle bracelet and be
under house arrest". Things seem on tilt, somehow.

Dora

You should also be concerned that the media has already convicted the
suspect in the case. There has been no trial and the only evidence
we're aware of so far is that someone who looked like the suspect was
shopping at the same store at about the same time. Perhaps the police
have more evidence, but the media doesn't and should not be
convicting the guy before a trial.

Pete C.

They do it all the time, though, Pete. If there's nothing important to
report in the news they'll drag a suspect through the mud over every
relationship he ever had or even thought about having. I'm not
unsympathetic to the poor young womans' family, not in the least. But we're
just a bunch of folks on usenet; we don't know for sure this guy did
anything at all. This isn't an episode of CSI or Law & Order.

Jill

elaine said:

"limey" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Becca said:

jmcquown wrote:

> The thing is, this was a teenager. And sadly, her parents didn't
> teach her these basic rules. Mine did. I feel for the family.
>
> Jill

Jill, I am glad you are cautious, this is probably why you have been
safe. This girl's father was in law enforcement for 16 years, so I
have a hard time believing that her father did not teach her to be
careful. Parents teach kids a lot; do not take drugs, do not drink,
do not smoke, wear your seatbelt, etc., but teenagers have a mind of
their own.
Becca

I'm having a hard time with this young girl's death today. She had
just graduated, was bright and pretty and her life has been wrenched
away. At the same time, we have the news reporters concentrating
on spoiled Paris Hilton and her having served five days of her
original 45 days in prison "but will wear an ankle bracelet and be
under house arrest". Things seem on tilt, somehow.

Dora

Crazy! Would that all people in jail are moved to house arrest
because they cannot eat the food and endangering their health.

Spoiled or what..........

elaine

I'm sure if I owned (or was heir to) a string of hotel chains I'd get to be
confined to my poor pitiful mansion with my servants, swimming pool, etc.
too. There shouldn't be such a double standard but there is.

Jill

Puester said:

Dave Smith said:

Becca said:

The judge said Paris would not be allowed any alternative jail
methods or electronic monitoring, but now she has been "reassigned"
to house arrest. I should not comment, because I have no idea what
really happened, but this makes it look like her attorneys handed
the judge a big, fat contribution to his reelection campaign. I am
not saying this happened, but this is what people will assume.

It is nice to be rich. LOL I am only guessing, of course.

Perhaps there was a matter of Hilton's personal safety. Prisons are
full of nasty women and they were probably planning on giving her a
little prison justice just for something to do.

According to the news she was in a private cell, and even if she
wasn't, why should she get preferential treatment to other felons?
She was caught driving drunk more than once and drove again after her
license was suspended. I wonder what the penalty would have been if
she had killed someone while driving under the influence....

gloria p

She wasn't even of *legal age* when she was arrested this time. What
happened to "gee, you have to be 21"? (Caveat: in most states, I guess,
although when I reached the age of majority in TN it was 18, then later 9,
then finally 21).

Jill

Dee Dee said:

On Jun 7, 3:24 pm, "limey" <[email hidden]> wrote:
At the same time, we have the news reporters concentrating on

Quoted message said:

spoiled Paris Hilton and her having served five days of her original
45 days in prison "but will wear an ankle bracelet and be under house
arrest". Things seem on tilt, somehow.

Dora- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Counting time was actually 3 days & 3 hours. One can speculate what
the medical problem is.
De Dee

Maybe her breast implants couldn't take the heat 😉

In article <[email hidden]>,

(Steve Pope) said:

If you're packing a piece but spending lots of time on the road,
you're putting your personal safety at peril far more than an
individual who does neither of these. So, who is being more
responsible?

That statement made absolutely no sense... ;-)
I have to drive to work and live in general.

Protecting myself is a choice.
Driving isn't.
--
Peace, Om

Remove _ to validate e-mails.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a Son of a [censored]" -- Jack Nicholson

In article <[email hidden]>,

Dave Smith said:

We sure as hell don't throw them into a situation where they will be
subjected to vicious beatings and possible death.

And that was a serious consideration in this case.

Jail violence is a serious problem that needs to be addressed.
It's widely ignored and that is wrong.

We are not supposed to be a third world country, but our jails may as
well be. :-(
--
Peace, Om

Remove _ to validate e-mails.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a Son of a [censored]" -- Jack Nicholson

Dave Smith said:

Puester said:

According to the news she was in a private cell, and even if she wasn't,
why should she get preferential treatment to other felons? She was
caught driving drunk more than once and drove again after her license
was suspended. I wonder what the penalty would have been if she had
killed someone while driving under the influence....

I don't dispute that she deserved some jail time. I was just trying to
point out that there are some real losers in jail and some of them like to
make a name for themselves by attacking more famous and celebrity
prisoners. She deserves to go to jail, but what she does not deserve is to
have her life endangered in a violent environment. It is like the issue of
convicted pedophiles who are put into protective custody. They deserve the
jail time, and since there is generally not a death sentence for those
crimes, or where there is it has to be a more humane method of execution,
we sure as hell don't throw them into a situation where they will be
subjected to vicious beatings and possible death.

LA jail has a special section for celebs. To keep the celebs safe and
keep the other inmates from doing things like taking pictures to sell.
--
Susan N.

"Moral indignation is in most cases two percent moral,
48 percent indignation, and 50 percent envy."
Vittorio De Sica, Italian movie director (1901-1974)

Omelet said:

[email hidden] (Steve Pope) wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

If you're packing a piece but spending lots of time on the road,
you're putting your personal safety at peril far more than an
individual who does neither of these. So, who is being more
responsible?

Quoted message said:

That statement made absolutely no sense... ;-)
I have to drive to work and live in general.

Quoted message said:

Protecting myself is a choice.
Driving isn't.

A rather limited view of the world. Millions of people in
cites like London, New York, San Francisco do not drive nor
do they need to drive to work or otherwise.

Steve

Omelet said:

I believe you can still own an air rifle?

Yes we can and do. But the maximum power allowed without registration on a
firearm Certificate, is 12 ft lbs for rifles and 6 ft lbs for pistols, not
exactly in the Elk hunting class. If the power of a pistol was over 6 ft lbs
it would be classed as a firearm and would therefore be banned for ownership
by most people. We can own air rifles with a muzzle energy of over 12 ft lbs
with an appropriate certficate but the maximum for practical use is around
24 ft lb, still way below even a .22 rimfire short. Most of the very
powerful airguns are antiques and they take so long to recharge is that they
are almost impractical. similar rifles were so feared at the time of the
Napoleonic wars that the French threatened that anyone caught carrying one
would be subject to immediate execution.

What is little known is that UK citizens can still own pistols but ownership
is restricted to certain uses, such as professional pest controllers,
stalkers, or farmers, for humane dispatch of large animals or those trapped
alive. The pistols for such use can be of any 'appropriate' calibre and of
any action type. I know of users with revolvers in the .357/.44 class and
autos in 9mm, .40 and .45. A .410 double barrel, semi-auto or revolver is
favoured by many pest controllers using either bird shot, buck or solid slug
according to circumstance. Pistols of any calibre are banned for target
shooting though, just one of the idiotic contradictions in UK firearm
legislation.

David

In article <[email hidden]>,

(Steve Pope) said:

Omelet said:

[email hidden] (Steve Pope) wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

If you're packing a piece but spending lots of time on the road,
you're putting your personal safety at peril far more than an
individual who does neither of these. So, who is being more
responsible?

Quoted message said:

That statement made absolutely no sense... ;-)
I have to drive to work and live in general.

Quoted message said:

Protecting myself is a choice.
Driving isn't.

A rather limited view of the world. Millions of people in
cites like London, New York, San Francisco do not drive nor
do they need to drive to work or otherwise.

Steve

We don't have an efficient public transportation system.
With the price of gas the way it is, do you really think I'd not use
it???

I use about 1.5 gallons per day to commute.
--
Peace, Om

Remove _ to validate e-mails.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a Son of a [censored]" -- Jack Nicholson

In article <[email hidden]>,

Ophelia said:

Omelet said:

I believe you can still own an air rifle?

Yes we can and do. But the maximum power allowed without registration on a
firearm Certificate, is 12 ft lbs for rifles and 6 ft lbs for pistols, not
exactly in the Elk hunting class. If the power of a pistol was over 6 ft lbs
it would be classed as a firearm and would therefore be banned for ownership
by most people. We can own air rifles with a muzzle energy of over 12 ft lbs
with an appropriate certficate but the maximum for practical use is around
24 ft lb, still way below even a .22 rimfire short. Most of the very
powerful airguns are antiques and they take so long to recharge is that they
are almost impractical. similar rifles were so feared at the time of the
Napoleonic wars that the French threatened that anyone caught carrying one
would be subject to immediate execution.

What is little known is that UK citizens can still own pistols but ownership
is restricted to certain uses, such as professional pest controllers,
stalkers, or farmers, for humane dispatch of large animals or those trapped
alive. The pistols for such use can be of any 'appropriate' calibre and of
any action type. I know of users with revolvers in the .357/.44 class and
autos in 9mm, .40 and .45. A .410 double barrel, semi-auto or revolver is
favoured by many pest controllers using either bird shot, buck or solid slug
according to circumstance. Pistols of any calibre are banned for target
shooting though, just one of the idiotic contradictions in UK firearm
legislation.

David

Fascinating... Thanks. :-)
--
Peace, Om

Remove _ to validate e-mails.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a Son of a [censored]" -- Jack Nicholson

On Fri, 8 Jun 2007 15:16:26 -0500, "jmcquown" <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Pete C. said:

limey said:

Becca wrote:
> jmcquown wrote:
>
>
>> The thing is, this was a teenager. And sadly, her parents didn't
>> teach her these basic rules. Mine did. I feel for the family.
>>
>> Jill
>
> Jill, I am glad you are cautious, this is probably why you have been
> safe. This girl's father was in law enforcement for 16 years, so I
> have a hard time believing that her father did not teach her to be
> careful. Parents teach kids a lot; do not take drugs, do not drink,
> do not smoke, wear your seatbelt, etc., but teenagers have a mind of
> their own.
> Becca

I'm having a hard time with this young girl's death today. She had
just graduated, was bright and pretty and her life has been wrenched
away. At the same time, we have the news reporters concentrating
on spoiled Paris Hilton and her having served five days of her
original 45 days in prison "but will wear an ankle bracelet and be
under house arrest". Things seem on tilt, somehow.

Dora

You should also be concerned that the media has already convicted the
suspect in the case. There has been no trial and the only evidence
we're aware of so far is that someone who looked like the suspect was
shopping at the same store at about the same time. Perhaps the police
have more evidence, but the media doesn't and should not be
convicting the guy before a trial.

Pete C.

They do it all the time, though, Pete. If there's nothing important to
report in the news they'll drag a suspect through the mud over every
relationship he ever had or even thought about having. I'm not
unsympathetic to the poor young womans' family, not in the least. But we're
just a bunch of folks on usenet; we don't know for sure this guy did
anything at all. This isn't an episode of CSI or Law & Order.

Jill

maybe not, but it probably will be soon.

your pal,
[censored]

jmcquown said:

Pete C. said:

limey said:

Becca wrote:
> jmcquown wrote:
>
>
>> The thing is, this was a teenager. And sadly, her parents didn't
>> teach her these basic rules. Mine did. I feel for the family.
>>
>> Jill
>
> Jill, I am glad you are cautious, this is probably why you have been
> safe. This girl's father was in law enforcement for 16 years, so I
> have a hard time believing that her father did not teach her to be
> careful. Parents teach kids a lot; do not take drugs, do not drink,
> do not smoke, wear your seatbelt, etc., but teenagers have a mind of
> their own.
> Becca

I'm having a hard time with this young girl's death today. She had
just graduated, was bright and pretty and her life has been wrenched
away. At the same time, we have the news reporters concentrating
on spoiled Paris Hilton and her having served five days of her
original 45 days in prison "but will wear an ankle bracelet and be
under house arrest". Things seem on tilt, somehow.

Dora

You should also be concerned that the media has already convicted the
suspect in the case. There has been no trial and the only evidence
we're aware of so far is that someone who looked like the suspect was
shopping at the same store at about the same time. Perhaps the police
have more evidence, but the media doesn't and should not be
convicting the guy before a trial.

Pete C.

They do it all the time, though, Pete. If there's nothing important to
report in the news they'll drag a suspect through the mud over every
relationship he ever had or even thought about having. I'm not
unsympathetic to the poor young womans' family, not in the least. But we're
just a bunch of folks on usenet; we don't know for sure this guy did
anything at all. This isn't an episode of CSI or Law & Order.

Jill

Today they changed their focus to the more newsworthy Paris Hilton
fiasco... Award winning journalism...

Pete C.

Omelet said:

I

Jail violence is a serious problem that needs to be addressed.
It's widely ignored and that is wrong.

We are not supposed to be a third world country, but our jails may as
well be. :-(

When a local girl and her husband sexually molested and murdered a couple
of teenage girls, one of them her own sister, she ended up ratting him out
and getting a special deal, only 12 years. He got live and dangerous
offender designation, so he stays in jail. A bunch of women prisoners
rioted, part of a plan to distract guards so someone could get to her.
Female guards could not get the inmate sunder control so the riot squad
from the local male prison were called in. The entire operation was
videotaped to make sure that everything was on the up and up. There was a
major scandal because these poor women were strip searched by male guards.
The poor dears felt they had been dehumanized. These same women a few hours
earlier were throwing buckets of [censored] and [censored] at the female guards. They
solution was to close down that old jail and build a new facility where the
women live in cabin groups and get to lock their doors from the inside.

On Fri, 8 Jun 2007 19:30:10 +0000 (UTC), [email hidden] (Steve

Pope) said:

Sure. Let's see. The incidence of getting murdered in the U.S.
is 6 per 100,000.

It is 3.6 per 100,000 for firearms,Number 8 in the top 32 countries.
Average is 6.9
Google firearms murder rate.

Quoted message said:

Two to five times that of any civilized country,

Iran has one of the oldest in the world, check their stats.

Quoted message said:

but still way, way lower than many other causes of death such as
accidents, coronary disease and so on. And lower than the risk
in the U.S. one century ago.

Quoted message said:

Or take the time you'd spend at the
shooting range and use it for aerobic exercise instead.

Its more strength training.

Quoted message said:

If you're packing a piece

Having a weapon, lessens your chances of being a victim, not increase
your chances.

jmcquown said:

The thing is, this was a teenager. And sadly, her parents didn't teach her
these basic rules. Mine did. I feel for the family.

Hi all,

I live here in KC and she was abducted from my Target store. Just want
to clear one thing up. Yes, she was 18 and it was in broad daylight.
As for her family not teaching her the basic rules- He left the store
before her and waited on her. He ran up to her very quickly and she
fought back.
Not sure what else she could have done. How could she have known a
very normal looking guy in the parking lot who appeared to be also
just going to his car would RUSH her like that?
Do you recommend we never go to our car if there is ANYONE else in the
lot?

A.

In article <[email hidden]>,

Pan Ohco said:

Quoted message said:

Or take the time you'd spend at the
shooting range and use it for aerobic exercise instead.

Its more strength training.

He has no idea how tired I am after a 4 hour range session. ;-)

And soaked in sweat.
--
Peace, Om

Remove _ to validate e-mails.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a Son of a [censored]" -- Jack Nicholson

Alexandra said:

jmcquown said:

The thing is, this was a teenager. And sadly, her parents didn't teach her
these basic rules. Mine did. I feel for the family.

Hi all,

I live here in KC and she was abducted from my Target store. Just want
to clear one thing up. Yes, she was 18 and it was in broad daylight.
As for her family not teaching her the basic rules- He left the store
before her and waited on her. He ran up to her very quickly and she
fought back.
Not sure what else she could have done. How could she have known a
very normal looking guy in the parking lot who appeared to be also
just going to his car would RUSH her like that?
Do you recommend we never go to our car if there is ANYONE else in the
lot?

Her parents will go to their grave wishing they had the IQ to teach
her not to go traipsing about ALONE. There was no way to know that
particular preditor was out there but it is absolulutely moronic not
to realize thsat preditors are always on the lookout for easy prey.
Had that poor girl been with even one friend the cowardly preditor
(and make no mistake about it, they are all cowards) would not have
chose her... he chose her for one reason and one reason only, she was
alone, and obviously alone. Hashing and rehashing all the what ifs is
nothing but mental masturbation... do not go alone!

Sheldon

Sheldon said:

Her parents will go to their grave wishing they had the IQ to teach
her not to go traipsing about ALONE. There was no way to know that
particular preditor was out there but it is absolulutely moronic not
to realize thsat preditors are always on the lookout for easy prey.

There is a couple not too far from here who are probably wishing they had
done things a lot differently. Their daughter was locked out of the house
because she had broken her curfew. She was abducted, sexually assaulted
and murdered by a husband and wife set of serial killers after the male
half of the murderous pair found her sitting all alone in a park early in
the morning.
..

"jmcquown" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

(Caveat: in most states, I guess,
although when I reached the age of majority in TN it was 18, then later 9,
then finally 21).

So they decided for a brief moment that 18 was too old??

Thank goodness they realized their mistake in time! 😉

Mary