Re: Broken KH/Schlumpf hub

How many miles have you done on it?

Perhaps there should be a required maintenance log for Schlumpf hubs.
Eg after a certain amount of use they are all pulled apart and
serviced. And after a certain amount of usage to replace all moving
parts.

A Schlumpf hub is a bit like a plane...extremely reliable but you never
ever want anything to go wrong in mid-flight.

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GizmoDuck said:

How many miles have you done on it?

Perhaps there should be a required maintenance log for Schlumpf hubs.
Eg after a certain amount of use they are all pulled apart and
serviced. And after a certain amount of usage to replace all moving
parts.

A Schlumpf hub is a bit like a plane...extremely reliable but you never
ever want anything to go wrong in mid-flight.

I dunno whether servicing would help much with these problems people
are having - because any sensible service interval would be way higher
than the distances people are breaking the new hubs in. I suspect it's
more an example of very high stresses 36 riders put on the hubs, which
have only previously been tested on 24/29, and the need for the hub
upgrade & recall. I know my old 29 hub seems to be working fine, and
that's been ridden easily 4000 probably 5000 or more km, but I guess I
must put way less stress on it than a fast rider on a wheel that weighs
2 or 3 times as much as my 29er wheel.

Although that's obviously all conjecture, I know very little about the
internals of my hub, and nothing at all about what's different between
new and old hubs.

Joe

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joemarshall said:

I dunno whether servicing would help much with these problems people are
having - because any sensible service interval would be way higher than
the distances people are breaking the new hubs in. I suspect it's more
an example of very high stresses 36 riders put on the hubs, which have
only previously been tested on 24/29, and the need for the hub upgrade
& recall. I know my old 29 hub seems to be working fine, and that's
been ridden easily 4000 probably 5000 or more km, but I guess I must
put way less stress on it than a fast rider on a wheel that weighs 2 or
3 times as much as my 29er wheel.

Although that's obviously all conjecture, I know very little about the
internals of my hub, and nothing at all about what's different between
new and old hubs.

Joe

True, but I would still propose that there is some sort of recommended
service and replacement interval. Moving parts wear down eventually.
A bikes' chain will skip when it's worn, but I don't know what the
Schlumpf will do. Probably slip.

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joemarshall said:

Almost certainly isn't a fix, but is there any chance loose cranks could
allow this wobble to happen? Being splined aren't loose cranks a bit
less obvious than square taper?

Joe

That's definitely not the problem. I torqued the cranks to ensure they
are set right.

corbin

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GizmoDuck said:

How many miles have you done on it?

Perhaps there should be a required maintenance log for Schlumpf hubs.
Eg after a certain amount of use they are all pulled apart and
serviced. And after a certain amount of usage to replace all moving
parts.

A Schlumpf hub is a bit like a plane...extremely reliable but you never
ever want anything to go wrong in mid-flight.

700 miles. I had 100 miles on my ODO before Vietnam, rode the 300 miles
in Vietnam on the old hub (400 ODO). I got the new hub right when I got
back, and now my odo is over 1100.

I hadn't done *anything* to the hub other than tightening the cranks.
It says to grease it 1-2 times a year...and I haven't had it even 6
months!

corbin

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Hopefully you guys will post any response you get from Florian. I don't
know if Florian has open or captured bearings in his hub. Open bearings
are more subject to these problems. The axial stability of the axle with
respect to the hub has to be set by a lip or a retaining ring against
the inner race of a bearing. This would be a bearing inside the hub,
not the wheel bearings that attach to the frame. When done in a tidy
fashion this would be inside the housing and invisible. In my
renditions (not a tidy fashion) these are retaining rings outside of
the housing and visible. The motion exhibited in your video could arise
from a worn bearing in which the inner race could shift axially with
respect to the outer race. This would be accompanied by grinding or
rumbling of the bearing and that doesn't seem to be the case. A worn
retaining lip on the axle or a broken retaining ring would behave the
same way.

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harper said:

This would be accompanied by grinding or rumbling of the bearing and
that doesn't seem to be the case.

Interesting! Maybe this is the problem. I was experiencing some
grinding and rumbling noises on yesterdays 10-12 mile ride before I had
the freewheel problem. I stopped several times to examine the hub, shift
through rotations, and make sure the noises weren't my spokes or brake
rubbing.

FWIW, I've also broken 4 spokes with this wheel build (broken at the
bend side). My prior non-geared coker wheel I had never broken a
spoke.

corbin

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NOOOO!!!! Corbin, that sucks! I was lucky to have broken mine
sufficiently early! I'm definitely going to bring my ungeared 36 with
me to RTL...

If you ship the hub to Florian UPS Express and he fixes it RIGHT AWAY
and ships it back to you UPS Express (he did for me, and says he does
all the time for broken hubs) then you can still get it in time.
Methinks if you send it now, he'll get it Monday, and if he ships
Monday or Tuesday, you should get it by next Thursday or Friday. There
is still hope!

What if you did this? I'm not... advocating a DIY fix, but merely
brainstorming. Okay, disclaimer done. What if you tell Florian that you
broke your hub, and then ask him if it's okay if you try to fix it for
before RTL? That way, you could clear it with him to get inside and
maybe fix what's wrong, so he'll still fix it for you after RTL if
you're unable to make it work again. I think that'd be the way to do
it... unless you need a replacement part. If you did this and were able
to identify, with Florian's help, the part you need, he could ship it to
you and you'd have it by Monday or Tuesday next week... plenty of time
to get it all set to go before RTL.

Good luck, Corbin! We (all of us at RTL) need you on your geared hub!
(You've gotta be the fastest GUni rider I know... it'd totally be a
shame if you ended up without your hub at the race!)

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GizmoDuck said:

A Schlumpf hub is a bit like a plane...extremely reliable but you never
ever want anything to go wrong in mid-flight.

wow, Ken. That's a GREAT way to think about it! So true!

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Wow Corbin, that really bites. I'm glad you weren't hurt!

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