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Race report: Escarpment trail run

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General fitness, health and nutrition
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1 August 2005
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4 August 2005
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Tony
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  1. This is probably one of the toughest and most unique races on the east
    coast. http://escarpmenttrail.com/

    Summary:

    This was my goal race of the year, and I had an absolute blast. I finished
    in 71st place (out of about 175) in 4:24:34, beating my goal time of 4:30.
    6peat winner Ben Nephew (who set the course record last year 2:45:20, ran it
    this year in 2:56:54. Temps were in low 60's up to upper 70's, and there was
    mist, then clouds and then a bit of sun. High humidity made hydration
    essential.

    Very long version:

    Ever since I first hiked the escarpment trail 12 years ago, it's been my
    favorite trail in the Catskills. The views become more frequent as you go
    south, and the southern end (where the race ends) is the site where several
    grand mountain hotels were built in the early 1800's (all since burned
    down), and where there are dramatic cliffs and views overlooking the Hudson
    river valley 2000 over feet below.

    When I learned there was a trail race there I wanted to do it, though I knew
    how hard it would be since even hiking it is difficult. Even though I've
    been a technical trail runner since I was 15, running sections 100 miles
    away from the escarpment trail on the very same long path, I knew some
    serious training had to be done.

    Finally after a few years of getting back into running after a switch to
    cycling, I ran a 50k trail and a marathon last year, which qualified me for
    the escarpment trail run. This year began poorly with a series of illnesses
    in February, so I started with little base in March, though my training from
    last year seemed to carry over and things went well. I worked up my long
    runs to 4 hours, did LT training once a week for the last 10 weeks, and ran
    hilly trail routes for part of my long runs, with two sessions dedicated to
    uphill and downhill training near threshold. I also ran the 30km
    double-trouble trail race 5 weeks ago as training, and though that race has
    almost no flat, it's hills would feel flat on the escarpment trail.

    My taper went well, and my legs really needed the rest. I had a bee sting
    between the toes on my left foot this Friday before the race, and it hurt to
    walk on until Saturday night, despite repeated icing. Luckily after applying
    tiger-balm that night, Race morning it felt fine. I was satisfied with my 5
    months of training and with a weight loss of 16 pounds since mid May,
    getting down to 165/166.

    Race morning had me feeling well rested, having caught up on some missing
    sleep Saturday afternoon. As I rode the bus to the start I had my 2 bottle
    waistpack ready to go with accelerade in the bottles, extra powder for 3
    more bottles, a clip 2 pouch, salt tabs, and a gel. I felt more relaxed than
    ever before a race, knowing I'd done all I could to prepare, and having
    hiked the trail a few times before. This is exactly the kind of terrain I
    love running on: extremely technical singletrack.

    Start: Going up Windham High Peak
    1800' to 3500+', 3.2 miles:

    Owing to the course profile and a healthy respect for the climbs to come,
    the plan was to go up Windham very conservatively. This was also Doug's
    sagely advice. This race is kind of like one of the long mountain stages in
    the tour de France where you're foolhardy to go up the early climbs too
    fast. With a couple of days of glycogen in my legs, I had no desire to go
    out hard, and I wanted to warm up carefully during the run to get readings
    from my body (didn't wear a HRM, just listening to all the little signals).

    I started with about 150 people in front of me and 25 people behind me -
    ensuring a slow start. It took 2 mins for everyone in front of me to file
    onto the singletrack trail, then walking then jogging slowly. As I settled
    into my jog, then walked the first mildly steep section, a few more people
    passed me. After that I settle in behind a group that was running while I
    was walking uphill.

    It never ceases to amaze me, as it did throughout the day, how many people
    run when they could walk fast more efficiently. I mostly walked fast up
    Windham, but jogged the flatter sections. Toward the top, I passed several
    people who started too hard. The last guy I passed was breathing way too
    hard, and not long after I passed him I heard him take a hard fall. Calling
    back to him, he was ok, but, I thought, he was in for a long hard day. I
    reached the top in a very conservative ~54 mins.

    Windham was the first of SEVEN water stops, every one of which is a serious
    haul for the volunteers, and it was really great to see 10-15 of them at
    each stop handing out water and gatorade and cheering us on - just fantastic
    support. Since my bottles were both pretty full, I just sipped a little
    water. I was feeling good, my legs warmed up and ready for the day.

    Down Windham to Red BD trail
    2700', 2.65 (5.85) miles:

    This is a steep descent at first, then less so, then drops again. Here is
    where I started passing lots of people, still running conservatively just at
    my normal downhill pace using short quick steps, and a bit of gallop on
    steeper sections (you never fall when galloping).

    For me, the more technical the trail, the better. Even going up Windham,
    wherever it got technical, I would gain on people and finally had to pass
    some. Now on the first downhill I easily passed about 10 people.

    At the red trail intersection is the 2nd water stop. It was here I learned
    that my hydration strategy was out the window. I had emptied one bottle, so
    I wanted to refill and mix with a baggie of accelerade powder I'd
    pre-measured. I asked them if they could fill a bottle but they said they
    could only give 2 small cups - enough for drinking right there - but only
    enough to fill 1/2 my 20oz bottle.

    I totally understand why they are careful with the water and I was thankful
    to get any. So I put the powder in and had to wait for the next water stop
    to finish filling it. I pondered my hydration strategy as I continued.

    Across to the Blackhead Mt climb start
    2800', 2.55 (8.4) miles:

    In here, I got stuck behind a pack (it happened a few times later too) and
    it was difficult to pass so many people at once (about 7-8 running close
    together). While I don't mind running in a pack, whenever the trail gets
    very technical they slow down, and I don't need to slow as much, so I feel
    encumbered.

    Still running under control, and finally past the pack, I hit the yellow
    trail that marks the start of the Blackhead climb. There was also a water
    stop there, so I put 2 small cups of gatorade in my bottle and started up
    the climb.

    Up Blackhead
    3940', 1 (9.4) miles:

    As I started walking up, I felt ready for the 1100' climb, but not sure what
    pace to set, as I knew I wanted to save a lot for the last section of the
    race. Basically it's so steep you get pegged and you breathe very hard even
    taking very short steps. I probably take much shorter steps than most
    people, partly because my legs aren't long, and partly because I've found it
    saves the legs more to take short quick choppy steps.

    While on the early part of the climb, as I heard some other runners talking
    behind me, it occurred to me that since early on the Windham climb, I'd
    passed many, but had not been passed by anyone. An easy start and a steady
    pace was working out well. But I also didn't want to let myself go up
    blackhead too slow, so I just went by how my legs felt and not by my heavy
    breathing. If they started to burn too much I slowed a bit.

    Toward the top I caught up to several people, one of whom was asking someone
    for salt caps. I told her I had succeed caps and I gave her one as I passed
    her. She was the first of many I talked to who were cramping. (I took a cap
    before the race, and at 1:15 about 2:25, then at about 3:30).

    Cresting the top there were party balloons on the trail and a horde of
    people up there, lots of cheering, and a water stop. There were a bunch of
    runners standing around rehydrating. I just put some gatorade in my bottle
    and kept going, so I passed 4-5 people right there.

    Down to Dutcher Notch
    2500', 2.6 (12) miles:

    Soon after leaving blackhead, on the steep downhill I came up to several
    more runners and passed them, once again taking the rough technical sections
    smoothly where others slow down. For me up, down, or flat, the rougher the
    better. One of the guys I caught on the milder downhill section was running
    well, so I ran with him for a while and found out we both ran double-trouble
    in almost the same exact times (1:35 first loop, close to 2:00 the second
    loop).

    When it got steeper again, I passed him and then got to dutcher notch and
    yet another water stop - and an enthusiastic crowd! Those people were
    fantastic for lugging the water so far, especially to dutcher notch,
    blackhead, and stoppel point, where I was headed now. During this downhill
    section, I had picked up the pace a bit from my downhill on Windham, but I
    was still under control and not running all out, trying to save something
    for the finish. I just tried to run relaxed and smoothly, especially down
    the steeper sections.

    Up to Stoppel Point
    3420', 2.1 (14.1) miles:

    After drinking some gatorade, putting some in the bottle, and retying my
    shoes a little tighter, I started walking up the climb. The transition from
    downhill running to hiking up a steep climb is always interesting, and it
    hit me hard at first - I had to get my climbing legs going again.

    I had caught another 4 runners at the notch, and due to a quick stop, I was
    out ahead of them all. But soon I had to slow a bit and 3 of them passed me
    again. I let them go, thinking of what Paul Sherwin always says on the tour
    de France coverage - 'there he is going off the back of this select little
    climbing peleton... all he can do now is to climb the climb at his pace and
    not go too far into the red zone'.

    Actually it wasn't that bad, and I trailed the group of 3 up the climb, but
    it made me think I might have gone a bit too hard up Blackhead. After about
    10 mins I had recovered, and by the time we got up to the plane on Stoppel
    Point, I felt pretty good and was right behind them.

    At the water stop on Stoppel, I downed a little gatorade, put some in my
    bottle, and ate an orange slice; feeling good. My stop was fast again, and I
    passed the group of 3 plus someone else at the stop. With mostly downhill to
    the finish, I felt confident I could finish strong - my quads had felt
    absolutely fine going down the punishing hill from blackhead to dutcher
    notch.

    To North Point
    2900', 1.7 (15.8) miles:

    I still felt pretty good, though not exactly fresh, and I decided to really
    let it rip the last 3 miles. I caught up to a guy pretty soon and it felt
    fantastic to still be passing people so late in the race. I hadn't been
    passed since early on Windham and that made me really appreciate the
    slow-start steady-pace strategy.

    Soon I passed 2 more people, and I was loving the downhill again - where my
    hamstrings where worn out from the climbs, my quads were fine. I hammered
    the technical sections leading to North point but there's more fairly smooth
    slightly down trail here. At north point I drank 1/2 cup and kept going.

    Down to finish
    2100+', 2.45 (18.25*) miles:

    After North point there are *many* very rugged technical sections all the
    way to the finish, many of them steep little drops of 10 to 20 feet that are
    close to being cliffs. This is my element, and I carefully but confidently
    ran down everything without hesitation, and began passing more people fairly
    quickly. I was flying and loving it.

    Where it got flatter my legs felt heavy, but I was enjoying the difficult
    sections so much that I didn't mind. I passed someone on many of the little
    cliff sections. When the trail loops out left to the edge of the escarpment
    after about a mile it goes up and down and is fairly flat a good bit of the
    time, and I was not liking those little uphills.

    I knew the finish wasn't far, so I kept holding my increased pace, and
    passed a couple of more people. The 2nd to the last guy I passed with less
    than a mile to go was stronger on the flats, and he passed me back as the
    trail got smoother for a while. He was the only one to pass me since early
    and I couldn't stay with him on the flats. He finished just ahead of me. I
    passed one more guy and then shortly thereafter I heard the cheering at the
    finish and came in still running smoothly, but getting very close to empty
    since hammering all the way down from north point.

    I was pleased with my finish time, and felt like I'd paced it fairly well,
    and it feels damn good to pass people all day! Thanks Doug for the tips on
    this race, and others who have shared their training advice.

    When I set my time goal I really had no idea how fast I could go, I just
    wanted to beat the median time since I'm usually in the middle of the pack
    at trail races. I just tried to go out easy and finish strong and had no way
    to check times along the way.

    I had no falls, and just 2 stumbles, despite running pretty fast down the
    hills. My quads were strong the whole way, despite really hammering all the
    down's the 1300' all the way down from Stoppel. My hamstrings weren't really
    sore or cramping, but they were out of gas. In retrospect this comes as no
    surprise since I train 3 days a week on the bike and 3 days running. I also
    did some specific downhill and uphill training and this helped, but on the
    flatter sections my hamstrings got tired out a bit. Thus my strength remains
    downhills, and any difficult technical trail sections. Those are the places
    where I passed about 80 people in the race.

    This race is very unique, has wonderful and interesting people both running
    in it and running it and I had a great time. I plan to run it again next
    year.

    For those interested and not bored to death with my report, here's a good
    read from last year from 6 time winner Ben Nephew: http://tinyurl.com/ap56k

    -Tony

    * note: I used the NJ/NY trail conference map mileage since it gives
    distances between landmarks. The maps say its 18.25, but race course
    measured out at 18.6 miles - but it's a trail race - so whatever, besides in
    many sections it's literally too rough to run a wheel over it 🙂

  2. Tony (remove) said:

    This was my goal race of the year, and I had an absolute blast.
    I finished in 71st place (out of about 175) in 4:24:34

    Kick ass!!

    Congrats, Tony. Well done!

    Considering the condition of the roads, and the traffic, and the wildly
    unpredictable human (or sometimes near-human) element, sometimes the
    road running here in the city would just about qualify as "technical".
    ;-) But obviously this escarpment thingy is something else
    altogether, even compared to moderately rough trails. Sounds like a
    blast.

    Also sounds like you more or less grew up or at least came of age on
    mountainous trails. What's your story?

    Quoted message said:

    Thus my strength remains downhills, and any difficult technical trail
    sections.

    So how about fell running as practiced in the UK (and maybe e.g.
    Alaska; not clear to me whether the mountain running Dot chronicles
    here is the same thing exactly) - do you read about that scene,
    consider trying it, already done some?

  3. Tony (remove) said:

    This is probably one of the toughest and most unique races on the east
    coast. http://escarpmenttrail.com/

    Summary:

    This was my goal race of the year, and I had an absolute blast. I finished
    in 71st place (out of about 175) in 4:24:34, beating my goal time of 4:30.
    6peat winner Ben Nephew (who set the course record last year 2:45:20, ran it
    this year in 2:56:54. Temps were in low 60's up to upper 70's, and there was
    mist, then clouds and then a bit of sun. High humidity made hydration
    essential.

    Very long version:

    [...]

    Tony, your plan worked beautifully. It's great to see someone put
    together a training program and actually carry it through to the very
    finish of their goal race. I've been following your weekly training and
    I'm very impressed with your success. And you can write too. Thanks for
    the report. ;-)

    Congrats!

    --
    Phil M.

  4. On Mon, 01 Aug 2005 19:37:01 GMT, "Tony"

    qtrader2@(remove)hotmail.com said:

    This is probably one of the toughest and most unique races on the east
    coast. http://escarpmenttrail.com/


    good report. and your performance sounds well thought out
    and executed.

    i just have some thoughts...seems that for a run of this nature
    people would already be mature trail runners who know
    what to bring. what happened to the lady who needed
    caps? perhaps she was one of those who got in by
    running a road marathon. or perhaps they weren't
    so strict on the qualification aspect. thanks for
    writing this up.

    i know running all rocks/roots is exhausting. it feels
    like at least twice as hard as a road run. and when you
    get tired out, you trip. i bet the stumbles you had
    made you more alert for a while.
    ....thehick

  5. "Tony" <qtrader2@(remove)hotmail.com> wrote

    Quoted message said:

    It never ceases to amaze me, as it did throughout the day, how many people
    run when they could walk fast more efficiently. I mostly walked fast up
    Windham, but jogged the flatter sections.

    True. This often holds true among the quicker runners, too. At my last mtn
    race, I passed the first woman walking while she was jogging up some real
    steep stuff. She gave me a big double take and a "How did you learn to walk
    like that?"

    Quoted message said:

    At the red trail intersection is the 2nd water stop. It was here I learned
    that my hydration strategy was out the window. I had emptied one bottle,
    so
    I wanted to refill and mix with a baggie of accelerade powder I'd
    pre-measured. I asked them if they could fill a bottle but they said they
    could only give 2 small cups - enough for drinking right there - but only
    enough to fill 1/2 my 20oz bottle.

    I totally understand why they are careful with the water and I was
    thankful
    to get any.

    That sounds totally absurd, sorry. The aid stations serve the runners, not
    vice versa! Those people who were cramping in the later stages were
    dehydrated, probably as a result of drinking too little early on. Moreover,
    since you were carrying two bottles, you would have topped up there and
    probably skipped the next stop 2.x miles down the trail. There's a huge
    variation in how much water people need. One size does not fit all. I need
    40oz/hour, and some skinny women I know need less than 20/hour.

    Quoted message said:

    So I put the powder in and had to wait for the next water stop
    to finish filling it. I pondered my hydration strategy as I continued.

    I'd be pondering how I was going to discuss this with the RD after the race!
    Water is a safety issue.

    Anyways, great race, you took it out easy and ate them up later, a la Doug.

    I find technical downs very stressful because while I'm quick on downs in
    general, I fear tripping so much that I slow way down. I always breath a
    sigh of relief when I can just stride out and not worry too much about
    kicking a rock or mixing it up with a root.

    -- Dan

  6. Tony said:

    This was my goal race of the year, and I had an absolute blast.

    yay, reaching your goal is "the best", especially considering all the
    things that could go wrong..

    Quoted message said:

    For those interested and not bored to death with my report,

    it wasn't boring! it was nice the way you broke it up into sections (at
    least for my flighty brain).

    i agree with dan that the water issue is a little troubling, and it
    didn't sound like they gave any warning of rationing before hand (it
    caught you by surprise, etc)

    heather

  7. "Charlie Pendejo" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:
    Tony (remove) said:

    This was my goal race of the year, and I had an absolute blast.
    I finished in 71st place (out of about 175) in 4:24:34

    Kick ass!!

    Congrats, Tony. Well done!

    Thanks! It's probably the best running experience I've ever had.

    Quoted message said:

    Considering the condition of the roads, and the traffic, and the wildly
    unpredictable human (or sometimes near-human) element, sometimes the
    road running here in the city would just about qualify as "technical".
    ;-) But obviously this escarpment thingy is something else
    altogether, even compared to moderately rough trails. Sounds like a
    blast.

    I hear you, especially in winter 🙂

    Quoted message said:

    Also sounds like you more or less grew up or at least came of age on
    mountainous trails. What's your story?

    Not really, I grew up in the burbs and we just happened to have some great
    little mountains (500' to 700' hills really) with rugged trails over them
    just at the edge of town. One of my friends lived right at the start of one
    of the trails so we would always go up on the mountain to hang out and
    party and we would often run down the trail at full speed. We didn't start
    running UP the hills until we got into orienteering a few years later at
    around age 18.

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    Thus my strength remains downhills, and any difficult technical trail
    sections.

    So how about fell running as practiced in the UK (and maybe e.g.
    Alaska; not clear to me whether the mountain running Dot chronicles
    here is the same thing exactly) - do you read about that scene,
    consider trying it, already done some?

    It's probably virtually the same thing as fell running, as that's what the
    escarpment Website compares it to. I think in Alaska this race would be
    medium, but not sure, the footing on the broken sections of the escarpment
    trail are quite challenging, and often the most efficient way through is to
    leap from rock to rock with large drops in between.

    -Tony

  8. "Phil M." <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:


    Tony (remove) said:

    This is probably one of the toughest and most unique races on the east
    coast. http://escarpmenttrail.com/

    Summary:

    This was my goal race of the year, and I had an absolute blast. I


    finished

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    in 71st place (out of about 175) in 4:24:34, beating my goal time of


    4:30.

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    6peat winner Ben Nephew (who set the course record last year 2:45:20,


    ran it

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    this year in 2:56:54. Temps were in low 60's up to upper 70's, and there


    was

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    mist, then clouds and then a bit of sun. High humidity made hydration
    essential.

    Very long version:

    [...]

    Tony, your plan worked beautifully. It's great to see someone put
    together a training program and actually carry it through to the very
    finish of their goal race. I've been following your weekly training and
    I'm very impressed with your success. And you can write too. Thanks for
    the report. ;-)

    Congrats!

    Thanks Phil! It's very rewarding to be well prepared and then run it and
    have such a totally exhilarating experience doing it, particularly in the
    final part of the race. In writing about it, I think my usual edge of
    cynicism lifted for this occasion.

    -Tony

    Quoted message said:

    --
    Phil M.

  9. "frank-in-toronto" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    On Mon, 01 Aug 2005 19:37:01 GMT, "Tony"

    qtrader2@(remove)hotmail.com said:

    This is probably one of the toughest and most unique races on the east
    coast. http://escarpmenttrail.com/


    good report. and your performance sounds well thought out
    and executed.

    i just have some thoughts...seems that for a run of this nature
    people would already be mature trail runners who know
    what to bring. what happened to the lady who needed
    caps? perhaps she was one of those who got in by
    running a road marathon. or perhaps they weren't
    so strict on the qualification aspect. thanks for
    writing this up.

    Some marathoners find their way into the race. I was talking to one of them
    afterward who was also unaware of salts - the support crew at one of the
    water stops had given him salts when he was cramping badly. He said after
    the salts he was good to go again in about 5 minutes, and that he'd learned
    a big lesson for all his future races. The lady I gave a succeed cap to on
    blackhead at least was aware what she needed, and knew succeed caps by name.

    Quoted message said:

    i know running all rocks/roots is exhausting. it feels
    like at least twice as hard as a road run. and when you
    get tired out, you trip. i bet the stumbles you had
    made you more alert for a while.
    ...thehick

    Actually the stumbles were when I was following other runners through rooty
    sections, so I didn't have a good view of the trail ahead. Toward the end I
    was very focused and still had good legs, but you can go down at any time,
    as I know from past experience.

    -Tony

  10. "Dan Stumpus" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:


    "Tony" <qtrader2@(remove)hotmail.com> wrote

    Quoted message said:

    It never ceases to amaze me, as it did throughout the day, how many


    people

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    run when they could walk fast more efficiently. I mostly walked fast up
    Windham, but jogged the flatter sections.

    True. This often holds true among the quicker runners, too. At my last


    mtn

    Quoted message said:

    race, I passed the first woman walking while she was jogging up some real
    steep stuff. She gave me a big double take and a "How did you learn to


    walk

    Quoted message said:

    like that?"

    Quoted message said:

    At the red trail intersection is the 2nd water stop. It was here I


    learned

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    that my hydration strategy was out the window. I had emptied one bottle,
    so
    I wanted to refill and mix with a baggie of accelerade powder I'd
    pre-measured. I asked them if they could fill a bottle but they said


    they

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    could only give 2 small cups - enough for drinking right there - but


    only

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    enough to fill 1/2 my 20oz bottle.

    I totally understand why they are careful with the water and I was
    thankful
    to get any.

    That sounds totally absurd, sorry. The aid stations serve the runners,


    not

    Quoted message said:

    vice versa! Those people who were cramping in the later stages were
    dehydrated, probably as a result of drinking too little early on.


    Moreover,

    Quoted message said:

    since you were carrying two bottles, you would have topped up there and
    probably skipped the next stop 2.x miles down the trail. There's a huge
    variation in how much water people need. One size does not fit all. I


    need

    Quoted message said:

    40oz/hour, and some skinny women I know need less than 20/hour.

    Well it might have been the situation at just that one water stop, I didn't
    know and didn't want to think about it any further. Luckily it wasn't that
    hot and I had 40oz accelerade to start with, and didn't finish that
    completely until around midway. Later in the race, they offered to fill up
    my bottle, but at that point I didn't want it full.

    If you're going to mix powders you have to know there's a full bottle's
    worth at the next stop, otherwise you waste time fiddling around trying to
    decide what to do, as I did at water stop #2.

    The race is in very inaccesable areas, and I'm sure the race director -
    Doug's friend [censored] Vincent - doesn't know how many water carrier volunteers
    will show up on race day -- so he makes it very clear in the application
    that the only water you can count on is the water you carry. This race is a
    low-cost no-frills event with no awards and is great just how they run it.
    No complaints here.

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    So I put the powder in and had to wait for the next water stop
    to finish filling it. I pondered my hydration strategy as I continued.

    I'd be pondering how I was going to discuss this with the RD after the


    race!

    Quoted message said:

    Water is a safety issue.

    True, but the policy is to carry your own water, and that's clearly stated.
    Nowhere on the race application or anywhere on the website does it promise
    water will be out there in quantity. I didn't know there would be numerous
    water stops until just before the race. Clearly they're there to supplement
    what runners carry, not replace it.

    Quoted message said:

    Anyways, great race, you took it out easy and ate them up later, a la


    Doug.

    Thanks Dan, yes, Doug's admonitions, plus a healthy respect for the later
    climbs and downs kept me under control.

    Quoted message said:

    I find technical downs very stressful because while I'm quick on downs in
    general, I fear tripping so much that I slow way down. I always breath a
    sigh of relief when I can just stride out and not worry too much about
    kicking a rock or mixing it up with a root.

    -- Dan

    I guess I'm truly a goat because I'm exactly the opposite. I thrive on the
    technical sections and find them exhilarating.

    -Tony

  11. h squared said:

    i agree with dan that the water issue is a little troubling, and it
    didn't sound like they gave any warning of rationing before hand

    ah, i just saw your reply to dan that they warned you well beforehand.

    h

  12. "h squared" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:
    Tony said:

    This was my goal race of the year, and I had an absolute blast.

    yay, reaching your goal is "the best", especially considering all the
    things that could go wrong..

    Quoted message said:

    For those interested and not bored to death with my report,

    it wasn't boring! it was nice the way you broke it up into sections (at
    least for my flighty brain).

    i agree with dan that the water issue is a little troubling, and it
    didn't sound like they gave any warning of rationing before hand (it
    caught you by surprise, etc)

    heather

    Yea, for one thing, the thunderstorms that came just after the official race
    cutoff (6 hours) would have made it more tretcherous, as has happened in
    past years. That would have made the cliffy downs much more interesting 🙂

    The water thing - it's an added bonus to for them to provide any water.
    That's just the kind of race it is. I'm sure that when the race started 29
    years ago little or no water was provided on trail. All runners are told to
    carry water and not depend on the water stops, and most people had
    camelbacks. The water stops are for topping off, etc. Doug told me to bring
    2 large bottles, and because it wasn't hot I chose to take 20oz bottles
    instead of something larger.

    If you think about it, for them to have 20oz of water at each stop for each
    of 175 runners - that's a lot of weight to carry - about 220 pounds. If you
    have only a few volunteers (and I'm sure it varies by year and weather
    conditions) that's a lot of weight, and the trails to haul it in aren't easy
    as this is a point-to-point race. I think it may have been just the
    situation at the one water stop where I asked - perhaps the person in charge
    of that stop was being stricter for some reason. To me it's no big deal. At
    the time I was going to refill the bottle, I still had one full bottle. I
    know some people were running low on salts, but I don't think anyone was
    suffering from dehydration.

    -Tony

  13. "h squared" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:
    h squared said:

    i agree with dan that the water issue is a little troubling, and it
    didn't sound like they gave any warning of rationing before hand

    ah, i just saw your reply to dan that they warned you well beforehand.

    h

    yea, and I should have refreshed before replying to you - T

  14. Tony, awesome race, awesome report.

    I posted my GITM report just before yours here on rec.running and now after
    reading yours I feel like some sort of girly man.

    Tough race.

    JK

  15. "Tony" <qtrader2@(remove)hotmail.com> wrote

    Quoted message said:

    The race is in very inaccesable areas, and I'm sure the race director -
    Doug's friend [censored] Vincent - doesn't know how many water carrier
    volunteers
    will show up on race day -- so he makes it very clear in the application
    that the only water you can count on is the water you carry. This race is
    a
    low-cost no-frills event with no awards and is great just how they run it.
    No complaints here.

    Ah, that changes things...

    We're used to being pampered out here at our west coast mountain races.

  16. 32 degrees said:

    I feel like some sort of girly man.

    Take off the fishnet stockings and mini skirt, and you may feel
    differently.

    TBR
    "As democracy is perfected, the office of president represents, more and
    more closely, the inner soul of the people. On some great and glorious day
    the plain folks of the land will reach their heart's desire at last and the
    White House will be adorned by a downright moron."
    H.L. Mencken (1880 - 1956)
    "Anyone with degrees from Yale and Harvard is presumed to be intelligent,
    but George W. Bush has managed to overcome that presumption."

  17. Tony - Great race and very interesting report!

    The quiet confidence that you had before the race was well justified.
    It looks like your race training, planning and strategy was spot on -
    with perhaps the exception of carrying a bit more water?

    Anthony.

  18. "32 degrees" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    Tony, awesome race, awesome report.

    I posted my GITM report just before yours here on rec.running and now


    after

    Quoted message said:

    reading yours I feel like some sort of girly man.

    Tough race.

    JK

    lol no girly man would race on a course with any hill of substance, so you
    don't qualify as such. I know there are much tougher races out there (though
    I don't think around here), but I had to make it sound like the challenge it
    was for me. Barkley it is not.

    -Tony

  19. <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    Tony - Great race and very interesting report!

    The quiet confidence that you had before the race was well justified.
    It looks like your race training, planning and strategy was spot on -
    with perhaps the exception of carrying a bit more water?

    Anthony.

    Thanks Anthony (I feel like I'm talking to myself). I wrote some other
    responses to the water stop, and I didn't make it clear in my report that
    the race promises no water on the course and tell you to carry what you'll
    need. Volunteers haul water to various points to supplement what you carry,
    and probably to provide a safety measure. Most people had camelbacks or
    waistpacks like me. When I was stopping at the 2nd water stop to fill a
    bottle, I still had one full 20oz bottle, so at no time was I ever short of
    liquids -- it was just my nutrition strategy (powder mixing) that was thrown
    off a bit. Next year if the temperatures are similar, I will probably carry
    the same amount of liquid.

    -Tony

  20. On Tue, 02 Aug 2005 12:56:29 GMT, "Tony"

    qtrader2@(remove)hotmail.com said:

    no girly man would race on a course with any hill of substance, so you
    don't qualify as such.

    So he's just a girly girl now?

    TBR
    "As democracy is perfected, the office of president represents, more and
    more closely, the inner soul of the people. On some great and glorious day
    the plain folks of the land will reach their heart's desire at last and the
    White House will be adorned by a downright moron."
    H.L. Mencken (1880 - 1956)
    "Anyone with degrees from Yale and Harvard is presumed to be intelligent,
    but George W. Bush has managed to overcome that presumption."

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