lights

"Ian Smith" <[email hidden]> wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

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On Sat, 16 Aug 2003 23:33:56 +0100, doobrie <[email hidden]>

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with those hi-vis yellow flourescent workmans jacket type things that have the silver stripes
on them, does the built in silver stripe

provide

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a similair thing to the scotch light stuff?

Yes, the silver stripe is reflective. Frequently it _is_ scotchlite (TM and all).

If you want to see that it meets some sort of standard, look for at least 'class 2'. I think the
standard is actually BS EN 471. Class 2 is what you need for working on roads. Personally, I get
class 3 - which is what you need for working on motorways.

Class 3 has more reflective area than class 2, but the main benefit for cycling is that it has
arms with reflective bands round the arms. This might help to make arm-signals visible, which is
why I use it.

I've also seen research that found that putting flourescent areas on the arms makes a person more
conspicuous than on teh torso, but I don't remember what the hypothesis for why was (torso is a
single block, and might therfore be a bollard, while bollards rarely have arms? arms move around
more than torsos? dunno), so it might not apply for typical cycling movements.

On the topic of hi-vis, I increasingly see orange stuff. in the UK, orange is for railways and
'saturn yellow' is for roads. I think some EC thingy or something now tolerates orange for roads.
Drawing on the study that found all that matters conspicuity-wise is how closely you look like a
policeman, I don't use orange for cycling. For the real UFO-effect, however, I have a nice
flourescent orange boiler-suit, with reflective hoops on arms, legs, torso, and over the
shoulders. It's almost worth cycling in it to see if someone actually dares say smidsy.

The only down side of class 3 is it's much more difficult to find - you need somehwhere that
supplies serious roadworks contractors rather than just builders (so a normal builder's merchant
won't do). I know screwfix do class 3 jackets (www.screwfix.com), which might actually be easiest.

regards, Ian SMith
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and to the 10% of men - like me - who are colour-blind orange and yellow are rather dull, often
invisible, colours of no warning value whatsoever!

Quoted message said:

The only down side of class 3 is it's much more difficult to find - you need somehwhere that
supplies serious roadworks contractors rather than just builders (so a normal builder's merchant
won't do). I know screwfix do class 3 jackets (www.screwfix.com), which might actually be easiest.

regards, Ian SMith

im issued with one from work as i occasionally visit sites and need to wear the protective gear
whenever on site - the only downside is they only go upto XL and whilst it fits over me its too
small to close

im either going to find a larger one or sew some quick release nylon onto the front section to keep
it from flapping ... in a few months time the thing should fit me properly as once back from my
holiday middle of september i'll be in proper diet/cycle mode and plan to lose approx 6 stone over
the next 8/9 months

then i'll have the pick of cycle clothing and bike 😉

Quoted message said:

Yes, the yellow is high visibility, the silver/white stripes are reflective.

Reflectives are a *great* way to announce your presence to motor vehicles after dark. A couple of
bands here and there and in a set of headlights you'll light up like a christmas tree.

Hampshire County Council have an online road safety webpage/shop that sell reflectives very
cheaply and post free:

shopcreator.comsitemap.htmOpen ↗

on my way up the A45, birmingham just off the motorway i saw a hi-vis clothing shop just before the
turn to solihull ice rink if anyone knows the area ... called something like factorsafe although i
dont think thats quite what it was, but close

saw in the window different types of top in hi-vis ... the one that i liked the look of was a polo
tshirt in hi vis yellow

i might take a proper look next time im down that way during opening hours but i also have one of
these shops on my normal daily route but doesnt have anything on show, i'll drop in there too

Geoff Pearson said:

"Alun Roberts" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

bbc.co.ukbbc.co.ukOpen ↗

Put the name of your town in the weather box. Click on the five-day forecast - it will tell you
precisely the lighting up times of your town.

Does anyone know where I can get the sunrise/set times for the whole year - I'm interested in the
rate of change?

<http://www.onlineweather.com/v4/uk/sun/>

Also, have a peek at
<http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&q=sunrise+sunset+UK&btnG=Google+Search> for
some more - a Google search for "sunrise sunset UK" (no "s used)

James

--
homepage.ntlworld.comLarrau.jpgOpen ↗

Geoff Pearson said:

and to the 10% of men - like me - who are colour-blind orange and yellow are rather dull, often
invisible, colours of no warning value whatsoever!

The most common type is some form of red-green colour blindness, such as my father has. From what
I've seen, yellows are just abou OK for r-g protanopia and deuteranopia if all you're bothered about
is apparent brightness, but you might have problems with very reddish oranges.

The trouble probably comes when you need something distinct from green.

Quick pictures at <http://www.tiresias.org/guidelines/colour_blindness.htm>, nice PDF at
<http://more.btexact.com/people/rigdence/colours/>. It looks to me, from their simulations,
that yellows are -probably- the best hedged bets for high-vis gear, but I'm much less convinced
about orange.

Fluorescent yellow with white reflective stripes are the colours worn by the local bicycle plods.
Guess what I choose to wear?

--
Andrew Chadwick <We're all in this together

In "]news:[email hidden], Geoff Pearson
<[email hidden]> typed:

Quoted message said:

and to the 10% of men - like me - who are colour-blind orange and yellow are rather dull, often
invisible, colours of no warning value whatsoever!

The vast majority of those 10% are red-green colour blind like me. Yellow, orange and blue are fine.
Red and green are not good. If you are having problems with orange and yellow you probably have one
of the rarer forms of colour blindness.

Tony

--
"I don't want to achieve immortality through my work. I want to achieve immortality through not
dying." Woody Allen

Andrew Chadwick said:

to me, from their simulations, that yellows are -probably- the best hedged bets for high-vis
gear, but I'm much less convinced about orange.

Well, that's OK on teh railway - I think train drivers aren't allowed to be colour blind.

regards, Ian SMith
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On Sun, 17 Aug 2003 17:37:08 +0000 (UTC) someone who may be Ian Smith <[email hidden]>
wrote this:-

Quoted message said:

Railway hi-vis vests pull appart - they are three separate panels (a back, front left and front
right) joined together by either poppers or velcro. The idea is that if you're deserate to get
out of the way of a train and your vest gets snagged on something, it pulls apart rather than
holds you up.

In the days of manual hump yards and shunter's poles it sometimes happened that the shunter slipped
and the pole went somewhere it was not supposed to. It is true that staff were not supposed to ride
on moving wagons, with their pole holding down the brake lever, but one could see this at many
places like Severn Tunnel Junction into the
1980s. It actually looks like great fun, but I would not wish to try it without a lot of practice.

A slip could mean that the pole slid across the body, going through the arm holes of high visibility
clothing of the original pattern. The end result could be a shunter attached to a moving wagon by
his pole sticking through the high visibility clothing, which was very dangerous. After this
problem, along with some other similar ones, was identified the concept of high visibility clothing
that would come apart if tugged hard was produced.

--
David Hansen, Edinburgh | PGP email preferred-key number F566DA0E I will always explain revoked
keys, unless the UK government prevents me using the RIP Act 2000.

doobrie said:

i'll be riding to/from work at 6:45am and 6pm - a 15 mile trip that without incident will be
taking me just over an hour

roughly when will the nights / mornings start drawing in and require lights? or is it worth
getting setup now for the odd time there is dim light?

It's worth getting set up now, in case you want to do a pleasure trip that involves a late return.
LED rears are fine, and you can get ones that meet BSI standards that burn for a *long* time on a
couple of AAs (I use a Cateye AU100, and like it a lot). For the front, a Serious bit of kit with a
separate rechargeable battery is a Good Thing. Some have twin lamps, one at a lower power (though
quite adequate to get you noticed) and a brighter one for unlit lanes at speed.

Or, if you want to do a really good job and don't intend the machine for sports use, get a dynohub.
Not cheap, but very, very good. You can get a very nice unit from Shimano, or an even nicer one from
Schmidt. They're built into the front wheel hub so they're always there, and there's no worry about
slipping in the wet etc. that you have with "bottle dynamos" that run by rollers off the tyres.
Lights stay permanently attached so they're always there if and when you need them, and the
batteries never run down (there aren't any...). For extra safety you can get dynamo lamps with a
standlight, a charged reserve that keeps LEDs burning for a couple of minutes after you've stopped
at a junction or similar. For a utility bike you'd have to try very hard to get a better all around
lighting setup than a dynohub and standlight lamps, though the capital costs are high: the hub
itself is expensive, and there will be wheel building costs on top. B&M standlights aren't cheap
either, but if you've got the money then very highly recommended.

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch University of Dundee Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Medical Physics, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK net [email hidden]
dundee.ac.uk~pjclinchOpen ↗

"Geoff Pearson" <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

Does anyone know where I can get the sunrise/set times for the whole

year -

Quoted message said:

I'm interested in the rate of change?

largeformatphotography.infosuncalcOpen ↗