Jan Ullrich : Should he have returned to TMO ?

The T-E-A-M was not Jan's problem. Jan was Jan's problem and has been for some time.

Last year was a fluke. Lance took for granted his condition and forgot to fuel up at the proper time and it nearly cost him.

Without LA in the TDF, JU may very well have 5-6 wins, regardless of what team he had around him.

Jan let down the team, not the other way around.

Unlike last year, Jan was under much pressure to excel in this year's TdF by both his team manager and the entire German press.

My hunch is that Jan is not one that functions at his best under such pressure.

limerickman said:

I'd like to get the view of all the expert cycling opinion out there in the Forum !

Jan Ullrich had a very good TDF last year - albeit that LA may not have been
at his best.
But the 2003 TDF saw a rejuvenated Jan Ullrich.

Do the Forum think it was wise of him to go back to T-Mobile in light of the
events at the 2004 TDF and the apparent support given to Kloden instead of their team captain ?

My own view is that the move back to TMO was not the correct move.
The issue of Pevenage and Goodefroot still smoulders on.

He should have stayed with Bianchi and/or gone to another team, instead
of returning.

What do you think ?

Just wait until next years TdF. With Ullrich, Kloden, and Vinokourov all on the same team. 3 GC contenders on one team should make it very interesting assuming they are all healthy.

I think his performance and the "support" he got from his team in the TdF this year says it all. It's true that part of the reason for Jan's poor performance might be his lack of dedication or that he was ill at the start of the race (or whatever). But being essentially abandoned by his team on La Mongie was proof enough for me that Jan's return to T-Mobile was a bad move.

I think it would be in Ullrich's best interest to move to another team. His relationship with Goodefroot is tenuous at best. I'd like to see him move to CSC and work with Bjarne Riis.

I think you need a better question - ie "which team SHOULD JU have gone to?"
1. MOB (that's the official UCI abbreviation, not TMO)?
2. ALB (Alessio-Bianchi, the team that got most of the other big Bianchi names from last year)?
3. GST (Gerolsteiner, the only other Germain TT1?
4. SOT (Some Other Team... sorry)

Even though the move back to MOB wasn't ideal, I think it was better than any of the alternatives for the TdF and the rest of the calendar as well. What other team could pay his star's salary and support him through the major stage races? Remember we're talking the end of last season now, not June 2004.

CSC would be a good team for Jan. It seemed to work well for Basso, and Lance has said that that would be his second choice if he couldn't have USPS/Discovery.

thebluetrain said:

Just wait until next years TdF. With Ullrich, Kloden, and Vinokourov all on the same team. 3 GC contenders on one team should make it very interesting assuming they are all healthy.

Bah.

Next year hell.

They all said the same thing last year when they almost beat Lance. Instead they faced a 100% armstrong and if you recall most of his rivals quit. (Mayo, Hamilton, Heras, etc..).

mattp71 said:

Bah.

Next year hell.

They all said the same thing last year when they almost beat Lance. Instead they faced a 100% armstrong and if you recall most of his rivals quit. (Mayo, Hamilton, Heras, etc..).

I was speaking about the T-mobile team and how having 3 GC contenders on one team would make that team interesting to watch as those 3 GC contenders fight it out. I said nothing of Mayo, Hamilton, Heras, etc. or Lance. The thread was about Tmobile and Ullrich

DiabloScott said:

I think you need a better question - ie "which team SHOULD JU have gone to?"
1. MOB (that's the official UCI abbreviation, not TMO)?
2. ALB (Alessio-Bianchi, the team that got most of the other big Bianchi names from last year)?
3. GST (Gerolsteiner, the only other Germain TT1?
4. SOT (Some Other Team... sorry)

Even though the move back to MOB wasn't ideal, I think it was better than any of the alternatives for the TdF and the rest of the calendar as well. What other team could pay his star's salary and support him through the major stage races? Remember we're talking the end of last season now, not June 2004.

And this was a point that I was thinking of adding to my initial question to the Forum.

Given JU's problems when he was fired by Telekom in 2002 : given the fact that the Coast investment went awol, for a company like Bianchi to come to his rescue in 2003 was certainly a vote of confidence in a man, who's currency at the time. was pretty shaky.
I thought that that level of goodwill could have been reciprocated by JU especially after his excellent 2003 TDF.
OK - his team wasn't great but it wouldn't have been great cycling under the
Coast insignia either.
He ought to have honoured Bianchi for rescuing him and letting him take part
in a great TDF.

It is my opinion that Bianchi would only bail out someone who is highly respected.
I would add that they would have probably given JU whatever additional support would be required for 2004 onwards, if he had stayed.
I accept that Bianchi weren't bailing him out for the fun of it - they wanted a
return but to come in and make the offer they made and to essentially get the UCI to agree to this late commercial rescue, ought to have been repaid by
JU.

But no, as soon as T-Mobile made an offer he scooted back.

meehs said:

I think his performance and the "support" he got from his team in the TdF this year says it all. It's true that part of the reason for Jan's poor performance might be his lack of dedication or that he was ill at the start of the race (or whatever). But being essentially abandoned by his team on La Mongie was proof enough for me that Jan's return to T-Mobile was a bad move.

I think it would be in Ullrich's best interest to move to another team. His relationship with Goodefroot is tenuous at best. I'd like to see him move to CSC and work with Bjarne Riis.

I don't think his team abandeoned him. They had Guerini pulling for him while he was in trouble. IT was determined that Kloden was in much better shape, and Afterwards Jan said he had no problem with the decision of letting him go.

There is no other team who can afford JU at euros 2.5 million/year (and I'm not sure that includes salaries of certain members of his entourage). JU wanted to earn a good salary, and T-Mobile could offer him a higher salary than CSC could. T-Mobile was not only financially the most stable, but it could reap the benefits of JU's success in 03 too because it is a German-based company.

thebluetrain said:

I was speaking about the T-mobile team and how having 3 GC contenders on one team would make that team interesting to watch as those 3 GC contenders fight it out. I said nothing of Mayo, Hamilton, Heras, etc. or Lance. The thread was about Tmobile and Ullrich

Don't matter. I've been reading these "wait until next year" threads for at least 3 years now. The only way someone else will win the tour, is if Lance doesn't race it.

mattp71 said:

Don't matter. I've been reading these "wait until next year" threads for at least 3 years now. The only way someone else will win the tour, is if Lance doesn't race it.

I agree with you. I dont see anyone beating Lance, but its obvious that you are to stupid to realize that this is not a "wait until next year" thread, its a Jan Ullrich/Tmobile thread.

thebluetrain said:

I agree with you. I dont see anyone beating Lance, but its obvious that you are to stupid to realize that this is not a "wait until next year" thread, its a Jan Ullrich/Tmobile thread.

Not only that, I don't think anyone even said "wait until next year" in this entire thread! Did they? In fact, I don't even see that anyone had even implied that they think JU will win it next year in this thread.