FREEWHEELS .....

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Jerry C. said:

You hit the nail on the head. I have a mostly-Italian bike and I would like to keep it somewhat
authentic as I upgrade it. I have no intention of accepting inferior performance though.

Quoted message said:

Donald Gillies said:

I know how you feel. I have three "mostly-Italian" 1970's bikes and feel the same way. However,
the first of these "mostly-Italian" bikes is an original Schwinn Paramount P-15 / 1974. As stock
equipment this bicycle came with a Shimano Crane Derailleur and a suntour pro-compe gold
freewheel.

From about 1960 until about 1980, campagnolo did not do much in the way of innovation. In that
period campy rested and was mostly a marketing company. About the only thing they produced was a
set of sidepull brakes. Suntour filled that technical vacuum from japan, producing beautiful
products and revolutionizing geartrains, first with the slant-parallelogram derailleur patents,
and later with ultra 6 and ultra 7 derailleurs.

They started something that campy is still finishing today (if you think about it, campy sells
an "ultra ultra ultra-10" gear system.) If I traveled into the past with a chorus bicycle,
labels removed, the inhabitants of 1970 would assume that it had a suntour drivetrain. imitation
is the most sincere form of flattery.

So, i would suggest you might want to get a collectable suntour ultra freewheel for your italian
bicycle. The quality is unsurpassed by the european brands, and you can add 2 more gears to your
classic bicycle without molesting the rear triangle.

="Jerry C." <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I'm going to more modern Campy components, but what you said is interesting. I currently have a 6
speed, but I can fit a 7 speed into my 126mm space (I forget the correct technical term for that
space). Are you saying that a vintage Suntour 8 or 10 speed would fit in 126mm?

Suntour's skinny format Ultra Six fits in 121mm and their Ultra Seven in the place of a regular
Japanese six, 126mm. European clearances were a touch tighter than JIS, but that was hardly ever a
problem. Occasionally you'd see the chain hit the seatstay end when shifting down from high gear
with an Ultra Seven where a Regina Six.would clear.

--
Andrew Muzi www.yellowjersey.org Open every day since 1 April, 1971

Sheldon Brown said:

Tom Ace wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

In this group, Jobst has said there's no longer any good reason to buy a manual car, and that
people want them because of irrational desires for a feeling of control, or because of juvenile
notions of machismo. Do a google search and see for yourself.

Gee, I missed that.

Something else where Jobst and I are in basic agreement, though I wouldn't care to characterize the
reasons that some folks prefer this atavistic apparatus.

So, paying a couple thou extra for an automatic is the only way to avoid being juvenile?
What*ever*, dudes.

Jasper

Sheldon Brown said:

To me this made it obvious that the way to go was to get a Scott 340b tuner and I forget which
Fisher amp, but I was always amazed at the number of folks who would rather not mix brands,
although there was no technical compatibility issue whatever.

The pile of stereo equipment needs to sit in someone's living room though, usually in plain view of
the Wife, so Wife Acceptance Factor comes into it -- and if the front plates or sizes are wildly
disparate, WAF could drop below the critical value. Hell, I'm not a big fan of
champagne-stacked-on-silver-sttacked-on-black stereo piles myself.

Jasper

Jerry C. said:

You wrote below: "it is of some interest to some of us whether it is caused by a fondness for
Campagnolo, or by a dislike for Shimano." I am concerned about our society if that's what people
are concerned about. That pales in significance next to topics such as universal employment, a
national health care system, election reform, and legitimate justification of military invasions.

Oh, Christ, don't be an [censored]. This is an argument that's as ridiculous as it is widespread, and
it should be eradicated from the face of the earth. Why don't you stop posting in usenet and start a
Communist thinktank, if you think everything else is irrelevant. Jesus.

Jasper

Peter Cole said:

OK, I didn't see that (I thought I read the whole tedious thread), what I saw was: "Jerry C."
<[email hidden]> wrote in message
* touch cheaper. Aesthetics are also a factor. So is anal-retentiveness.

Oh, so he did. I guess anal-retentiveness is only a bad thing when it affects other people.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Since he doesn't seem to have a very varied style, I eagerly await "poison", "pathology", "hatred"
and "venting" making appearances here.

OK, I guess that wasn't part of this thread?? A pre-emptive strike on your part?

30 seconds with Google Groups. Our man has a very distinctive style.

Actually, the email I received from him in response to that is definitely a notch up the
froth scale.
--
David Damerell <[email hidden]> Kill the tomato!

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Damerell,

You don't understand the simplest of things. My "frothings" as you say have no utility to the
newsgroup because I requested advice for MY bike. Since you have no practical or well-meaning
advice, stay out of MY thread. Further, don't write to me personally unless invited. It is more than
bad netiquette.

Jerry C.
------------------------------------------------

David Damerell said:

Jerry C. said:

When you have nothing to contribute, it is better to not say anything.

Nicely put. No doubt you have some neat rationalisation as to why your own frothings are of
any utility.

Quoted message said:

Apparently, you have heard the terms "poison", "pathology", "hatred" and "venting" before.
Probably many times. Get a life.

Oh, damn, I missed one, and I should have spotted it. Your class of kook always produces "get a
life", to highlight the comparison between people who post snide news articles and themselves
(posting snide news articles.) Can't be helped.

Any further mail from you will be automatically deleted.

--------------090006090200070200000902 Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

<!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN"> <html> <head> <title></title>
</head> <body> Damerell,<br> <br> You don't understand the simplest of things. My "frothings"
as you say have no utility to the newsgroup because I requested advice for MY bike.
Since you have no practical or well-meaning advice, stay out of MY thread. Further, don't
write to me personally unless invited. It is more than bad netiquette. <br> <br> Jerry
C.<br> ------------------------------------------------<br> David Damerell wrote:<br> <blockquote
type="cite" cite="[email hidden]"> <pre wrap="">On Friday, 11
Jul 2003, Jerry C. wrote: </pre> <blockquote type="cite"> <pre wrap="">When you have nothing to
contribute, it is better to not say anything. </pre> </blockquote> <pre wrap=""><!----> Nicely put.
No doubt you have some neat rationalisation as to why your own frothings are of any utility. </pre>
<blockquote type="cite"> <pre wrap=""> Apparently, you have heard the terms "poison", "pathology",
"hatred" and "venting" before. Probably many times. Get a life. </pre> </blockquote> <pre
wrap=""><!----> Oh, damn, I missed one, and I should have spotted it. Your class of kook always
produces "get a life", to highlight the comparison between people who post snide news articles and
themselves (posting snide news articles.) Can't be helped.

Any further mail from you will be automatically deleted.

</pre> </blockquote> <br> </body> </html>

--------------090006090200070200000902--

Damerell,

I asked that you NOT respond to me privately. Your response below was not an automatic response, but
instead you received my request and wrote to me privately AGAIN. Let me repeat myself: DO NOT WRITE
TO ME PRIVATELY.

Jerry C.
--------------------------------------------------

David Damerell said:

Your mail has been automatically deleted. I hope you didn't spend too long writing it, because I'm
not spending any time reading it. You will not receive this message again.

-----------------------------------------------------
Damerell,

You don't understand the simplest of things. My "frothings" as you say have no utility to the
newsgroup because I requested advice for MY bike. Since you have no practical or well-meaning
advice, stay out of MY thread. Further, don't write to me personally unless invited. It is more than
bad netiquette.

Jerry C.

Jerry C. said:

It's funny that some people are defending Shimano when Shimano was not attacked. You too fail to
understand this.

Ridiculous. I don't defend Shimano. I criticize a businessman who seeks protection from competition.

Quoted message said:

Additionally, I have lurked for a long time and read many of Q.S.P.C.'s posts (Peter C.). I find
them interesting and helpful, but not angry.

I would agree except when it comes to whining about Shimano supply chains that Q.S.P.C. can't
compete with. He does it over and over again.

Quoted message said:

He performs a service, as do many others such as Andrew Muzi and Sheldon Brown. Sheldon's cranky
reply to me can be overlooked for his intention was good and he performs a great service to the
bike community. OTOH, there are critics that don't contribute anything and merely complain and
infest this newsgroup. Frequently (but not always) they hide behind the skirt of an anonymous
pseudonym. Guess where you fit in.

Jerry C.
-----------------------------------

Precious Pup said:

There is no reason to attack Shimano. Why is Q.S.P.C. angry?

Q.S.P.C. is forever [censored] because he thinks he's entitled to sell Shimano stuff at some
given price/markup. Other Shimano supply chains undercut him and he thinks someone owes
him something or that he has an entitlement to make a living running a bike shop. So he
whines about it in rbt time after time after time. If you enjoy whining, by all means
throw the dog a bone.

Jerry C. said:

I asked that you NOT respond to me privately. Your response below was not an automatic response,
but instead you received my request and wrote to me privately AGAIN. Let me repeat myself: DO NOT
WRITE TO ME PRIVATELY.

back, you know.

Jasper

Jasper Janssen said:

Jerry C. said:

I asked that you NOT respond to me privately. Your response below was not an automatic response,
but instead you received my request and wrote to me privately AGAIN. Let me repeat myself: DO NOT
WRITE TO ME PRIVATELY.

Quoted message said:

back, you know.

... quite a few times, actually - as well as the article he just emailed to me, he Cc:ed one or two
others that also appeared as news postings.
--
David Damerell <[email hidden]> Kill the tomato!

Jasper Janssen said:

back, you know.

Jasper

=====================
Jasper,

I didn't write to him personally, except in responding to him to not to

reaction, but perhaps you didn't understand the scenario. Additionally, this is not "private
playground squabbling", as you put it. This is directly related to an RBT post and the subject
should stay within RBT. Additionally, RBT readers (other than you) may be interested in knowing
Damerell's proclivity to extend his non-responsive-to-original-question rants into private
mailboxes.

Jerry C.