Finding my ideal gears



Simon Brooke <[email protected]> wrote:

>I've used all the different Shimano road cleat systems, and didn't really
>like any of them; I now have Look Keos on my road bike, and like them very
>well. The basic Keo isn't expensive.

Thanks for the recommendation, the Look Keo Classic is indeed an
affordable choice.

--
Membrane
 
Peter Clinch wrote:
(I use Time ATAC pedals/cleats in
> MTB/touring shoes for a nice compromise between off-bike mobility and
> utility and working well, plus Times give more float than SPuDs, engage
> more positively IMHO and are less prone to disengaging with worn cleats).

I'll second that. I have Atacs on my MtB and Time Axion on my road bike...
 
in message <[email protected]>, Peter Clinch
('[email protected]') wrote:

> Membrane wrote:
>
>> Although when reading it again it seems to apply only to a smaller 2
>> bolt (mtb?) cleats, not the 3 bolt (road?) cleats that I linked to.
>
> Yes. Note that there's no problem using MTB cleats on a road machine,
> aside from slight loss of efficiency (but still way better than
> clips/straps or platforms).
>
>> I don't expect to walk on these shoes much beyond hobbling out of the
>> house with the bike and the occasional country road lunch stop for
>> longer rides.
>
> No problem using SPuD-R or Look (or Time) in that case. I'll leave it
> the roadies to discuss the relative merits of either system, though my
> overall impression is that Looks are the Default Road Pedal.
>
>> I also had a look at entry level Time RXE pedals:
>> http://www.cycleways.com/store/product/25489/Time-RXE-Pedal/
>> but I couldn't figure out if they were compatible with the Shimano shoes
>> & cleats and thought I'd be safer to stick to one brand.
>
> You're generally looking at 3 bolt (big, road) or 2 bolt (small, MTB)
> cleats, and the shoes designed for 3 won't work for 2 and vice versa,
> but shoes made for 2 hole cleats will typically fit them all and I
> /assume/ it's the same for 3.

Sadly, no. Shimano SPD-R (now defunct (fortunately)) had a completely
different bolt pattern, and there are other exceptions. Speedplay Zeros
are four bolt, but can be used with three bolt shoes using an adapter
plate.

Note that as far as I'm aware, the only 'road' clipless pedal system that's
legal to use in Britain at night is Campagnolo Pro Fit, for which you can
get (optional) reflectors.

> (Note that the Times I use are more like this
> (http://www.cyclestore.co.uk/productDetails.asp?productID=6383) and are
> MTB type. If you /do/ want something to walk in too I reckon these are
> quite a bit better than your actual SPuDs)

Agree.

--
[email protected] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

The Conservative Party is now dead. The corpse may still be
twitching, but resurrection is not an option - unless Satan
chucks them out of Hell as too objectionable even for him.
 
In news:[email protected],
Clive George <[email protected]> tweaked the Babbage-Engine to tell
us:

> (I see your 30/34 and raise you 24/32, which is what our tandem has -
> 26" wheels)


24/34 with a 559 wheel on the Speedmachine, 24/34 with a 406 on the trike
(until Settle Cycles pull their finger out, when it'll be 20/34).

--
Dave Larrington
<http://www.legslarry.beerdrinkers.co.uk>
I am Wan, for I am pursued by the Army of Plums.
 
Membrane <[email protected]> wrote:

>I might bite
>the bullet and get a pair of shoes and entry level pedals to fit to the
>mongrel.

Update: Last week I went out to get Look Keo Classic road pedals and
Shimano shoes, but the local shops were out of stock of both. While
waiting for new stock to arrive I read forum posts from 2 people who
both had experienced nasty knee problems after switching from a MTB
style pedals & shoes to a road system, one had switched back to MTB
style which resolved the problem. Afaik this could have been caused by
using cleats with not enough float, the posts didn't specify what cleats
they used, but it spooked me enough to get myself MTB style pedals and
shoes instead.

A web search suggested that Shimano shoes which I was looking at don't
have a great reputation, Specialized shoes seemed to be universally
liked, including the entry level models, so I bought the Specialized 07
Sport MTB shoes.
<http://www.cycleways.com/store/product/32914/Sp.07-Sport-Mtb-Shoe---48/>

Did my first ride using the pedals and shoes today, and my feet were
quite sore, couldn't wait to get home and take the shoes off.

The upper structure of these shoes consists of a mesh, with leather
patches sown over it. With the main upper structure mesh being made out
of polyester or something like that I don't think that these shoes will
"break in" as leather shoes do.

The end of the instep flap pushes against my leg, this is the issue that
is causing the most irritation. Also, walking bare foot after having
taken off the shoes I noticed that the balls of my feet were hurting.

--
Membrane
 
Membrane wrote:

> A web search suggested that Shimano shoes which I was looking at don't
> have a great reputation, Specialized shoes seemed to be universally
> liked, including the entry level models, so I bought the Specialized 07
> Sport MTB shoes.

This suggests you didn't try them on against one another (or much else)
first. Shimano and Specialized shoes are very different shapes, and
whether something is good will depend on the shape of your foot and how
it relates to the shape of the shoe. So I don't like Shimano shoes, but
my wife likes hers... we have different shaped feet.

> Did my first ride using the pedals and shoes today, and my feet were
> quite sore, couldn't wait to get home and take the shoes off.

They could be the wrong shape... Specialized do go on about how they've
anatomically designed everything, but the fact is different feet are
different shapes and if yours don't match the shoe's then you're snookered.

> The end of the instep flap pushes against my leg, this is the issue that
> is causing the most irritation. Also, walking bare foot after having
> taken off the shoes I noticed that the balls of my feet were hurting.

Try on *in person* every shoe you can find before deciding what to buy.
Web reviews are of little use here. It's entirely possible you just
made an expensive mistake :-(

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net [email protected] http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/
 
Membrane wrote:
........
> Did my first ride using the pedals and shoes today, and my feet were
> quite sore, couldn't wait to get home and take the shoes off.
>
> The upper structure of these shoes consists of a mesh, with leather
> patches sown over it. With the main upper structure mesh being made
> out of polyester or something like that I don't think that these
> shoes will "break in" as leather shoes do.
>
> The end of the instep flap pushes against my leg, this is the issue
> that is causing the most irritation. Also, walking bare foot after
> having taken off the shoes I noticed that the balls of my feet were
> hurting.

There could be several things going on here.

The shoes may not be right for you. Maybe a different size, shape or style
would help. Or you may just not be used to the shoes yet. They soften a
bit as well, despite not being made of leather.

Cleat position may not be ideal, or your body and mind is just not yet used
to the way shoes with cleats feel. Experiment with the position of the
cleats if they don't seem to be quite in the right place.

I remember suffering with sore feet too when first trying Look pedals. Now
I rarely get any foot discomfort with them at all.

~PB
 
Peter Clinch <[email protected]> wrote:

>This suggests you didn't try them on against one another (or much else)
>first.

I tried them on for size, but whether a shoe works in practice can imo
only be determined by doing a medium to long ride in them, the
Specialized felt ok for the first 30k. Also the few bike shops in town
that sell shoes typically don't stock many, so the choice of available
entry level shoes in a given size is very limited, if any.

--
Membrane
 
Membrane wrote:
> Peter Clinch <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> This suggests you didn't try them on against one another (or much
>> else) first.
>
> I tried them on for size, but whether a shoe works in practice can imo
> only be determined by doing a medium to long ride in them, the
> Specialized felt ok for the first 30k. Also the few bike shops in town
> that sell shoes typically don't stock many, so the choice of available
> entry level shoes in a given size is very limited, if any.

I agree with you, you really can't tell whether shoes are going to be OK
from a quick try-on. All you can tell is if they're terrible and a complete
non-starter.

~PB
 
in message <[email protected]>, Membrane
('[email protected]') wrote:

> A web search suggested that Shimano shoes which I was looking at don't
> have a great reputation, Specialized shoes seemed to be universally
> liked, including the entry level models, so I bought the Specialized 07
> Sport MTB shoes.
> <http://www.cycleways.com/store/product/32914/Sp.07-Sport-Mtb-Shoe---48/>

I have a pair of the three-year-old predecessor of this model. They're OK -
not wonderful, but OK. The 'body geometry' lumps and bumps in the sole
don't really suit me, and while they have flattish soles they're
surprisingly uncomfortable to walk in - they tilt my feet inwards. I find
SIDI shoes much more comfortable - but seeing what they cost they bloody
ought to be!

> Did my first ride using the pedals and shoes today, and my feet were
> quite sore, couldn't wait to get home and take the shoes off.

I think there's a 'getting used to it' thing here. Persevere for a couple
of weeks.

> The end of the instep flap pushes against my leg, this is the issue that
> is causing the most irritation. Also, walking bare foot after having
> taken off the shoes I noticed that the balls of my feet were hurting.

This is the problem with MTB type clip systems: the area supported by the
pedal is quite small. You do get used to this, but it is why road systems
are better.

--
[email protected] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

;; when in the ****, the wise man plants courgettes
 
Membrane <[email protected]> wrote:

>Specialized shoes seemed to be universally
>liked, including the entry level models, so I bought the Specialized 07
>Sport MTB shoes.
><http://www.cycleways.com/store/product/32914/Sp.07-Sport-Mtb-Shoe---48/>
>
>Did my first ride using the pedals and shoes today, and my feet were
>quite sore, couldn't wait to get home and take the shoes off.

[...]

>The end of the instep flap pushes against my leg, this is the issue that
>is causing the most irritation.

A small modification could make a significant difference. The arched
shape of the instep flap makes it very difficult for the end to flex to
adapt to the foot/leg when the foot is at the shallowest angle relative
to the leg. After I made 2 cuts, the end now flexes with ease:
http://codewallop.110mb.com/img/specialized_shoe_modification.jpg

It feels good trying it out off the bike, but I'll have to wait until
the soreness from yesterday's ride has disappeared to test it out on
another ride.

--
Membrane
 
Simon Brooke <[email protected]> wrote:

>> Also, walking bare foot after having
>> taken off the shoes I noticed that the balls of my feet were hurting.
>
>This is the problem with MTB type clip systems: the area supported by the
>pedal is quite small.

You could be right, but afaics the stiffness of the sole should
distribute the support. I did read one forum post from someone who
reported an (unspecified) comfort improvement after upgrading to a more
expensive model with a stiffer carbon sole.

The (non carbon) soles on my entry level shoes feel quite stiff, I can
barely flex them by hand. By comparison the (regular walking) shoes I
used with my platform pedals were a lot more flexible.

--
Membrane
 
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