ASN Humagro

"jack" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

What is ASN Humagro? Is it a steroid or a suplement? Has anyone used
this product an how well did it work?

If you have enough money to throw away to buy this [censored], send it to me. You
will have my undying gratitude and I will encourage your training endevours.
Which will have greater effect on your training than this [censored].

As for what it is, it is a product designed to separate you from your money.

"Lee Michaels" <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

"jack" <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

What is ASN Humagro? Is it a steroid or a suplement? Has anyone used
this product an how well did it work?

If you have enough money to throw away to buy this [censored], send it to me.
You will have my undying gratitude and I will encourage your training
endevours. Which will have greater effect on your training than this [censored].

As for what it is, it is a product designed to separate you from your
money.

While one can debate the validity or invalidity of homeopathic medicine, I
wish the scam artists would at least research what a homeopathic medicine is
before advertising their [censored] as "homeopathic". While this product is
clearly [censored], it is NOT, as advertised, homeopathic [censored]. It's just plain
[censored].

David

In article <[email hidden]>,
"David Cohen" <[email hidden]> writes:
[snip]

Quoted message said:

While one can debate the validity or invalidity of homeopathic medicine, I
wish the scam artists would at least research what a homeopathic medicine is
before advertising their [censored] as "homeopathic".

What would that gain them? The simple truth is that homeopathic
treatment is experiencing a resurgence in popularity in the west.
The snake-oil salesmen are trying to profit from that. Nothing
new here.

Quoted message said:

While this product is
clearly [censored], it is NOT, as advertised, homeopathic [censored]. It's just plain
[censored].

Even were it truly a homeopathic remedy: Unless prescribed by a
homeopath, it would be of dubious efficacy. The best that could be
said of it is it would likely do little or no harm. (The key words
there being "best" and "likely." Self-prescribing homeopathic
remedies is not recommended.)

--
Jim Seymour | "It is wrong always, everywhere and
WARNING: The "From:" address is a | for everyone to believe anything upon
spam trap. DON'T USE IT! Use: | insufficient evidence."
[email hidden] | - W. K. Clifford, ca. 1876

"Runs With Knives" <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

"David Cohen" <[email hidden]> writes:
[snip]

Quoted message said:

While one can debate the validity or invalidity of homeopathic medicine,
I
wish the scam artists would at least research what a homeopathic medicine
is
before advertising their [censored] as "homeopathic".

What would that gain them?

My gratitude.

Priceless.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

While this product is
clearly [censored], it is NOT, as advertised, homeopathic [censored]. It's just plain
[censored].

Even were it truly a homeopathic remedy: Unless prescribed by a
homeopath, it would be of dubious efficacy. The best that could be
said of it is it would likely do little or no harm. (The key words
there being "best" and "likely." Self-prescribing homeopathic
remedies is not recommended.)

Oh, I don't know. There are plenty of good self-prescribing guides out
there. There's nothing magical about it. I think people don't self-prescribe
enough.

LIVE DANGEROUSLY. LIFE'S SHORT.

David

"Runs With Knives" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>,
"David Cohen" <[email hidden]> writes:
[snip]

Quoted message said:

While one can debate the validity or invalidity of homeopathic medicine,
I
wish the scam artists would at least research what a homeopathic medicine
is
before advertising their [censored] as "homeopathic".

What would that gain them? The simple truth is that homeopathic
treatment is experiencing a resurgence in popularity in the west.
The snake-oil salesmen are trying to profit from that. Nothing
new here.

Here you are differentiating between the typical supplement snake-oil
salesmen and the homeopathic snake-oil salesmen? I guess you could make the
case the homeopaths are simply self-deluded.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

While this product is
clearly [censored], it is NOT, as advertised, homeopathic [censored]. It's just plain
[censored].

Even were it truly a homeopathic remedy: Unless prescribed by a
homeopath, it would be of dubious efficacy.

Unless? Dubious? How about absolutely worthless except as a placebo
regardless of who prescribed it?

The best that could be

Quoted message said:

said of it is it would likely do little or no harm. (The key words
there being "best" and "likely." Self-prescribing homeopathic
remedies is not recommended.)

--
Jim Seymour | "It is wrong always, everywhere and
WARNING: The "From:" address is a | for everyone to believe anything
upon
spam trap. DON'T USE IT! Use: | insufficient evidence."
[email hidden] | - W. K. Clifford, ca.
1876

In article <[email hidden]>,
"ATP*" <[email hidden]> writes:
[snip]

Quoted message said:

Here you are differentiating between the typical supplement snake-oil
salesmen and the homeopathic snake-oil salesmen? I guess you could make the
case the homeopaths are simply self-deluded.

[snip]

Quoted message said:

Unless? Dubious? How about absolutely worthless except as a placebo
regardless of who prescribed it?

[snip]

Except my wife has degrees in naturalpathy and classical homepathy
from accredited schools in the Netherlands. (Studied for seven
years.) I've seen homeopathic treatments work too many times to
dismiss it out-of-hand. I could tell you of cases, one that involved
me, but I suspect you'd just dismiss the evidence, so there's no
point. Homeopathic remedies don't always work. Neither does
modern western medicine.

--
Jim Seymour | "It is wrong always, everywhere and
WARNING: The "From:" address is a | for everyone to believe anything upon
spam trap. DON'T USE IT! Use: | insufficient evidence."
[email hidden] | - W. K. Clifford, ca. 1876

Runs With Knives said:

"ATP*" <[email hidden]> writes:
[snip]

Quoted message said:

Here you are differentiating between the typical supplement snake-oil
salesmen and the homeopathic snake-oil salesmen? I guess you could make the
case the homeopaths are simply self-deluded.

[snip]

Quoted message said:

Unless? Dubious? How about absolutely worthless except as a placebo
regardless of who prescribed it?

[snip]

Except my wife has degrees in naturalpathy and classical homepathy
from accredited schools in the Netherlands. (Studied for seven
years.) I've seen homeopathic treatments work too many times to
dismiss it out-of-hand. I could tell you of cases, one that involved
me, but I suspect you'd just dismiss the evidence, so there's no
point. Homeopathic remedies don't always work. Neither does
modern western medicine.

I find the studies using animals interesting. Hard to have a placebo
effect with a dog.

David

In article <[email hidden]>,

David Cohen said:

Runs With Knives said:

"ATP*" <[email hidden]> writes:
[snip]

Quoted message said:

Here you are differentiating between the typical supplement snake-oil
salesmen and the homeopathic snake-oil salesmen? I guess you could make
the
case the homeopaths are simply self-deluded.

[snip]

Quoted message said:

Unless? Dubious? How about absolutely worthless except as a placebo
regardless of who prescribed it?

[snip]

Except my wife has degrees in naturalpathy and classical homepathy
from accredited schools in the Netherlands. (Studied for seven
years.) I've seen homeopathic treatments work too many times to
dismiss it out-of-hand. I could tell you of cases, one that involved
me, but I suspect you'd just dismiss the evidence, so there's no
point. Homeopathic remedies don't always work. Neither does
modern western medicine.

I find the studies using animals interesting. Hard to have a placebo
effect with a dog.

Speaking of which, a study I was reading (forget which) with animals
listed the placebo effect as a possible cause of what they found. I
could not figure out how you get the placebo effect with a hamster, but
that was one of their theories.

Quoted message said:

David

--
Will Brink @ http://www.brinkzone.com/

In article <[email hidden]>,

WillBrink said:

In article <[email hidden]>,
[email hidden] (Runs With Knives) wrote:

[snip]

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Except my wife has degrees in naturalpathy and classical homepathy
from accredited schools in the Netherlands.

Sorry to hear it.

Why?

--
Jim Seymour | "It is wrong always, everywhere and
WARNING: The "From:" address is a | for everyone to believe anything upon
spam trap. DON'T USE IT! Use: | insufficient evidence."
[email hidden] | - W. K. Clifford, ca. 1876

"David Cohen" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Runs With Knives said:

"ATP*" <[email hidden]> writes:
[snip]

Quoted message said:

Here you are differentiating between the typical supplement snake-oil
salesmen and the homeopathic snake-oil salesmen? I guess you could make
the
case the homeopaths are simply self-deluded.

[snip]

Quoted message said:

Unless? Dubious? How about absolutely worthless except as a placebo
regardless of who prescribed it?

[snip]

Except my wife has degrees in naturalpathy and classical homepathy
from accredited schools in the Netherlands. (Studied for seven
years.) I've seen homeopathic treatments work too many times to
dismiss it out-of-hand. I could tell you of cases, one that involved
me, but I suspect you'd just dismiss the evidence, so there's no
point. Homeopathic remedies don't always work. Neither does
modern western medicine.

I find the studies using animals interesting. Hard to have a placebo
effect with a dog.

David

But it's not unusual for a study to have flawed results. Were they double
blind studies like the ones funded by Muscle Media magazine?
Homeopathy is pseudoscience- I hope a Godless man of science such as
yourself can see that:-)

In article <[email hidden]>, "ATP*" <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

"Runs With Knives" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>,
"ATP*" <[email hidden]> writes:
[snip]

Quoted message said:

Here you are differentiating between the typical supplement snake-oil
salesmen and the homeopathic snake-oil salesmen? I guess you could make
the
case the homeopaths are simply self-deluded.

[snip]

Quoted message said:

Unless? Dubious? How about absolutely worthless except as a placebo
regardless of who prescribed it?

[snip]

Except my wife has degrees in naturalpathy and classical homepathy
from accredited schools in the Netherlands. (Studied for seven
years.) I've seen homeopathic treatments work too many times to
dismiss it out-of-hand. I could tell you of cases, one that involved
me, but I suspect you'd just dismiss the evidence, so there's no
point.

Anecdotal. Doesn't count for much scientifically.

Dismissing science, or lack there of, is what such people do best.

--
Will Brink @ http://www.brinkzone.com/

In article <[email hidden]>,
"David Cohen" <[email hidden]> wrote:

<snipped>

Quoted message said:

It certainly pays my bills. But I have seen Western medicine fail, many
times. Western medicine's greatest strength is with really bad acute
problems...a bullet to the chest, a broken leg, bacterial meningitis,
etcetera. It's greatest failings, and where other forms of medicine often
shine, are with the prevention and treatment of chronic problems...asthma,
diabetes, heart disease, a BIG FREAKIN' PROSTATE (sorry, didn't mean to
yell), digestive disorders, autoimmune disorders, etcetera.

Like I said, it all has it's time and place. Use what's appropriate.

David

Well stated!!! <applause>

Chronic health problems are seldom helped by allopathic remedies.
Lifestyle changes are often in order, as well as paying very strict
attention to one's body!

OTOH, those who totally reject "modern medicine" for any reason are real
fools. It has it's place.
--
Om.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-[censored]." -Jack Nicholson

"WillBrink" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>,

David Cohen said:

"WillBrink" <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

"David Cohen" <[email hidden]> wrote:
> Runs With Knives wrote:
> > "ATP*" <[email hidden]> writes:
> > [snip]
> > >
> > > Here you are differentiating between the typical supplement
> > > snake-oil
> > > salesmen and the homeopathic snake-oil salesmen? I guess you could
> > > make
> > > the
> > > case the homeopaths are simply self-deluded.
> > [snip]
> > >
> > > Unless? Dubious? How about absolutely worthless except as a
> > > placebo
> > > regardless of who prescribed it?
> > [snip]
> >
> > Except my wife has degrees in naturalpathy and classical homepathy
> > from accredited schools in the Netherlands. (Studied for seven
> > years.) I've seen homeopathic treatments work too many times to
> > dismiss it out-of-hand. I could tell you of cases, one that
> > involved
> > me, but I suspect you'd just dismiss the evidence, so there's no
> > point. Homeopathic remedies don't always work. Neither does
> > modern western medicine.
>
> I find the studies using animals interesting. Hard to have a placebo
> effect with a dog.

Speaking of which, a study I was reading (forget which) with animals
listed the placebo effect as a possible cause of what they found. I
could not figure out how you get the placebo effect with a hamster, but
that was one of their theories.

If you use classical and/or operant conditioning to get the animal to
associate getting, for example, a particular sweet-tasting substance from
a
syringe, with some effect, you could end up with a placebo effect.

It would be a conditioned behavior/response, but placebo effect in the
classic sense? Say the sweet stuff made a tumor shrink in a rat and the
other rats didn't get sweet stuff and didn't see a tumor reduction? Hard
to call placebo on that one I would think. Sweet stuff might get them to
run to ths food faster or some behavioral response I am sure.

That was the kind of placebo response I was thinking of. You test an
anti-inflammatory on arthritic hamsters, measuring their activity levels.
The hamsters learn to asociate the sweet liquid drug with feeling better.
When given a sweet liquid placebo, they have the same increase in activity
level. HA HA! Fooled the hamsters!! Stupid hamsters.

David

In article <[email hidden]>,

DZ said:

Runs With Knives said:

WillBrink said:

"accredited schools in the Netherlands"? Does that mean the
governing accrediting body in the Netherlands considers the pseudo
science of homeopathy a legit form of medical treatment?

Apparently so.

The need for accreditation is negatively correlated with the
quality and reputation of an institution granting the degree.

Harvard - not an accredited university. But distance learning
scammy-looking degrees - those are from accredited institutions.

Actually, Harvard is accredited. It just never bothers to mention it,
because it doesn't need to.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

She's legally allowed to put "Dr." in front of her name there.

You mean "there" in Netherlands but not in the US?

In the US, anybody can legally do it.

Quoted message said:

It's simple to prove a coin is biased: keep trials with results near
50:50 tucked away in the file drawer, and only publish those where you
get a large number of heads in a row (due to chance, but statistically
significant to reject the 50:50 hypothesis). But then we'll find out
that studies showing the biasness of a coin tend to have a smaller N.

Actually, coins _are_ biased. When the non-silver quarters first came
out, several of us tried a simple experiment: spinning them. There was
a distinct bias for tails. (That didn't apply if they were tossed
into the air, though; only when spun on a table.)

Seth
--
Of course, common logic fails to hold up here on mfw, as a general rule
of thumb. -- Lyle McDonald

In article <[email hidden]>,

(Runs With Knives) said:

In article <[email hidden]>,
WillBrink <[email hidden]> writes:
[snip]

Quoted message said:

I would cut my own head off with a spork if I had to listen to my wife
tell me about homeopathy.

To each his own, I s'pose.

Quoted message said:

"accredited schools in the Netherlands"? Does
that mean the governing accrediting body in the Netherlands considers
the pseudo science of homeopathy a legit form of medical treatment?

Apparently so. She's legally allowed to put "Dr." in front of her
name there.

Not in the US, that's for damn sure.

Quoted message said:

And, had I not stolen her away, she would probably be in
practice with her own GP, who'd asked her to join his practice. You
see, in the Netherlands, which isn't quite so backward as we are here
in the States, they're finding out that *gasp* some of that old stuff
actually worked.

You are an idiot, and she is not a doctor.

--
Will Brink @ http://www.brinkzone.com/

In article <[email hidden]>,

DZ said:

Harvard - not an accredited university.

I assume you're joking?

--
Will Brink @ http://www.brinkzone.com/

In article <[email hidden]>,

DZ said:

WillBrink said:

DZ said:

Harvard - not an accredited university.

I assume you're joking?

Harvard graduate schools may or may not be accredited depending on the
department - http://www.harvard.edu/siteguide/faqs/faq114.html

I didn't see a list of programs not accredited, but as someone else
pointed out, being Harvard, perhaps they don't need it.

--
Will Brink @ http://www.brinkzone.com/

WillBrink said:

In article <[email hidden]>,

DZ said:

WillBrink said:

DZ wrote:
>
> Harvard - not an accredited university.

I assume you're joking?

Harvard graduate schools may or may not be accredited depending on
the department - http://www.harvard.edu/siteguide/faqs/faq114.html

I didn't see a list of programs not accredited, but as someone else
pointed out, being Harvard, perhaps they don't need it.

Quite a few graduate courses aren't accredited; for example my fourth-year
maths course at Cambridge gave me a Certificate of Advanced Study in
Mathematics. It's not accredited. The difference is simply that if someone
asks the Maths Faculty whether their BA Maths course is really good enough
to give an undergrad degree, then the faculty point at the certificate of
accreditation, which says it is. Whereas if someone asks whether the CASM
course is 'good enough' for whatever, then the answer will be 'well, we
think it's good, nowhere else does this particular course, look at the
subject material and the exams, make your own mind up'.

That does mean that the maths faculty could if it wanted to just give you a
CASM without you doing any work (if you could convince them to do that
somehow..), but they can't legally just give you a BA.

For Harvard, I'd imagine that pretty much any undergrad course is
accredited; certainly all the BA, BSc etc. courses, and the graduate courses
will be accredited if there is an accrediting body that does that sort of
course. But your prospective employer isn't going to care too much, they'll
just check with Harvard that you're not lying and assume that the course you
did is worthwhile.

Peter

"WillBrink" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>,

(Runs With Knives) said:

In article
<[email hidden]>,
WillBrink <[email hidden]> writes:
[snip]

Quoted message said:

I would cut my own head off with a spork if I had to listen to my wife
tell me about homeopathy.

To each his own, I s'pose.

Quoted message said:

"accredited schools in the Netherlands"? Does
that mean the governing accrediting body in the Netherlands considers
the pseudo science of homeopathy a legit form of medical treatment?

Apparently so. She's legally allowed to put "Dr." in front of her
name there.

Not in the US, that's for damn sure.

Yet we allow chiropractors to call themselves doctors. I'm not saying they
are as useless as homeopaths, but the "science" is just about as flaky. Some
are enlightened physical therapists and others are complete quacks.