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3km

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General fitness, health and nutrition
Published
23 January 2006
Last activity
28 January 2006
Original author
Micheal Artindale
Posts
38
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  1. diablo said:

    "jtaylor" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]!nnrp1.uunet.ca...

    Quoted message said:

    "diablo" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    "jtaylor" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]!nnrp1.uunet.ca...

    {snip}

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    In this case however, he's probably right that Artindale's max distance

    per

    Quoted message said:

    hour probably cannot be simply doubled in two hours given his current

    level

    Quoted message said:

    of fitness and apparent 'training cojones'.

    Well, anyone could say that about almost anyone's swimming.

    Quoted message said:

    Martin didn't show his work in
    this problem, but appears to have arrived at the the correct answer.

    Um, he started by saying 3 + 3 was 5, then when that was pointed out to
    not
    be so, he said "no, I meant that 3 means 5, and if you want to get 8 then
    you have to add 3 more". Nobody mentioned 8 until he did - check the
    thread.

    The 8 comes in with regard to Artindale's goal of the 8Km lake swim,
    mentioned elsewhere by Artindale.

    Martin's response to Artindale's 3Km news was:

    "That means you can probably do 5k in 4 hours. Only 3k more to squeeze in"

    Again, assuming Artindale can do 3Km in 1 hour, its reasonable to assume
    that over 2 hours (given his present shape) he can get to 5Km. You know
    swimming, and are a smart guy, so you know this is more probable than 6Km in
    2 hours. His goal of 8Km with a projected current ability of 5Km is Martin's
    3Km.

    Not getting into a pissing match - don't want to tread on Smith's toes, just
    answering your question.

    That's right. Since I don't see jtaylor's posts, I forgot about him.
    Since he thought the oven cleaner in the suit suggestion was real
    advice, I should have known he wouldn't likely understand higher math.

  2. "Martin Smith" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:
    Micheal Artindale said:

    We are not talking about right now, we are talking about 6 months. Who


    realy

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    knows what will happen in 6 months.

    What is your current goal again? You have changed it so many times I
    lost track. What is your goal?

    I have a few. The 2 that are closest to now would be 1) swim 200IM. 2) swim
    from a island to shore, it is between 8-10km. When I get a GPS, I will get
    the exact distance.

    I have a lot more

    Quoted message said:


    Quoted message said:

    Martin, I have a challenge. Before the end of the month, go to your


    local

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    pool and do 8 km. Report back to us on how long it took. Also, the day
    after, report on how you feel.

    I can't. I wish I could, but I don't have the time.

    You should be able to do that in 2-3 hrs. You mean in the next week, you
    cannot find the time. Is that the lazyness in you that is coming out

    Quoted message said:


    Quoted message said:

    It took me 1 year to learn crawl, and do it in 59 seconds, actually


    about 4

    Quoted message said:

    months, 3 times a week for a hr each practice.

    It took a year to learn crawl? What was your main problem?

    I never put my head in the water. I had to learn to swim with my head in the
    water, and breathing.

    Quoted message said:


    Quoted message said:

    The next year it was honing it so that i could bring it to 45 seconds.

    Hone?... Buddha. I don't think you can use that verb in this context.
    What you're doing is more like chisling a new face into Mount Rushmore.

    The jack hammers on Mount Rushmore does the same. If you are a far distance
    away, it is not noticeable. Close up, it looks horrible.

    Quoted message said:


    Quoted message said:

    I may be in the typical prime, but I am improving every day/week/month.


    I

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    have yet to hit any peak. I dont have a muscle problem. I have a
    disadvantage. I learned how to swim almost 10 years later than you.

    Like you said, Who really knows what will happen in six months?

    Yes, I could do 8km in 1hr.

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    I ll believe that when I see it, or dont see it.

    You asked more questions.

    You have the freedom to stop typing

  3. Micheal Artindale said:


    "Martin Smith" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:
    Micheal Artindale said:

    We are not talking about right now, we are talking about 6 months. Who


    realy

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    knows what will happen in 6 months.

    What is your current goal again? You have changed it so many times I
    lost track. What is your goal?

    I have a few. The 2 that are closest to now would be 1) swim 200IM. 2) swim
    from a island to shore, it is between 8-10km. When I get a GPS, I will get
    the exact distance.

    I have a lot more

    Focus, Mechael. What is your first goal, the one you are working on
    now?

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    Martin, I have a challenge. Before the end of the month, go to your


    local

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    pool and do 8 km. Report back to us on how long it took. Also, the day
    after, report on how you feel.

    I can't. I wish I could, but I don't have the time.

    You should be able to do that in 2-3 hrs. You mean in the next week, you
    cannot find the time. Is that the lazyness in you that is coming out

    I mean the pool is open from 7-12, and I work from 8-17.

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:


    Quoted message said:

    It took me 1 year to learn crawl, and do it in 59 seconds, actually


    about 4

    Quoted message said:

    months, 3 times a week for a hr each practice.

    It took a year to learn crawl? What was your main problem?

    I never put my head in the water. I had to learn to swim with my head in the
    water, and breathing.

    It doesn't take a year to learn to put your head in the water.
    Breathing is a little harder, but nowhere near a year. So we're
    talking about fear of water. Your problem is psychological.

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    The next year it was honing it so that i could bring it to 45 seconds.

    Hone?... Buddha. I don't think you can use that verb in this context.
    What you're doing is more like chisling a new face into Mount Rushmore.

    The jack hammers on Mount Rushmore does the same. If you are a far distance
    away, it is not noticeable. Close up, it looks horrible.

    Quoted message said:


    Quoted message said:

    I may be in the typical prime, but I am improving every day/week/month.


    I

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    have yet to hit any peak. I dont have a muscle problem. I have a
    disadvantage. I learned how to swim almost 10 years later than you.

    Like you said, Who really knows what will happen in six months?

    Yes, I could do 8km in 1hr.

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    I ll believe that when I see it, or dont see it.

    You asked more questions.

    You have the freedom to stop typing

  4. "Martin Smith" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:
    Micheal Artindale said:


    "Martin Smith" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    Micheal Artindale wrote:

    > We are not talking about right now, we are talking about 6 months.


    Who

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    realy

    Quoted message said:

    > knows what will happen in 6 months.

    What is your current goal again? You have changed it so many times I
    lost track. What is your goal?

    I have a few. The 2 that are closest to now would be 1) swim 200IM. 2)


    swim

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    from a island to shore, it is between 8-10km. When I get a GPS, I will


    get

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    the exact distance.

    I have a lot more

    Focus, Mechael. What is your first goal, the one you are working on
    now?

    The one that is the soonest? Swim 200IM at a race in June.

    Quoted message said:


    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    > Martin, I have a challenge. Before the end of the month, go to your


    local

    Quoted message said:

    > pool and do 8 km. Report back to us on how long it took. Also, the


    day

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    > after, report on how you feel.

    I can't. I wish I could, but I don't have the time.

    You should be able to do that in 2-3 hrs. You mean in the next week, you
    cannot find the time. Is that the lazyness in you that is coming out

    I mean the pool is open from 7-12, and I work from 8-17.

    So, for the next 7 days you work, no day off? And I thought only I could
    come up with excuses.

    Do it. Prove to me that you are not just talk.

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:


    > It took me 1 year to learn crawl, and do it in 59 seconds, actually
    about 4
    > months, 3 times a week for a hr each practice.

    It took a year to learn crawl? What was your main problem?

    I never put my head in the water. I had to learn to swim with my head in


    the

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    water, and breathing.

    It doesn't take a year to learn to put your head in the water.
    Breathing is a little harder, but nowhere near a year. So we're
    talking about fear of water. Your problem is psychological.

    It is not psychological. It was technique. I had to relearn how to swim.
    Once I learned how, then I worked on speed.
    The next year, I worked on speed.

  5. Micheal Artindale said:

    "Martin Smith" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:
    Micheal Artindale said:

    "Martin Smith" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    >Micheal Artindale wrote:
    >
    >
    >>We are not talking about right now, we are talking about 6 months.

    Who

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    realy

    >>knows what will happen in 6 months.
    >
    >What is your current goal again? You have changed it so many times I
    >lost track. What is your goal?

    I have a few. The 2 that are closest to now would be 1) swim 200IM. 2)

    swim

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    from a island to shore, it is between 8-10km. When I get a GPS, I will

    get

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    the exact distance.

    I have a lot more

    Focus, Mechael. What is your first goal, the one you are working on
    now?

    The one that is the soonest? Swim 200IM at a race in June.

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    >>Martin, I have a challenge. Before the end of the month, go to your

    local

    >>pool and do 8 km. Report back to us on how long it took. Also, the

    day

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    >>after, report on how you feel.
    >
    >I can't. I wish I could, but I don't have the time.

    You should be able to do that in 2-3 hrs. You mean in the next week, you
    cannot find the time. Is that the lazyness in you that is coming out

    I mean the pool is open from 7-12, and I work from 8-17.

    So, for the next 7 days you work, no day off? And I thought only I could
    come up with excuses.

    The pool isn't open for lap swimming on the weekend. Besides that, I
    don't want to swim an 8k. I don't like swimming 8k's.

    Quoted message said:

    Do it. Prove to me that you are not just talk.

    You can assume I'm just talk. It wouldn't make any difference in your
    training anyway.

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    > > It took me 1 year to learn crawl, and do it in 59 seconds, actually
    >about 4
    >
    >>months, 3 times a week for a hr each practice.
    >
    >It took a year to learn crawl? What was your main problem?

    I never put my head in the water. I had to learn to swim with my head in

    the

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    water, and breathing.

    It doesn't take a year to learn to put your head in the water.
    Breathing is a little harder, but nowhere near a year. So we're
    talking about fear of water. Your problem is psychological.

    It is not psychological. It was technique. I had to relearn how to swim.
    Once I learned how, then I worked on speed.
    The next year, I worked on speed.

    You said you had to learn to put your head in the water. If the problem
    wasn't psychologica, what was the problem?


  6. Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    >>>Martin, I have a challenge. Before the end of the month, go to your
    >
    >local
    >
    >>>pool and do 8 km. Report back to us on how long it took. Also, the

    day

    Quoted message said:

    >>>after, report on how you feel.
    >>
    >>I can't. I wish I could, but I don't have the time.
    >
    >You should be able to do that in 2-3 hrs. You mean in the next week,


    you

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    >cannot find the time. Is that the lazyness in you that is coming out

    I mean the pool is open from 7-12, and I work from 8-17.

    So, for the next 7 days you work, no day off? And I thought only I could
    come up with excuses.

    The pool isn't open for lap swimming on the weekend. Besides that, I
    don't want to swim an 8k. I don't like swimming 8k's.

    Ok, dont 8km. Go do 2 hrs of lengths. tell us how far you did.

    I highly doubt that the pool is closed on the weekend.

    Quoted message said:


    Quoted message said:

    Do it. Prove to me that you are not just talk.

    You can assume I'm just talk. It wouldn't make any difference in your
    training anyway.

    No, but it might give me a reason to listen to you.

    Quoted message said:


    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    >> > It took me 1 year to learn crawl, and do it in 59 seconds,


    actually

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    >>about 4
    >>
    >>>months, 3 times a week for a hr each practice.
    >>
    >>It took a year to learn crawl? What was your main problem?
    >
    >I never put my head in the water. I had to learn to swim with my head


    in the

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    >water, and breathing.

    It doesn't take a year to learn to put your head in the water.
    Breathing is a little harder, but nowhere near a year. So we're
    talking about fear of water. Your problem is psychological.

    It is not psychological. It was technique. I had to relearn how to swim.
    Once I learned how, then I worked on speed.
    The next year, I worked on speed.

    You said you had to learn to put your head in the water. If the problem
    wasn't psychologica, what was the problem?

    Goggles, or lack there of. When I first figured out how to swim i was
    swimming with my face forward, out of the water. Once I got goggles I had to
    learn how to move again. At first, I would lift my head up, and then put it
    back down. I had to learn how to breathe on myside.

    Now, it does seam trivial, but back then, it was not.

    Micheal

  7. Micheal Artindale said:


    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    >>>>Martin, I have a challenge. Before the end of the month, go to your
    >>
    >>local
    >>
    >>>>pool and do 8 km. Report back to us on how long it took. Also, the

    day

    >>>>after, report on how you feel.
    >>>
    >>>I can't. I wish I could, but I don't have the time.
    >>
    >>You should be able to do that in 2-3 hrs. You mean in the next week,


    you

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    >>cannot find the time. Is that the lazyness in you that is coming out
    >
    >I mean the pool is open from 7-12, and I work from 8-17.

    So, for the next 7 days you work, no day off? And I thought only I could
    come up with excuses.

    The pool isn't open for lap swimming on the weekend. Besides that, I
    don't want to swim an 8k. I don't like swimming 8k's.

    Ok, dont 8km. Go do 2 hrs of lengths. tell us how far you did.

    Before Christmas, I had been pulling a three-times-weekly 1500 in
    about 24 minutes, so i estimate I could swim 1500's continuously at
    about a 30 minute pace for as long as my body heat held out. That
    makes for about 6k in two hours.

    But I don't enjoy long continuous swims like some others here do. I
    much prefer a two-hour workout to a two-hour swim. I'm a workout
    swimmer, which, in my case means I enjoy swimming hard, coached
    workouts with a group, and I don't enjoy racing. I do enjoy an open
    water race as a zen meditation, and I enjoy the fellowship of the pre-
    and post-race gatherings, but I have never enjoyed racing as a
    competitive sport, and long pool swims in a lane of overweight
    dentists and skinny guys in billowing parachutes are extremely
    frustrating.

    One of the few problems with living in Norway is that masters swimming
    is not a big sport. The only club I can join here trains once a week
    for one hour at 9PM, and they just do a few drills. It isn't worth the
    trouble of getting to the pool, plus if I work hard at that hour of
    the night, I don't get to sleep until 2AM because my metabolism gets
    fired up. So I get to swim Mon-Fri, 7:00-7:30, in one of two lanes set
    aside for lap swimming. Fortunately, at that hour there are no
    overweight dentists or skinny guys in billowing parachutes to pass.

    Quoted message said:

    I highly doubt that the pool is closed on the weekend.

    I didn't say it was closed on weekends. I said it isn't open for lap
    swimming on weekends. The child is king in Norway. Most pool time is
    set aside for children and families.

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    Do it. Prove to me that you are not just talk.

    You can assume I'm just talk. It wouldn't make any difference in your
    training anyway.

    No, but it might give me a reason to listen to you.

    You're out of shape and weak. You have to build both your strength and
    fitness. You won't do either perfecting your technique, and you won't
    do either swimming 100s at a 4 minute pace. At that pace you don't
    even have a technique. You have to have enough strength and fitness to
    be able to do the strokes correctly.

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    >>> > It took me 1 year to learn crawl, and do it in 59 seconds,


    actually

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    >>>about 4
    >>>
    >>>>months, 3 times a week for a hr each practice.
    >>>
    >>>It took a year to learn crawl? What was your main problem?
    >>
    >>I never put my head in the water. I had to learn to swim with my head


    in the

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    >>water, and breathing.
    >
    >It doesn't take a year to learn to put your head in the water.
    >Breathing is a little harder, but nowhere near a year. So we're
    >talking about fear of water. Your problem is psychological.

    It is not psychological. It was technique. I had to relearn how to swim.
    Once I learned how, then I worked on speed.
    The next year, I worked on speed.

    You said you had to learn to put your head in the water. If the problem
    wasn't psychologica, what was the problem?

    Goggles, or lack there of. When I first figured out how to swim i was
    swimming with my face forward, out of the water. Once I got goggles I had to
    learn how to move again. At first, I would lift my head up, and then put it
    back down. I had to learn how to breathe on myside.

    Now, it does seam trivial, but back then, it was not.

    But what was the problem. You got goggles, so you put your head in the
    water. It doesn't take a year to learn to do that. You don't even have
    to learn to do it anyway. Swimming craw stroke with your head up is a
    lot harder than swimming with your head in the water. Please don't
    tell me it's easier for you.


  8. Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    >>It doesn't take a year to learn to put your head in the water.
    >>Breathing is a little harder, but nowhere near a year. So we're
    >>talking about fear of water. Your problem is psychological.
    >
    >
    > It is not psychological. It was technique. I had to relearn how to


    swim.

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    > Once I learned how, then I worked on speed.
    > The next year, I worked on speed.

    You said you had to learn to put your head in the water. If the problem
    wasn't psychologica, what was the problem?

    Goggles, or lack there of. When I first figured out how to swim i was
    swimming with my face forward, out of the water. Once I got goggles I had


    to

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    learn how to move again. At first, I would lift my head up, and then put


    it

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    back down. I had to learn how to breathe on myside.

    Now, it does seam trivial, but back then, it was not.

    But what was the problem. You got goggles, so you put your head in the
    water. It doesn't take a year to learn to do that. You don't even have
    to learn to do it anyway. Swimming craw stroke with your head up is a
    lot harder than swimming with your head in the water. Please don't
    tell me it's easier for you.


    It isnt easyer to do it head up. It was all I knew. Now, I can bearly do it,
    even though I needed to do 150m of it 2 yrs ago for my Bronze Medalion.

    When you have to relearn how to do a stroke, at can take a while.

    It did not take a full year. it took about 4 months, that is the length of
    time our team practiced each year, and it was for about an hour 3 times a
    week.

    This has nothing to do with fitness.

    It has to do with lack of skill.

    And now, I am a lot better.

    Micheal

  9. Micheal Artindale said:

    It isnt easyer to do it head up. It was all I knew. Now, I can bearly do it,
    even though I needed to do 150m of it 2 yrs ago for my Bronze Medalion.

    When you have to relearn how to do a stroke, at can take a while.

    It did not take a full year. it took about 4 months, that is the length of
    time our team practiced each year, and it was for about an hour 3 times a
    week.

    This has nothing to do with fitness.

    It has to do with lack of skill.

    And now, I am a lot better.

    You're still not being forthright. I know what you are saying is false.
    If you can swim with your head up, you can swim with your head down,
    because swimming with your head down is easier. You just put your head
    down in the normal position. You might not be able to breath at first,
    however, because turning your head to the side and breathing is a new
    skill. So, although you could swim with your head down immediately, you
    would have to stop when you ran out of air or lift your head.

    But the skill of turning your head to one side enough to breath doesn't
    take four months to learn, especially for one who can already swim crawl
    head up, unless one has a psychological problem, a fear of breathing
    water, for example.

    You said you had no psychological problem, but now you say you swam with
    your head up because you had no goggles, or, you couldn't learn to put
    your face in the water until you got goggles. That's a psychological
    problem. When I was 15, the age at which you say it took you four months
    to learn to put your face in the water, there were no goggles. Everyone
    swam without goggles. But you couldn't? That's a psychological problem.
    Or did you wear contacts and you couldn't see at all without them?

    Unless there is something you are not telling, your problems are
    weakness and lack of fitness. Now you say your immediate goal is to swim
    a 200IM in a masters meet. You say you can't enter the 200IM now,
    because you can't do butterfly. If you could do butterfly, you could
    enter the race. How much butterfly are you doing each week?

  10. Thats great keep up the good work.
    http://www.tri-mansworldmailboxofficesupply.com/index.html

  11. "Martin Smith" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:
    Micheal Artindale said:

    It isnt easyer to do it head up. It was all I knew. Now, I can bearly do


    it,

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    even though I needed to do 150m of it 2 yrs ago for my Bronze Medalion.

    When you have to relearn how to do a stroke, at can take a while.

    It did not take a full year. it took about 4 months, that is the length


    of

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    time our team practiced each year, and it was for about an hour 3 times


    a

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    week.

    This has nothing to do with fitness.

    It has to do with lack of skill.

    And now, I am a lot better.

    You're still not being forthright. I know what you are saying is false.
    If you can swim with your head up, you can swim with your head down,
    because swimming with your head down is easier. You just put your head
    down in the normal position. You might not be able to breath at first,
    however, because turning your head to the side and breathing is a new
    skill. So, although you could swim with your head down immediately, you
    would have to stop when you ran out of air or lift your head.

    Yes, and lift up, not to the side.

    Quoted message said:


    But the skill of turning your head to one side enough to breath doesn't
    take four months to learn, especially for one who can already swim crawl
    head up, unless one has a psychological problem, a fear of breathing
    water, for example.

    I had no fear of water. it did not take thew whole 4 months. it took 4
    months to lear how to decently do crawl and breath on one side.

    Quoted message said:


    You said you had no psychological problem, but now you say you swam with
    your head up because you had no goggles, or, you couldn't learn to put
    your face in the water until you got goggles. That's a psychological
    problem. When I was 15, the age at which you say it took you four months
    to learn to put your face in the water, there were no goggles. Everyone
    swam without goggles. But you couldn't? That's a psychological problem.
    Or did you wear contacts and you couldn't see at all without them?

    I have never worn glasses. My eyes would burn regardless of what water i was
    in. I had to get used to that not happening, which, if you want to stretch
    it, is psycological.

    Quoted message said:


    Unless there is something you are not telling, your problems are
    weakness and lack of fitness. Now you say your immediate goal is to swim
    a 200IM in a masters meet. You say you can't enter the 200IM now,
    because you can't do butterfly. If you could do butterfly, you could
    enter the race. How much butterfly are you doing each week?

    Each day, at least 50m, if not more. It wears me out too quickly.

    I may only do the 100IM. On April 8th there is a meet, I will go, if I can
    get the time off. It will depend on what I am like in March.

    Micheal

  12. Micheal Artindale said:

    I had no fear of water. it did not take thew whole 4 months. it took 4
    months to lear how to decently do crawl and breath on one side.

    Now you are down from one year to less than fourth months. Do you see
    my point here? You aren't telling the truth. You said it took you one
    year to learn to swim crawlstroke. Now it is clear it took you a few
    weeks, and then you started your effort to do it decently. We don't
    know what decently means to you.

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    You said you had no psychological problem, but now you say you swam with
    your head up because you had no goggles, or, you couldn't learn to put
    your face in the water until you got goggles. That's a psychological
    problem. When I was 15, the age at which you say it took you four months
    to learn to put your face in the water, there were no goggles. Everyone
    swam without goggles. But you couldn't? That's a psychological problem.
    Or did you wear contacts and you couldn't see at all without them?

    I have never worn glasses. My eyes would burn regardless of what water i was
    in. I had to get used to that not happening, which, if you want to stretch
    it, is psycological.

    It isn't a stretch at all. It is a psychological problem. Unless you
    have some unexplained medical problem, opening your eyes underwater
    doesn't make them burn. Swimming without goggles for, say, 10 minutes
    and more, will make your eyes burn or feel sandy, after you get out.

    Before the 60's, there were no goggles. Everyone swam without them.
    They gradually caught on; they weren't very good at first.

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    Unless there is something you are not telling, your problems are
    weakness and lack of fitness. Now you say your immediate goal is to swim
    a 200IM in a masters meet. You say you can't enter the 200IM now,
    because you can't do butterfly. If you could do butterfly, you could
    enter the race. How much butterfly are you doing each week?

    Each day, at least 50m, if not more. It wears me out too quickly.

    50 whole meters? Well, it's a start. But notice, it wears you out too
    quickly. That is lack of fitness. The only way to eliminate lack of
    fitness is to do more than 50 meters.

    Quoted message said:

    I may only do the 100IM. On April 8th there is a meet, I will go, if I can
    get the time off. It will depend on what I am like in March.

    See, you are already talking yourself out achieving your goal. Your
    most recent one.

  13. "Martin Smith" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:
    Micheal Artindale said:

    I had no fear of water. it did not take thew whole 4 months. it took 4
    months to lear how to decently do crawl and breath on one side.

    Now you are down from one year to less than fourth months. Do you see
    my point here? You aren't telling the truth. You said it took you one
    year to learn to swim crawlstroke. Now it is clear it took you a few
    weeks, and then you started your effort to do it decently. We don't
    know what decently means to you.

    From when I started on the team to the following begining of the next season
    is one year.

    Decently means, be able to do it, and make it look as though you know what
    you are doing.

    Quoted message said:


    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    You said you had no psychological problem, but now you say you swam


    with

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    your head up because you had no goggles, or, you couldn't learn to put
    your face in the water until you got goggles. That's a psychological
    problem. When I was 15, the age at which you say it took you four


    months

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    to learn to put your face in the water, there were no goggles. Everyone
    swam without goggles. But you couldn't? That's a psychological problem.
    Or did you wear contacts and you couldn't see at all without them?

    I have never worn glasses. My eyes would burn regardless of what water i


    was

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    in. I had to get used to that not happening, which, if you want to


    stretch

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    it, is psycological.

    It isn't a stretch at all. It is a psychological problem. Unless you
    have some unexplained medical problem, opening your eyes underwater
    doesn't make them burn. Swimming without goggles for, say, 10 minutes
    and more, will make your eyes burn or feel sandy, after you get out.

    I guess I have some unknown medical problem. My eyes always have burned when
    water got on them. Wether it was in a bat tub, shower, pool, lake, ocean...
    doesnt matter. If I do not wear goggles, my eyes burn. If i were to swim in
    a lake, after about a minute, I would have dificulty seeing.

    I am a medical wonder i guess.

    Quoted message said:


    Before the 60's, there were no goggles. Everyone swam without them.
    They gradually caught on; they weren't very good at first.

    Yes, and before the 60's, you had rabbit ears to pick up TV, now we have
    Satilite dish.

    Quoted message said:


    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    Unless there is something you are not telling, your problems are
    weakness and lack of fitness. Now you say your immediate goal is to


    swim

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    a 200IM in a masters meet. You say you can't enter the 200IM now,
    because you can't do butterfly. If you could do butterfly, you could
    enter the race. How much butterfly are you doing each week?

    Each day, at least 50m, if not more. It wears me out too quickly.

    50 whole meters? Well, it's a start. But notice, it wears you out too
    quickly. That is lack of fitness. The only way to eliminate lack of
    fitness is to do more than 50 meters.

    Some days, I do 100 or 150. I want to get to be able to do equal distance of
    all 5 strokes, just one of my many swim related goals.

    Quoted message said:


    Quoted message said:

    I may only do the 100IM. On April 8th there is a meet, I will go, if I


    can

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    get the time off. It will depend on what I am like in March.

    See, you are already talking yourself out achieving your goal. Your
    most recent one.

    Last summer I wanted to do 8km. I scaled it down to 4km. I did this so that
    I could eventually achive my goal. This is no different. I may do 200IM this
    year. If i cannot do 50 Fly decently, I wont make a fool out of myself.

    I never did say that i wont do 200IM, I just may not do it yet.

    Micheal

  14. Micheal Artindale said:


    "Martin Smith" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:
    Micheal Artindale said:

    I had no fear of water. it did not take thew whole 4 months. it took 4
    months to lear how to decently do crawl and breath on one side.

    Now you are down from one year to less than fourth months. Do you see
    my point here? You aren't telling the truth. You said it took you one
    year to learn to swim crawlstroke. Now it is clear it took you a few
    weeks, and then you started your effort to do it decently. We don't
    know what decently means to you.

    From when I started on the team to the following begining of the next season
    is one year.

    You said it took one year to learn crawl, but the team only trained
    for four months of that year. That reduces the year by eight months.
    Then you said it didn't take you the four months to leanr crawl, you
    learned crawl quickly, and then you set about improving your technique
    to get to where you could do crawl "decently," whatever that means.

    Quoted message said:

    Decently means, be able to do it, and make it look as though you know what
    you are doing.

    You mean, so the youth won't laugh at you. Not relevant. It took you a
    few weeks to learn crawl. Decently is a non-issue. you still can't do
    crawl decently. 4 minutes per hundred is indecent for a 25 year old
    guy. If you were Larry's father, 4 minutes per hundred would be
    reasonable, but Larry's father, who is in his 90's if memory serves,
    probably goes faster than 4 minutes.

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    > You said you had no psychological problem, but now you say you swam


    with

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    > your head up because you had no goggles, or, you couldn't learn to put
    > your face in the water until you got goggles. That's a psychological
    > problem. When I was 15, the age at which you say it took you four


    months

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    > to learn to put your face in the water, there were no goggles. Everyone
    > swam without goggles. But you couldn't? That's a psychological problem.
    > Or did you wear contacts and you couldn't see at all without them?

    I have never worn glasses. My eyes would burn regardless of what water i


    was

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    in. I had to get used to that not happening, which, if you want to


    stretch

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    it, is psycological.

    It isn't a stretch at all. It is a psychological problem. Unless you
    have some unexplained medical problem, opening your eyes underwater
    doesn't make them burn. Swimming without goggles for, say, 10 minutes
    and more, will make your eyes burn or feel sandy, after you get out.

    I guess I have some unknown medical problem. My eyes always have burned when
    water got on them. Wether it was in a bat tub, shower, pool, lake, ocean...
    doesnt matter. If I do not wear goggles, my eyes burn. If i were to swim in
    a lake, after about a minute, I would have dificulty seeing.

    I would see a doctor then. Personally, I think you are lying to
    yourself, but as jtaylor has already established, I'm just an [censored].

    Quoted message said:

    I am a medical wonder i guess.

    You are "The Great Excuzo." You can find an excuse for anything. There
    is no task The Great Excuzo can't find an excuse not to do.

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    Before the 60's, there were no goggles. Everyone swam without them.
    They gradually caught on; they weren't very good at first.

    Yes, and before the 60's, you had rabbit ears to pick up TV, now we have
    Satilite dish.

    And you alone, on this planet, can't put fresh water in your eyes.

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    > Unless there is something you are not telling, your problems are
    > weakness and lack of fitness. Now you say your immediate goal is to


    swim

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    > a 200IM in a masters meet. You say you can't enter the 200IM now,
    > because you can't do butterfly. If you could do butterfly, you could
    > enter the race. How much butterfly are you doing each week?

    Each day, at least 50m, if not more. It wears me out too quickly.

    50 whole meters? Well, it's a start. But notice, it wears you out too
    quickly. That is lack of fitness. The only way to eliminate lack of
    fitness is to do more than 50 meters.

    Some days, I do 100 or 150. I want to get to be able to do equal distance of
    all 5 strokes, just one of my many swim related goals.

    What was that fifth stroke again? Why not concentrate on just the
    four?

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    I may only do the 100IM. On April 8th there is a meet, I will go, if I


    can

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    get the time off. It will depend on what I am like in March.

    See, you are already talking yourself out achieving your goal. Your
    most recent one.

    Last summer I wanted to do 8km. I scaled it down to 4km. I did this so that
    I could eventually achive my goal. This is no different. I may do 200IM this
    year. If i cannot do 50 Fly decently, I wont make a fool out of myself.

    You cut your 8k goal in half to avoid doing the work to achieve the 8k
    goal. Now you are doing the same thing with the 200IM. You are cutting
    200IM goal in half so you can avoid doing the work to achieve it. What
    you wrote above implies you now believe you can't even achieve the
    goal of swimming a 200IM. Where does that come from? What did your
    parents do to you?

    Quoted message said:

    I never did say that i wont do 200IM, I just may not do it yet.

    Yes, you did. You implied you won't be able to do it, and you won't
    do it.

  15. A digression:

    There are, however, some swimmers who prefer to swim without goggles,
    at least in competition.

    See for example the new recordman in the 50 SCM fly, Kaio Almeida

    http://cache.gettyimages.com/xc/53288202.jpg?v=1&c=MS_GINS&k=2&d=780858ABC91EC214D851ABBE58D120FD

    Russian backstroker Stanislava Komarova makes my eyes to water

    http://cache.gettyimages.com/xc/2887565.jpg?v=1&c=MS_GINS&k=2&d=1C6D8063EE0A1F08BCB6A2EF0726E1C8

    http://editorial.gettyimages.com/source/search/details_pop.aspx?iid=56667066&cdi=0

    Sometimes your goggles turn against you and try to strangle you, as in
    the following picture:

    http://editorial.gettyimages.com/source/search/details_pop.aspx?iid=56649889&cdi=0

    (Sorry for my English)

  16. A digression:

    There are, however, some swimmers who prefer to swim without goggles,
    at least in competition.

    See for example the new recordman in the 50 SCM fly, Kaio Almeida

    http://cache.gettyimages.com/xc/53288202.jpg?v=1&c=MS_GINS&k=2&d=780858ABC91EC214D851ABBE58D120FD

    Russian backstroker Stanislava Komarova makes my eyes to water

    http://cache.gettyimages.com/xc/2887565.jpg?v=1&c=MS_GINS&k=2&d=1C6D8063EE0A1F08BCB6A2EF0726E1C8

    http://editorial.gettyimages.com/source/search/details_pop.aspx?iid=56667066&cdi=0

    Sometimes your goggles turn against you and try to strangle you, as in
    the following picture:

    http://editorial.gettyimages.com/source/search/details_pop.aspx?iid=56649889&cdi=0

    (Sorry for my English)

  17. Quoted message said:

    A digression:

    There are, however, some swimmers who prefer to swim without goggles,
    at least in competition.

    I'm one of them. I don't wear them for pool races, except for the 1500.

    Quoted message said:

    See for example the new recordman in the 50 SCM fly, Kaio Almeida

    http://cache.gettyimages.com/xc/53288202.jpg?v=1&c=MS_GINS&k=2&d=780858ABC91EC214D851ABBE58D120FD

    Russian backstroker Stanislava Komarova makes my eyes to water

    http://cache.gettyimages.com/xc/2887565.jpg?v=1&c=MS_GINS&k=2&d=1C6D8063EE0A1F08BCB6A2EF0726E1C8

    http://editorial.gettyimages.com/source/search/details_pop.aspx?iid=56667066&cdi=0

    Sometimes your goggles turn against you and try to strangle you, as in
    the following picture:

    http://editorial.gettyimages.com/source/search/details_pop.aspx?iid=56649889&cdi=0

    (Sorry for my English)

  18. "Martin Smith" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:


    I would see a doctor then. Personally, I think you are lying to
    yourself, but as jtaylor has already established, I'm just an [censored].

    This is utterly false.

    a) searching the whole of the usenet archives for the term "[censored]" with
    jtaylor as author yields no hits (following this post there will be, of
    course, one);

    b) any such evaluation of Martin's character by participants in this
    newsgroup is entirely his own doing;

    and

    c) searching for such terms of abuse with Martin as the author is, in
    contrast, a rich vein. Some examples follow:

    "You are a fool"

    "jtaylor the banana"

    "Gosh, what an ass"

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