I blew it!

On Sat, 7 Aug 2004 15:20:42 -0400, Roger Zoul <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

I went on a metric century today with about 3700+ feet of climbing.
According to my Polar 720i, that's about 1800 more feet than I normally
do
on 65 miles. Well, the ride as going great. Finally we got to this one
longish climb...some guy came past me....I decided to follow....I finally
pasted him back....HR hit 173 (my theoretical max) and stayed there a
while...I was huffing and puffing...only going about 5 mph or so...but I
got
that hill. My buddy who was with me at the beginning said I was out of
sight by the time he got to the top of that hill. He must weigh some 60
lbs
less than me.

Well, the next time a major hill came...I started having cramps in my
left
quad...the muscle to the left of the knee cap (inner front thigh)...got
off
and massaged it for a bit...it felt better. Went on...another hill...this
time it started locking up. Got off...I couldn't bend my leg....it was
stuck straight....that muscle as hard as a rock...it took about 3 minutes
before it relaxed. That was at 46 miles. I rode to 50 miles (3400ft of
ascent) where the next rest stop was. I got in the sag wagon. Dammit.

I must learn to respect the climb. I must find some better climbing
material, too.

Were you at least out of the saddle attacking the hill or did you just
mash the pedals seated?
Doing the 'Lance Dance' gets me up the hills and saves my legs for the
straight stuff while getting my heart going a little faster.
2 cents mode off.
Bill Baka

--
Using M2, Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/

"Roger Zoul" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I went on a metric century today with about 3700+ feet of climbing.
According to my Polar 720i, that's about 1800 more feet than I normally do
on 65 miles. Well, the ride as going great. Finally we got to this one
longish climb...some guy came past me....I decided to follow....I finally
pasted him back....HR hit 173 (my theoretical max) and stayed there a
while...I was huffing and puffing...only going about 5 mph or so...but I

got

Quoted message said:

that hill. My buddy who was with me at the beginning said I was out of
sight by the time he got to the top of that hill. He must weigh some 60

lbs

Quoted message said:

less than me.

Well, the next time a major hill came...I started having cramps in my left
quad...the muscle to the left of the knee cap (inner front thigh)...got

off

Quoted message said:

and massaged it for a bit...it felt better. Went on...another hill...this
time it started locking up. Got off...I couldn't bend my leg....it was
stuck straight....that muscle as hard as a rock...it took about 3 minutes
before it relaxed. That was at 46 miles. I rode to 50 miles (3400ft of
ascent) where the next rest stop was. I got in the sag wagon. Dammit.

I must learn to respect the climb. I must find some better climbing
material, too.

Hi Roger,

I do the Lance Dance, too. I don't necessarily do that much of it out of
the saddle, but I've worked on my aerobic ability to spin the smaller gears.
That keeps me in the game on the longer climbs. It also saves your legs
when you're doing longer rides.

So how was Tigerville? Sorry I didn't make it up there. Who woulda thought
they could move the date from October to early August and still have the
same Fall weather? I just wasn't up for 4 hours of driving to do a 3 hour
ride. I did 82 miles ... half of that solo and half with an old training
buddy from Anderson. What a glorious morning!

Sorry to hear that you ended up in the sag wagon. Work on using small gears
on those hills. When you mash the big gears, you work your muscles harder
and they give out sooner.

We'll talk more about this.

Bob C.

Bill Baka wrote:
|| On Sat, 7 Aug 2004 15:20:42 -0400, Roger Zoul
|| <[email hidden]> wrote:
||
||| I went on a metric century today with about 3700+ feet of climbing.
||| According to my Polar 720i, that's about 1800 more feet than I
||| normally do
||| on 65 miles. Well, the ride as going great. Finally we got to
||| this one longish climb...some guy came past me....I decided to
||| follow....I finally pasted him back....HR hit 173 (my theoretical
||| max) and stayed there a while...I was huffing and puffing...only
||| going about 5 mph or so...but I got
||| that hill. My buddy who was with me at the beginning said I was
||| out of sight by the time he got to the top of that hill. He must
||| weigh some 60 lbs
||| less than me.
|||
||| Well, the next time a major hill came...I started having cramps in
||| my left
||| quad...the muscle to the left of the knee cap (inner front
||| thigh)...got off
||| and massaged it for a bit...it felt better. Went on...another
||| hill...this time it started locking up. Got off...I couldn't bend
||| my leg....it was stuck straight....that muscle as hard as a
||| rock...it took about 3 minutes before it relaxed. That was at 46
||| miles. I rode to 50 miles (3400ft of ascent) where the next rest
||| stop was. I got in the sag wagon. Dammit.
|||
||| I must learn to respect the climb. I must find some better climbing
||| material, too.
|||
|||
|| Were you at least out of the saddle attacking the hill or did you
|| just mash the pedals seated?

I was mashing but I was in the lower gear on the bike. I didn't stand,
though. I was already at my limit, so there wouldn't have been much point
to standing.

|| Doing the 'Lance Dance' gets me up the hills and saves my legs for
|| the straight stuff while getting my heart going a little faster.

I'm not sure what the "Lance Dance" is, sadly.

psycholist wrote:
|| "Roger Zoul" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
|| news:[email hidden]...
||| I went on a metric century today with about 3700+ feet of climbing.
||| According to my Polar 720i, that's about 1800 more feet than I
||| normally do on 65 miles. Well, the ride as going great. Finally
||| we got to this one longish climb...some guy came past me....I
||| decided to follow....I finally pasted him back....HR hit 173 (my
||| theoretical max) and stayed there a while...I was huffing and
||| puffing...only going about 5 mph or so...but I got that hill. My
||| buddy who was with me at the beginning said I was out of sight by
||| the time he got to the top of that hill. He must weigh some 60 lbs
||| less than me.
|||
||| Well, the next time a major hill came...I started having cramps in
||| my left quad...the muscle to the left of the knee cap (inner front
||| thigh)...got off and massaged it for a bit...it felt better. Went
||| on...another hill...this time it started locking up. Got off...I
||| couldn't bend my leg....it was stuck straight....that muscle as
||| hard as a rock...it took about 3 minutes before it relaxed. That
||| was at 46 miles. I rode to 50 miles (3400ft of ascent) where the
||| next rest stop was. I got in the sag wagon. Dammit.
|||
||| I must learn to respect the climb. I must find some better climbing
||| material, too.
|||
|||
||
|| Hi Roger,
||
|| I do the Lance Dance, too. I don't necessarily do that much of it
|| out of the saddle, but I've worked on my aerobic ability to spin the
|| smaller gears. That keeps me in the game on the longer climbs. It
|| also saves your legs when you're doing longer rides.

I was in the smallest gear! Pedal pretty fast, really, even though I don't
recall the cadence.

||
|| So how was Tigerville?

Lovely. Absolutely lovely. I was quite disappointed I didn't complete such
a ride ride on such a beautiful day with such lovely scenery.

Sorry I didn't make it up there. Who woulda
|| thought they could move the date from October to early August and
|| still have the same Fall weather?

I was all set to be unhappy about them moving the date, but they apparently
put in a special order for fantastic weather.

I just wasn't up for 4 hours of
|| driving to do a 3 hour ride. I did 82 miles ... half of that solo
|| and half with an old training buddy from Anderson. What a glorious
|| morning!
||

Wow. This would have been a cakewake for you.

|| Sorry to hear that you ended up in the sag wagon. Work on using
|| small gears on those hills. When you mash the big gears, you work
|| your muscles harder and they give out sooner.

I've got a lot of stuff to work on, it would seem! 🙂

||
|| We'll talk more about this.
||

Yes, let's do, as I need some work!

On Sat, 7 Aug 2004 17:34:50 -0400, Roger Zoul <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

I was mashing but I was in the lower gear on the bike. I didn't stand,
though. I was already at my limit, so there wouldn't have been much
point
to standing.

|| Doing the 'Lance Dance' gets me up the hills and saves my legs for
|| the straight stuff while getting my heart going a little faster.

I'm not sure what the "Lance Dance" is, sadly.

You didn't watch the tour? One of the commentators called it when he got
out of the saddle and creamed the competition going up a hill.
Standing and rocking the bike to add arm power and making it look easy.
Bill Baka
Going back to observer mode, dull day.

--
Using M2, Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/

I think you got sucked into trying something beyond your range of expertise,
stayed at it for too long, and paid the price for the lesson. I almost had
this happen to me today. A couple went by at 24 mph and I jumped on their
tails. Funny thing, though, I could get no closer than a bike's length
behind them. Of course, I kept trying harder and harder while they looked
as if they were pedaling easily (and having a chat at the same time). I was
killing myself trying to keep close on their rear wheels when I finally came
to my senses and realized that I am not "there" yet. Maybe I will be next
time, but today, it was slightly beyond my abilities. I was so close that I
wanted desperately to keep trying, so I know the feeling you had. I finally
had to go back into my comfort mode at about 18 mph and think about that
lesson.

On the other hand, you probably learned some things that will help you next
time. No experience is worthless, after all.

Pat in TX

Bill Baka said:

On Sat, 7 Aug 2004 17:34:50 -0400, Roger Zoul <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

I was mashing but I was in the lower gear on the bike. I didn't stand,
though. I was already at my limit, so there wouldn't have been much
point
to standing.

|| Doing the 'Lance Dance' gets me up the hills and saves my legs for
|| the straight stuff while getting my heart going a little faster.

I'm not sure what the "Lance Dance" is, sadly.

You didn't watch the tour? One of the commentators called it when he got
out of the saddle and creamed the competition going up a hill.
Standing and rocking the bike to add arm power and making it look easy.

I've long wondered what rocking back and forth does. Explanation
please?

--
Cheers, Bev
===================================================
Red ship crashes into blue ship - sailors marooned.

Quoted message said:

I've long wondered what rocking back and forth does. Explanation
please?

--
Cheers, Bev

Go back to robbing the wishing well, you're way too old to learn at this point.

Fx199 said:

Quoted message said:

I've long wondered what rocking back and forth does. Explanation
please?

Go back to robbing the wishing well, you're way too old to learn at this point.

Did somebody once tell you that you were clever? Did she owe you
money?

--
Cheers,
Bev
------------------------------------------------------
"Give me all your brains or I'll blow your money out!"
--Anonymous Unsuccessful Bank Robber

The Real Bev said:

I've long wondered what rocking back and forth does. Explanation
please?

By standing, you add a good amount of body weight to the downstroke.
By 'pulling the handlebar up' on the same side, you can also use the
arm and shoulder to help push the leg down.

But all this downward force on one side of the bike wouldn't work if
you didn't tilt the bike in the opposite direction. Reverse and
repeat, and the bike goes rocking back and forth.

Roger Zoul wrote:

<snip tale of massive cramp>

Roger,

Water! That's all you needed there man. Of course by the time you got the cramp
it was too late. You need to drink more water, before, after, during the ride.

Robert

R15757 wrote:
|| Roger Zoul wrote:
||
|| <snip tale of massive cramp>
||
|| Roger,
||
|| Water! That's all you needed there man. Of course by the time you
|| got the cramp it was too late. You need to drink more water, before,
|| after, during the ride.
||
|| Robert

Perhaps. I didn't feel overly thirsty and I had drank before the ride and
at the 15-mile point too. But who knows if I had enough. Interesting,
when I got back to the start inthe sag wagon I noticed that I had even
worked up my usual sweat -- I'm usually sweating down the front so badly
that I look like someone spilled a lot of water on my belly. I think
drinking more it something to try....

"Roger Zoul" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I went on a metric century today with about 3700+ feet of climbing.
According to my Polar 720i, that's about 1800 more feet than I normally do
on 65 miles. Well, the ride as going great. Finally we got to this one
longish climb...some guy came past me....I decided to follow....I finally
pasted him back....HR hit 173 (my theoretical max) and stayed there a
while...I was huffing and puffing...only going about 5 mph or so...but I got
that hill.

Quoted message said:

Well, the next time a major hill came...I started having cramps in my left
quad...

Quoted message said:

I rode to 50 miles (3400ft of
ascent) where the next rest stop was. I got in the sag wagon. Dammit.

I must learn to respect the climb. I must find some better climbing
material, too.

Pacing is everything on long rides. Cramps are a sign of deep muscle fatigue,
you just pushed them too far. When you're asking more from your muscles than
you have accustomed them to, you've got to pace it very carefully. You want to
keep peak efforts as low as possible, I think of it as the "no burn" rule, try
to avoid any effort that results in muscle burn, as that is accumulating
fatigue, which will lead to early cramping. Charging on a long climb was the
very last thing you should have done if you wanted to finish that ride.

You can continue to ride with cramping, I did the last 75 of a 125 miler that
way a few years back. Frequent stretches and massaging the legs (hard when
hands start cramping, too), perhaps walking some hills, will get you home. I
wouldn't do it unless absolutely necessary though, just too unpleasant.

"Dan Daniel" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

The Real Bev said:

I've long wondered what rocking back and forth does. Explanation
please?

By standing, you add a good amount of body weight to the downstroke.
By 'pulling the handlebar up' on the same side, you can also use the
arm and shoulder to help push the leg down.

This really only helps with sprinting.

Quoted message said:

But all this downward force on one side of the bike wouldn't work if
you didn't tilt the bike in the opposite direction. Reverse and
repeat, and the bike goes rocking back and forth.

Rocking a bike is really hard on the wheels, and not really necessary.

Peter Cole said:

"Dan Daniel" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

The Real Bev said:

I've long wondered what rocking back and forth does. Explanation
please?

By standing, you add a good amount of body weight to the downstroke.
By 'pulling the handlebar up' on the same side, you can also use the
arm and shoulder to help push the leg down.

This really only helps with sprinting.

Well, no matter what the effort, you will be doing this with the arms
to some extent. I've found it helps to do it deliberatley at times.
Maybe if only to take my mind off the pain in my legs? 🙂

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

But all this downward force on one side of the bike wouldn't work if
you didn't tilt the bike in the opposite direction. Reverse and
repeat, and the bike goes rocking back and forth.

Rocking a bike is really hard on the wheels, and not really necessary.

Again like the arm thing, rocking will happen. I didn't mean to imply
that someone should deliberately rock the bike hard in the opposite
direction. A silly waste of motion, and as you say hard on wheels.

Dan Daniel said:

Peter Cole said:

"Dan Daniel" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

On Sat, 07 Aug 2004 19:46:45 -0700, The Real Bev
<[email hidden]> wrote:

>
>I've long wondered what rocking back and forth does. Explanation
>please?

By standing, you add a good amount of body weight to the downstroke.
By 'pulling the handlebar up' on the same side, you can also use the
arm and shoulder to help push the leg down.

This really only helps with sprinting.

Well, no matter what the effort, you will be doing this with the arms
to some extent. I've found it helps to do it deliberatley at times.
Maybe if only to take my mind off the pain in my legs? 🙂

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

But all this downward force on one side of the bike wouldn't work if
you didn't tilt the bike in the opposite direction. Reverse and
repeat, and the bike goes rocking back and forth.

Rocking a bike is really hard on the wheels, and not really necessary.

Again like the arm thing, rocking will happen. I didn't mean to imply
that someone should deliberately rock the bike hard in the opposite
direction. A silly waste of motion, and as you say hard on wheels.

I have found it just happens, especially when attacking a serious hill.
Not too much on sprints, just hills for me. LA does it sometimes, not
always, so it may just be the person and the circumstances.
Bill Baka

--
Using M2, Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/

Quoted message said:

Subject: Re: I blew it!
From: The Real Bev [email hidden]
Date: 8/8/2004 12:51 AM US Eastern Standard Time
Message-id: <[email hidden]>

Fx199 said:

Quoted message said:

I've long wondered what rocking back and forth does. Explanation
please?

Go back to robbing the wishing well, you're way too old to learn at this

point.

Did somebody once tell you that you were clever? Did she owe you
money?

No, actually I buy and sell people like you based only on my cleverness.
Sorry to tell you this this, but I'm rich, based only on my smart
mouth.(writing)
Be happy with what you have anyway.
I have to screen my calls because of the "her(s)" you mentioned.
Bye bye spiderweb-crotch.

(Fx199) said:

Bye bye spiderweb-crotch.

I miss a couple weeks of r.b.m. messages, and this is what I come
back to see?

I guess I haven't missed much. <G>
--
Rick Onanian

Quoted message said:

I've long wondered what rocking back and forth does. Explanation

Quoted message said:

please?

Quoted message said:

By standing, you add a good amount of body weight to the downstroke.
By 'pulling the handlebar up' on the same side, you can also use the
arm and shoulder to help push the leg down.

Quoted message said:

But all this downward force on one side of the bike wouldn't work if
you didn't tilt the bike in the opposite direction. Reverse and
repeat, and the bike goes rocking back and forth.

Good explanation.

I have found that on very steep hills, I can get out of the saddle and my pedal
will not budge and I have to rock the bike and use my upper body to turn over
the pedals. Now I am talking about very steep (right around 20%).

I really do not keep that sort of thing up for very long. The pros seem to do
it for miles. Of course, it is their living otherwise they wouldn't be pros
now would they?