Brompton cycles

On Wed, 16 Jun 2004 14:54:27 +0100, Bob Downie

bob_news@downie-geo#n0spam#.co.uk said:

I have been told that Bromptons are good folding machines
(i.e. they really fold) and are reasonable to ride. Anyone
have any thoughts e.g.

ride quality?

Responsive or twitchy depending on whether you like them or
not. Small wheels take a little while to get used to if you
are used to 700 and 26" wheels. I find the ride very smooth,
there is a little built-in suspension, and with the right
tyres fairly fast.

Quoted message said:

foldability?

Excellent. Fast and small.

Quoted message said:

will they fit on an aeroplane?

Depends on the size of the aeroplane. Boom boom!

Quoted message said:

which model?

Get an L or a T rather than a C. Get the T if you want to
carry stuff on a rack and need dynamo lighting. Alternative
get an L and fit a front luggage holder and then upgrade the
front wheel to the new SON hub dynamo. You then have the
option of 3 gears or 6 and of standard or lower gearing.
I've not cycled in London though so I'll defer advice to
someone else.

Quoted message said:

prices?

Variable. New from 300-600ish.

Quoted message said:

alternatives?

A lot these days but nothing to match the foldability.

Quoted message said:

Anyone know of a second-hand one for sale?

There are always half a dozen on ebay these days. There are
often bikes listed on the free ads at Velo Vision and some
bike shops (I bought mine through one of the York bike
shops online free ads). Campervan John will probably have
one for sale ;-)

Colin

Bob Downie:

Quoted message said:

ride quality? foldability? will they fit on an aeroplane? which model? prices? alternatives?

Prices are on www.bromptonbicycle.co.uk - and those are the prices you can expect to pay for a new bike because they don't allow dealers to sell them for less (according to my local Brompton dealer).

They hold their value well too so even the ones on ebay won't be cheap.

I love them. Unfortunately, I don't *need* one enough at the moment to be able to justify the expense. Otherwise I'd go straight for the T6.

d.

very practical for the last few miles of a commute and you
won't ruin your clothes, but I'd have a full sized any day.
Can't do the small wheels.

Beware the thieves though. Congestion charging has made them
hot property. We lost one from outside the police station at
Waterloo Station. I understand that there is a man on the
Commercial road who fences the stolen items but I was
dissuaded from discussing the matter with him by my
girlfriend.

*sighs*

======
"Bob Downie" <bob_news@downie-geo#n0spam#.co.uk> wrote in
message news:nzR62lDTEF0AFwN0@downie-
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Quoted message said:

Anyone here have any opinions on Brompton cycles? I am
shortly to find myself spending most of my summer in
London (commuting home at weekends) and am distraught at
the thought of not having my cycle to hand.

I have been told that Bromptons are good folding machines
(i.e. they really fold) and are reasonable to ride. Anyone
have any thoughts e.g.

ride quality? foldability? will they fit on an aeroplane?
which model? prices? alternatives?

Anyone know of a second-hand one for sale?

Thanks
--
Bob Downie bob@downie-geo#n0spam#.co.uk Remove #n0spam# to
reply directly

Colin Blackburn said:

On Wed, 16 Jun 2004 14:54:27 +0100, Bob Downie <bob_news@downie-
geo#n0spam#.co.uk> wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

ride quality?

Quoted message said:

Responsive or twitchy depending on whether you like them
or not. Small wheels take a little while to get used to if
you are used to 700 and 26" wheels. I find the ride very
smooth, there is a little built-in suspension, and with
the right tyres fairly fast.

I don't find it twitchy at all, maybe I've just got used to
it. Lent it to a pal back in January and she said she found
it twitchy right after starting, but by the time we'd got to
the end of the station car park she pronounced it fine,
having "dialled in" by then.

The ride position is quite upright, which can be a bit odd
if you're used to drops but again it doesn't take long to
get used to.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

foldability?

Excellent. Fast and small.

Indeed. I've yet to see anything else that comes too close
to either the speed or compactness of the Brom fold (and the
unfold is just as quick and easy).

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

will they fit on an aeroplane?

Depends on the size of the aeroplane. Boom boom!

The folded package is just under 2' square by 1' deep, so it
won't go under the seat in front or in the overhead lockers.
But there shouldn't be any problem getting them in the hold,
though they'll take a chunk out of your baggage allowance.
They're not the lightest folders out there, but OTOH they're
well built and will take a fair bit of punishment (mine's
been mountain biking a few times and lived to tell the
tale!). Depending on spec it's between 10.7 Kg and 12.9 Kg

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

which model?

Quoted message said:

Get an L or a T rather than a C. Get the T if you want to
carry stuff on a rack and need dynamo lighting.
Alternative get an L and fit a front luggage holder and
then upgrade the front wheel to the new SON hub dynamo.
You then have the option of 3 gears or 6 and of standard
or lower gearing. I've not cycled in London though so I'll
defer advice to someone else.

I agree with Colin that the C is a false economy, with
generally lower spec bits and no mudguards. Spending the
extra will mean longer until you replace bits and you get
substantially better tyres to start with.

IMHO the front pannier system is well worth considering for
any model of Brom: it really does work well. The rear rack
is too low for panniers, and since I tend to take luggage in
panniers I didn't really see the point. I have a SON dynohub
on mine for the front lamp. The new SON in narrow width that
will fit a Brom as-is is only in the prototype stage at
present, AIUI.

Mine is a 3 speed with the -18% gearing. Recommended if you
have big hills. I'd have the -12% in any case as the default
is a bit overgeared to my taste, but tastes vary. The 6
speed works well and makes the bike a better "do
everything", but it isn't necessary and is another thing to
go wrong and need maintaining. Since mine is primarily a
hack bike I didn't bother.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

alternatives?

A lot these days but nothing to match the foldability.

VeloVision #10 has a buyers' guide for folders. But if you
want a quick and compact fold first and foremost the Brom
still leads the pack. The Birdy is a better ride and has
options with all sorts of gearing for multiple uses, but
costs more and the fold isn't so good. If you want something
cheaper the Dahons are very good value for money but are
generally just fold in two jobs.

Quoted message said:

There are always half a dozen on ebay these days. There
are often bikes listed on the free ads at Velo Vision and
some bike shops

But they do hold their value well, so expect to pay a fair
bit in any case. Most I see for sale have the standard
gearing, so by the time I'd have faffed about getting
something lower I'd probably be just as well getting a new
one. Note that Mk 2 Broms have inferior brakes and are
missing various other minor tweaks, but that doesn't seem to
be accounted for in 2nd hand pricing.

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer Tel 44 1382 660111
ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital Fax 44 1382
640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK net
[email hidden] dundee.ac.uk~pjclinchOpen ↗

Will H said:

very practical for the last few miles of a commute and you
won't ruin your clothes, but I'd have a full sized any
day. Can't do the small wheels.

The small wheels do make it an object of ridicule to the
local yoof, but I still ride it faster than they can manage
because I have 100 psi tyres and they probably don't even
realise they can pump theirs up...

Unless you're going over major bumpage on a routine basis
the small wheels aren't really much of an issue IME. And for
occasional bumpage the rear suspension works pretty well and
the upright position takes the sting out of the wrists.

Quoted message said:

Beware the thieves though. Congestion charging has made
them hot property.

Though on the plus side, being able to fold them up and take
them in places (quicker than locking a bike outside) gives
you more security options.

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer Tel 44 1382 660111
ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital Fax 44 1382
640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK net
[email hidden] dundee.ac.uk~pjclinchOpen ↗

davek said:

Prices are on www.bromptonbicycle.co.uk - and those are
the prices you can expect to pay for a new bike because
they don't allow dealers to sell them for less (according
to my local Brompton dealer).

Also the case that since they could probably beat customers
off with a [censored] stick and /still/ sell the production,
there just isn't any real sense in people discounting them.

Quoted message said:

I love them. Unfortunately, I don't *need* one enough at
the moment to be able to justify the expense.

I never needed one until I had one. Now it's practically
indispensable.

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer Tel 44 1382 660111
ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital Fax 44 1382
640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK net
[email hidden] dundee.ac.uk~pjclinchOpen ↗

On Wed, 16 Jun 2004 15:34:52 +0100, Peter Clinch <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Colin Blackburn said:

Responsive or twitchy depending on whether you like them
or not. Small wheels take a little while to get used to
if you are used to 700 and 26" wheels. I find the ride
very smooth, there is a little built-in suspension, and
with the right tyres fairly fast.

I don't find it twitchy at all, maybe I've just got
used to it.

That's my point. I think a 5 minute ride may put some people
off, once you get a feel for it it is responsive!

Quoted message said:

I have a SON dynohub on mine for the front lamp. The new
SON in narrow width that will fit a Brom as-is is only in
the prototype stage at present, AIUI.

The latest issue of Velo Vision seemed to suggest a finished
product, my copy is at home so I can't check.

Colin

Peter Clinch:

Quoted message said:

Mine is a 3 speed with the -18% gearing. Recommended if you have big hills. I'd have the -12% in any case as the default is a bit overgeared to my taste, but tastes vary.

When I looked into this, I found that the standard 6-speed gearing gives very close to the same range as my road bike, albeit with larger gaps between gears, of course.

d.

On Wed, 16 Jun 2004 14:54:27 +0100 someone who may be Bob Downie
<bob_news@downie-geo#n0spam#.co.uk> wrote this:-

Quoted message said:

Anyone here have any opinions on Brompton cycles?

Google will bring up many opinions on these bikes.

atob.org.ukBuyers' Guide.htmlOpen ↗

--
David Hansen, Edinburgh | PGP email preferred-key number
F566DA0E I will always explain revoked keys, unless the UK
government prevents me using the RIP Act 2000.

Peter Clinch said:

Will H said:

very practical for the last few miles of a commute and
you won't ruin your clothes, but I'd have a full sized
any day. Can't do the small wheels.

The small wheels do make it an object of ridicule to the
local yoof

I get a lot of that here, but if you get the chance to stop
and fold it in front of them, the yobbery can turn to
admiration. Suddenly they are cool.

John B

Colin Blackburn said:

The latest issue of Velo Vision seemed to suggest a
finished product, my copy is at home so I can't check.

My inference was that it's at least not yet in the shops.
Whether it will be in time for Christmas is another matter.

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer Tel 44 1382 660111
ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital Fax 44 1382
640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK net
[email hidden] dundee.ac.uk~pjclinchOpen ↗

Thanks for the help folks.

Here's the killer question. If your kids were needing new
shoes would you still buy a T6 Brompton?
--
Bob Downie bob@downie-geo#n0spam#.co.uk Remove #n0spam# to
reply directly

Bob Downie bob_news@downie-geo#n0spam#.co.uk said:

Here's the killer question. If your kids were needing new
shoes would you still buy a T6 Brompton?

Yes, a Brompton would be very suitable for shoe shopping ;-)

Roos

On Wed, 16 Jun 2004 16:55:12 +0100, Bob Downie

bob_news@downie-geo#n0spam#.co.uk said:

Thanks for the help folks.

Here's the killer question. If your kids were needing new
shoes would you still buy a T6 Brompton?

Yes. Though as I have no kids so it's academic. Hell, if I
had 'em I'd send 'em up chimneys for a Brompton.

Colin

Bob Downie said:

Anyone here have any opinions on Brompton cycles? I am
shortly to find myself spending most of my summer in
London (commuting home at weekends) and am distraught at
the thought of not having my cycle to hand.

I have been told that Bromptons are good folding machines
(i.e. they really fold) and are reasonable to ride. Anyone
have any thoughts e.g.

ride quality? foldability? will they fit on an aeroplane?
which model? prices? alternatives?

Anyone know of a second-hand one for sale?

Thanks

Bromptons are ideal for London and you will find lots of
people riding them. I have never yet come across a place in
London that has objected to my taking in a folded B which,
given the risks of leaving a bike locked up outside, is
another strong point. You can take them on the train,
plane, underground and taxis. No need for a toolkit - if it
breaks/gets a puncture fold it hail a cab and fix it at
home. The Birdy is a better ride but a worse fold and much
rarer in London but worth considering. The other is to get
a Steve Parry Brompton if you want something better. He
does all sorts of mods to them from disc brakes to more
gears at a price.

To go by plane, get a Airnimal Turtle suitcase which fits
the B inside nicely with the saddle removed.

For London the L3 plus front basket is fine unless you want
a rack for luggage and dynamo lights in which case get the
T3. The six gears are not really needed in London and you
can always to a deal to retrofit them for the price
difference if you change your mind when you buy the bike.

You can find them second hand in Loot but they hold their
value and are not a whole lot cheaper second hand than new.
Another reason for new is they have recently changed the
main hinge which gives a slightly longer wheelbase which
rides better. Check though that it is new hinge stock and
not old hinge stock you are buying

Tony

Peter Clinch said:

I never needed one until I had one. Now it's practically
indispensable.

Ditto here.

Tony

"Bob Downie" <bob_news@downie-geo#n0spam#.co.uk> wrote in message
news:bBdV6SHg1G0AFwZb@downie-geo%23n0spam%23.co.uk...

Quoted message said:

Thanks for the help folks.

Here's the killer question. If your kids were needing new
shoes would you still buy a T6 Brompton?
--
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reply directly

Using a Brompton in London compares very well cost-wise to
using public transport, even after investing in a front
carrier. Do the math for your fares - maybe with the
assumption that after a really tiring day or after-work
drinks you'll take the Brompton on public transport.

Ben said:

"Bob Downie" <bob_news@downie-geo#n0spam#.co.uk> wrote in
message news:bBdV6SHg1G0AFwZb@downie-
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Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Here's the killer question. If your kids were needing new
shoes would you still buy a T6 Brompton?

Since I bought an L3 by choice and chose not to fit the
retrofit 6 (despite having the money in my pocket) then, no,
I wouldn't. But they could get their feet squeezed for a
while and I'd let them play on the L3...

Quoted message said:

Using a Brompton in London compares very well cost-wise to
using public transport, even after investing in a front
carrier. Do the math for your fares - maybe with the
assumption that after a really tiring day or after-work
drinks you'll take the Brompton on public transport.

My next door neighbour was quite impressed with mine, and
bought one
(L3) himself. They run a single car for the family so it
wasn't replacing a second car or anything like that,
and Brian's commute is only a couple of miles, but he
reckons it paid for itself outright within a year. So
since this is well past the year, their 3 girls have
more shoe possibilities opening up now!

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer Tel 44 1382 660111
ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital Fax 44 1382
640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK net
[email hidden] dundee.ac.uk~pjclinchOpen ↗

Bob Downie said:

Anyone here have any opinions on Brompton cycles?

<snip>

Hi Bob, fancy meeting you here. ;-)

Just thought I'd butt in with one observation that no-one
else has raised which is height (or rather, leg length).

As you know I'm a short [censored] and I find the saddle height,
even at its absolute maximum (and then some), just adequate.
Unless you go for the extended seat post, I thing you'd find
the saddle height too low. The downside to the extended seat-
post is the the whole package isn't going to stow away quite
so neatly although looking at the website, I see that they
do a telescopic extention for the seat-post as well now.

Have a go on mine next time you down and see what you think.

Cheers.

Tim

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