boiling/poaching (?) fish

On Sat, 03 Apr 2004 16:17:00 GMT, [email hidden] Interjected.. :

Quoted message said:

Hi,

I recently talked to a lady from Norway, and she told me
about cooking fish in boiling water. She lets the water
come to a boil, puts the fish in and it will stop boiling,
lets it come back to a boil again, then turns it off and
lets it sit for a bit. Is that about all there is to it?
How to decide how long to let it sit in the water after
the heat is turned off?

Thanks for any advice or suggestions! David

This method does work. I do prefer steaming to it however,
unless you want to impart some stronger flavors to the
fish. Like spices and lemon and such. Then, you'd flavor
the water.

This is also the method to make the best chicken. Boil the
water, add a whole chicken, then bring it back to boil.
Turn off heat, cover well and let it sit 2 whole hours.

In 2 hours you will have the juiciest fall off the bone
chicken you ever had. Let it cool, and use it for Chicken
salads and sandwiches. Slightly warmed over rice with
steamed vegetables. It is going to be gelatinous and
wonderful. It is worth to try at least once. The Chinese
had been doing this for centuries.

The fish would come out just fine as well. I'd not do this
to fatty fish like Salmon. I'd steam instead.

Steve

Buffering... _69%_ |||||||||||||||||||

I recently steamed some frozen fish filet with vinegar and
water. It tasted delicious, but some parts were mushy. Could
I have avoided this?

E. P.

Quoted message said:

Hi,

I recently talked to a lady from Norway, and she told me
about cooking fish in boiling water. She lets the water
come to a boil, puts the fish in and it will stop boiling,
lets it come back to a boil again, then turns it off and
lets it sit for a bit. Is that about all there is to it?
How to decide how long to let it sit in the water after
the heat is turned off?

Thanks for any advice or suggestions! David

I tend to put bigger fish in cold water, bring it up to the
boil, and turn the heat out. If you want it hot, 15-20
minutes for large trout. For a whole salmon, I tend to let
it simmer for a few minutes before turning the heat out. If
I want the fish cold, I let the fish cool in the liquid.

I like to add a bottle of dry white wine, an onion, and some
whole fresh herbs to the water.
--

Lady Catherine, Wardrobe Mistress of the Chocolate Buttons
diceyhome.free-online.co.ukdiceyhome.free-online.co.ukOpen ↗ Click on Kate's Pages
and explore!

It all said:

Hi,

I recently talked to a lady from Norway, and she told me
about cooking fish in boiling water. She lets the water
come to a boil, puts the fish in and it will stop boiling,
lets it come back to a boil again, then turns it off and
lets it sit for a bit. Is that about all there is to it?
How to decide how long to let it sit in the water after
the heat is turned off?

Thanks for any advice or suggestions! David

It all depends on the size of the fish your "boiling" a
whole sturgeon (or other large fish) can take several hours,
a fillet of sole a few minutes.

There are many recipes available for the poaching* of fish.
Sometimes they are poached in wine or stock rather than
water, but either way the poaching liquid is usually
reserved and used to make a sauce with or as the basis for a
fish soup or stew.

If you had in mind a particular cut of fish it would be
easier to give more precise instructions.

*"Boiled" fish should be a manner of speaking and not of
cooking, since fish ought never to be actually boiled, but
poached. Highly seasoned water, known in culinary parlance
as court bouillon, should be allowed to boil 15-20 minutes,
and the fish should be laid in and cooked in the very gently
simmering white wine court bouillon which is kept just below
the boiling point. Strained, this court bouillon makes the
best possible base for all fish sauces."
--
JL

Quoted message said:

Hi,

I recently talked to a lady from Norway, and she told me
about cooking fish in boiling water. She lets the water
come to a boil, puts the fish in and it will stop boiling,
lets it come back to a boil again, then turns it off and
lets it sit for a bit. Is that about all there is to it?
How to decide how long to let it sit in the water after
the heat is turned off?

Thanks for any advice or suggestions! David

I tend to put bigger fish in cold water, bring it up to the
boil, and turn the heat out. If you want it hot, 15-20
minutes for large trout. For a whole salmon, I tend to let
it simmer for a few minutes before turning the heat out. If
I want the fish cold, I let the fish cool in the liquid.

I like to add a bottle of dry white wine, an onion, and some
whole fresh herbs to the water.
--

Lady Catherine, Wardrobe Mistress of the Chocolate Buttons
diceyhome.free-online.co.ukdiceyhome.free-online.co.ukOpen ↗ Click on Kate's Pages
and explore!

Kate said:

I tend to put bigger fish in cold water, bring it up to
the boil, and turn the heat out. If you want it hot, 15-
20 minutes for large trout. For a whole salmon, I tend
to let it simmer for a few minutes before turning the
heat out. If I want the fish cold, I let the fish cool
in the liquid.

I like to add a bottle of dry white wine, an onion, and
some whole fresh herbs to the water.

For Christmas Eve last year, I poached a very large hunk of
sea bass. This was the first time I'd poached a fish, and I
followed Alton Brown's advice: Use an electric skillet,
because it will regulate the temperature a lot better than
poaching on the stovetop. Keep the poaching liquid at the
exact temperature that you want the fish to be when it's
done cooking (140-145F). That way, the fish CAN'T get
overcooked.

The poaching liquid contained water, onions, ketjap manis,
and lemons (I halved the lemons, squeezed the juice into the
pan, and then put the squeezed halves into the liquid so
some of the oils from the rind could join the party). It was
perfect. (Thanks, AB!)

Bob

I've had poached fish a few times. I think the texture is
completely uninteresting and the flavor is bland. I much
prefer fish grilled, sauted, broiled, roasted, fried, in
chowder or gumbo or cioppino, or raw at the sushi bar.

--
------------------------------------------------------------
----------------
----
Louis Cohen Living la vida loca at N37° 43' 7.9" W122° 8'
42.8"

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
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Quoted message said:

Hi,

I recently talked to a lady from Norway, and she told me
about cooking fish in boiling water. She lets the water
come to a boil, puts the fish in and it will stop boiling,
lets it come back to a boil again, then turns it off and
lets it sit for a bit. Is that about all there is to it?
How to decide how long to let it sit in the water after
the heat is turned off?

Thanks for any advice or suggestions! David

Louis Cohen said:

I've had poached fish a few times. I think the texture is
completely uninteresting and the flavor is bland. I much
prefer fish grilled, sauted, broiled, roasted, fried, in
chowder or gumbo or cioppino, or raw at the sushi bar.

I poached some salmon that had been forgotten in the
freezer too long. I skinned it while it was still mostly
frozen and noticed a fishy odor. To get rid it, I I washed
it in white vinegar, then rinsed it. The poaching broth
included celery and onion, as well as dill and garlic.
After removing and flaking the salmon, I thickened the
broth with an oat roux. All of it together as a sauce over
ziti made a supper to remember.

Jerry
--
Engineering is the art of making what you want from things
you can get. ¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯-
¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯

Quoted message said:

Louis Cohen said:

I've had poached fish a few times. I think the texture is
completely uninteresting and the flavor is bland. I much
prefer fish grilled, sauted, broiled, roasted, fried, in
chowder or gumbo or cioppino, or raw at the sushi bar.

Poaching fish is merely just another method of cooking fish.
How you serve it is another entirely different matter.

Consider making ribs. How many people will think the
best way to fix them is to, first not marinade, wet or
dry, the ribs, nor finish them off with sauce? Just eat
them completely plain. Most would not prefer them
prepared that way.

The same is said for poaching fish. Poaching is actually the
best vehicle to showcase sauces that are served with the
fish. If you make a special sauce, grilling or baking may
not show off the sauce in its best light.

Here are some good examples:

* Exported from MasterCook *

POACHED SALMON FILLETS W WATERCRESS
MAYONNAISE

Recipe By : Bon Appétit,August 2002 Serving Size : 6
Preparation Time :0:00 Categories : Dinner Fish Main
Dish Seafood

Amount Measure Ingredient -- Preparation Method --------
------------ --------------------------------
3/4 cup mayonnaise
4/2 cup finely chopped watercress leaves 1
tablespoon coarse-grained Dijon mustard 1 teaspoon
fresh lemon juice
5/3 cup water
6/3 cup dry white wine 1 shallot -- thinly sliced 4
fresh parsley sprigs 1 fresh thyme sprig 6 6 ounce
center-cut salmon fillets with skin

Mix first 4 ingredients in small bowl to blend; season to
taste with salt and pepper.

Combine 1/3 cup water, wine, shallot, parsley, and thyme in
large skillet. Place salmon fillets, skin side down, in
skillet; sprinkle with salt and pepper. Cover skillet
tightly and simmer over medium-low heat until salmon is
barely opaque in center, about 10 minutes. Remove from heat;
let stand, covered, 5 minutes. Transfer salmon to platter;
discard wine mixture. Cover salmon with plastic wrap and
chill until cold, at least 4 hours. (Watercress mayonnaise
and salmon can be made 1 day ahead. Cover separately and
keep chilled.)

Place 1 salmon fillet on each of 6 plates. Serve with
watercress mayonnaise.

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

NOTES : An elegant, portable entrée. Baby greens with
vinaigrette would round out the menu nicely. What to drink:
A lightly oaked Chardonnay.

* Exported from MasterCook *

POACHED SALMON IN A SORREL SAUCE

Recipe By : Rick Moonen, Food & Wine Magazine Serving Size
: 4 Preparation Time :0:00 Categories : Dinner Fish Main
Dish Seafood

Amount Measure Ingredient -- Preparation Method --------
------------ -------------------------------- 2 cups
clam juice 2 cups dry white wine 1 large shallot --
chopped 10 parsley stems 2 fresh thyme sprigs 1 small
bay leaf 1 1/2 tablespoons unsalted butter 2 tablespoons
all-purpose flour
1/2 cup heavy cream Court Bouillon 4 6 ounce skinless
salmon fillets 1 cup firmly packed finely shredded
fresh sorrel leaves (about 3 ounces) Kosher salt
Freshly ground white pepper Fresh lemon juice
(optional)

2. In a medium nonreactive saucepan, combine the clam juice,
wine, shallot, parsley stems, thyme sprigs, bay leaf and
1 cup of water. Boil over high heat until reduced to 2
cups, about 25 minutes. Strain the reduction into a bowl.

3. Wipe out the pan. Add 1 tablespoon of the butter and melt
over low heat. Stir in the flour to make a roux and cook,
stirring, for 2 minutes. Remove from the heat and let the
roux cool for 5 minutes.

4. Set the saucepan over moderate heat and gradually whisk
the reduction into the roux to make a smooth sauce. Bring
to a boil, whisking constantly. Reduce the heat to very
low and simmer the sauce gently, whisking often, until no
floury taste remains, about 10 minutes. Stir in the cream
and simmer for 5 minutes longer. Remove from the heat.
(MAKE AHEAD: The sauce can stand at room temperature for
up to 1 hour. Reheat gently before proceeding.)

5. Bring the Court Bouillon to a simmer. Add the salmon
fillets and adjust the heat so that the liquid is barely
simmering. Poach the salmon until just cooked through,
about 6 minutes, depending on the thickness of the fish.

6. Meanwhile, bring the sauce to a simmer over moderate
heat. Remove the pan from the heat and whisk in the
remaining 1/2 tablespoon of butter. Stir in the sorrel to
wilt it and season the sauce with salt, white pepper and
lemon juice, if using. If the sauce seems thick, thin it
with a little of the Court Bouillon; the sauce should
have the consistency of light cream.

7. Using a slotted spoon or spatula, remove the salmon from
the poaching liquid and drain briefly on paper towels.
Set the salmon on warmed plates and spoon the sorrel
sauce on top. Serve immediately.

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

NOTES : Be sure to add the sorrel to the sauce shortly
before serving--its lovely green color fades quickly. Serve
this elegant dish with boiled or steamed new potatoes.

--
Alan

"If you reject the food, ignore the customs, fear the relig-
ion, and avoid the people, you might better stay home."
-- James Michener

Bob said:

Kate said:

I tend to put bigger fish in cold water, bring it up to
the boil, and turn the heat out. If you want it hot, 15-
20 minutes for large trout. For a whole salmon, I tend
to let it simmer for a few minutes before turning the
heat out. If I want the fish cold, I let the fish cool
in the liquid.

I like to add a bottle of dry white wine, an onion, and
some whole fresh herbs to the water.

For Christmas Eve last year, I poached a very large hunk
of sea bass. This was the first time I'd poached a fish,
and I followed Alton Brown's advice: Use an electric
skillet, because it will regulate the temperature a lot
better than poaching on the stovetop. Keep the poaching
liquid at the exact temperature that you want the fish to
be when it's done cooking (140-145F). That way, the fish
CAN'T get overcooked.

The poaching liquid contained water, onions, ketjap manis,
and lemons (I halved the lemons, squeezed the juice into
the pan, and then put the squeezed halves into the liquid
so some of the oils from the rind could join the party).
It was perfect. (Thanks, AB!)

Bob

Oh, yes! I'd forgotten the lemons! I usually add those to.
Hack a couple into quarters, squeeze them hard into the
kettle, and toss them in along the fish. I like to use fresh
herbs out of the garden when I can.

I don't own an electric skillet (I'd have no use for one).
I've never had a problem doing it on the stove top in a
traditional fish kettle. I've never seen an electric skillet
that would take a whole 12 lb salmon, either, but the fish
kettle does this several times a year. Much more use to me
than the skillet! I've also used fish kettles for boiling a
herd of christmas puddings, a flock haggises, and a 20" jam
roly-poly.
--

Lady Catherine, Wardrobe Mistress of the Chocolate Buttons
diceyhome.free-online.co.ukdiceyhome.free-online.co.ukOpen ↗ Click on Kate's Pages
and explore!

alzelt said:

Quoted message said:

Louis Cohen said:

I've had poached fish a few times. I think the texture
is completely uninteresting and the flavor is bland. I
much prefer fish grilled, sauted, broiled, roasted,
fried, in chowder or gumbo or cioppino, or raw at the
sushi bar.

Quoted message said:

The same is said for poaching fish. Poaching is actually
the best vehicle to showcase sauces that are served with
the fish. If you make a special sauce, grilling or baking
may not show off the sauce in its best light.

Right. But turning a dish into a 'sauce vehicle' is hardly a
good thing. I tend to agree with Louis here.

--
Reg email: RegForte (at) (that free MS email service) (dot)
com

In article <[email hidden]>,

Reg said:

alzelt said:

Quoted message said:

Louis Cohen wrote:

> I've had poached fish a few times. I think the texture
> is completely uninteresting and the flavor is bland. I
> much prefer fish grilled, sauted, broiled, roasted,
> fried, in chowder or gumbo or cioppino, or raw at the
> sushi bar.

Quoted message said:

The same is said for poaching fish. Poaching is actually
the best vehicle to showcase sauces that are served with
the fish. If you make a special sauce, grilling or
baking may not show off the sauce in its best light.

Right. But turning a dish into a 'sauce vehicle' is hardly
a good thing. I tend to agree with Louis here.

While for most fish, I agree also, but with some fish it
does not matter how it's cooked, it's still going to be
bland. <G> Whiting is one, and flounder is another IMHO. I
like to poach both of those and serve with copious sauces,
or just use them for chowder.

K.

--
Sprout the Mung Bean to reply...

"There are many intelligent species in the universe, and
they are all owned by cats! -- Asimov

Quoted message said:

,,<Cat's Haven Hobby Farm>,,<Katraatcenturyteldotnet>,,<

cgi6.ebay.comeBayISAPI.dllOpen ↗
&include=0&userid=katra

Katra said:

In article
<[email hidden]>, Reg

Quoted message said:

alzelt said:

>Louis Cohen wrote:
>
>
>>I've had poached fish a few times. I think the texture
>>is completely uninteresting and the flavor is bland. I
>>much prefer fish grilled, sauted, broiled, roasted,
>>fried, in chowder or gumbo or cioppino, or raw at the
>>sushi bar.

Quoted message said:

The same is said for poaching fish. Poaching is actually
the best vehicle to showcase sauces that are served with
the fish. If you make a special sauce, grilling or baking
may not show off the sauce in its best light.

Right. But turning a dish into a 'sauce vehicle' is hardly
a good thing. I tend to agree with Louis here.

While for most fish, I agree also, but with some fish it
does not matter how it's cooked, it's still going to be
bland. <G> Whiting is one, and flounder is another IMHO. I
like to poach both of those and serve with copious sauces,
or just use them for chowder.

K.

Flounder is great cooked right in a tomato sauce in the
oven. You can call it as poaching, baking, or something
else; no one ever told me.

I set fillets in a baking dish or, for individual portions,
in au gratin dishes. A layer of sauce on the bottom, the
fish, and sauce to cover. Depending on the rest of the
meal, various toppings. My favorite is a bland cheese;
pieces of mozzarella make flounder Parmesan. Ziti in the
side with a little more of the same sauce -- there will be
sauce to spare from the fish -- and a salad make a quick
and tasty supper.

Jerry
--
Engineering is the art of making what you want from things
you can get. ¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯-
¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯

In article <[email hidden]>,

Jerry Avins said:

Katra said:

In article
<[email hidden]>, Reg

Quoted message said:

alzelt wrote:

>
>>Louis Cohen wrote:
>>
>>
>>>I've had poached fish a few times. I think the
>>>texture is completely uninteresting and the flavor is
>>>bland. I much prefer fish grilled, sauted, broiled,
>>>roasted, fried, in chowder or gumbo or cioppino, or
>>>raw at the sushi bar.

>The same is said for poaching fish. Poaching is
>actually the best vehicle to showcase sauces that are
>served with the fish. If you make a special sauce,
>grilling or baking may not show off the sauce in its
>best light.

Right. But turning a dish into a 'sauce vehicle' is
hardly a good thing. I tend to agree with Louis here.

While for most fish, I agree also, but with some fish it
does not matter how it's cooked, it's still going to be
bland. <G> Whiting is one, and flounder is another IMHO.
I like to poach both of those and serve with copious
sauces, or just use them for chowder.

K.

Flounder is great cooked right in a tomato sauce in the
oven. You can call it as poaching, baking, or something
else; no one ever told me.

I'd probably call it "braising". ;-) Sounds good. I'll have
to try that. Tomato sauces do go well with some of the
milder fish.

Quoted message said:

I set fillets in a baking dish or, for individual
portions, in au gratin dishes. A layer of sauce on the
bottom, the fish, and sauce to cover. Depending on the
rest of the meal, various toppings. My favorite is a bland
cheese; pieces of mozzarella make flounder Parmesan. Ziti
in the side with a little more of the same sauce -- there
will be sauce to spare from the fish -- and a salad make a
quick and tasty supper.

Jerry

What? No lemon or dill? <G>

Personally, I like to bake fish a lot. I'll sprinkle the
inside of the fish liberally with lemom pepper (salt free)
and stuff it with thinly sliced lemons and chopped fresh
dill, and add some butter, then top the fish with the same.
Wrap the whole mess in foil and bake.

Salmon is especially good this way! Take the drippings
with the dill, lemon, butter and fish juice and reduce
slightly in a skillet and add your choice of thickeners to
make a sauce for the fish. I add some additional minced
dill to this.

K.

--
Sprout the Mung Bean to reply...

"There are many intelligent species in the universe, and
they are all owned by cats! -- Asimov

Quoted message said:

,,<Cat's Haven Hobby Farm>,,<Katraatcenturyteldotnet>,,<

cgi6.ebay.comeBayISAPI.dllOpen ↗
&include=0&userid=katra

Reg said:

alzelt said:

Quoted message said:

Louis Cohen wrote:

> I've had poached fish a few times. I think the texture
> is completely uninteresting and the flavor is bland. I
> much prefer fish grilled, sauted, broiled, roasted,
> fried, in chowder or gumbo or cioppino, or raw at the
> sushi bar.

Quoted message said:

The same is said for poaching fish. Poaching is actually
the best vehicle to showcase sauces that are served with
the fish. If you make a special sauce, grilling or baking
may not show off the sauce in its best light.

Right. But turning a dish into a 'sauce vehicle' is hardly
a good thing. I tend to agree with Louis here.

Guess you spend very little time in good French
restaurants. Many people count sauce as an ingredient, NOT
a condiment. There is a difference. And that is why poached
fish is very common.

I am not denouncing other methods of preparation. I grill
fish quite often, as I live in the Northwest. But, when I am
interested in a specific flavor and consistency, a sauced,
poached fish is great.
--
Alan

"If you reject the food, ignore the customs, fear the relig-
ion, and avoid the people, you might better stay home."
-- James Michener

alzelt said:

Reg wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Right. But turning a dish into a 'sauce vehicle' is
hardly a good thing. I tend to agree with Louis here.

Guess you spend very little time in good French
restaurants. Many people count sauce as an ingredient, NOT
a condiment. There is a difference. And that is why
poached fish is very common.

I do like sauces, and I do like them on fish sometimes. I
also find that misuse of sauce is a common way to cover up
cooking mistakes. I'm not against poaching fish, I just find
it the least interesting way of cooking it, and it makes
serving it with a sauce a requirement.

Quoted message said:

I am not denouncing other methods of preparation. I grill
fish quite often, as I live in the Northwest. But, when I
am interested in a specific flavor and consistency, a
sauced, poached fish is great.

Penmart's pathetic remarks notwithstanding, there's no
either/or issue when it comes to poaching and high heat
cooking. I frequently cook fish at a temp of 180 - 190 F
using dry heat, sometimes served with sauce, sometimes
not. It makes for excellent texture without the flavor
loss of poaching.

--
Reg email: RegForte (at) (that free MS email service) (dot)
com