Looking for MTB recommendations

I have ordered my VT2, and everything I have read about it
is great🙂 Aslso look at www.mtbr.com CS

"Boyd Speerschneider" <[email hidden]> wrote in
message "]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Hello,

Here's my situation. I've been a roadie (don't laugh) for
the past 10 years. I've ridden off-road a grand total of 3
times, but never with a decent bike and clipless pedals.
Its always been one or the other, but never both. Lately,
I've *really* wanted to hit some trails. I work at an LBS
and can purchase an MTB at about 25% below wholesale, but
my choices are limited to Giant, Santa Cruz, Marin, and
Ellsworth. Coming from a

road

Quoted message said:

background, I was inclined to buy a hardtail and maybe a
suspension seatpost. The other guys I've talked to at the
shop (all hard-core MTBers) have told me this would be a
mistake, even if I intend to race. They've suggested I buy
a full-suspension bike. FWIW, I'm 5'9" and about 145lbs.

So here are my choices and my impressions of them (in
alphabetical order):

Ellsworth - almost definately out of my price range
^^^^^^^^^ Id - "all-mountain" bike... pretty much an
indestructable work horse which can handle all but the
biggest drops and can also be built fairly light if one
wants to race.

Truth - a more race worthy version of Ellsworth's Instant
Center Tracking rear suspension also found on the Id.

Giant - a more economical choice ^^^^^ AC - All
Conditions, pretty heavy and plush. An "all-
mountain" bike.

NRS - No Resonance System - designed for cross
country racing.

Traditional

Quoted message said:

4-bar linkage rear suspension.

VT - Variable Travel - either 5.0 or 5.6 inches of rear
travel. Another "all-mountain" bike.

Marin - haven't really looked into them as I'm not all
that impressed with what I've seen in terms of quality of
materials.

Santa Cruz - pretty expensive also ^^^^^^^^^^

Blur - a very nice looking, light racing machine. Uses
virtual pivot

point

Quoted message said:

suspension (whatever that is).

Superlight - basically a lighter version of the blur.

I guess what I'm looking for is any suggestions, thoughts,
or recomendations.

FWIW, I'm leaning toward the NRS, but could be pursuaded
otherwise.

Thanks in advance,

- Boyd S.

Boyd Speerschneider said:

The other guys I've talked to at the shop (all hard-core
MTBers) have told me this would be a mistake, even if I
intend to race. They've suggested I buy a full-suspension
bike. FWIW, I'm 5'9" and about 145lbs.

You should say where you are and what sort of terrain you
plan on riding. If its very rocky, yes full-suspension is
nice. If its buff trails and long-extended climbs (as it is
here in Oregon), a light hartail is a plus. That doesn't
mean that people don't ride full-sussers here - I see them
all the time (mostly on the fireroads, oddly enough).

--
-BB- To reply to me, drop the attitude (from my e-mail
address, at least)

Boyd Speerschneider ran this through spell check:

Quoted message said:

Hello,

Here's my situation. I've been a roadie (don't laugh) for
the past 10 years. I've ridden off-road a grand total of 3
times, but never with a decent bike and clipless pedals.
Its always been one or the other, but never both. Lately,
I've *really* wanted to hit some trails. I work at an LBS
and can purchase an MTB at about 25% below wholesale, but
my choices are limited to Giant, Santa Cruz, Marin, and
Ellsworth. Coming from a road background, I was inclined
to buy a hardtail and maybe a suspension seatpost. The
other guys I've talked to at the shop (all hard-core
MTBers) have told me this would be a mistake, even if I
intend to race. They've suggested I buy a full-suspension
bike. FWIW, I'm 5'9" and about 145lbs.

couple of thoughts: you don't say what kind of trails you
will be on...or your budget

HT vs FS one school of thought is that you build up a better
skills base learning to MTB on a hardtail, becuase you learn
more about how to respond to what's going on with your bike
and the trail. With inexperienced MB-ers and FS, there's a
tendency to just let the bike take the hits, with out
learning the skills that go with it.

Racing on HT vs FS... don't even go there, that was most
likely the third to last flame fest here... ;-)

basic buying a MTB FAQ bbauer.gomen.orgnewbikeOpen ↗

tell your hardcore friend to read this:
teamsmack.orgride1.htmOpen ↗ remind them it's about
fun, not being hardcore.

welcome to the club, now go ride some dirt

Penny S

--
me and my bike:
www.specialtyoutdoors.com/penny/biking/biking.asp

Boyd Speerschneider said:

The other guys I've talked to at the shop (all hard-core
MTBers) have told me this would be a mistake, even if I
intend to race. They've suggested I buy a full-suspension
bike. FWIW, I'm 5'9" and about 145lbs.

Hmm, well seeing as you're in Tampa, I'd totally agree with
your bike shop buddies and suggest you get something with
loads of suspension to cope with all those huge mountains.

--
a.m-b FAQ: j-harris.netambfaq.htmOpen ↗

b.bmx FAQ: t-online.debmx faq.htmOpen ↗

Quoted message said:

Id - "all-mountain" bike... pretty much an indestructable
work horse which can handle all but the biggest drops and
can also be built fairly light if one wants to race.

Yes, but it gets very costly, as you will want the lightest
components. So, it will be a tad heavy. An excellent trail
bike but not fun to race.

Quoted message said:

Truth - a more race worthy version of Ellsworth's Instant
Center Tracking rear suspension also found on the Id.

A lovely frame: belongs to the creme de la creme league.
Though they say Ellsworth is sometimes as a company is not
too friendly to deal with.

Quoted message said:

Giant - a more economical choice ^^^^^ AC - All
Conditions, pretty heavy and plush. An "all-
mountain" bike.

NRS - No Resonance System - designed for cross
country racing.

Traditional

Quoted message said:

4-bar linkage rear suspension.

a Truth.

Quoted message said:

Blur - a very nice looking, light racing machine. Uses
virtual pivot

point

Quoted message said:

suspension (whatever that is).

More of a trail bike than a racing bike. Hyped up a lot
last year as a technological break through. The jury is
still out on that.

Quoted message said:

Superlight - basically a lighter version of the blur.

Quite different from the Blur, a classic racing machine, the
design has been the same for years, they refine it a little
bit every year. An interesting choice: easy maintenance.
People win XC races on them.

Quoted message said:

FWIW, I'm leaning toward the NRS, but could be pursuaded
otherwise.

The NRS are excellent, you get a lot for the money, and
people win races on them. The techically minded magazines
claim that NRS has a less active suspension than the FSR
on the Ellsworth: i.e., it locks up during hard breaking
or honking.

Check out mtbr.commtbr.comOpen ↗ there are lots of reviews.
The most interesting are those with bad critique.

Per lowdin.nulowdin.nuOpen ↗

Boyd Speerschneider said:

You might want to look at Titus as well, and I have been
impressed with Specialized new line-up.
--
Craig Brossman, Durango Colorado (remove ".nospam" to reply)

"Boyd Speerschneider" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Hello,

Here's my situation. I've been a roadie (don't laugh) for
the past 10 years. I've ridden off-road a grand total of 3
times, but never with a decent bike and clipless pedals.
Its always been one or the other, but never both.

Boyd, If you raced road, or can ride well with Cat 2's, then
you should have an aerobic advantage over friends which only
mountain bike, but will be at a huge technical skill
disadvantage for quite some time to come---best way to begin
"enjoying" the mountain biking right away, on technical
trails ( another poster said you were in Tampa, meaning
Alafia is nearby, and it is very cool and quite technical on
many of its trails) would be to go the "All Mountain" bike
route, with 5 or 6 inches of full suspension, which should
be using SPV on front and back to make best use out of your
roadie cadence potential. This bike will be heavier than the
hardtails your long time mountain biking buddies may be
riding, but it will get you through technical obstacles with
less need for finesse, and allow you to have fun
immediately. Your aerobic advantage should cover the extra
weight of the bike, and when you screw up and hit something
really hard, the all mountain bike should be tougher than
the 20 pound X-country alternative.

Down side of this advise for you is that you are a light
rider, so bike weight will be more of an issue to you than a
190 pound rider---but if you are going out to ride for fun,
I still think this is the best advise. If you are hell bent
to race, then the Santa Cruz Blur might be the better route.

Dan V

"Boyd Speerschneider" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Ellsworth - almost definately out of my price range
^^^^^^^^^ Id - "all-mountain" bike... pretty much an
indestructable work horse which can handle all but the
biggest drops and can also be built fairly light if one
wants to race.

petefagerlin.comouch f.jpgOpen ↗

Quoted message said:

Truth - a more race worthy version of Ellsworth's Instant
Center Tracking rear suspension also found on the Id.

Don't buy the ICT hype. They're four bar bikes, like many
others out there.

Also consider Ellsworth's very spotty customer service,
their "lifetime warranty" that is not a lifetime warranty
(their implementaion[charging customers for replacement
parts for frames with manufacturing defects] is actually
illegal) and the fact that Tony Ellsworth is lying sack of
[censored] and a poor excuse for a human being.

p e t e f a g e r l i n said:

"Boyd Speerschneider" <[email hidden]> wrote in
message "]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Ellsworth - almost definately out of my price range
^^^^^^^^^ Id - "all-mountain" bike... pretty much an
indestructable work horse which can handle all but the
biggest drops and can also be built fairly light if one
wants to race.

petefagerlin.comouch f.jpgOpen ↗

Quoted message said:

Truth - a more race worthy version of Ellsworth's Instant
Center Tracking rear suspension also found on the Id.

Don't buy the ICT hype. They're four bar bikes, like many
others out there.

Also consider Ellsworth's very spotty customer service,
their "lifetime warranty" that is not a lifetime warranty
(their implementaion[charging customers for replacement
parts for frames with manufacturing defects] is actually
illegal) and the fact that Tony Ellsworth is lying sack of
[censored] and a poor excuse for a human being.

Wow! Another Ellsworth down. I've now seen this plus two
frames cracked in half and all around the shock area.

Quoted message said:

You might want to look at Titus as well,

I second that, both me and my wife ride Titus, they are
wonderful to handle, and unlike Ellsworth they are very nice
to deal with.

Per lowdin.nulowdin.nuOpen ↗

Dan Volker said:

best way to begin "enjoying" the mountain biking right
away, on technical trails ( another poster said you were
in Tampa, meaning Alafia is nearby, and it is very cool
and quite technical on many of its trails) would be to go
the "All Mountain" bike route, with 5 or 6 inches of full
suspension,

You're so full of [censored]...

which should be

Quoted message said:

using SPV on front and back to make best use out of your
roadie cadence potential. This bike will be heavier than
the hardtails your long time mountain biking buddies may
be riding, but it will get you through technical obstacles
with less need for finesse, and allow you to have fun
immediately.

Man, I can't wait to trade in my hardtails and rigid bikes
so I can get a full suspension bike and start having fun.

Quoted message said:

Your aerobic advantage should cover the extra weight of
the bike, and when you screw up and hit something really
hard, the all mountain bike should be tougher than the 20
pound X-country alternative.

Pfft! Why is the alternative to FS a 20lb whippet bike? And
why would a FS necessarily last longer than a well-built
24lb hardtail?

--
a.m-b FAQ: j-harris.netambfaq.htmOpen ↗

b.bmx FAQ: t-online.debmx faq.htmOpen ↗

Dan Volker said:

best way to begin "enjoying" the mountain biking right away

Austin Powers strikes again.

Bill "One *MILLION* Dollars" S.

On Mon, 8 Mar 2004 10:02:10 -0500, "Dan Volker"
<[email hidden]> blathered:

Quoted message said:

best way to begin "enjoying" the mountain biking right
away, on technical trails would be to go the "All Mountain"
bike route, with 5 or 6 inches of full suspension

btinternet.comwormcan.gifOpen ↗

Damn! Wish someone had told me that 14 years ago, I knew I
was doing something wrong....

Pete

"bomba" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Dan Volker said:

best way to begin "enjoying" the mountain biking right
away, on technical trails ( another poster said you were
in Tampa, meaning Alafia is nearby, and it

is

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

very cool and quite technical on many of its trails)
would be to go the

"All

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Mountain" bike route, with 5 or 6 inches of full
suspension,

You're so full of [censored]...

First, bomba, if anyone here is full of [censored], its a
newsgroup poser like yourself, who enjoys hurling insults
over the net, that would have you toothless in real life.
Because I don't want to buy in to the ss cult, or your own
version of what is the ultimate in mountain biking, you
start humping my leg.

Quoted message said:

which should be

Quoted message said:

using SPV on front and back to make best use out of your
roadie cadence potential. This bike will be heavier than
the hardtails your long time mountain biking buddies may
be riding, but it will get you through

technical

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

obstacles with less need for finesse, and allow you to
have fun

immediately.

Quoted message said:

Man, I can't wait to trade in my hardtails and rigid bikes
so I can get a full suspension bike and start having fun.

Spoken like a moron who is incapable of giving good advice
to a "roadie" who wants to get in to mountain biking. Yeah,
why don't you convince him he'll have lots of fun riding
technical trails his first week on a rigid ss bike. I know a
lot of roadies, and I have seen how they take to mountain
biking on x-country bikes, versus the ones who have gotten
big travel bikes. Either you don't know any, or you care
more about having them see the world your way , than you do
about them enjoying their first year of mountain biking. If
they don't like their first few days or weeks, what is to
keep them even on their new mountain bike? Saddle them with
a rigid, ss piece of [censored], and it will almost guarantee they
won't enjoy the sport long enough to build skills--they'll
be back on the road bike instead.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Your aerobic advantage should cover the extra weight of
the bike, and

when

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

you screw up and hit something really hard, the all
mountain bike should

be

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

tougher than the 20 pound X-country alternative.

Pfft! Why is the alternative to FS a 20lb whippet bike?
And why would a FS necessarily last longer than a well-
built 24lb hardtail?

Most road riders expect a good bike to be a "light bike".
Going from a 15 pound bike on the road, to a 20 pound
mountain bike will seem to many of them as a big jump in
weight and frame strength. They would have to have "reasons"
to want a heavier bike---whether it is a 24 pound hard tail
or 30 pound all mountain full sus.

And I never said anything about the 24 pound hardtail not
lasting as long as the 30 pound "all mountain bike"--this is
just more of your jumping to the conclusions you enjoy
jumping to....

Dan V

bomba said:

Man, I can't wait to trade in my hardtails and rigid bikes
so I can get a full suspension bike and start having fun.

I think his point was to start off with full-suss, so the OP
wouldn't have to go to all that "bother" of developing
riding skills. I don't know where the assumption that the OP
was in Tampa came from anyway - maybe just from the comment
about "hard-core mountain bikers" (those are all in Florida,
right?). ;-)

--
-BB- To reply to me, drop the attitude (from my e-mail
address, at least)

"Per Löwdin" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

You might want to look at Titus as well,

I second that, both me and my wife ride Titus, they are
wonderful to

handle,

Quoted message said:

and unlike Ellsworth they are very nice to deal with.

Per lowdin.nulowdin.nuOpen ↗

I'll put in a third. Cracked the lower swing arm on my
Switchblade and took it in to Titus (ok, so I live in
Phoenix) and they told me to come back in a couple hours to
pick it back up. They even cleaned up the bike a little.

I wouldn't recommend the SB for racing, to boingy! Nice
free ride.

Gary

BB <[email hidden]> wrote in news:c2gvsj$1r7d0c$1@ID-
130844.news.uni-berlin.de:

Quoted message said:

You should say where you are and what sort of terrain you
plan on riding. If its very rocky, yes full-suspension is
nice. If its buff trails and long-extended climbs (as it
is here in Oregon), a light hartail is a plus. That
doesn't mean that people don't ride full-sussers here - I
see them all the time (mostly on the fireroads, oddly
enough).

Sorry I left that part out. I will be riding what most would
consider technical trails at Alifia State Park and such.
Lots of rocks, roots, trees, and steep, treacherous
climbs/descents.

- Boyd S.

Dan Volker ran this through spell check:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

You're so full of [censored]...

First, bomba, if anyone here is full of [censored], its a
newsgroup poser like yourself, who enjoys hurling insults
over the net, that would have you toothless in real life.
Because I don't want to buy in to the ss cult, or your own
version of what is the ultimate in mountain biking, you
start humping my leg.

since when are Hardtail and SS synonomous?

ps

"Penny S" <[email hidden]> wrote in
:"]news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

couple of thoughts: you don't say what kind of trails you
will be on...or your budget

As a beginner, I wouldn't consider myself a "trail
connoisseur". What I would consider technical others would
probably consider a piece of cake. I'll mostly be riding at
state parks and such that have trails specifically designed
and built by MTBers, ie. pretty technical. As for the other
part of your question, I'd like to keep it under $1500.

Quoted message said:

HT vs FS one school of thought is that you build up a
better skills base learning to MTB on a hardtail, becuase
you learn more about how to respond to what's going on
with your bike and the trail. With inexperienced MB-ers
and FS, there's a tendency to just let the bike take the
hits, with out learning the skills that go with it.

Good point. Then again, most MTBers I've talked to around
here who started with HTs have either sold them or are
trying to do so. I figured I might as well just skip that
step to cut my inevitable financial losses.

Quoted message said:

Racing on HT vs FS... don't even go there, that was most
likely the third to last flame fest here... ;-)

Sounds like the helmet wars over at rec.bicycles.racing 😉

Quoted message said:

basic buying a MTB FAQ bbauer.gomen.orgnewbikeOpen ↗

Thanks.

Quoted message said:

tell your hardcore friend to read this:
teamsmack.orgride1.htmOpen ↗ remind them it's about
fun, not being hardcore.

LMAO!!! Thanks for the link.

Quoted message said:

welcome to the club, now go ride some dirt

I did this morning on a borrowed bike (Giant VT) ... it was
a blast!!!

Quoted message said:

Penny S

Thanks for your help.

- Boyd S.