Does Martha Deserve it?

larry said:

Well she lied, cheated, stole and got caught.. so I guess
she deserves to go to JAIL. .. but some time in stripes
scares nearly everybody.

Laurence

I don't think they wear stripes anymore. The big question
is, does she look good in ORANGE? ;-)

re recent news articles; Ex-chairman Ovitz of Disney who got
a $120mil "severance package" after less than a year on the
job..... It's legal, but it's theft !

People who scam Federal income tax for billions (
collectively ) Feds then settle for "a dime on the dollar".
But if you or I were short by five bucks, they'd "take your
house" to make an example of you.

I guess we all have our sore spot. Martha acted on a tip
from her broker. ( who doesn't ? ) She acted on it, and
got caught

Like the scene in The Wizard of Oz..... "Pay no attention to
that man behind the drape "......

<rj>

larry said:

Well she lied, cheated, stole and got caught.. so I guess
she deserves to go to JAIL. I think they should fine the
#%&$ out of her and put her back to work to pay some big
taxes. But on the other hand those with plenty of money are
not very afraid of paying a fine.. big deal.. but some time
in stripes scares nearly everybody.

Laurence

<rj

larry said:

Well she lied, cheated, stole and got caught.. so I guess
she deserves to go to JAIL. I think they should fine the
#%&$ out of her and put her back to work to pay some big
taxes. But on the other hand those with plenty of money
are not very afraid of paying a fine.. big deal.. but some
time in stripes scares nearly everybody.

I like the system they have in Norway <?> where fines, even
for traffic violations, are based on income. A $100 speeding
ticket for one of the working poor is a hefty penalty, but
it means nothing to a millionaire.

larry said:

But on the other hand those with plenty of money are not
very afraid of paying a fine.

Of course not, because to her, a fine of a few thousand
dollars is pocket change. That same fine would ruin my
finances for years. Fines should be proportionate to the
person's net worth. Martha probably has a few hundred
million dollars worth of assets, so fine her half. Even to a
multi-millionare, half of her money is a huge blow.

At the same time, the same argument could be made about
Microsoft. I think the government wanted to fine them a few
million, when they have about $45 billion in the bank. They
have more money in the bank than most countries' GDP. Fine
them about $44 billion, and use it to repay part of the
national debt. Make them useful, same with Martha :-)

--
John Gaughan johngaughan.netjohngaughan.netOpen ↗
[email hidden]

larry said:

Well she lied, cheated, stole and got caught.. so I guess
she deserves to go to JAIL.

Why jail? Her's was a non-violent crime. Since it was
financial in nature, it would seem appropriate that the
punishment should be financial as well.

I think they should fine the #%&$ out of her and put her

Quoted message said:

back to work to pay some big taxes. But on the other hand
those with plenty of money are not very afraid of paying a
fine.. big deal..

Make the fine commensurate with both the amount of the
financial crime *plus* a penalty based on income.

Quoted message said:

but some time in stripes scares nearly everybody.

Prison isn't a deterrant. It never has been. People who
commit crimes do so with the belief that they're never
get *caught*.

--
Darryl L. Pierce <[email hidden]> Visit the Infobahn
Offramp - <http://mypage.org/mcpierce> "What do you care
what other people think, Mr. Feynman?"

jmcquown said:

I don't think they wear stripes anymore. The big question
is, does she look good in ORANGE? ;-)

Federal prisoners get to wear normal clothes most of the
time.

-sw

Steve Wertz said:

jmcquown said:

I don't think they wear stripes anymore. The big question
is, does she look good in ORANGE? ;-)

Federal prisoners get to wear normal clothes most of
the time.

-sw

Every Federal prisoner, that I have seen, wore the orange
jump suit. Of course there may be some that wear normal
cloths, possibly at the "club fed" prisons. Pan Ohco

On 07 Mar 2004 20:24:28 GMT, [email hidden] (SportKite1)

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

jmcquown said:

I don't think they wear stripes anymore. The big
question is, does she look good in ORANGE? ;-)

Prisoners assigned to work details wear black and white
stripes in Florida.

Are they chained at the ankle too?

Practice safe eating - always use condiments

Quoted message said:

"jmcquown" [email hidden] Newsgroups:
rec.food.cooking References:
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Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Message-ID:
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ejjokajhocjppc

dhklnfjodimfcophoomghmgflkmngjbbhlgnmiboapdjinoploeaipigmgg-
diibekhifcjaajn emkeahkfplghp

Quoted message said:

NNTP-Posting-Date: Sun, 07 Mar 2004 08:59:41 EST Date: Sun,
7 Mar 2004 08:01:26 -0600

larry said:

Well she lied, cheated, stole and got caught.. so I guess
she deserves to go to JAIL. .. but some time in stripes
scares nearly everybody.

Laurence

I don't think they wear stripes anymore. The big question
is, does she look good in ORANGE? ;-)

I think Mothra won't mind mauve and puce stripes, so long
as they're vertical... far more slimming than
international pumpkin.

---= BOYCOTT FRENCH--GERMAN (belgium) =--- ---= Move UNITED
NATIONS To Paris =--- Sheldon ```````````` "Life would be
devoid of all meaning were it without tribulation."

"larry" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Well she lied, cheated, stole and got caught.. so I guess
she deserves to go to JAIL. I think they should fine the
#%&$ out of her and put her back to work to pay some big
taxes. But on the other hand those with plenty of money
are not very afraid of paying a fine.. big deal.. but some
time in stripes scares nearly everybody.

Laurence

There are a couple problems as I see it. First, people with
money usually go to prisons where they get carpet in their
"cells" and roam freely, and watch cable, etc. I don't think
it is going to benefit anyone if she goes to jail, and since
she maintains she is innocent, I doubt it will teach her
anything either. The jails are already overcrowded and
costing taxpayers ridiculous amounts, when so many of the
people there could be contributing to society instead of
living off it. The unfortunate fact is that jail time does
*not* scare everybody. If it were such a great deterrent,
then the numbers would be drastically different than they
are. People like Martha, people who use drugs (note, I said
use, not deal), people who commit "victimless"
crimes...there needs to be some other stop gap in place to
deal with these people. Jail is not a solution. She needs to
be fined, to the extent of the money she should have lost in
the deal at a minimum. She should also be doing plenty of
community service works....hey I know! She can "Martha-ize"
peoples houses, organizing them, filling the pantry with
goodies, and lets not forget creating a beautiful garden
space in which to relax with a good cup of Earl Grey....

kimberly

"John Gaughan" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

larry said:

But on the other hand those with plenty of money are not
very afraid of paying a fine.

Of course not, because to her, a fine of a few thousand
dollars is pocket change. That same fine would ruin my
finances for years. Fines should be proportionate to the
person's net worth. Martha probably has a few hundred
million dollars worth of assets, so fine her half. Even to
a multi-millionare, half of her money is a huge blow.

Except that the fines are already more than a few thousand
bucks...not to mention she lost 1/4 of her worth the day she
was convicted. She was worth around 4.5 million in the
morning, down to just over 3 in the afternoon.

kimberly

Dave Smith said:

I like the system they have in Norway <?> where fines,
even for traffic violations, are based on income. A $100
speeding ticket for one of the working poor is a hefty
penalty, but it means nothing to a millionaire.

Also in Finland. Methinks you've heard about that 170000
euros fine for speeding in the city, for a young finnish
millionaire.

Methinks it's right, too.

Vilco

BTW - 170000 euros = 190000 dollars. Nice?

Darryl L. Pierce said:

Why jail? Her's was a non-violent crime. Since it was
financial in nature, it would seem appropriate that the
punishment should be financial as well.

Since when has our judicial system ever been based on an
"Eye for an Eye"?

Quoted message said:

Prison isn't a deterrant...

Right. It is a punishment.

~john

Vilco said:

Dave Smith said:

I like the system they have in Norway <?> where fines,
even for traffic violations, are based on income. A $100
speeding ticket for one of the working poor is a hefty
penalty, but it means nothing to a millionaire.

Also in Finland. Methinks you've heard about that 170000
euros fine for speeding in the city, for a young finnish
millionaire.

Methinks it's right, too.

Vilco

BTW - 170000 euros = 190000 dollars. Nice?

Exactly; adjust the fine to an index of pain which is common
to all. How many times have I left my car on the sidewalk
after 2 AM, to get a 5 buck fine. Now in NYC, that would
amount to a 75$ fine, and possible towing of the vehicle
with even more money; ouch! that hurts.

Rich

--
-----------------------------------------------------------
----------

Dum spiro, spero. (Cicero) As long as I breathe, I hope.

On Sun, 07 Mar 2004 14:50:40 -0600, Pan Ohco <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Steve Wertz said:

jmcquown said:

I don't think they wear stripes anymore. The big question
is, does she look good in ORANGE? ;-)

Federal prisoners get to wear normal clothes most of
the time.

-sw

Every Federal prisoner, that I have seen, wore the orange
jump suit. Of course there may be some that wear normal
cloths, possibly at the "club fed" prisons.

They only wear orange jump suits when they travel someplace
(like court or being transferred to another prison). Have
you ever actually been *in* a Federal prison, or just seen
it on TV and the movies?

-sw

Darryl L. Pierce said:

Prison isn't a deterrant. It never has been. People who
commit crimes do so with the belief that they're never get
*caught*.

I would think that prison would make the person come out
worse having to associate with all the other criminals in
there. You get a nice mix of different types of
crookedness to rub off on you. I won't say what I think
the solution is :-)

regards, Ben

--
"What passes for wisdom may only be eloquent foolishness"

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Steve Wertz said:

They only wear orange jump suits when they travel
someplace (like court or being transferred to another
prison). Have you ever actually been *in* a Federal
prison, or just seen it on TV and the movies?

I have been *to* prison, not *in* ;-) and I can honestly
say that from what I saw, and what the person serving time
said, is that they wear khaki pants and a button shirt, but
the colors are bland light brown. This was a federal
prison, not state, and no transportation to or from court
going on that I saw.

--
John Gaughan johngaughan.netjohngaughan.netOpen ↗
[email hidden]

John Gaughan said:

Steve Wertz said:

They only wear orange jump suits when they travel
someplace (like court or being transferred to another
prison). Have you ever actually been *in* a Federal
prison, or just seen it on TV and the movies?

Quoted message said:

I have been *to* prison, not *in* ;-)

I think *in* sounds better than *to*. Depends on how you use
it in a sentence, I guess.

Quoted message said:

and I can honestly say that from what I saw, and what the
person serving time said, is that they wear khaki pants and
a button shirt, but the colors are bland light brown.

Quoted message said:

This was a federal prison, not state, and no transportation
to or from court going on that I saw.

Maybe they do have different standards for different
prisons. Even some state prisons allow inmates to wear
regular clothes (especially female inmates). There are some
limitations though - like nothing that resembles a guards
uniform, of course.

-sw

larry said:

Well she lied, cheated, stole and got caught.. so I guess
she deserves to go to JAIL.

The hot question is, is Martha gonna toss a salad!! (OBfood)

No, seriously, does she deserve to go to jail? Yes. WILL she
go to jail? Doubtful. Has justice been served? Not till Ken
Lay is a [censored]!

nb