Am I a wuss?

Only some kind of wuss would ask that, so probably yes. 😉😄

Heart rates vary so don't try and compare yours with others. There is always somebody faster so just try and get better than you are now.
The bad news is after you pass 30 it tends to get a little tougher very year.

curby said:

Any advice / analysis would be helpful, I feel that I am fine sitting in the pack but cant take much of a pull or attack for more than a few hundred meters...

If this is my hardest effort is my training too easy?

You are smart to want to determine your true max HR using something other than a statistical model.

The easiest way to determine your max HR is to go out and perform a max effort.

I like to evaluate mine by going for an easy ride for about an hour to get good and warmed up. Then I do a couple of moderately difficult intervals lasting about two minutes each to activate the body's glycemic energy producing pathways. Then I go to my favorite hill and start to climb it at a pace that I know I cannot maintain to the top. When I start to feel as though I am gasping for air and have a pretty good burn throughout my entire body, I stand and sprint as hard as I can until I completely blow up.

The max value you achieve during a drill like that is as close to your true max HR as anything you can determine.

It is not a comfortable test, but it's kind of psychologically fun to say at the bottom of a climb, "I am going to intentionally blow up before I reach the top."

Just keep at it & training hard. Who knows what juice the rest of the pack is on.

curby said:

Any advice / analysis would be helpful, I feel that I am fine sitting in the pack but cant take much of a pull or attack for more than a few hundred meters...

If this is my hardest effort is my training too easy?

If you want to improve your short term power you need to mix in some shorter intervasls. 40 min is fine for threshold improvement but won't improve your 1-5 min power.

Your absolute HR is not relevant as a measure of how much power or how hard you are working.

gregf83 said:

If you want to improve your short term power you need to mix in some shorter intervasls. 40 min is fine for threshold improvement but won't improve your 1-5 min power.

Your absolute HR is not relevant as a measure of how much power or how hard you are working.

Hey greg, long time, no see.

Well, up until just lately that is. 😄

Still throwing your speculative efforts round bikeforums I see.

Chapeau! said:

Hey greg, long time, no see.

Well, up until just lately that is. 😄

Still throwing your speculative efforts round bikeforums I see.

Do I know you?

gregf83 said:

Do I know you?

Its umd's best friend.

Hope your all keeping well, riding well.

gregf83 said:

If you want to improve your short term power you need to mix in some shorter intervasls. 40 min is fine for threshold improvement but won't improve your 1-5 min power.

Your absolute HR is not relevant as a measure of how much power or how hard you are working.

+1 on that, and a single pull in a good fast paceline should not go over 5 minutes either, so that's right on point with doing some short intervals. I would do some 5x5's (hard) and/or 5x3's (harder) with a 2 or 3 minute rest in between.

thanks ya'll

should I put a HR number on these 5min interval efforts? this workout was what I think of as TT practice, seems my legs & lactate are the limiters, my heart rate seems very manageable over this effort.

does this ride sound too easy? my intention was to really beat myself up on this one... mostly my calves seem to load up and slow down my cadence, I feel like I can stand up and sprint any time during this effort and increase my speed.

thanks again,

new equipment, new data, new thinking...

curby

gman0482 said:

+1 on that, and a single pull in a good fast paceline should not go over 5 minutes either, so that's right on point with doing some short intervals. I would do some 5x5's (hard) and/or 5x3's (harder) with a 2 or 3 minute rest in between.

Greg certainly offers $ick advice.

curby said:

thanks ya'll

should I put a HR number on these 5min interval efforts? this workout was what I think of as TT practice, seems my legs & lactate are the limiters, my heart rate seems very manageable over this effort.

does this ride sound too easy? my intention was to really beat myself up on this one... mostly my calves seem to load up and slow down my cadence, I feel like I can stand up and sprint any time during this effort and increase my speed.

thanks again,

new equipment, new data, new thinking...

curby

If you want to use HR you can, but I personally never use it for training purposes. I love to use wattage, but since my computer only measures power on my trainer indoors, I go by my best mph and/or cadence averages. I'll just do a route/interval, record my highest average from it and use it for future repeats.

IMO, using HR, there's too many variables that can offset it. But whatever my PB averages are, they are what they are.

You can always use RPE.

Good luck,
-Greg

curby said:

should I put a HR number on these 5min interval efforts? this workout was what I think of as TT practice, seems my legs & lactate are the limiters, my heart rate seems very manageable over this effort.

It's probably better to find a suitable hill and time your intervals. Do them as hard and consistently as you can. If you use a target HR for short intervals your power will invariably drop with subsequent intervals.

For example here is a recent set of 5min intervals w/1min rest. The first 5 intervals averaged between 306-308W but my HR went up a little higher each time.

Thanks a lot Greg! #@#$-er! hehe

Just got this heart rate monitor now you're showing me that I really needed a power meter... ;-)

seriously tho, thanks for the post, good to know. perhaps progressive intervals using heart rate will be something I can try...

BTW, anyone want to comment on my numbers? does that sound like an easy workout? ~83% of maximum heartrate for 40mins?

thanks again,

curby

L1 = <68% of your HR
L2 = 69-83% HR
L3 = 84-94%
L4 = 95-105%
L5 = >106% HR

I copy/pasted what I wrote in the other thread. Hope this helps.

BTW, so you trained in high L2 zone. Try to do some 2x20's around high L3, or do some 5-min intervals around high L4. But again, like the other Greg said, HR training can be misleading.

Read more: http://www.cyclingforums.com/cycling-training/478119-proper-training-where-am-i-going-tips.html#ixzz0wfO82v3l

jhuskey said:

The bad news is after you pass 30 it tends to get a little tougher very year.

Damn! well that isn't very good. I was hoping for a decent come back this year. 😕

gman0482 said:

L1 = <68% of your HR
L2 = 69-83% HR
L3 = 84-94%
L4 = 95-105%
L5 = >106% HR

I copy/pasted what I wrote in the other thread. Hope this helps.

BTW, so you trained in high L2 zone. Try to do some 2x20's around high L3, or do some 5-min intervals around high L4. But again, like the other Greg said, HR training can be misleading.

Read more: http://www.cyclingforums.com/cycling-training/478119-proper-training-where-am-i-going-tips.html#ixzz0wfO82v3l

I need to correct myself. I didn't realize you were talking about 83% of your max HR. I that case 83% is a descent effort. Again though, HR can change for many different reasons that might not even be related to cycling.

If you still want to train with HR, you should do a 1 hour test to see what your FTHR is, (functional threshold heart rate) and then you can base your training on the different levels.

The way I train is by my mph averages, or time averages as Greg mentioned.

steve said:

Damn! well that isn't very good. I was hoping for a decent come back this year. 😕

If you're not a wuss and get out there and do some damned hard, but structured training the you'll have your decent comeback.

😉

I find that the hardest part isn't getting the training done, that's the easy bit - it's finding enough hours in the day to get enough sleep.

swampy1970 said:

it's finding enough hours in the day to get enough sleep.

Working night shifts ?

gman0482 said:

Working night shifts ?

Long commute and an early start which means getting up at O'dark 30... Combine that with the fact that wifey doesn't like to go to bed until late and that doesn't leave much sleepin' time.