Bike Sizing

FWIW. I think the 56cm frame will be too small for you ... but, a part of frame sizing is cosmetic ...

Regardless, you probably want a frame with a top tube whose length is 57cm-to-58cm + a 120mm stem +/- 10mm.

BTW. If you were 5'10" to 6'0", then you might be happier with the 56cm frame ... I know someone who is ~5'10+, and his expensive bike (that he was supposedly sized for him) is a 58cm Kestrel (the particular fitter rounds UP).

With a 56cm frame, the height of the stem & handlebar may be lower than a person your height would feel comfortable with unless you stacked a lot of spacers between the headset & stem (nothing wrong with that ... there is a limit, but it's mostly a cosmetic issue & only partially a structural matter).

FWIW. I recommend STEEL, first ... aluminum, second, and CF last.

Thanks for the replies! I was thinking that 58cm would be the way to go. I was looking at getting a bike from bikesdirect.com and it seemed that 58cm was the way I wanted to go.....That being said, would the Shimano 105 components be what I would want or is the Tiagra sufficient. I have read that the 105 shifter has been breaking a lot. So it makes me think that the Tiagra shifters would be sufficient. I wish I could afford the Ultegra but now I cannot. Thanks again!

Cole

ColeJustesen said:

Thanks for the replies! I was thinking that 58cm would be the way to go. I was looking at getting a bike from bikesdirect.com and it seemed that 58cm was the way I wanted to go.....That being said, would the Shimano 105 components be what I would want or is the Tiagra sufficient. I have read that the 105 shifter has been breaking a lot. So it makes me think that the Tiagra shifters would be sufficient. I wish I could afford the Ultegra but now I cannot. Thanks again!

Cole

I'd second the 58cm. I'm 6'2" w/ ~33.5" inseam and relatively long arms and torso and I ride a 58 w/ a shorter 75mm stem. Fits pretty damn well for me, especially after a BG fit.

I've been pretty happy w/ my 105 group personally and it was one of my primary criterium when I bought my road bike, It seems like a general consensus of most people that it is probably the value sweet spot for a beginner-intermediate bike if you can afford it, but I also hear people who are fine w/ their Tiagra as well.

I've not heard any bad things to speak of regarding durability of any of the 105 components personally.

Sid Nitzerglobi said:

I'd second the 58cm. I'm 6'2" w/ ~33.5" inseam and relatively long arms and torso and I ride a 58 w/ a shorter 75mm stem. Fits pretty damn well for me, especially after a BG fit.

I've been pretty happy w/ my 105 group personally and it was one of my primary criterium when I bought my road bike, It seems like a general consensus of most people that it is probably the value sweet spot for a beginner-intermediate bike if you can afford it, but I also hear people who are fine w/ their Tiagra as well.

I've not heard any bad things to speak of regarding durability of any of the 105 components personally.

You've got an interesting fit. I just shoved a copy of Solid State Physics into my crotch to measure my cycling inseam and got 34.5" (901.7mm or 16,559,582,751 Bohr radii), and my scooter has a 57.5 cm VTT and a 100mm stem. It seems if you had gone a size smaller you might have been able to have a longer stem and put more weight over the front end. Do you ever get speed wobbles on fast descents? Do you have flexibility issues? It just seems a bit odd to have such a short stem.....just wondering.

alienator said:

You've got an interesting fit. I just shoved a copy of Solid State Physics into my crotch to measure my cycling inseam and got 34.5" (901.7mm or 16,559,582,751 Bohr radii), and my scooter has a 57.5 cm VTT and a 100mm stem. It seems if you had gone a size smaller you might have been able to have a longer stem and put more weight over the front end. Do you ever get speed wobbles on fast descents? Do you have flexibility issues? It just seems a bit odd to have such a short stem.....just wondering.

I was surprised myself actually, but during test rides after the initial 20-30 minute pre-purchase fit w/ the default stem I still felt like I was reaching for the hoods (drops were fine). I had checked out a 56cm in a Synapse but it felt kind of cramped and like I was reaching back for the pedals a good bit with out moving the saddle really far back.

I actually have pretty decent flexibility (guess I can thank soccer, tae kwon do, and aikido for that) everywhere except my lower back/mid-section. Strangely enough, the drops and aero bars seem to be my most comfortable positions on the bike but I do kind of have a hump back form on them.

Haven't really felt any issues on descents so far, but fast for me <40mph and not all that technical at this point.

I've been toying a bit with the idea of either swapping the stem shims (I've got a +12 degree angle at this point IIRC) or flipping the stem altogether to see if I can find a spot which will stretch me out a bit more and in a more aero position, but have been a little reticent to go playing around too much on my own since I spent a decent amount of cash on the fit and it seems to work pretty well for me otherwise. I guess I could potentially check out going back to a 100mm stem as well if my fitter is willing to work with me on it (hopefully he would be).

It just goes to show how individual fit is and how universal the rules of thumb aren't.

If you search through this forum, you'll find lots of links to bike fit calculators, and lots of commentary thereon.

OldGoat said:

If you search through this forum, you'll find lots of links to bike fit calculators, and lots of commentary thereon.

I have been doing tons of research and it just seems to confuse me more. I was hoping (which I did receive) was a little push over the fence.

I was looking at these particular bikes:
Motobecane Vent Noir
and
Windsor Fens

I am leaning towards the Windsor Fens, but right now it is out of stock on the 58cm frame.

Cole

ColeJustesen said:

I am leaning towards the Windsor Fens, but right now it is out of stock on the 58cm frame.

FWIW. The 60cm WINDSOR is not as large as you think ... while there is undoubtedly an ideal top tube length for every rider, you should note that the 60cm frame is really a 55cm (c-c) and the 58.5cm top tube is certainly not outside an acceptable length for someone your height ...

OTHER factors affect the rider's reach ... stem length, stem height (i.e., the number of spacers used), handlebar shape + actual brake location (you may-or-may-not want to re-locate the brakes levers from wherever they are located), seatpost setback + where the saddle is located ... so, you shouldn't think of the 15mm difference between the so-called 58cm & so-called 60cm frames as being signficant.

alfeng said:

FWIW. The 60cm WINDSOR is not as large as you think ... while there is undoubtedly an ideal top tube length for every rider, you should note that the 60cm frame is really a 55cm (c-c) and the 58.5cm top tube is certainly not outside an acceptable length for someone your height ...

OTHER factors affect the rider's reach ... stem length, stem height (i.e., the number of spacers used), handlebar shape + actual brake location (you may-or-may-not want to re-locate the brakes levers from wherever they are located), seatpost setback + where the saddle is located ... so, you shouldn't think of the 15mm difference between the so-called 58cm & so-called 60cm frames as being signficant.

Thank you for the information! To me the Windsor Fens seems like the best deal for me right now. I know that bike would cost a lot more in my LBS than what they have it advertised at.

Cole

ColeJustesen said:

... would the Shimano 105 components be what I would want or is the Tiagra sufficient. I have read that the 105 shifter has been breaking a lot. So it makes me think that the Tiagra shifters would be sufficient. I wish I could afford the Ultegra but now I cannot.

BTW/FYI. Almost ALL Shimano components are good ... so a lot of a buyer's decision should/would normally be based on his/her budget AND ego ...

The 105 components are decidely better than the Tiagra ... basically, 105 components are less refined Ultegra components ... and, Ultegra components are detuned spinoffs of Dura Ace components.

Currently, the Tiagra shifters are based on the previous generation 105/Ultegra stuff ... so, in reality, you aren't giving up too much. The Tiagra drivetrain will be 9-speed (nothing wrong with that) whereas a current 105 drivetrain will be 10-speed.

So, if cost were a factor [that is, IF the cost of the 105 equipped bike was greater than $300(US) more than the cost of the 9-speed Tiagra group as might be the case at an LBS ... but, which is not the case with the two bikes you are currently looking at from BikesDirect.com], then between the two shifters, I would choose a bike with Tiaga shifters BECAUSE 'I' would would be immediately reselling the shifters on eBay & installing Campagnolo shifters on the bike!?!

Since you-and-99.9%-of-people-buying-a-new-bike probably wouldn't be changing out the Shimano shifters for a pair of Camapgnolo shifters, the 10-speed group with the 105 shifters is clearly the better choice.

alfeng said:

BTW/FYI. Almost ALL Shimano components are good ... so a lot of a buyer's decision should/would normally be based on his/her budget AND ego ...

The 105 components are decidely better than the Tiagra ... basically, 105 components are less refined Ultegra components ... and, Ultegra components are detuned spinoffs of Dura Ace components.

Currently, the Tiagra shifters are based on the previous generation 105/Ultegra stuff ... so, in reality, you aren't giving up too much. The Tiagra drivetrain will be 9-speed (nothing wrong with that) whereas a current 105 drivetrain will be 10-speed.

So, if cost were a factor [that is, IF the cost of the 105 equipped bike was greater than $300(US) more than the cost of the 9-speed Tiagra group as might be the case at an LBS ... but, which is not the case with the two bikes you are currently looking at from BikesDirect.com], then between the two shifters, I would choose a bike with Tiaga shifters BECAUSE 'I' would would be immediately reselling the shifters on eBay & installing Campagnolo shifters on the bike!?!

Since you-and-99.9%-of-people-buying-a-new-bike probably wouldn't be changing out the Shimano shifters for a pair of Camapgnolo shifters, the 10-speed group with the 105 shifters is clearly the better choice.

Are those the components people refer to as "Campy"? The salesman at my LBS said he really liked Campy parts and that they are pretty spendy. How much would those shifters cost to replace? Thanks.....I am just to trying to weigh all my options.

Cole

ColeJustesen,
If your goal is something approaching perfect fit then you want to select the frame size/geometry that allows you to achieve your preferred setup without having to do stuff like adding a ton of spacers or going with a super short/long/high rise stem, etc.

You mentioned that you are getting recommendations for different size frames. The problem I see right off the bat is that not all bike manufacturers measure their frames the same way. Some measure center (of the Bottom Bracket) to top (the top tube) and others measure center to center. With sloping tops tubes we have the notion of the virtual top tube.
The way to differentiate different bikes is not by comparing stated sizes but by comparing: top tube length, seat tube angle and head tube length. Seat tube length doesn't really tell you anything other than larger sizes for a given frame model will have progressively longer top tubes\head tubes and shallower seat tube angles.
I usually recommend going with the smallest frame that allows for the correct reach without exceeding your maximum saddle to bar height differential and without having to resort to excessive spacers/funky stems. This ideal frame size/geometry will also allow you to set up your saddle for good fore/aft balance. With this perfect setup you should be in a very efficient position and not have any pain points like sore hands, back, etc.

The amount of bar drop you can tolerate is dependent of experience, strength, flexibility and genes.
Most new riders will not be super comfortable on a properly setup road bike until they have gotten some miles in. When calculating reach you need to give consideration to the seat tube angle. When calculating saddle to bar drop you need to factor in head tube length. You will increase your odds of selecting the correct size/geometry bike if you understand how all the various lengths and angles will impact your fit. It's not that complicated and you will feel better about this purchase if you are not relying entirely on the folks at the bike shop for size recommendations.
A little reading to get your started:
Keith Bontrager on The Myth of K.O.P.S.
How to Fit a Bicycle

rich88 said:

ColeJustesen,
If your goal is something approaching perfect fit then you want to select the frame size/geometry that allows you to achieve your preferred setup without having to do stuff like adding a ton of spacers or going with a super short/long/high rise stem, etc.

You mentioned that you are getting recommendations for different size frames. The problem I see right off the bat is that not all bike manufacturers measure their frames the same way. Some measure center (of the Bottom Bracket) to top (the top tube) and others measure center to center. With sloping tops tubes we have the notion of the virtual top tube.
The way to differentiate different bikes is not by comparing stated sizes but by comparing: top tube length, seat tube angle and head tube length. Seat tube length doesn't really tell you anything other than larger sizes for a given frame model will have progressively longer top tubes\head tubes and shallower seat tube angles.
I usually recommend going with the smallest frame that allows for the correct reach without exceeding your maximum saddle to bar height differential and without having to resort to excessive spacers/funky stems. This ideal frame size/geometry will also allow you to set up your saddle for good fore/aft balance. With this perfect setup you should be in a very efficient position and not have any pain points like sore hands, back, etc.

The amount of bar drop you can tolerate is dependent of experience, strength, flexibility and genes.
Most new riders will not be super comfortable on a properly setup road bike until they have gotten some miles in. When calculating reach you need to give consideration to the seat tube angle. When calculating saddle to bar drop you need to factor in head tube length. You will increase your odds of selecting the correct size/geometry bike if you understand how all the various lengths and angles will impact your fit. It's not that complicated and you will feel better about this purchase if you are not relying entirely on the folks at the bike shop for size recommendations.
A little reading to get your started:
Keith Bontrager on The Myth of K.O.P.S.
How to Fit a Bicycle

Wow......what a ton of information there! Thanks a lot for the links.....I was able to tell the length of the crank now using the 18.5% measurement. I feel like I need to read over those a couple of times to really figure out what I need. Thanks again....those are great links!

Cole

ColeJustesen said:

Hello everybody...I am new here and have a couple of questions for anyone who would like to help me sort out my confusion. First let me say that I have never used a road bike before, except for a little while testing out at a shop.

I went to some local shops and one shop got me setup on a 56cm frame, while another shop set me up on a 58cm and even suggested we try a 60cm frame. I am 6'1" tall with an inseam of 33.75". I would say that I have shorter legs considering my height but with a longer torso. Based on my measuring and calculating a 57cm bike would fit me just right (however I don't know how true that statement really is). When I rode the bikes at the shops they all felt comfortable, well to me anyway (at this point I had never rode this style of a bike). So my main question for you all is what size should I get? Do I step down to a 56cm or go to a 58cm? One shop salesman explained that over time your body learns to adjust and strengthens itself which in return allows it to stretch out more with less strain and really thought that 58cm would fit the bill.

One other question about body to bike frame setup, I am 225 lbs., should I worry about anything as far as to what the frame is made of or what/how the bike rims are made?

Thanks for any advice, help, direction......

Cole

I'd pass on the 56 and look at the 58 or 60 -'especially as you're tall and don't exactly have long legs for your height. I'm 5ft11 and have a 34" inseam (all legs n short body )and ride a 58. The top tube is ~58 and I use a stem that's advertised as 110 by measures closer to 120.

Concentrate on getting a frame with the correct seat angle and top tube length. If you end up going with too short a stemmthe weight distribution will be all to **** and it'll never inspire confidence.

swampy1970 said:

I'd pass on the 56 and look at the 58 or 60 -'especially as you're tall and don't exactly have long legs for your height. I'm 5ft11 and have a 34" inseam (all legs n short body )and ride a 58. The top tube is ~58 and I use a stem that's advertised as 110 by measures closer to 120.

Concentrate on getting a frame with the correct seat angle and top tube length. If you end up going with too short a stemmthe weight distribution will be all to **** and it'll never inspire confidence.

What degree for the seat angle would be sufficient? Based off my LBS test rides, I would say that the angles that work best for me are probably between 72.5-73.0 degrees with a top tube length around 580-585mm......

Is there a way to measure how long the stem needs to be, or is it basically a comfort thing?

Cole

ColeJustesen said:

What degree for the seat angle would be sufficient? Based off my LBS test rides, I would say that the angles that work best for me are probably between 72.5-73.0 degrees with a top tube length around 580-585mm......

Is there a way to measure how long the stem needs to be, or is it basically a comfort thing?

Cole

For an average proportioned person of your size, if the seat is in the middle of the saddle rails and you have ~ 11 to 12cm stem you'll be in the right ballpark.

As for seat angle, it all depends on how long your upper and lower leggy bits are...

Just remember that if you are comparing two frames that have identical top tube lengths but different seat tube angles that the one with the steeper seat tube angle will result in a longer overall reach assuming you are mounting your saddle in the same fore/aft position relative to the bottom bracket. The one area you will see significant differences between brands in a given size is the head tube length. If you choose a frame with too short a head tube you will have issues getting your saddle to bar drop height set correctly. Check out some frame specs on line and you will see what I mean.