Overtrousers

Simon said:

I don't
understand many peoples hang ups about them.

Rustling with every step, catching the wind, reduced breathability and
extra sweat from an extra layer, and reduced freedom of movement
compared to close fit stretch trousers in my case.

Not the End Of The World I'll grant you, and certainly not if the
alternative is getting completely soaked (when I'll wear my o-Ts), but
just something I'd rather do without when I can and trousers that deal
okay with showers (if not full-on rain) are something I find preferable.

Quoted message said:

them. I've also found that these overtrousers are not very long (and yes
I have got the right size!)

Leg length isn't a standardised feature of either trousers or people.
I, for example, have the opposite problem with relatively short legs and
many trousers being too long for me. Lowe typically have relatively
long limbs on their garments IME so you might see how their offerings
work for you.

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net [email hidden] http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/

Simon said:

I know different people have different opinions on overtrousers. Some,
for their own reasons, hate them and will only wear them as an absolute
last resort. Personally if it is raining, and I am going on what might
be a particularly muddy walk, I will wear them without problems. I don't
understand many peoples hang ups about them. If I am on a wet and muddy
walk, but want to stop off at a pub or whatever along the way, then I
can easily slip them off without having to sit and have my drink in wet
and muddy clothes!

So I am rather confused about the fit of many modern overtrousers. One
criticism I hear levelled against them is that traditionally
overtrousers were or are a 'baggy mess', to quote one comment I have
seen. As a result many modern overtrousers, at least the really
expensive breathable ones in eVent or the more expensive Gore-Tex are
cut slimmer, and hence IMHO are not as useful.

For me this causes problems. I like to wear loose fitting clothing if I
am walking. I certainly won't go near tights, and my legs are not for
public consumption in shorts! If I wear the looser fitting clothing
these new slimmer fit overtrousers such as the Berghaus ones or the Rab
Bergen style end up feeling quite restrictive in movement when worn over
them. I've also found that these overtrousers are not very long (and yes
I have got the right size!) Even if I bend down to tie up laces they
ride up at the bottom. The trousers that are underneath often poke out
of the hems, thus getting wet! I'm not a fan of gaitors BTW. The Rab
Bergen ones do have an elasticated draw cord at the bottom. But I find
they look odd when tightened, and don't cover my socks in that state.

So does anyone know of any decent eVent or high end Gore-tex
overtrousers that 1) have enough room in them to go over looser fit
clothing without it all bunching up inside and causing restrictive
feeling movement, and 2) actually have legs long enough to cover the
tops of my boots so my socks and the trousers the overtrousers are
supposed to be protecting don't get wet? Ones with cargo style leg
pockets would also be useful for me sometimes.

Simon

Make them! That way you can have stretch or bagginess to suit you
personally, as many pockets as you like, and make them as long as you
need to cover everything you want covered.

I made my husband some a few years back out of a 3 layer proofed nylon
breathable stuff, with the upper body section of mesh lining fabric to
help breathability and to reduce bulk at the waist. You could make them
less baggy at the ankles, with some of those water resistant zips to
open vents for taking them off over boots if you really wanted to.

The Boy needs a new pair: another project for DIY kit!

--
Kate XXXXXX R.C.T.Q Madame Chef des Trolls
Lady Catherine, Wardrobe Mistress of the Chocolate Buttons
http://www.katedicey.co.uk
Click on Kate's Pages and explore!

Kate XXXXXX said:

Make them!

Or commission someone else to, to your measurements. Kate might do you
some, if not then http://www.slioch.co.uk would be an option.

Another possibility would be Paramo trousers, which are completely
waterproof trousers, which are more breathable than conventional
membrane overtrousers and no need to be wearing two different garments.
There are various other intrinsically waterproof walking trousers, such
as Rohan's Dry Trailblazers, which also have thigh pockets.

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net [email hidden] http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/

Peter Clinch said:

Kate XXXXXX said:

Make them!

Or commission someone else to, to your measurements. Kate might do you
some, if not then http://www.slioch.co.uk would be an option.

Find me in the Yellow Pages!

Quoted message said:

Another possibility would be Paramo trousers, which are completely
waterproof trousers, which are more breathable than conventional
membrane overtrousers and no need to be wearing two different garments.
There are various other intrinsically waterproof walking trousers, such
as Rohan's Dry Trailblazers, which also have thigh pockets.

The Rohan ones are rather nice, and don't look or feel too much like
Waterproof Breeks!

--
Kate XXXXXX R.C.T.Q Madame Chef des Trolls
Lady Catherine, Wardrobe Mistress of the Chocolate Buttons
http://www.katedicey.co.uk
Click on Kate's Pages and explore!

Peter Clinch said:

Kate XXXXXX said:

Make them!

Or commission someone else to, to your measurements. Kate might do you
some, if not then http://www.slioch.co.uk would be an option.

Another possibility would be Paramo trousers, which are completely
waterproof trousers, which are more breathable than conventional
membrane overtrousers and no need to be wearing two different garments.
There are various other intrinsically waterproof walking trousers, such
as Rohan's Dry Trailblazers, which also have thigh pockets.

I wore Paramo Cascada trousers on a trip to the Pyrenees last month so
I didn't need an extra pair of trousers, though I did take some
lightweight powerstretchs just in case. The Cascadas have full leg
length zips for ventilation if you feel too warm - I rarely do, even
in tropical latitudes. They are very comfortable, quite unlike my
Goretex which I no longer bother with, and they come in a very wide
range of sizes:
http://www.safariquip.co.uk/i_paramo_sizes.html

I bought mine from Mountain Factor:
http://shop.themountainfactor.com/product.php?xProd=39

who gave me 20% off and free shipping, which came the next day. I have
no connection with them, I'm just a satisfied customer.

HTH

John D.
--
John Dawson at home in Kendal, Cumbria.
Lake District Walks Web Pages http://www.lakedistrictwalks.com/
Sicilian Volcanoes at http://www.lakedistrictwalks.com/sicily/
Pyrenees trek at http://www.lakedistrictwalks.com/pyrenees

John Dawson said:

On Mon, 17 Sep 2007 16:15:33 +0100, Peter Clinch

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Another possibility would be Paramo trousers, which are completely
waterproof trousers, which are more breathable than conventional
membrane overtrousers and no need to be wearing two different garments.
There are various other intrinsically waterproof walking trousers, such
as Rohan's Dry Trailblazers, which also have thigh pockets.

I wore Paramo Cascada trousers on a trip to the Pyrenees last month so
I didn't need an extra pair of trousers, though I did take some
lightweight powerstretchs just in case. The Cascadas have full leg
length zips for ventilation if you feel too warm - I rarely do, even
in tropical latitudes. They are very comfortable, quite unlike my
Goretex which I no longer bother with, and they come in a very wide
range of sizes:http://www.safariquip.co.uk/i_paramo_sizes.html

Seconded. I've kept mine on and driven home in them rather than get
changed ! They might possibly be a little cool in icy conditions for
those who chill easily, in which case a pair of thin thermals or
tights would do the trick, but otherwise can be worn in a wide range
of conditions. I very often put mine on at the start of a walk if
there's a risk of real rain rather than carry them separately, so
comfortable are they.

Paramo also make a set of short gaiters which go nicely underneath
their overtrousers, there being no real need for longer ones which
make my legs unbearably hot.

--
"Where are we going, and why are we in this hand-basket ?"

In message <[email hidden]>, Simon
<[email hidden]> writes

Quoted message said:

So does anyone know of any decent eVent or high end Gore-tex
overtrousers that 1) have enough room in them to go over looser fit
clothing without it all bunching up inside and causing restrictive
feeling movement, and 2) actually have legs long enough to cover the
tops of my boots so my socks and the trousers the overtrousers are
supposed to be protecting don't get wet? Ones with cargo style leg
pockets would also be useful for me sometimes.

You could do a lot worse than contacting Slioch

e-mail: [email hidden] - ask for their swatch of material samples
and catalogue. They're not cheap, but you gets wot you pay for. Made
to measure kit by the way !!
--
Bill Grey

The Craghoppers "waterproof" trousers are not over-trousers as such, but
are quite waterproof, and fairly warm - their cut wouldn't impress
Saville Row, on account of the legs are already bent a bitty. I agree
that you can't take them off to drop into a pub, but there are so few
pubs in the mountains here that this isn't an issue for me - I do not do
a lot of undressing under the Shelter Stone!

Richard

Quoted message said:

Saville Row, on account of the legs are already bent a bitty. I agree
that you can't take them off to drop into a pub, but there are so few

There is also the issue that I don't like having to change into a new
pair of trousers in a cold wet carpark at the end of a walk and risk
getting arrested for streaking! ;-)

I've looked at Slioch before. Didn't realise they did custom jobs. But
they look *really* expensive! For those prices I would expect them to
give my legs bionic like abilities!

Simon
--
http://www.simonwyndham.co.uk

Simon said:

I've looked at Slioch before. Didn't realise they did custom jobs. But
they look *really* expensive!

Bespoke clothing generally is. Which is why most of what we wear is
mass produced! OTOH, you know it will fit and be specified /just/ the
way you want, which is very rare in mass produced clothing.

Quoted message said:

For those prices I would expect them to
give my legs bionic like abilities!

If it's the only way to get something that actually fits the way you
want then it's probably worth it, as every step you take in them will be
an improvement on the alternative. Lots of steps on a big hill-walk...

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net [email hidden] http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/

Peter Clinch said:

Simon said:

I've looked at Slioch before. Didn't realise they did custom jobs. But
they look *really* expensive!

Bespoke clothing generally is. Which is why most of what we wear is
mass produced! OTOH, you know it will fit and be specified /just/ the
way you want, which is very rare in mass produced clothing.

Quoted message said:

For those prices I would expect them to
give my legs bionic like abilities!

If it's the only way to get something that actually fits the way you
want then it's probably worth it, as every step you take in them will be
an improvement on the alternative. Lots of steps on a big hill-walk...

Pete.

In my line of work as a professional sewist of custom clothing (and
other stuff), I frequently come across the idea that having something
run up by the local dressmaker is cheaper than buying it. For some
reason I have always failed to comprehend, women seem to think that they
can have a tarty party frock/wedding dress 'run up' by me for less than
a BHS or Monsoon version... WHERE this strange notion comes from I do
not know: it isn't an idea *I* ever suffered from.

And it isn't one that most blokes suffer from, either. Maybe I failed
to catch the silly notion that having something tailored to your
specific measurements and requirements, hand finished, and made from
beautiful fabrics was an option you expected to *pay* for because my dad
always had his uniforms and suits built by Gieives (later Geives & Hawks
of 1, Saville Row), and my mother sewed, so I could SEE the work that
went into things.

Building and engineering clothing for walkers and others with specific
needs is a special area of a specialist field. The clothing is
generally better made than that of yer normal high street fashion
manufacturers (there are a few exceptions, in both directions), made
from high tec fabrics, and made in smaller numbers than 'ordinary'
clothes. It's one area where we EXPECT garments to last several years,
and to be worn hard in those years, and we also expect to pay the price
for that.

When you want a special garment that fits a particular body *doing a
particular activity*, you need to either acquire the skills and
equipment to make it yourself, or find someone who can do it for you and
pay them. It takes years to acquire the skills. It isn't just the
basic sewing know-how: you also need to know about the fabrics (and
these are constantly being updated as new fabrics are developed [this is
true in fashion as well as tec stuff: we now have fabrics with
encapsulated perfumes, fabrics that can be lit up like a Christmas tree,
and fabrics that change colour with body heat - like those silly kettles
that go pink when they boil!] and if you are going to work with them,
you need to know what they were developed for and how best to sew them),
the new findings (like water resist zips),AND the new machinery to sew
them with!

And you have to know when to duck out... Anything that needs taped
seams where the tape is welded over the seam on the inside is going to
work better (in that the tape will stick and stay stuck for the life of
the garment) if it is factory welded as there is no present home use
welding tool: irons do NOT work as well (I know, I've tried!). A set-up
where they manufacture standard sizes for the mass market (for a given
value of 'mass'!) but also tailor make for individuals, and who make
clothing with this weld, is going to do a better job than I can on these
seams, at least as far as getting the seams done is concerned. These
makers *usually* only make *their* design of garment in your personal
fit. If you want a totally unique design and fit combination, you are
going to have to find someone willing to tackle the job, and possibly
make some sort of compromise on the seam finish to cope with the
limitations of the technology and economics of working with a small
operation. And you are going to have to pay: probably up to twice what
buying a good pair from a good manufacturer would cost if you went for
their all weather highest spec pair of trousers, coat, whatever.

But it would fit.

--
Kate XXXXXX R.C.T.Q Madame Chef des Trolls
Lady Catherine, Wardrobe Mistress of the Chocolate Buttons
http://www.katedicey.co.uk
Click on Kate's Pages and explore!

Kate XXXXXX wrote

Quoted message said:

And it isn't one that most blokes suffer from, either.

It's been a long-standing source of amusement in our
household that I paid more for my wedding suit than my
wife paid for her dress, and it was money very well
spent indeed.

Chris

Chris Gilbert said:

Kate XXXXXX wrote

Quoted message said:

And it isn't one that most blokes suffer from, either.

It's been a long-standing source of amusement in our
household that I paid more for my wedding suit than my
wife paid for her dress, and it was money very well
spent indeed.

Roos made her own dress, so in financial terms almost certainly cheaper
than my Prince Charlie, though in time == money terms probably more
expensive... Well worth it, whatever. Venue of Corrie Fee in decent
weather absolutely priceless, of course :-)

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net [email hidden] http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/

"Kate XXXXXX" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

my dad always had his uniforms and suits built by Gieives (later Geives &
Hawks of 1, Saville Row),

That's where I got mine from until they began to cater too much for the
Americans and Arabs in the early nineties...what was your Dad in?

Peter Clinch wrote

Quoted message said:

Venue of Corrie Fee in decent
weather absolutely priceless, of course :-)

Literally.

Very nice set of pics out of it. Loved the kilt :-)

Chris

Chris Gilbert said:

Kate XXXXXX wrote

Quoted message said:

And it isn't one that most blokes suffer from, either.

It's been a long-standing source of amusement in our
household that I paid more for my wedding suit than my
wife paid for her dress, and it was money very well
spent indeed.

Chris

The joke in ours is that I spent the wedding dress fund on a sewing
machine: I got 2 day's wear out of the wedding dress I made (I wore it
for a party five years after the wedding), and 13 years out of the
sewing machine! I made my dress and those of my two bridesmaids for
less than Alan's suit cost.

He can just get into the suit still, but my dress is now TOO BIG!

Unfortunately the sewing machine broke. Fortunately I now have plenty
of others to play with!

--
Kate XXXXXX R.C.T.Q Madame Chef des Trolls
Lady Catherine, Wardrobe Mistress of the Chocolate Buttons
http://www.katedicey.co.uk
Click on Kate's Pages and explore!

Gordon said:

"Kate XXXXXX" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

my dad always had his uniforms and suits built by Gieives (later Geives &
Hawks of 1, Saville Row),

That's where I got mine from until they began to cater too much for the
Americans and Arabs in the early nineties...what was your Dad in?

RAF. He were a fly boy! Specialist Recce Navigator on things like
PR9's, Vulcans, Phantoms...

He was shaped like a gorilla: large head, wide shoulders, long back and
arms, short legs: 44" chest and 36" waist, and a seventeen and a half
inch collar! He played rugby and ran, and pulled 9G regularly several
times a day when flying, so had neck muscles like a bull. NOT an easy
fit, but dressed in his Gents Natty Suiting and No 1 uniform, he looked
very smart. He was average height, but always claimed he was a 6'3" man
issued with a 5'2" man's legs!

--
Kate XXXXXX R.C.T.Q Madame Chef des Trolls
Lady Catherine, Wardrobe Mistress of the Chocolate Buttons
http://www.katedicey.co.uk
Click on Kate's Pages and explore!

Kate XXXXXX <[email hidden]> writes

Quoted message said:

In my line of work as a professional sewist of custom clothing (and
other stuff), I frequently come across the idea that having something
run up by the local dressmaker is cheaper than buying it. For some
reason I have always failed to comprehend, women seem to think that
they can have a tarty party frock/wedding dress 'run up' by me for less
than a BHS or Monsoon version... WHERE this strange notion comes from
I do not know: it isn't an idea *I* ever suffered from.

My lady friend would understand where you're coming from!

She is a very meticulous (amateur) dressmaker, and is frequently the
victim of friends who want "a bit of an alteration doing", which can
sometimes mean reconstructing a cheaply sewn dress or skirt.

The last client seemed to think that giving her a couple of grotty
unwanted handbags was sufficient to reward her efforts....

I tell her repeatedly that when they ask for work doing, she should
check what is involved, and give them a quote, to be paid in cash.
Unfortunately she is too timid with them.
--
Gordon H
(Remove "Invalid" to reply)

Gordon H said:

Kate XXXXXX <[email hidden]> writes

Quoted message said:

In my line of work as a professional sewist of custom clothing (and
other stuff), I frequently come across the idea that having something
run up by the local dressmaker is cheaper than buying it. For some
reason I have always failed to comprehend, women seem to think that
they can have a tarty party frock/wedding dress 'run up' by me for
less than a BHS or Monsoon version... WHERE this strange notion comes
from I do not know: it isn't an idea *I* ever suffered from.

My lady friend would understand where you're coming from!

She is a very meticulous (amateur) dressmaker, and is frequently the
victim of friends who want "a bit of an alteration doing", which can
sometimes mean reconstructing a cheaply sewn dress or skirt.

The last client seemed to think that giving her a couple of grotty
unwanted handbags was sufficient to reward her efforts....

I tell her repeatedly that when they ask for work doing, she should
check what is involved, and give them a quote, to be paid in cash.
Unfortunately she is too timid with them.

Show her my contract:
http://www.diceyhome.free-online.co.uk/KatePages/HowToGet/kate_dicey_contract.htm

After the initial consultation and design drawings, I do nothing until
it is signed and the deposit paid.

--
Kate XXXXXX R.C.T.Q Madame Chef des Trolls
Lady Catherine, Wardrobe Mistress of the Chocolate Buttons
http://www.katedicey.co.uk
Click on Kate's Pages and explore!