OT - 'Simple' digital camera

PeterC said:

Been looking at such for a friend. Checked Olympus for a start, as most
models are OK in rain, but the reports aren't good.

Weren't good in what way? I've been happy with mine (a 725 SW)

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net [email hidden] http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/

Peter Clinch said:

PeterC said:

Been looking at such for a friend. Checked Olympus for a start, as most
models are OK in rain, but the reports aren't good.

Weren't good in what way? I've been happy with mine (a 725 SW)

Pete.

Most of the reviews and users' comments mentioned complex menus and slow
operation; also pictures not too good.
I was happy with my Olympus, but that was a v. early OM1, so things might
have changed since then!
--
Peter.
If you can do it today, you didn't put off enough yesterday.

PeterC said:

Most of the reviews and users' comments mentioned complex menus and slow
operation; also pictures not too good.

For the menus, I've found that my camera has a lot of complexity but you
don't need to be familiar with it to use it. If you just want to point
and shoot, you can do that. But if you want to tune what you're doing
to a grater degree you've got that option too (and shades between, so
you've got two dozen preset modes (portraits, sports, indoor, landscapes
etc.) which will tune things up a bit from the basic acquisition.

Tricky to call the pictures, as I've never been a great or prolific
photographer, or compared what I've taken to what I would have had with
a different camera... but no complaints of the ones I've shot so far.
Only real Gotcha with mine is no viewfinder, which can make shooting in
bright sunlight a bit of a game, bit OTOH it means it's lighter and more
compact.

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net [email hidden] http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/

Peter Clinch said:

PeterC said:

Most of the reviews and users' comments mentioned complex menus and slow
operation; also pictures not too good.

For the menus, I've found that my camera has a lot of complexity but you
don't need to be familiar with it to use it. If you just want to point
and shoot, you can do that. But if you want to tune what you're doing
to a grater degree you've got that option too (and shades between, so
you've got two dozen preset modes (portraits, sports, indoor, landscapes
etc.) which will tune things up a bit from the basic acquisition.

Tricky to call the pictures, as I've never been a great or prolific
photographer, or compared what I've taken to what I would have had with
a different camera... but no complaints of the ones I've shot so far.
Only real Gotcha with mine is no viewfinder, which can make shooting in
bright sunlight a bit of a game, bit OTOH it means it's lighter and more
compact.

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net [email hidden] http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/

i am very happy with an olympus mju 800. http://www.bristolcameras.co.uk/page492.htm

and memory cards from http://www.mymemory.co.uk/Olympus

it's not perfect. but it is v good value. v v good value in fact.

I'd recomment the Pentax Optio S7. Great features (7MP, 3xoptical, clear
screen), excellent video (640x480 30fps, limited only by memory card).
Camera is very small and light, but packs a punch.

I've just got one from www.ebuyer.com for ONLY £99. Amazed I was.

Regards,

Simon M

"PeterC" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Been looking at such for a friend. Checked Olympus for a start, as most
models are OK in rain, but the reports aren't good.
So, any advice please on this:

basically point'n'shoot
OK for scenery/daylight
weather/muck/jolt-resistant
simple menu structure
~3X optical zoom
good battery life

Sony seem good but, as with most makes, would soon 'die' in a rucksack.

She doesn't want anything too complex and heavy. I don't want it to be too
expensive.

Thanks.
--
Peter.
If you can do it today, you didn't put off enough yesterday.

In message <[email hidden]>

PeterC said:

Peter Clinch said:

PeterC said:

Been looking at such for a friend. Checked Olympus for a start, as most
models are OK in rain, but the reports aren't good.

Weren't good in what way? I've been happy with mine (a 725 SW)

Pete.

Most of the reviews and users' comments mentioned complex menus and slow
operation; also pictures not too good.
I was happy with my Olympus, but that was a v. early OM1, so things might
have changed since then!

I've got and used a mju 400, mju 410 and also C70Z as compact digital
cameras. The 400 and 410 are splashproof and very simple to use. I've
used them in all kinds of harsh conditions such as ski-touring and
caving and am pleased with the results. They've been superseded
recently by the mju725 / 800 etc which offer more megapixels but lack
the viewfinder.

The C70Z is not showerproof but offers more control over the final
picture taking and has a better lens.

If you want a comparison with the OM1 then you really need to take a
look at the new E400 or E410 which are the equivalent in DSLR terms
(i.e. currently the smallest and lightest DSLR models on the market)

Mike
--
o/ \\ // |\ ,_ o Mike Clark
<\__,\\ // __o | \ / /\, "A mountain climbing, cycling, skiing,
"> || _`\<,_ |__\ \> | immunology lecturer, antibody engineer and
` || (_)/ (_) | \corn computer user"

In article <[email hidden]>,
[email hidden] says...

Quoted message said:

Been looking at such for a friend. Checked Olympus for a start, as most
models are OK in rain, but the reports aren't good.

This month's Practical Photography carries a positive review of the
Olympus Mju 770 SW. Drop-proof, waterproof, crush-proof and freeze-proof
(all within reason of course - it's not a tank). 7MP, reasonable zoom
range (although, like almost all compacts, it doesn't go wide enough for
my liking), £249.

It's only a short review and doesn't go into how simple or otherwise it
is to operate, so it might be worth a trip to Jessops to play with one.
After all, it's not like you've got to actually *buy it* from them.

David Skinner said:

This month's Practical Photography carries a positive review of the
Olympus Mju 770 SW. Drop-proof, waterproof, crush-proof and
freeze-proof (all within reason of course - it's not a tank). 7MP,
reasonable zoom range (although, like almost all compacts, it doesn't
go wide enough for my liking), £249.

If you want wide in a digicam, check out the Canon S7, it's one of the few
pocket sized cameras that go as wide as 28mm. Quite cheap too second hand.
The newer versions don't do RAW. Not tough waterproof models though.

Quoted message said:

It's only a short review and doesn't go into how simple or otherwise
it is to operate, so it might be worth a trip to Jessops to play with
one. After all, it's not like you've got to actually *buy it* from
them.

Why not? I've bought most of my camera gear from there. The process is
simple, you find the cheapest price on the internet, write down the name and
phone number of the company, then ask Jessops to price-match it. They've
always done that with me. If there are any problems, it's easy to take it
back.

Paul
--
http://www.wilderness-wales.co.uk

Paul Saunders said:

David Skinner said:

This month's Practical Photography carries a positive review of the
Olympus Mju 770 SW. Drop-proof, waterproof, crush-proof and
freeze-proof (all within reason of course - it's not a tank). 7MP,
reasonable zoom range (although, like almost all compacts, it doesn't
go wide enough for my liking), £249.

If you want wide in a digicam, check out the Canon S7, it's one of the few
pocket sized cameras that go as wide as 28mm. Quite cheap too second hand.
The newer versions don't do RAW. Not tough waterproof models though.

Quoted message said:

It's only a short review and doesn't go into how simple or otherwise
it is to operate, so it might be worth a trip to Jessops to play with
one. After all, it's not like you've got to actually *buy it* from
them.

Why not? I've bought most of my camera gear from there. The process is
simple, you find the cheapest price on the internet, write down the name and
phone number of the company, then ask Jessops to price-match it. They've
always done that with me. If there are any problems, it's easy to take it
back.

Paul
--http://www.wilderness-wales.co.uk

they don't price match any more.

In article <[email hidden]>, pvs1
@wildwales.fsnet.co.uk says...

Quoted message said:

If you want wide in a digicam, check out the Canon S7, it's one of the few
pocket sized cameras that go as wide as 28mm. Quite cheap too second hand.
The newer versions don't do RAW. Not tough waterproof models though.

I adore my Sigma 10-20mm zoom (that's about 17mm at the wide end in 35mm
equiv). I bet there aren't many compacts that match that! 28mm would do
though.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

It's only a short review and doesn't go into how simple or otherwise
it is to operate, so it might be worth a trip to Jessops to play with
one. After all, it's not like you've got to actually *buy it* from
them.

Why not? I've bought most of my camera gear from there. The process is
simple, you find the cheapest price on the internet, write down the name and
phone number of the company, then ask Jessops to price-match it. They've
always done that with me. If there are any problems, it's easy to take it
back.

Maybe it's just me, maybe it's just the Nottingham branch, but the last
couple of times I tried to buy stuff there I ended up leaving empty-
handed without even speaking to anyone - they would ignore me and skip
to people who had entered the shop after me, fawn around the pretty
young thing with the stuck-film, hang-around in the back room, etc. I'd
remembered the deodorant, done my flies up and everything, honest.

Oh well, their bad luck - I was there to replace my ageing Pentax kit
with a whole new Nikon outfit - and a fairly high-end one at that.
Jacob's across the road got my business after these two abortive
attempts.

So last year when I went digital, Jessops weren't even on the list!

Mike Clark said:

In message <[email hidden]>

PeterC said:

Peter Clinch said:

PeterC wrote:
> Been looking at such for a friend. Checked Olympus for a start, as most
> models are OK in rain, but the reports aren't good.

Weren't good in what way? I've been happy with mine (a 725 SW)

Pete.

Most of the reviews and users' comments mentioned complex menus and slow
operation; also pictures not too good.
I was happy with my Olympus, but that was a v. early OM1, so things might
have changed since then!

I've got and used a mju 400, mju 410 and also C70Z as compact digital
cameras. The 400 and 410 are splashproof and very simple to use. I've
used them in all kinds of harsh conditions such as ski-touring and
caving and am pleased with the results. They've been superseded
recently by the mju725 / 800 etc which offer more megapixels but lack
the viewfinder.

Perhaps I'll have another look, if I can find alternative sites.
I'd be happy with max. 6Mp - more ain't better.

Quoted message said:

The C70Z is not showerproof but offers more control over the final
picture taking and has a better lens.

Would prefer showerproof.

Quoted message said:

If you want a comparison with the OM1 then you really need to take a
look at the new E400 or E410 which are the equivalent in DSLR terms
(i.e. currently the smallest and lightest DSLR models on the market)

No, not DSLR!

Thanks.

--
Peter.
If you can do it today, you didn't put off enough yesterday.

David Skinner said:

In article <[email hidden]>,
[email hidden] says...

Quoted message said:

Been looking at such for a friend. Checked Olympus for a start, as most
models are OK in rain, but the reports aren't good.

This month's Practical Photography carries a positive review of the
Olympus Mju 770 SW. Drop-proof, waterproof, crush-proof and freeze-proof
(all within reason of course - it's not a tank). 7MP, reasonable zoom
range (although, like almost all compacts, it doesn't go wide enough for
my liking), £249.

Ouch! Twice the price we're considering.

Quoted message said:

It's only a short review and doesn't go into how simple or otherwise it
is to operate, so it might be worth a trip to Jessops to play with one.
After all, it's not like you've got to actually *buy it* from them.

True.
--
Peter.
If you can do it today, you didn't put off enough yesterday.

Paul Saunders <[email hidden]> writes

Quoted message said:

David Skinner said:

It's only a short review and doesn't go into how simple or otherwise
it is to operate, so it might be worth a trip to Jessops to play with
one. After all, it's not like you've got to actually *buy it* from
them.

Why not? I've bought most of my camera gear from there. The process is
simple, you find the cheapest price on the internet, write down the name and
phone number of the company, then ask Jessops to price-match it. They've
always done that with me. If there are any problems, it's easy to take it
back.

Paul

I bought all three of my digi cameras at Jessops. I found them to be
the only source of replacement batteries for my old camcorder, after
derisive laughter from the Curry sales excretives, where I bought the
camcorder.
I decided that they were worth my custom, and they do try to match the
"warehouse" prices, which isn't easy when you are providing proper
advice and support.
--
Gordon H
(Remove invalid to email)

In message <[email hidden]>, PeterC
<[email hidden]> writes

Quoted message said:

Most of the reviews and users' comments mentioned complex menus and slow
operation; also pictures not too good.
I was happy with my Olympus, but that was a v. early OM1, so things might
have changed since then!

Morgan Computers have got a few Olympus cameras on their website at the
moment, they're generally older models, but don't cost a fortune.

http://www.morgancomputers.co.uk/shop/products2.asp?CategoryID=16

We've just bought a mju410 from them for the office.

Regards,
--
Neil Pugh

"PeterC" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Been looking at such for a friend. Checked Olympus for a start, as most
models are OK in rain, but the reports aren't good.
So, any advice please on this:

basically point'n'shoot
OK for scenery/daylight
weather/muck/jolt-resistant
simple menu structure
~3X optical zoom
good battery life

Sony seem good but, as with most makes, would soon 'die' in a rucksack.

She doesn't want anything too complex and heavy. I don't want it to be too
expensive.

I'll repeat what an earlier thread contained here: a wideangle (at least
28mm wide) is pretty essential for landscapes.

So I would look at the Panasonic LX2, FX07, FX30 or TZ3, and Canon Powershot
SD800IS (Ixus850 IS). The Canon is the only one with a viewfinder (optical)
sadly. All have image stabilisation, the Canon is the smallest and
lightest.

I have the LX2 and like it a lot - it has a 28mm lens, sensor and LCD, fully
manual and supports RAW. It is fine noise-wise except at high (400+ ) ISO
which I doubt you'll need on the fells! Quite small, not a 'trouser pocket
cam' but fine in a coat/jacket. But may be too much camera for some.

If your friend's not bothered about fully manual and is happy with auto or
scene
modes, then one of the FX models (very similar to each other) will be OK or
the TZ3 - which is distinctive because it has a 10x zoom. I also have an
FX01 (the predecessor of the FXs mentioned above) and it is a great pocket
cam with a strong (metal) body, simple menus, takes good movies too.

Battery life for both Panasonics I have is superb.

I've no experience with Canons but obviously it will be pretty good -
though not as fine imagewise as other Canons or the LX2, I think, reading
the reviews on http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/canonsd800is/page11.asp

PeterC said:

On Tue, 8 May 2007 20:23:27 +0100, David Skinner wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

This month's Practical Photography carries a positive review of the
Olympus Mju 770 SW. Drop-proof, waterproof, crush-proof and freeze-proof

Quoted message said:

Ouch! Twice the price we're considering.

You're paying that much more for /fully/ waterproof. I've taken
underwater video with my 725 (part of the reason I want this level of
waterproofing is I'm a sea kayaker, and it might be in my pocket in a
capsize). But if (as is entirely likely) you don't need that level of
waterproofing then why pay for it?
OTOH, you might slip during a river crossing and want more than
showerproof, but there's no denying it ramps up the cost a lot.

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net [email hidden] http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/

David Skinner said:

I adore my Sigma 10-20mm zoom (that's about 17mm at the wide end in
35mm equiv). I bet there aren't many compacts that match that!

Same with my Canon 10-22, equivalent to 16mm at the wide end.

Quoted message said:

28mm
would do though.

At a pinch, although I've always found that 24mm gives you that essential
little bit extra. 24mm is quite rare with digicams, but the Sony R1 has one,
and it's supposed to be an excellent lens, worth buying the camera just for
the lens, so I've read.

<Jessops>

Quoted message said:

Maybe it's just me, maybe it's just the Nottingham branch, but the
last couple of times I tried to buy stuff there I ended up leaving
empty- handed without even speaking to anyone - they would ignore me
and skip to people who had entered the shop after me, fawn around the
pretty young thing with the stuck-film, hang-around in the back room,
etc.

I guess branches vary. They're pretty good in Swansea, and of course they
know me by name.

Paul
--
http://www.wilderness-wales.co.uk

PeterC said:

I'd be happy with max. 6Mp - more ain't better.

Ooh! You've touched a nerve there! You really should quantify a statement
like that!

More is definitely better if you want to make 24" x 16" prints, and in fact
it's essential if you want to sell images to a publisher who states that
size as their minimum requirements.

But that's probably not what you want it for, right? 6MP is adequate for
prints up to about A3 in size. And in a digicam, more megapixels = more
noise, which is not an advantage.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

If you want a comparison with the OM1 then you really need to take a
look at the new E400 or E410 which are the equivalent in DSLR terms
(i.e. currently the smallest and lightest DSLR models on the market)

No, not DSLR!

You say that like it's a bad thing! Depends on your requirements of course,
but a DSLR will give much better quality, and they all have fully automatic
modes if that's what you want.

Paul
--
http://www.wilderness-wales.co.uk

Paul Saunders said:

PeterC said:

I'd be happy with max. 6Mp - more ain't better.

Ooh! You've touched a nerve there! You really should quantify a statement
like that!

More is definitely better if you want to make 24" x 16" prints, and in fact
it's essential if you want to sell images to a publisher who states that
size as their minimum requirements.

But that's probably not what you want it for, right? 6MP is adequate for
prints up to about A3 in size. And in a digicam, more megapixels = more
noise, which is not an advantage.

This is more the sort of use; probably mainly on the PC, actually.
Yes, was considering noise.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

If you want a comparison with the OM1 then you really need to take a
look at the new E400 or E410 which are the equivalent in DSLR terms
(i.e. currently the smallest and lightest DSLR models on the market)

No, not DSLR!

You say that like it's a bad thing! Depends on your requirements of course,
but a DSLR will give much better quality, and they all have fully automatic
modes if that's what you want.

Not bad, Paul, just that she wants a simple, small, light but fairly robust
camera that doesn't cost a fortune.

Personally an SLR is attractive, but I have 2 cameras that I don't use and
can't justify not using another one!

--
Peter.
If you can do it today, you didn't put off enough yesterday.