Helmets worn

(Ziggy) said:

Number of helmets being worn *None*.

A pleasant start to the day.

After a recent thread on helmets. I counted cyclists around home
(north side of Glasgow). About 18 out of 20 were helmeted. I think
that is getting fairly typical here, certainly at least 3/4 of
cyclists I see are helmeted. Then I was up in Inverness for 3 days
this week. What a contrast. I would say 1/4 or less helmeted. Many
cyclists using normal clothing and the bike as the natural means of
transport for a town like Inverness.
Anybody else seeing big variations in helmet wearing rates in
different areas?

Iain

Ziggy said:

I went out a little later than usual this morning and hit the school influx. I
gave up counting the children after about a dozen but there were five cycle
mounted posties.

Number of helmets being worn *None*.

Posties in danger of heavy handed discipline cases under the conduct
code for not wearing uniform, unfortunately five.

Instead of training and safe methods of working Royal Mail throw
plastic hats and hi-vis vests at the problem.
--
Phil Cook looking north over the park to the "Westminster Gasworks"

Phil Cook said:

Ziggy said:

I went out a little later than usual this morning and hit the school influx. I
gave up counting the children after about a dozen but there were five cycle
mounted posties.

Number of helmets being worn *None*.

Posties in danger of heavy handed discipline cases under the conduct
code for not wearing uniform, unfortunately five.

Posties illegally riding on the pavement: 100% :/

In message <[email hidden]>,
iarocu <[email hidden]> writes

Quoted message said:

(Ziggy) said:

Number of helmets being worn *None*.

A pleasant start to the day.

After a recent thread on helmets. I counted cyclists around home
(north side of Glasgow). About 18 out of 20 were helmeted. I think
that is getting fairly typical here, certainly at least 3/4 of
cyclists I see are helmeted. Then I was up in Inverness for 3 days
this week. What a contrast. I would say 1/4 or less helmeted. Many
cyclists using normal clothing and the bike as the natural means of
transport for a town like Inverness.

Quoted message said:

Anybody else seeing big variations in helmet wearing rates in
different areas?

Not noticed the proportion, but I live in Cambridgeshire, there quite a
lot of 'utility' cyclists about in the local towns, and I'd say helmet
usage is on the lower side.

There is lots of pavement cycling though. I think it's been encouraged
because lots of places have pavement cycle lanes, and cycling on the
rest of the pavements seems to ignored/expected.
--
Chris French

I have noticed that specialy experienced riders wear helmets.
Unfortunately young riders are ashamed of helmets (why cos they don't
look cool than ?). I really don't understand those people.

If you look objectivly they are thinking something like: It is better
to get killed in accident than wear helmet.
BTW here is just a small poll we made at cyclingboard:
http://www.cyclingboard.com/ftopic23.html
6:6 currently :S

FabianG wrote on 28/04/2007 10:43 +0100:

Quoted message said:

I have noticed that specialy experienced riders wear helmets.
Unfortunately young riders are ashamed of helmets (why cos they don't
look cool than ?). I really don't understand those people.

Perhaps they are just better informed than you are.
http://www.cyclehelmets.org

--
Tony

"The most savage controversies are those about matters as to which there
is no good evidence either way."
- Bertrand Russell

iarocu said:

Anybody else seeing big variations in helmet wearing rates in
different areas?

I seem to be seeing more helmets recently, but I keep forgetting to count.

One thing I've noticed on recent rides is that helmets seem to be more
common on a flat cyclepath than on hilly roads.

--
Danny Colyer <URL:http://www.colyer.plus.com/danny/>
Reply address is valid, but that on my website is checked more often
"Daddy, put that down. Daddy, put that down. Daddy, put that down.
Daddy, why did you put that down?" - Charlie Colyer, age 2

On 28 Apr 2007 02:43:02 -0700 someone who may be FabianG
<[email hidden]> wrote this:-

Quoted message said:

I have noticed that specialy experienced riders wear helmets.

I haven't. Indeed it is those who have looked into the subject in
detail who tend not to wear the things.

--
David Hansen, Edinburgh
I will *always* explain revoked encryption keys, unless RIP prevents me
http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts2000/00023--e.htm#54

Danny Colyer said:

iarocu said:

Anybody else seeing big variations in helmet wearing rates in
different areas?

I seem to be seeing more helmets recently, but I keep forgetting to count.

One thing I've noticed on recent rides is that helmets seem to be more
common on a flat cyclepath than on hilly roads.

This may be very worrying.

"Flat cyclepath" to me implies a large percentage of recreational riders -
i.e. mumsie and daddie out for a saturday pootle with the kiddies. These
are, bless them, the voters of today and tomorrow; if they have already
been convinced that MFH's will save their lives, the law will not be far
behind.

I said:

Quoted message said:

One thing I've noticed on recent rides is that helmets seem to be more
common on a flat cyclepath than on hilly roads.

and _ responded:

Quoted message said:

This may be very worrying.

"Flat cyclepath" to me implies a large percentage of recreational riders -
i.e. mumsie and daddie out for a saturday pootle with the kiddies. These
are, bless them, the voters of today and tomorrow; if they have already
been convinced that MFH's will save their lives, the law will not be far
behind.

Sorry, that's a fair implication based on what I wrote, so I should have
clarified that flat cyclepath for me usually means commuters. I commute
along the Bath-Bristol cyclepath. During the school holidays there will
be a lot of recreational riders out during the evening commute, but the
rest of the time it's mostly commuters.

At weekends in good weather there certainly are a lot of recreational
family cyclists along there, but unless *I'm* out with my family I tend
to avoid the path at those times.

Hilly roads tends to mean more serious recreational cyclists. My own
recent riding on hilly roads has been on extended evening commutes
intended to get some miles into my legs.

--
Danny Colyer <URL:http://www.colyer.plus.com/danny/>
Reply address is valid, but that on my website is checked more often
"Daddy, put that down. Daddy, put that down. Daddy, put that down.
Daddy, why did you put that down?" - Charlie Colyer, age 2

in message <[email hidden]>, FabianG

(') said:

I have noticed that specialy experienced riders wear helmets.

Specially experienced riders mostly don't wear helmets, except when racing.

Quoted message said:

If you look objectivly they are thinking something like: It is better
to get killed in accident than wear helmet.

A helmet won't stop you being killed. Increases in helmet wearing are
statistically linked with increasing death rates, and in the countries
with the lowest death rates virtually no-one wears a helmet. This isn't
evidence that the helmets actually cause the extra deaths, although they
may do; but helmets certainly don't overall save any lives at all.

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

IMHO, there aren't enough committed Christians, but that's care
in the community for you. -- Ben Evans

FabianG said:

I have noticed that specialy experienced riders wear helmets.
Unfortunately young riders are ashamed of helmets (why cos they don't
look cool than ?). I really don't understand those people.

If you look objectivly they are thinking something like: It is better
to get killed in accident than wear helmet.
BTW here is just a small poll we made at cyclingboard:
http://www.cyclingboard.com/ftopic23.html
6:6 currently :S

How is that "objective"?

As the statistics show that there is at best no infleunce, and possible a
bad influence of helmet-wearing upon injury rates, a truly "objective" view
would instead be something like:

"It is better _not_ to get killed thatn wear a helmet."

And in the words of a refreshingly frank politician now sadly departed -

"Polls are for dogs."

Response to _:

Quoted message said:

"Flat cyclepath" to me implies a large percentage of recreational riders -
i.e. mumsie and daddie out for a saturday pootle with the kiddies. These
are, bless them, the voters of today and tomorrow; if they have already
been convinced that MFH's will save their lives, the law will not be far
behind.

It must have been May Bank Holiday just a couple of years ago that I
cycled past the bottom of the Manifold Valley cycle track in the Peak
District; there's maybe half a mile of shared-use pavement between the
carpark and the cycle track, and it was thronged with mums, dads and
kids - going in both directions on the one pavement. AFAICT I was the
only cyclist not wearing a helmet, and I was the only person on the
[deserted] road rather than the [packed] pavement.

--
Mark, UK
"The root of all superstition is that men observe when a thing hits, but
not when it misses."

FabianG said:

I have noticed that specialy experienced riders wear helmets.
Unfortunately young riders are ashamed of helmets (why cos they don't
look cool than ?). I really don't understand those people.

Probably because you are terminally stupid.

Now go away.

I said:

Quoted message said:

I seem to be seeing more helmets recently, but I keep forgetting to count.

One thing I've noticed on recent rides is that helmets seem to be more
common on a flat cyclepath than on hilly roads.

and _ responded.

Quoted message said:

This may be very worrying.

"Flat cyclepath" to me implies a large percentage of recreational riders -
i.e. mumsie and daddie out for a saturday pootle with the kiddies. These
are, bless them, the voters of today and tomorrow; if they have already
been convinced that MFH's will save their lives, the law will not be far
behind.

I counted today.

This morning I saw 18 cyclists, 7 of them wearing helmets. This evening
I saw 44 cyclists, 16 of them wearing helmets.

What I found particularly interesting was that if I hadn't been counting
I would probably have finished with the impression that I had seen more
helmeted than unhelmeted cyclists. The helmeted cyclists tended to be
more noticeable and memorable to me because they were, for the most
part, more like me (i.e. riding expensive bikes and wearing Lycra) and
familiar faces (people I see commuting day after day, year round). The
unhelmeted cyclists were mostly strangers wearing everyday clothes and
riding cheap MTB's.

This would suggest that Fabian may have something when he comments that
more experienced riders wear helmets. It looks (from my small sample)
as though the masses who don't consider themselves serious cyclists also
don't bother with helmets.

This morning's sample included 4 children, none accompanied by parents
and none wearing helmets. This evening's included only 2 children,
helmeted and accompanied by an unhelmeted parent.

--
Danny Colyer <URL:http://www.colyer.plus.com/danny/>
Reply address is valid, but that on my website is checked more often
"Daddy, put that down. Daddy, put that down. Daddy, put that down.
Daddy, why did you put that down?" - Charlie Colyer, age 2

"FabianG" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I have noticed that specialy experienced riders wear helmets.
Unfortunately young riders are ashamed of helmets (why cos they don't
look cool than ?). I really don't understand those people.

If you look objectivly they are thinking something like: It is better
to get killed in accident than wear helmet.
BTW here is just a small poll we made at cyclingboard:
http://www.cyclingboard.com/ftopic23.html
6:6 currently :S

Fabian,

thanks for directing us to the above site. The way it's set up it reads
"Cycling Boar" I rest my case.

Given that it appears to be specifically about BMX riding, and has nothing
whatsoever to do with utility cycling, and the correspondents using it
appear remarkably ill-informed, it is utterly irrelevant. But please don't
let that stop you posting, as utter irrelevance/ignorance seems to be
endemic in helmet discussions.

Quoted message said:

"Danny Colyer" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I said:

Quoted message said:

I seem to be seeing more helmets recently, but I keep forgetting to
count.

One thing I've noticed on recent rides is that helmets seem to be more
common on a flat cyclepath than on hilly roads.

I cycle the Gloucester Road in Bristol, a busy commuter route, every day,
and sometimes count the cyclists wearing helmets, which has on occasion
reached 50%. Very worrying.

Danny Colyer said:

This would suggest that Fabian may have something when he comments that
more experienced riders wear helmets. It looks (from my small sample)
as though the masses who don't consider themselves serious cyclists also
don't bother with helmets.

That's totally the opposite to my experience though. The younger
cyclists and children on hybrids and mtbs I see commuting every day
are seen wearing helmets, but almost my entire club, and most of those
I know who do audax and are considerably (older and) more experienced,
do not wear them.

I think that with less knowledgable cyclists it is just accepted that
'people wear helmets these days so they must work, right?' But I think
that it is a fashion thing and possibly also a macho thing amongst
'serious' road cyclists. Those young (men) you see wearing full lycra
and on racing (rather than touring or hybrid bikes) like to look the
part and to them that means looking like the pros on the telly, (well
'ard) which means wearing a helmet. More experienced and dare I say
it, older roadies remember a time when the road racing pros didn't
wear helmets and perhaps they are also less bothered about image, as
they know they have nothing to prove.