Equestrian posts

Danny Colyer said the following on 13/07/2006 21:57:

Quoted message said:

that were erected on the Bath-Bristol cyclepath on Tuesday. They're at
the Avon Lane access point in Saltford, which is where I join the path
on the way home.

I e-mailed the picture to a few appropriate people, asking what was
going on and pointing out that they make it harder to check for traffic
coming from the right when joining the path from Avon Lane. Today, I
have received this reply from the BANES cycling officer:

That seems a sensible reply from a counil official. Amazed!!!

I wonder what the rights of way issue is? I know on bridleways that
cyclists have to give way to horses and peds, but this path isn't a
bridleway - it's a footpath/cyclepath. As such, I can imagine some of
the "I'm in the right" cyclists just bombing past the horses with the
obvious dangers. I hope this all works out OK - I take the view that
the various facilities are for all to share. Just that some people
can't play nicely - horseriders, peds and cyclists.

It might also be worth taking a plastic bag with you if you grow roses :-)

--
Paul Boyd
http://www.paul-boyd.co.uk/

Paul Boyd wrote:

<About horses on the cycle path>

Quoted message said:

It might also be worth taking a plastic bag with you if you grow roses :-)

"I'm collecting it to put on my rhubarb."

"Really? We generally put custard on ours."

Boom boom.

--
Brian G

in message <[email hidden]>, Danny

Colyer (') said:

"The posts are for the signs which are being erected as part of a 12
month multi use trial in which horse riders will also be using some
existing shared use paths within the Authority including the section of
Bristol and Bath Railway Path in Bath and North East Somerset. At Avon
Lane horse riders are asked to leave the path. I will speak to the
Engineer who is dealing with this when he returns from leave on Monday
17th July and ask him to look into the concerns about visibility. The
signs are due to start going up on Monday 17th, however, I will ask the
Contractor not to do these until the visibility issue has been
checked."

There are a number of different communities of route users whom the
highways people want to shuffle off the roads. The horse people have
every right to ride their horses and as much right as we have to have
special facilities provided for them. However, there are particular
difficulties and dangers of mixing equestrian and cycle traffic
particularly on a narrow shared use path.

If you approach a horse fast and near-silently you are going to spook it,
and a spooked horse is dangerous both to its rider and to other users of
the path. If, as I understand, the Bristol-Bath path is a commuter run,
I imagine many of its users are travelling fairly fast. In practice I
suspect that either the horses will make it unacceptably dangerous for
the cyclists to use the path, or vice versa, or, worst of all, both.

Given that this is a '12 month trial' I suggest you keep a log of all
incidents you become aware of to feed back to the council. This isn't to
say 'we were here first so the equestrians can't use it'; in the end the
public policy balance may be that there's more need for an equestrian
facility than for a cycle one. And it may be that I'm completely wrong
and you'll all rub along happily. But I would hate the highways people
to be able to report back to the council 'oh the trial went very well,
we can open up all our cyclepaths to horses' if this is not in fact
true.

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/
;; First they came for the asylum seekers,
;; and I did not speak out because I was not an asylum seeker.
;; Then they came for the gypsies,
;; and I did not speak out because I was not a gypsy...
;; Pastor Martin Niemöller, translated by Michael Howard.

Brian G said the following on 14/07/2006 08:44:

Paul Boyd said:

<About horses on the cycle path>

Quoted message said:

It might also be worth taking a plastic bag with you if you grow roses
:-)

"I'm collecting it to put on my rhubarb."

"Really? We generally put custard on ours."

Boom boom.

LOL!!!!

--
Paul Boyd
http://www.paul-boyd.co.uk/

Simon Brooke said:

There are a number of different communities of route users whom the
highways people want to shuffle off the roads.

Yup, you said it.

Road engineers have a WHOLE LOT TO ANSWER FOR.

As one small example, I'm thinking of a new road near my company HQ.
Brand new road, almost straight, goes between two huge roundabouts. One
end is at a shopping centre near Leamington, the other leads towards two
M40 junctions.

And you regularly see a speed camera van parked halfway along this stretch.
No, I'm not turning towards you-know-who, my point is the road is
specifically engineered to be fast and smooth - then 'they' try to lock
the stable door after the horse has bolted by using cameras. Not that the
horse is on the road.
Road has no footpath at all - you do see the occasional pedestrian
trudging along the verges.
Roundabout at either end is not pleasant on a bike, and I would say
dangerous for the novice cyclist.
And so it goes.

Simon Brooke said:

There are a number of different communities of route users whom the
highways people want to shuffle off the roads. The horse people have
every right to ride their horses and as much right as we have to have
special facilities provided for them. However, there are particular
difficulties and dangers of mixing equestrian and cycle traffic
particularly on a narrow shared use path.

Remember Danny rides a bent, and we know how much horses love them. :-(

--
Dave...

dkahn400 said:

Remember Danny rides a bent, and we know how much horses love them. :-(

Though they have a reputation as horse-spookers I've never found that
(and I've come across quite a few around the lanes in Angus over the
years). I do make a point of approaching slowly and making sure the
riders know I'm there well in advance: I suspect that a careful approach
is more significant than what flavour of bike.

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net [email hidden] http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/

dkahn400 said:

Remember Danny rides a bent, and we know how much horses love them. :-(

--
Dave...

That's exactly what I was thinking when I read his OP. Not a good
mixture, IMO.

The only way I don't have to stop and stand up for horses in the
country is when my Hurricane is "hidden" in a large bunch of uprights.
The horses seem to understand I'm just a bicycle then. Most of the
horses in Hyde Park seem to have learnt that I'm a bicycle, though I
still see them eyeing me very suspiciously on occasion.

Peter Clinch said:

dkahn400 said:

Remember Danny rides a bent, and we know how much horses love them. :-(

Though they have a reputation as horse-spookers I've never found that
(and I've come across quite a few around the lanes in Angus over the
years). I do make a point of approaching slowly and making sure the
riders know I'm there well in advance: I suspect that a careful approach
is more significant than what flavour of bike.

Messrs Larrington and Chapman may well be along in a minute. :-)

--
Dave...

Peter Clinch said:

dkahn400 said:

Remember Danny rides a bent, and we know how much horses love them. :-(

Though they have a reputation as horse-spookers I've never found that
(and I've come across quite a few around the lanes in Angus over the
years). I do make a point of approaching slowly and making sure the
riders know I'm there well in advance: I suspect that a careful approach
is more significant than what flavour of bike.

I upset horses on the trice, but not on the upright, despite treating
them the same.

I'd say something like 30% of horses really don't like the trice, and
occasionally I've had to get off and stand up, because a horse
approaching head-on would not go past even when I was stationary. If
it comes to that I tend to stand and recite Jabberwocky loudly - that
cheers up the horse, and hopefully spooks the rider.

I suspect long low quietly moving things with forward-facing eyes
just screams SNEAKING PREDATOR to a horse.

regards, Ian SMith
--
|\ /| no .sig
|o o|
|/ \|

Paul Boyd said:

I can imagine some of
the "I'm in the right" cyclists just bombing past the horses with the
obvious dangers.

I mentioned this to a few people at work today, who were all appalled by
the idea of letting horses on the cyclepath. They included our web
designer, who is cycling to work about once a fortnight during the
summer (maybe he'll manage a bit more from next week, when the A4's
closed). His comment was: "I'm not slowing down for them".

Mind you, this guy rides on the pavement and jumps red lights, then
complains that the roads are too dangerous. He'd probably find the
roads less dangerous if he rode >6" from the kerb.

--
Danny Colyer <URL:http://www.colyer.plus.com/danny/>
"He who dares not offend cannot be honest." - Thomas Paine

dkahn400 said:

Quoted message said:

Remember Danny rides a bent, and we know how much horses love them. :-(

and Peter Clinch responded:

Quoted message said:

Though they have a reputation as horse-spookers I've never found that
(and I've come across quite a few around the lanes in Angus over the
years). I do make a point of approaching slowly and making sure the
riders know I'm there well in advance: I suspect that a careful approach
is more significant than what flavour of bike.

For the most part there's not a problem. I used to ride horses, so I'm
wary rather than nervous. I pass wide and slow, and start speaking to
the rider long before I do so. I've still managed to spook them on two
occasions.

I can't think of any point where the width of the cyclepath is as great
as the distance that I would usually leave when passing a horse on the
road. The fact that it will not be possible to pass as wide as I
believe is necessary worries me, but doesn't seem to bother the BANES
councillors. I've actually overheard councillors discussing this and
expressing disbelief that anyone could possibly object to the scheme.

Thankfully my commute only overlaps the area where horses will be
allowed by a few hundred yards.

--
Danny Colyer <URL:http://www.colyer.plus.com/danny/>
Subscribe to PlusNet <URL:http://www.colyer.plus.com/referral/>
"He who dares not offend cannot be honest." - Thomas Paine

Simon Brooke said:

If, as I understand, the Bristol-Bath path is a commuter run,
I imagine many of its users are travelling fairly fast. In practice I
suspect that either the horses will make it unacceptably dangerous for
the cyclists to use the path, or vice versa, or, worst of all, both.

It gets quite busy with commuters, but on sunny weekends and during the
school holidays it gets far, far busier with leisure cyclists riding
with their families. These are the times when I think the horses will
pose the greatest danger.

Quoted message said:

Given that this is a '12 month trial' I suggest you keep a log of all
incidents you become aware of to feed back to the council. This isn't to
say 'we were here first so the equestrians can't use it'; in the end the
public policy balance may be that there's more need for an equestrian
facility than for a cycle one. And it may be that I'm completely wrong
and you'll all rub along happily. But I would hate the highways people
to be able to report back to the council 'oh the trial went very well,
we can open up all our cyclepaths to horses' if this is not in fact
true.

That's an excellent idea, I will do so. I'm fairly confident, though,
that there will be a KSI long before the end of the trial, in which case
a log of incidents may not be necessary.

--
Danny Colyer <URL:http://www.colyer.plus.com/danny/>
Subscribe to PlusNet <URL:http://www.colyer.plus.com/referral/>
"He who dares not offend cannot be honest." - Thomas Paine

Peter Clinch said:

Though they have a reputation as horse-spookers I've never found that
(and I've come across quite a few around the lanes in Angus over the
years). I do make a point of approaching slowly and making sure the
riders know I'm there well in advance: I suspect that a careful
approach is more significant than what flavour of bike.

Lotsa lotsa horses where I live, near Newmarket, and I am certain that
most horses are normally OK with uprights (perhaps 'cos the stable lads
& lasses have bicycles not cars), and about a third are spooked by the
'bent (that's on-road horses, nearly all racehorses hate it). This
evening a pony pulling a trap, that I've seen a few times before and
thought was OK, gave it the wide eyes and flared nostrils. Being
attached to the trap reduced its options and the driver steered it to
the verge. Yes, I was already going slowly and watching the horse.

Also tonight I came upon a man walking a dog on a very narrow public
road. From about 20m away I said "Reel in your dog please." Man
stops, dog extends the trip-wire, man says "What?". Perhaps I should
have talked to the more intelligent of the two and said "Reel in your
human please."?

Mike

Ian Smith said:

I suspect long low quietly moving things with forward-facing eyes
just screams SNEAKING PREDATOR to a horse.

I always assumed that it's 'cos 'bents look a bit like a big chainsaw -
as used to cut up dead horseflesh 😉 but Ian's idea has more credence.
As for sharing a cycle path (with no significant grassy areas on both
sides) with horses - no thanks: too dangerous for both parties.

"Ian Smith" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Peter Clinch said:

dkahn400 said:

Remember Danny rides a bent, and we know how much horses love them. :-(

Though they have a reputation as horse-spookers I've never found that
(and I've come across quite a few around the lanes in Angus over the
years). I do make a point of approaching slowly and making sure the
riders know I'm there well in advance: I suspect that a careful approach
is more significant than what flavour of bike.

I upset horses on the trice, but not on the upright, despite treating
them the same.

I've never had a problem when on the Trice. As when on the upright, I speak
to the horse rider well in advance, and make sure I keep speaking as I go by
slowly. I'm also known to speak directly to the horse. Even with the
refective/fluorescent flag bobbing, I've not had any problem with horses.

D*gs, on the other hand....

Cheers, helen s

On 14/07/2006 21:50, Danny Colyer said,

Quoted message said:

I mentioned this to a few people at work today, who were all appalled by
the idea of letting horses on the cyclepath. They included our web
designer, who is cycling to work about once a fortnight during the
summer (maybe he'll manage a bit more from next week, when the A4's
closed). His comment was: "I'm not slowing down for them".

That attitude is why we have a bad reputation! I'm not sure I would
like the idea of having horses on a cyclepath either, but I'm sure
horseriders don't want cyclists on bridleways. In fact, I know they
don't, which is why I always give way, call out a friendly greeting, and
generally be as pleasant as possible in a one-man attempt to generate
some goodwill. It's a shame that the various groups can't just get on
and tolerate each other.

--
Paul Boyd
http://www.paul-boyd.co.uk/

On 14/07/2006 21:58, Danny Colyer said,

Quoted message said:

I've actually overheard councillors discussing this and
expressing disbelief that anyone could possibly object to the scheme.

I bet the number of these councillors who actually ride either a horse
or a bike is a nice round number. Zero!

--
Paul Boyd
http://www.paul-boyd.co.uk/

On 14/07/2006 22:21, Mike Causer said,

Quoted message said:

Also tonight I came upon a man walking a dog on a very narrow public
road. From about 20m away I said "Reel in your dog please." Man
stops, dog extends the trip-wire, man says "What?". Perhaps I should
have talked to the more intelligent of the two and said "Reel in your
human please."?

LOL!!!! I know that situation well :-)

Man (never seems to be woman) sees bike coming, obligingly stands to one
side of the path to let you pass, totally oblivious to their mutt
ferreting about on the other side of the path tethered by an almost
invisible black string.

--
Paul Boyd
http://www.paul-boyd.co.uk/