DD accident

Jo said:

Just heard from husband & son, who are currently riding the Dunwich
Dynamo. Husband (who is a nurse) has had to attend a nasty accident,
probably fatal. I don't know any other details, other than that it was a
cyclist, as they are still riding. I trust nobody here was involved?
Jo

It's just been on BBC Radio - rider killed after a collision with a van
:-(

On 9 Jul 2006 04:07:00 -0700 someone who may be "[email hidden]"
<[email hidden]> wrote this:-

Quoted message said:

It's just been on BBC Radio - rider killed after a collision with a van

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/essex/5162602.stm

--
David Hansen, Edinburgh
I will *always* explain revoked encryption keys, unless RIP prevents me
http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts2000/00023--e.htm#54

Jo said:

I trust nobody here was involved?

Not directly no, but I was there when it happened.

Specifically, the location was North Weld, Essex, just off from Epping
Forest.

I was at the back of a group of about 30 odd cyclists making there way
out of London, on roads that were becoming pretty quiet, when I heard
a yell, a deep loud thud, another bang, cyclists falling over and then
a child [who appeared to be walking with a guardian of some kind].
screaming in horror as she saw what had happened.

Then obviously a big comotion ensued, people jumping off bikes,
attending to the injured, making phone calls etc.

After a few minutes of standing there being of little use to anybody,
we carried on. As we passed the 'two' people down on the ground, they
were motionless...one obviously killed on impact. The guys drivers-
side windscreen was shattered and there were no other cars around.

Being on recumbents with a lower line of vision than the others we
heard everything and saw nothing or the manner of the impact, so
that's about all I can say I'm afraid. Sadly, there were 30 or so
others that saw much more.

Garry

garryb59 said:

Jo said:

I trust nobody here was involved?

Not directly no, but I was there when it happened.

Specifically, the location was North Weld, Essex, just off from Epping
Forest.

I was at the back of a group of about 30 odd cyclists making there way
out of London, on roads that were becoming pretty quiet, when I heard
a yell, a deep loud thud, another bang, cyclists falling over and then
a child [who appeared to be walking with a guardian of some kind].
screaming in horror as she saw what had happened.

Then obviously a big comotion ensued, people jumping off bikes,
attending to the injured, making phone calls etc.

After a few minutes of standing there being of little use to anybody,
we carried on. As we passed the 'two' people down on the ground, they
were motionless...one obviously killed on impact. The guys drivers-
side windscreen was shattered and there were no other cars around.

Being on recumbents with a lower line of vision than the others we
heard everything and saw nothing or the manner of the impact, so
that's about all I can say I'm afraid. Sadly, there were 30 or so
others that saw much more.

Garry

I have a little more information now. Of the two injured one had fairly
superficial injuries. The other one had multiple severe injuries.My
husband did what he could (as I am sure others did too), and managed to
keep him ventilated, in a fashion, until the ambulance came. He did not
expect him to survive, and sadly was proved to be right.
Jo

Jo said:

Quoted message said:

I have a little more information now. Of the two injured one had fairly
superficial injuries. The other one had multiple severe injuries.My
husband did what he could (as I am sure others did too), and managed to
keep him ventilated, in a fashion, until the ambulance came. He did not
expect him to survive, and sadly was proved to be right.

In a truly tradgic situation like this, you want somebody around that
knows what they're doing, and as I stood around and watched those
attending to the injured I was reminded once again how lacking my
emergency knowledge is. It's good he was there - it won't help the
bereaved family, but at least people did what they could.

Garry

On Sun, 09 Jul 2006 17:50:39 GMT someone who may be garryb59
<[email protected]> wrote this:-

Quoted message said:

In a truly tradgic situation like this, you want somebody around that
knows what they're doing, and as I stood around and watched those
attending to the injured I was reminded once again how lacking my
emergency knowledge is.

At the risk of sounding callous, perhaps, in a while, you might like
to consider attending a First Aid course. A variety are on offer
from the Red Cross or your local ambulance society (St John's in
England). The courses are not as horrible as one may think, though
the 1970s film on dealing with someone who has been shot with a
spear gun is not pleasant. The courses are very useful and there is
no obligation to do any more with it, though the voluntary societies
are always looking for trained people to lend a hand at events.
Perhaps the most important thing to remember is that there is very
little wrong with someone who is running around screaming, it is the
quiet ones who are dying.

http://www.redcross.org.uk//standard.asp?id=51069&cachefixer= is the
British Red Cross' courses. A search engine will find the other
societies' courses.

--
David Hansen, Edinburgh
I will *always* explain revoked encryption keys, unless RIP prevents me
http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts2000/00023--e.htm#54

David Hansen said:

At the risk of sounding callous, perhaps, in a while, you might like
to consider attending a First Aid course.

I may feel different if I was there, but I don't think that sounds
callous at all. In Australia you regularly see adverts from St John
Ambulance for their first aid courses and they are very powerful
(usually appealing to the fear of what could happen to your kids).
Though how effective they are I don't know. They do 2 hour courses on
the basics and I seem to remember similar courses being offered in the
UK. Even if you've done one of these before, it's worth while repeating
them every year or two, mainly to refresh your memory but also to pick
up on new techniques or discredited old ones.

Graeme

Jo said:

garryb59 said:

Jo said:

I trust nobody here was involved?

Not directly no, but I was there when it happened.

Specifically, the location was North Weld, Essex, just off from Epping
Forest.

I was at the back of a group of about 30 odd cyclists making there way
out of London, on roads that were becoming pretty quiet, when I heard
a yell, a deep loud thud, another bang, cyclists falling over and then
a child [who appeared to be walking with a guardian of some kind].
screaming in horror as she saw what had happened.

Then obviously a big comotion ensued, people jumping off bikes,
attending to the injured, making phone calls etc.

After a few minutes of standing there being of little use to anybody,
we carried on. As we passed the 'two' people down on the ground, they
were motionless...one obviously killed on impact. The guys drivers-
side windscreen was shattered and there were no other cars around.

Being on recumbents with a lower line of vision than the others we
heard everything and saw nothing or the manner of the impact, so
that's about all I can say I'm afraid. Sadly, there were 30 or so
others that saw much more.

Garry

I have a little more information now. Of the two injured one had fairly
superficial injuries. The other one had multiple severe injuries.My
husband did what he could (as I am sure others did too), and managed to
keep him ventilated, in a fashion, until the ambulance came. He did not
expect him to survive, and sadly was proved to be right.
Jo

I've just read about this on the BBC News website. I'm so sorry to hear
of this news. Indeed I'm sorry to hear of the death of any cyclist in a
road accident.

All those affected shall be in my thoughts.

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Jo said:

Just heard from husband & son, who are currently riding the Dunwich
Dynamo. Husband (who is a nurse) has had to attend a nasty accident,
probably fatal. I don't know any other details, other than that it was a
cyclist, as they are still riding. I trust nobody here was involved?
Jo

It's just been on BBC Radio - rider killed after a collision with a van
:-(

I hope you don't think that I mean to criticise, as I need your help on
this, but I think the term 'accident' should be held until the whole
circumstances come to light. I think it should only be used when events are
prooved to be truely accidental, not when some driver has neglected their
responsibility towards the safety of others.

By using the term 'accident' the media are prejudging any investigation. I
believe we should use the term 'incident' and pressurise the media to do the
same.

North Wales incident was called an accident, but the car was later found to
be unroadworthy. The incident on the A6 where the young lad was run down by
a tractor was called an accident, but it turned out that the tractor driver
did not have right of way. These were not just accidents, they were
neglectful acts.

--
Dave Lloyd
So open minded, my brains dribbled out.

On Mon, 10 Jul 2006 07:01:47 GMT someone who may be "david lloyd"
<[email hidden]> wrote this:-

Quoted message said:

By using the term 'accident' the media are prejudging any investigation. I
believe we should use the term 'incident' and pressurise the media to do the
same.

I agree, but would substitute the word crash. Simple and clear.

Quoted message said:

North Wales incident was called an accident, but the car was later found to
be unroadworthy.

Has that been shown? The BBC article was not clear and may have
referred to an inspection many months after the crash, as was
pointed out here.

Quoted message said:

The incident on the A6 where the young lad was run down by
a tractor was called an accident, but it turned out that the tractor driver
did not have right of way.

Any reference to that? I don't doubt you, but had not heard that
before.

--
David Hansen, Edinburgh
I will *always* explain revoked encryption keys, unless RIP prevents me
http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts2000/00023--e.htm#54

david lloyd wrote on 10/07/2006 08:01 +0100:

Quoted message said:

I hope you don't think that I mean to criticise, as I need your help on
this, but I think the term 'accident' should be held until the whole
circumstances come to light. I think it should only be used when events are
prooved to be truely accidental, not when some driver has neglected their
responsibility towards the safety of others.

"A 62-year-old man from Waltham Abbey, Essex, arrested on suspicion of
causing death by dangerous driving was released on bail pending further
inquiries"
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/essex/5162602.stm

--
Tony

"Anyone who conducts an argument by appealing to authority is not using
his intelligence; he is just using his memory."
- Leonardo da Vinci

"Tony Raven" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

david lloyd wrote on 10/07/2006 08:01 +0100:

Quoted message said:

I hope you don't think that I mean to criticise, as I need your help on
this, but I think the term 'accident' should be held until the whole
circumstances come to light. I think it should only be used when events
are
prooved to be truely accidental, not when some driver has neglected their
responsibility towards the safety of others.

"A 62-year-old man from Waltham Abbey, Essex, arrested on suspicion of
causing death by dangerous driving was released on bail pending further
inquiries"
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/essex/5162602.stm

There's loads of info over at acf

see

http://bikereader.com/forum/index.php?PHPSESSID=23c7dfd04f1357965753f70f7ebc16d0&topic=17761.30

Seems the driver tried do a runner.. but was stopped from driving off by
others at the scene.

A truly awful incident. I hope the driver has the legal book thrown at him
for attempting to leave the scene.

Condolences to the family & friends of the person killed.

helen s

wafflycat wrote on 10/07/2006 09:14 +0100:

Quoted message said:

"Tony Raven" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

david lloyd wrote on 10/07/2006 08:01 +0100:

Quoted message said:

I hope you don't think that I mean to criticise, as I need your
help on this, but I think the term 'accident' should be held
until the whole circumstances come to light. I think it should
only be used when events are prooved to be truely accidental, not
when some driver has neglected their responsibility towards the
safety of others.

"A 62-year-old man from Waltham Abbey, Essex, arrested on suspicion
of causing death by dangerous driving was released on bail pending
further inquiries"
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/essex/5162602.stm

There's loads of info over at acf

see

http://bikereader.com/forum/index.php?PHPSESSID=23c7dfd04f1357965753f70f7ebc16d0&topic=17761.30

"I was riding with the group when the collision happened. The van
driver was coming in the opposite direction, rounded a corner, and for
whatever reason drifted across (oversteering?) to our side of the road,
which incidentally was wide, clearly marked, and well-lit. He hit one
rider very hard - his front wheel left a skidmark up the bonnet and the
safety glass had an enormous dent in it. The bang I heard sounded like
two cars colliding. The injured cyclist then collided with another, who
fell hard but did not hit the car. The van driver immediately attempted
to drive off, but a few of us blocked his way before others came and
helped us. The reason the van had mounted the kerb was because he was
attempting to steer around us. I too thought the reaction of the
cyclists was very restrained. Had that occured on CM I doubt the police
would have fished him out before he was seriously injured. Even when he
got out the cab spoiling for a fight he was calmed and the situation
explained to him. Most of the group had gone to the injured man. I was
told they already had first-aiders and everything was being done that
could be, but the victim was not in a good way. Ambulances were called,
and arrived, as were police cars, which later blocked off the entire road."

I hope they throw the book at him. What sort of person spoils for a
fight having just killed a complete stranger?

--
Tony

"Anyone who conducts an argument by appealing to authority is not using
his intelligence; he is just using his memory."
- Leonardo da Vinci

On Mon, 10 Jul 2006 09:30:11 +0100 someone who may be Tony Raven
<[email hidden]> wrote this:-

Quoted message said:

What sort of person spoils for a
fight having just killed a complete stranger?

Fight or flight response. Very deeply ingrained.

--
David Hansen, Edinburgh
I will *always* explain revoked encryption keys, unless RIP prevents me
http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts2000/00023--e.htm#54

Jo said:

Just heard from husband & son, who are currently riding the Dunwich
Dynamo. Husband (who is a nurse) has had to attend a nasty accident,
probably fatal. I don't know any other details, other than that it was a
cyclist, as they are still riding. I trust nobody here was involved?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/essex/5164142.stm

Police have named a cyclist killed in a head-on collision with a Transit van
while taking part in a 120-mile night ride on Saturday.

Andrew Rawlind, 38, who was from Walthamstow, east London, died at the accident
scene in North Weald, Essex.

David Hansen wrote on 10/07/2006 09:49 +0100:

Quoted message said:

On Mon, 10 Jul 2006 09:30:11 +0100 someone who may be Tony Raven
<[email hidden]> wrote this:-

Quoted message said:

What sort of person spoils for a
fight having just killed a complete stranger?

Fight or flight response. Very deeply ingrained.

UR Nick Freeman and ICMFP ;-)

--
Tony

"Anyone who conducts an argument by appealing to authority is not using
his intelligence; he is just using his memory."
- Leonardo da Vinci

Quoted message said:

I hope they throw the book at him. What sort of person spoils for a
fight having just killed a complete stranger?

My son, who was standing by while his father helped the injured, heard
the driver say he had 'had a couple'. Probably explains his behaviour. I
hope the law deals with him fully and appropriately. My husband spent
the rest of the day in clothes soaked in blood from the incident. Maybe
if the driver had had to do that it would have brought home to him what
he had done.
Jo

"Jo" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I hope they throw the book at him. What sort of person spoils for a
fight having just killed a complete stranger?

My son, who was standing by while his father helped the injured, heard the
driver say he had 'had a couple'. Probably explains his behaviour. I hope
the law deals with him fully and appropriately. My husband spent the rest
of the day in clothes soaked in blood from the incident. Maybe if the
driver had had to do that it would have brought home to him what he had
done.
Jo

I hope your son informs the police of what he heard the driver say.

Condolences and respect to your husband. It can't have been easy for him.

helen s

wafflycat said:

"Jo" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I hope they throw the book at him. What sort of person spoils for a
fight having just killed a complete stranger?

My son, who was standing by while his father helped the injured,
heard the driver say ************. Probably explains his
behaviour. I hope the law deals with him fully and appropriately. My
husband spent the rest of the day in clothes soaked in blood from
the incident. Maybe if the driver had had to do that it would have
brought home to him what he had done.
Jo

I hope your son informs the police of what he heard the driver say.

Ditto - and remember that it'll soon be sub-judice....