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Rubber highways

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UK and Europe
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1 June 2006
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2 June 2006
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Richard
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  1. BBC NEWS
    Rubber highway to beat congestion
    By Jonathan Fildes
    Science and technology reporter, BBC News website

    A congestion-beating project that could lead to some of the UK's 9,000
    miles (14,500km) of disused railway being paved with rubber, has been
    launched.

    The flexible highways are made of panels of shredded car tyres laid over
    the existing tracks.

    New thoroughfares could be shared by both cars and trams travelling at
    up to 50mph (80km/h) say Holdfast, the company behind the scheme.

    But some users of disused railways do not support the scheme.

    "We would like to see these routes converted into walking and cycling
    routes," said Gill Harrison, a spokesperson for sustainable transport
    charity Sustrans.

    The charity has converted approximately 1,000 miles (1,600km) of disused
    railways into part of the National Cycle Network.

    "More road space does not automatically mean less congestion," she said.

    "More roads just get filled up with more cars. We're not saying that
    cars do not have their place, but ultimately we've all got to think
    about other ways of getting around."

    Burning rubber

    The rubber roads are being developed by Holdfast Rubber Highway (HRH)
    and may provide a use for some of the estimated 50m tyres disposed of in
    the UK each year.

    As of July 7, EU legislation will make it illegal to bury car tyres in
    landfill sites or burn them, making alternative uses like this more
    attractive.

    It took four men five days to put down 300m of road
    Peter Coates Smith, Holdfast Rubber Highway

    Parent company, Holdfast Level Crossings, already makes the rubber
    decking found at pedestrian and rail crossings.

    The company has extended this idea to create cheap interlocking panels
    that can be laid between the gaps on disused railway lines.

    Each mile of track would use 354,000 scrap tyres. Individual panels are
    made "cold" so there are few emissions in the production process.

    A 300m (980ft) demonstration track, funded by the not-for-profit Waste
    and Resources Action Programme (Wrap), has been built at a car depot in
    Corby, Northamptonshire.

    Over eight weeks, more than 8,000 cars will drive over the surface to
    make sure it can stand up to wear and tear.

    However, Mr Coates Smith, the managing director of Holdfast, said he was
    more interested in seeing how quickly the road could be laid.

    "It took four men five days to put down 300m of road," he said. "The
    panels we'd be using [in the future] are three times as long, so you can
    imagine 900m in five days."

    Limited appeal

    Eventually the jam-busting technology could be used to build a network
    of roads on the network of "dead" lines, closed by Dr Beeching in the 1960s.

    The company is keen to stress that they do not intend to build on
    disused lines in rural idylls. Instead, they say, the rubber highways
    will be a cheap alternative to urban bypasses and routes into conurbations.

    "We're talking about £1.4m per mile compared with £20m per mile for a
    new road," said Mr Coates Smith.

    The Highways Agency disputes these costs. They say that £20m buys you a
    mile of 3-lane motorway, complete with a hard shoulder, rather than just
    a single-lane rubber highway.

    In addition, some people believe that the network of new roads would
    have limited appeal to most people.

    "These tracks are generally disused because they go to places that
    people don't want to go to," said Roger Ford, industry and technology
    editor of Modern Railways magazine.

    Mr Ford also says that most disused railways have already had their
    sleepers and rails removed and tend to be overgrown, meaning that
    installing the road may be more difficult than envisaged.

    Keen interest

    This is not the first time that rubber has been incorporated into road
    surfaces. Many roads in Europe and the US have a small portion of rubber
    crumb mixed with the asphalt to make the road quieter.

    However these surfaces have never really taken off in the UK because the
    damp weather made the road surfaces crack and disintegrate.

    Mr Coates Smith believes the new road surface, made almost entirely of
    rubber, will not suffer the same problems.

    "There are no potholes, there's no cracking, no spoiling from frost and
    it's very quiet" he said.

    Maintenance costs are also very low as individual panels can be replaced
    in 15 minutes, according to Mr Coates Smith.

    In addition, as the routes were originally intended for trains, they are
    also ideally suited for trams.

    These carriages would run on the rails, left exposed between the rubber
    mats, and could carry between 50-100 people, Holdfast believes.

    They would share the road with cars. However, the thin lanes would mean
    that overtaking would be almost impossible.

    However, Mr Coates Smith believes that the environmental advantages and
    the congestion beating nature of the system will make it a success.

    He already has a number of companies, transport authorities and local
    councils, including Fife and Gosport, interested in the technology.

    "The response we've had is amazing. My phone has not stopped ringing."

    Story from BBC NEWS:
    http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/1/hi/sci/tech/5034912.stm

    Published: 2006/05/31 19:24:56 GMT

    © BBC MMVI

  2. Richard said:

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/1/hi/sci/tech/5034912.stm

    I can quite see that the local Council "safety officer" is going to take
    one look at those pictures and ban cycling on these (too dangerous,
    innit?) I'm also not entirely keen on Sustrans' 'rip up the tracks'
    ideology; I'd prefer to see the railways being reinstated, even at the
    expense of losing some of the long distance cycleways (or, at relatively
    little expense, reinstate the track and run a parallel cycleway;
    admittedly less scenic, what with the 6' fence to keep the cyclists off
    the track :-(

    R.

  3. Richard said:

    BBC NEWS
    Rubber highway to beat congestion
    By Jonathan Fildes
    Science and technology reporter, BBC News website

    That's just so, so sad.
    Why not put errr.... wellll..... railways on these routes?
    They were originally engineered, at great human effort and cost, to have
    the gradients, curves and tunnels for rail vehicles.
    One could think of light-rail type schemes, or railbuses.

    As a for instance, I helped in a small way with the Linux Beer Hike in
    Scotland last year. We held it in the village hall in Killin.
    Just about zero public transport, save a couple of buses a day to Stirling
    or Crianlarich.
    Looking at the OS map - a disused line which goes all the way down to
    Comrie, St Fillans etc.

    (Before anyone says it, yes the track up the glen is already a Sustrans
    route)

    And lets face the economic argument - small branch lines could be used to
    keep rural communities alive.

  4. Richard said:

    BBC NEWS
    Rubber highway to beat congestion
    By Jonathan Fildes
    Science and technology reporter, BBC News website

    A congestion-beating project that could lead to some of the UK's 9,000
    miles (14,500km) of disused railway being paved with rubber, has been
    launched.


    Most of the disused railways in Norfolk (and there are many) are empty
    track beds, devoid of track for many years. They are also discontinuous
    - farmers have ploughed them up, cuttings have been dammed and filled
    with water for fishing (Gt Dunham Tench lakes) and bridges demolished to
    make greater headroom for traffic underneath.

  5. Richard said:

    admittedly less scenic, what with the 6' fence to keep the cyclists off


    The cyclists could travel by rail.
    How about railbuses with bike racks at either end?
    They pick you up at the main railway stations, or you cycle to the centre
    of town. Railbus takes you out into the countryside, national park, etc.
    Pootle round on bike, picnic etc. then back.

    Nah, it would never take off.

  6. "Richard" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    BBC NEWS
    Rubber highway to beat congestion
    By Jonathan Fildes
    Science and technology reporter, BBC News website

    A congestion-beating project that could lead to some of the UK's 9,000
    miles (14,500km) of disused railway being paved with rubber, has been
    launched.

    The flexible highways are made of panels of shredded car tyres laid over
    the existing tracks.

    New thoroughfares could be shared by both cars and trams travelling at up
    to 50mph (80km/h) say Holdfast, the company behind the scheme.

    The article says that 354,000 scrap tyres are used per mile .... Govt stats
    say that approx 50 million tyres are scrapped each year in the UK ... my
    arithmetic gives me only about 140 miles that could be built per year from
    this idea ..... and presumably with technology increasing tyre life (and
    even reduced car use !!) the whole thing seems a flawed.

    RG

  7. Quoted message said:

    We're talking about £1.4m per mile

    How much?? 4 guys, less than 2 days work, and using materials that are a
    bi-product and that costs £1.4million. Obviously not as simple as they
    make out.

  8. John Hearns said:


    Nah, it would never take off.

    No, the British only ever picnic in their cars :-\

  9. On Thu, 01 Jun 2006 10:35:16 +0100 someone who may be Richard
    <[email hidden]> wrote this:-

    Quoted message said:

    I'm also not entirely keen on Sustrans' 'rip up the tracks'
    ideology;

    I'm not sure that they have one of those. Re-using formations where
    the tracks have already been ripped up is a different matter.

    Quoted message said:

    I'd prefer to see the railways being reinstated, even at the
    expense of losing some of the long distance cycleways

    Indeed. Sustrans' don't have a perfect record on this in some parts
    of the UK, but in other parts are more sensible.

    Quoted message said:

    (or, at relatively
    little expense, reinstate the track and run a parallel cycleway;
    admittedly less scenic, what with the 6' fence to keep the cyclists off
    the track :-(

    A few problems with that. On curves it could block the view of
    approaching trains for those working on the line. It would also
    remove a useful escape route for them. Given the narrowness of most
    formations there might be difficulty providing a place of safety on
    the cycle path side of the line.

    Cyclists would certainly not be keen on a concentration camp style
    fence along one side of the path.

    There are a number of examples where trains and trams run alongside
    paths with waist high fences/walls. These deter but don't prevent
    access and there is not a holocaust of dead members of the public
    along these lines, though there are some deaths and injuries. In
    some places there is no wall or fence alongside a tramway.

    The balance of risks and benefits lies with waist high fences. On
    the roads white lines are considered enough to separate cyclists
    from other traffic.

    --
    David Hansen, Edinburgh
    I will *always* explain revoked encryption keys, unless RIP prevents me
    http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts2000/00023--e.htm#54

  10. David Hansen said:
    Quoted message said:

    I'm also not entirely keen on Sustrans' 'rip up the tracks'
    ideology;

    I'm not sure that they have one of those. Re-using formations where
    the tracks have already been ripped up is a different matter.

    It's unfortunate that the impression given by the report is otherwise:

    "The flexible highways are made of panels of shredded car tyres laid
    over the existing tracks [...] "We would like to see these routes
    converted into walking and cycling routes," said Gill Harrison, a
    spokesperson for sustainable transport charity Sustrans."

    Quoted message said:

    The balance of risks and benefits lies with waist high fences. On
    the roads white lines are considered enough to separate cyclists
    from other traffic.

    Yebbut deaths on the roads are just unfortunate accidents that are
    nobody's fault, really. Deaths on the railways are the cue for public
    enquiries and millions spent on prevention. (Preaching to the converted
    with Mr Hansen, I know. :-)

    R.

  11. Richard said:
    Richard said:

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/1/hi/sci/tech/5034912.stm

    I can quite see that the local Council "safety officer" is going to take
    one look at those pictures and ban cycling on these (too dangerous,
    innit?)

    I dunno, you get knocked down, but you bounce right back up again

  12. Does anyone here know how well this surface would grip bicycle tyres in
    the wet?

    I have no experience of this material, but bike tyres on wet rubber
    elsewhere have been lethally slippery IME.

    --
    Helen D. Vecht: [email hidden]
    Edgware.

  13. On Thu, 01 Jun 2006 11:56:55 +0100 someone who may be Richard
    <[email hidden]> wrote this:-

    Quoted message said:

    Yebbut deaths on the roads are just unfortunate accidents that are
    nobody's fault, really. Deaths on the railways are the cue for public
    enquiries and millions spent on prevention.

    While that is true there is a long stretch of tramway on the Midland
    Metro with a cyclepath alongside. Where the two are close there is a
    waist high fence, where the two are apart there is nothing.

    The death of a cyclist in ISTR Nottingham who wheeled his bike
    across the tramway without looking did not lead to too many demands.
    However, he was only a cyclist.

    --
    David Hansen, Edinburgh
    I will *always* explain revoked encryption keys, unless RIP prevents me
    http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts2000/00023--e.htm#54

  14. John Hearns said:


    The cyclists could travel by rail.

    In India people cycle for miles balancing on the rail.

    --
    Tony

    "Anyone who conducts an argument by appealing to authority is not using
    his intelligence; he is just using his memory."
    - Leonardo da Vinci

  15. Helen Deborah Vecht said:

    Does anyone here know how well this surface would grip bicycle tyres in
    the wet?

    It's the same rubbery stuff that surrounds the rails at level crossings.
    This is grippier than the metal rail surrounds on older level crossings, but
    less good than tarmac. I'd also be worried about skid resistance under heavy
    braking by the likes of HGVs on this surface, especially at junctions.

    Regards,

    -david

  16. David Nutter <[email hidden]>typed

    Quoted message said:
    Helen Deborah Vecht said:

    Does anyone here know how well this surface would grip bicycle tyres in
    the wet?

    Quoted message said:

    It's the same rubbery stuff that surrounds the rails at level crossings.
    This is grippier than the metal rail surrounds on older level crossings, but
    less good than tarmac. I'd also be worried about skid resistance under heavy
    braking by the likes of HGVs on this surface, especially at junctions.

    Having watched two Audax UK riders fall off on this, in short succession
    (Yorkshire Dales 400 km, 1995) you have given me _no_ confidence in it
    :-(

    --
    Helen D. Vecht: [email hidden]
    Edgware.

  17. Helen Deborah Vecht said:

    David Nutter <[email hidden]>typed

    Quoted message said:

    It's the same rubbery stuff that surrounds the rails at level crossings.
    This is grippier than the metal rail surrounds on older level crossings, but
    less good than tarmac. I'd also be worried about skid resistance under heavy
    braking by the likes of HGVs on this surface, especially at junctions.

    Having watched two Audax UK riders fall off on this, in short succession
    (Yorkshire Dales 400 km, 1995) you have given me _no_ confidence in it
    :-(

    http://www.holdfastrubberhighway.co.uk/specifications.html

    has the corporate line on the stuff. I think the best use for it will be to
    turn disused rail depots into nice flat car parks or yards really quickly -
    a bit of a niche market. I'd be a bit worried about riding on a road
    surfaced with the stuff, though since almost no disused lines will be
    suitable for treatment this shouldn't present a problem.

    Still, the idea of turning railways into cruddy roads isn't really that new.
    The almost-completely-mad Transport Watch bloke springs to mind...

    Regards,

    -david

  18. in message <[email hidden]>, John Hearns

    (') said:
    Richard said:

    BBC NEWS
    Rubber highway to beat congestion
    By Jonathan Fildes
    Science and technology reporter, BBC News website

    That's just so, so sad.
    Why not put errr.... wellll..... railways on these routes?
    They were originally engineered, at great human effort and cost, to
    have the gradients, curves and tunnels for rail vehicles.
    One could think of light-rail type schemes, or railbuses.

    As a for instance, I helped in a small way with the Linux Beer Hike in
    Scotland last year. We held it in the village hall in Killin.
    Just about zero public transport, save a couple of buses a day to
    Stirling or Crianlarich.
    Looking at the OS map - a disused line which goes all the way down to
    Comrie, St Fillans etc.

    (Before anyone says it, yes the track up the glen is already a Sustrans
    route)

    And lets face the economic argument - small branch lines could be used
    to keep rural communities alive.

    Speaking as someone who cares passionately about the rural economy, sadly
    I don't think this marches. We have a brilliant railway through Galloway
    - I can remember picking my elder sister up off the train at Dalbeattie
    station when I was about six. Nowadays I regularly cycle the old railway
    up to Loch Skerrow Halt and the Water of Fleet viaducts. It would be a
    brilliant resource if the rails were still there, a resource which could
    only grow more valuable as the cost of road transport escalates.

    But I don't think it is realpolitik now, and I don't think it will be for
    another generation. Too much of the old trackbed is built over. Too many
    of the bridges and embankments have been destroyed. It would be a hugely
    costly business to reinstate it, and the landowning interests would
    fight it tooth and nail.

    It fundamentally ain't a-goin' to happen, except in a few specially
    favoured locations on the urban periphery. To have maintained - even in
    mothballs - a railway for fifty years would have been cheaper and
    politically far easier than reinstating one which has been
    systematically destroyed.

    --
    [email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

    ;; When your hammer is C++, everything begins to look like a thumb.

  19. David Nutter said:

    It's the same rubbery stuff that surrounds the rails at level
    crossings. This is grippier than the metal rail surrounds on older
    level crossings, but less good than tarmac. I'd also be worried about
    skid resistance under heavy braking by the likes of HGVs on this
    surface, especially at junctions.

    If grip is low, does that mean rolling resistance is low as well? Could
    be fast to ride on if so.

    Will cycles be allowed on these things anyway?

    ~PB

  20. Pete Biggs said:


    Will cycles be allowed on these things anyway?

    If they are I can see lots of cars coming to grief trying to pass them
    and falling off one edge or the other ;-)

    --
    Tony

    "Anyone who conducts an argument by appealing to authority is not using
    his intelligence; he is just using his memory."
    - Leonardo da Vinci

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