First ride

Brendo:

Quoted message said:

My left crank arm fell off...Store owner will get some 'please explains' >on Monday!!

What a shocker! Sounds like the bolt was not tightened down, worked
loose and then fell out. It must have felt very shoddy while it was
happening. The thing to watch for now is whether the splines or facing
in the crank are worn. The shop might bolt it back on, but you could be
stuck with it creaking and working loose, requiring a new crank arm.

Yes, your [censored] will get better! I think it's bruising around the bones,
but if you ride regularly, this doesn't happen.

Donga

Donga said:

Brendo:

Quoted message said:

My left crank arm fell off...Store owner will get some 'please explains' >on Monday!!

What a shocker! Sounds like the bolt was not tightened down, worked
loose and then fell out. It must have felt very shoddy while it was
happening. The thing to watch for now is whether the splines or facing
in the crank are worn. The shop might bolt it back on, but you could be
stuck with it creaking and working loose, requiring a new crank arm.

Yes, your [censored] will get better! I think it's bruising around the bones,
but if you ride regularly, this doesn't happen.

Donga

My main concernwith the crank is whether the bearings in the bottom
bracket have lost their seal. There was a little 'O' ring that had
forced its way out. Can dirt and grit get in there and cause problems?
The crank arm is back on, and it feels tight. I'm taking it out for a
small ride today, but taking itback to the LBS tomorrow.

Great news about the [censored] situation though!!

Brendo said:

After waiting 2 weeks for my bike to arrive, we picked them up on Friday .
Went for a ride Sat arvo up the freeway cycle path from Baldivis. For a
first time on a road bike, it was much easier to push than expected. All
up we did 32km averaging 22kmh (around 1hr30mn). Very enjoyable, except a
few things
1) Sore bum bones. Do these get better and build up resistance?

Yes, you do build up some resistance to the pressure on your rear, but it
only comes after riding many miles. You should also check that your body
position is right, you should be leaning forward to take some body weight on
your hands. If the sore bum continues to be a problem I can recommend one of
these:
http://www.wallbike.com/b17cscopper.html

May not be the coolest saddle for a road bike these days, but after some
treatment with Proofide or Snoseal and a few months of riding, the leather
saddle shapes to your rear and is the best comfort saddle to ride.

Quoted message said:

2) Headwinds. No wonder it felt easy for the first half.
3) My left crank arm fell off. I noticed a bit of extra movement, went to
pull out and the whole arm came off, still attached to my shoe.

What! This is a terrible thing to happen on a new bike. There is a bit of a
problem with the splined cranks that there is no warning if they do start to
work loose. With a square taper axle the crank strats clunking long before
it can come off. Best bet is to get a crank tool to keep it tightened up
yourself. And roast that LBS.

--
Cheers
Peter

~~~ ~ _@
~~ ~ _- \,
~~ (*)/ (*)

Quoted message said:

May not be the coolest saddle for a road bike these days, but after some
treatment with Proofide or Snoseal and a few months of riding, the leather
saddle shapes to your rear and is the best comfort saddle to ride.

the saddle is a plastic/rubber one, Ithink the brand is fi'zi:k. It's
got a clear gel running up the centre. Hopefully it will fit itself to
my bum!! I will give updates though

Quoted message said:

What! This is a terrible thing to happen on a new bike. There is a bit of a
problem with the splined cranks that there is no warning if they do start to
work loose. With a square taper axle the crank strats clunking long before
it can come off. Best bet is to get a crank tool to keep it tightened up
yourself. And roast that LBS.

I bought a crank tool that morning, luckily. I'll take it apart to day
and put it back now I have time to look at it properly. I have a feeling
that the splines are a bit worn due to the looseness and it moving
about, but I'll let you know how the LBS reacts.

[PHP][/PHP]

Brendo said:

1) Sore bum bones. Do these get better and build up resistance?

[PHP][/PHP]

Its called growing the "third foot". takes a little while - just dont give in. The pain is gain here. If its no better or even getting worse after 3-4 weeks of regular riding - you might need to try another type of saddle. In my experience, a lot of bikes arounf the $2k mark skimp on the seat and you can get quite a plank. Still as long as its the right shape for your 'taint', then no matter how well padded / gel'd it is, you should get used to it.

cheers,
MM

Brendo said:

Quoted message said:

What! This is a terrible thing to happen on a new bike. There is a bit of a
problem with the splined cranks that there is no warning if they do start to
work loose. With a square taper axle the crank strats clunking long before
it can come off. Best bet is to get a crank tool to keep it tightened up
yourself. And roast that LBS.

I bought a crank tool that morning, luckily. I'll take it apart to day
and put it back now I have time to look at it properly. I have a feeling
that the splines are a bit worn due to the looseness and it moving
about, but I'll let you know how the LBS reacts.

I'd advise not to try any fix yourself until you've sorted out the bike shop. That may void the warranty. There may already be damage due to it being loose to start with which could require part replacement. The crank arm may have already been damaged at the interface with the bb axle. You may find yourself always needing to tighten it because it no longer fits properly

Any half-decent shop would be much more amenable to you wheeling it in with crank off and asking for them to resolve it than coming back later if your fix didn't work. You'll probably also find that is written in any warranty.

Best of luck

Brendo said:

After waiting 2 weeks for my bike to arrive, we picked them up on Friday
. Went for a ride Sat arvo up the freeway cycle path from Baldivis. For
a first time on a road bike, it was much easier to push than expected.
All up we did 32km averaging 22kmh (around 1hr30mn). Very enjoyable,
except a few things
1) Sore bum bones. Do these get better and build up resistance?

Yes and no. Or, it depends. You may notice that there's many many
different seats. This is for a reason. [censored] comfort depends on a
number of things; your riding position, the seat fitting your sit
bones, and the relative "softness" of your discomfort threshold.
Everyone here will have their favorite seats, and the old farts will
insist that those awful brooks leather seats are the one true seat,
don't listen to them, soon they'll be dribbing into their prechewed
food in a nursing home muttering about new fangled alloys and dreaming
of the days when all bikes were steel. Here's a tip, seats come in
different shapes & sizes for a reason, and soft seats aren't
necessarily more comfortable, one that fits you is the key. Any half
decent LBS will let you testride many seats. Take advantage of this.
Also, get the LBS or a coach to set up your position on the bike.

Quoted message said:

2) Headwinds. No wonder it felt easy for the first half.
3) My left crank arm fell off. I noticed a bit of extra movement, went
to pull out and the whole arm came off, still attached to my shoe.
Managed to work out how to put it back on (with the help of a passer
by), but don't expect this when we just paid $2k for a bike!! Store
owner will get some 'please explains' on Monday!!

Take it back, do not *touch* it in the meantime. This should not
happen. The shop is supposed to check everything for tightness
including cranks etc (unless you assembled it yourself, in which case
all bets are off). If this was loose, then I'd insist that they check
the whole bike properly as well as fix the damage that the loose crank
arm may have caused. Out of curiosity, what crankset is it?

sinus said:

I'd advise not to try any fix yourself until you've sorted out the bike
shop. That may void the warranty. There may already be damage due to it
being loose to start with which could require part replacement. The
crank arm may have already been damaged at the interface with the bb
axle.

Oh, yes - warranty of course, I should have mentioned that. Let the shop do
the work for you.

My comments about getting a crank tool were in reference to you developing
the skills and equipment to look after your own bike. The warranty on parts
is usually only one year. After that you choose: get a shop to do
everything, pay for it and be a bit lacking in independence on the road, or
get some tools, play about with your bike (it's not rocket science after
all) and gain the satisfaction of being to look after most of your
maintenance.

For me the choice has been easy. With my last two bikes I really didn't even
feel the need to bother with the shop's 'free 3 month service'. I'll do all
my own servicing but that's just my independent approach.

--
Cheers
Peter

~~~ ~ _@
~~ ~ _- \,
~~ (*)/ (*)

Bleve said:

Everyone here will have their favorite seats, and the old farts will
insist that those awful brooks leather seats are the one true seat,
don't listen to them

Hey, I hope that's not a touch of 'ageism' creeping up - anyhow I'm still
the right side of 50 ;-)

By the way, have you ridden a Brooks leather saddle for any length of time?
Lots of people talk these saddles down (think of them as too "old school" I
guess) but have never ridden one. Yes they look less 'cool' and stylish, yes
they are heavier, but to argue about their comfort with any credibility,
tell me about your riding experience in terms of years or '000s of kms.

Quoted message said:

soon they'll be dribbing into their prechewed
food in a nursing home muttering about new fangled alloys and dreaming
of the days when all bikes were steel.

Yep, steel is real!

Quoted message said:

Here's a tip, seats come in
different shapes & sizes for a reason, and soft seats aren't
necessarily more comfortable, one that fits you is the key.

Leather saddles like Brooks are not soft. But what they do have is a good
shape to begin with (you can get various widths and lengths to suit your
pelvis) and after a short period of riding they will change shape to suit
your posterior. So with a Brooks you _will_ get a saddle that fits. With
plastic saddles you'll have to get a LBS who will allow you to try different
saddles until you get the right one, even buy one with a replacement offer
if it doesn't suit, after say, a week. Some shops will do this.

Note - plastic, carbon and other synthetic saddles _do not_ change to fit
your bum. You will have to adapt to suit the saddle through riding style or
hardening bum, or put up with an ongoing sore [censored].

--
Cheers
Peter

~~~ ~ _@
~~ ~ _- \,
~~ (*)/ (*)

Brendo said:

After waiting 2 weeks for my bike to arrive, we picked them up on Friday
.. Went for a ride Sat arvo up the freeway cycle path from Baldivis. For
a first time on a road bike, it was much easier to push than expected.
All up we did 32km averaging 22kmh (around 1hr30mn). Very enjoyable,
except a few things
1) Sore bum bones. Do these get better and build up resistance?

Congrats on the first ride - bugga about the crank though 🙁

In my (albeit limited!) experience your butt might get used to the saddle - *but* only if the saddle is a decent fit.

Try this to check:

Grab a piece of white paper and give the neighbours something to think about 🙄

Head outside to the gutter, put the paper on a dusty spot on the edge and sit on it. The grottiest part of the paper should give a fair picture of where your "sit bones" are. Measure across from the two darkest spots on the paper and compare with your saddle - if your saddle isn't able to support them (ie. it isn't wide enough, or the most supportive bits aren't matching up) then you might have to think about a new saddle.

Still, I'd give what you have already a fair go first.

cheers,
Ali

Alison,

I tried your test and it seems my saddle isn't wide enough by about
three feet!

Karl aka Stomper

Peter Signorini said:

Bleve said:

Everyone here will have their favorite seats, and the old farts will
insist that those awful brooks leather seats are the one true seat,
don't listen to them

Hey, I hope that's not a touch of 'ageism' creeping up - anyhow I'm still
the right side of 50 ;-)

Which side is that? 🙂 FWIW, I work with a number of riders on both
sides of that number. Some of the ones on the far side have turfed
their old leather saddles and got saddles that fit them out of the box.

Quoted message said:

By the way, have you ridden a Brooks leather saddle for any length of time?

Nope. And I won't. I have a saddle that fits. I've done 2 warnys on
it, I've done 1,000km in a week on it. I've done the Alpine Classic on
it. It fitted from day one. I've never had a saddle sore or any
numbness on it. It did take some months to find it though.

Quoted message said:

Lots of people talk these saddles down (think of them as too "old school" I
guess) but have never ridden one. Yes they look less 'cool' and stylish, yes
they are heavier, but to argue about their comfort with any credibility,
tell me about your riding experience in terms of years or '000s of kms.

In the last 4 years I've ridden ~75,000km. That enough? I also work
with around 15 or so road racing and event riders (as their coach) and
I listen and pay attention to their feedback on various things, not
least of which is comfort.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

soon they'll be dribbing into their prechewed
food in a nursing home muttering about new fangled alloys and dreaming
of the days when all bikes were steel.

Yep, steel is real!

As is dog faeces, bamboo and snot 🙂 What's for dinner?

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Here's a tip, seats come in
different shapes & sizes for a reason, and soft seats aren't
necessarily more comfortable, one that fits you is the key.

Leather saddles like Brooks are not soft. But what they do have is a good
shape to begin with (you can get various widths and lengths to suit your
pelvis) and after a short period of riding they will change shape to suit
your posterior.

They will change shape a little to suit your sit bones, but not your
soft tissue. Soft tissue is soft, it gets pushed around by harder
materials (2mm thick leather, for example). If the saddle suits your
[censored], that's great, but it's always going to put pressure on your
perenium. This may or may not be an issue, but it is not something
that a brooks saddle can mould itself to.

Quoted message said:

So with a Brooks you _will_ get a saddle that fits.

Fits, yes (maybe). Provides soft tissue pressure relief? Nope. It
can't (or it turns into a hammock, and causes all sorts of other
problems).

Quoted message said:

With
plastic saddles you'll have to get a LBS who will allow you to try different
saddles until you get the right one, even buy one with a replacement offer
if it doesn't suit, after say, a week. Some shops will do this.

Note - plastic, carbon and other synthetic saddles _do not_ change to fit
your bum. You will have to adapt to suit the saddle through riding style or
hardening bum, or put up with an ongoing sore [censored].

Or just find a saddle that fits in the first place. YMMV ....

Stomper said:

Alison,

I tried your test and it seems my saddle isn't wide enough by about
three feet!

Karl aka Stomper

*laughs*

well, I didn't say whether it had to be A4 or A3 paper 🙄

(that's a decent width frontage your house must have!)

cheers,
ali

sinus said:

Brendo said:

Quoted message said:

What! This is a terrible thing to happen on a new bike. There is a

bit of a

Quoted message said:

problem with the splined cranks that there is no warning if they do

start to

Quoted message said:

work loose. With a square taper axle the crank strats clunking long

before

Quoted message said:

it can come off. Best bet is to get a crank tool to keep it tightened

up

Quoted message said:

yourself. And roast that LBS.

I bought a crank tool that morning, luckily. I'll take it apart to day
and put it back now I have time to look at it properly. I have a
feeling
that the splines are a bit worn due to the looseness and it moving
about, but I'll let you know how the LBS reacts.

I'd advise not to try any fix yourself until you've sorted out the bike
shop. That may void the warranty. There may already be damage due to it
being loose to start with which could require part replacement. The
crank arm may have already been damaged at the interface with the bb
axle. You may find yourself always needing to tighten it because it no
longer fits properly

Any half-decent shop would be much more amenable to you wheeling it in
with crank off and asking for them to resolve it than coming back later
if your fix didn't work. You'll probably also find that is written in
any warranty.

Best of luck

Thanks for the advice, I had to put it back on yesterday because I was
15km from where I needed to be!!. I haven't touched it today, so it will
go back to the LBS on but not properly on.

Bought the bikes from a store about 60km away!! Think we will get the
local (5km away) guys to do any repairs, they sell GT mountain bikes.
GEtting GT road bike bits shouldbe okay. I'll talk to them during the week.

Bleve said:

Brendo said:

After waiting 2 weeks for my bike to arrive, we picked them up on Friday
. Went for a ride Sat arvo up the freeway cycle path from Baldivis. For
a first time on a road bike, it was much easier to push than expected.
All up we did 32km averaging 22kmh (around 1hr30mn). Very enjoyable,
except a few things
1) Sore bum bones. Do these get better and build up resistance?

Yes and no. Or, it depends. You may notice that there's many many
different seats. This is for a reason. [censored] comfort depends on a
number of things; your riding position, the seat fitting your sit
bones, and the relative "softness" of your discomfort threshold.
Everyone here will have their favorite seats, and the old farts will
insist that those awful brooks leather seats are the one true seat,
don't listen to them, soon they'll be dribbing into their prechewed
food in a nursing home muttering about new fangled alloys and dreaming
of the days when all bikes were steel. Here's a tip, seats come in
different shapes & sizes for a reason, and soft seats aren't
necessarily more comfortable, one that fits you is the key. Any half
decent LBS will let you testride many seats. Take advantage of this.
Also, get the LBS or a coach to set up your position on the bike.

Quoted message said:

2) Headwinds. No wonder it felt easy for the first half.
3) My left crank arm fell off. I noticed a bit of extra movement, went
to pull out and the whole arm came off, still attached to my shoe.
Managed to work out how to put it back on (with the help of a passer
by), but don't expect this when we just paid $2k for a bike!! Store
owner will get some 'please explains' on Monday!!

Take it back, do not *touch* it in the meantime. This should not
happen. The shop is supposed to check everything for tightness
including cranks etc (unless you assembled it yourself, in which case
all bets are off). If this was loose, then I'd insist that they check
the whole bike properly as well as fix the damage that the loose crank
arm may have caused. Out of curiosity, what crankset is it?

From my limited knowledge (and reading the stickers) it's a Gossamer
FSA with 50/34 chainrings.

Tried turning it a bit today, there is some creaking/groaning (I'm sure
there is a better word for that) in it. Anyhow, I'll post how things
turn out tommorrow.

Bleve said:

Peter Signorini said:

Hey, I hope that's not a touch of 'ageism' creeping up - anyhow I'm still
the right side of 50 ;-)

Which side is that? 🙂

Yeah :-) The lower side, by only a few years.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

By the way, have you ridden a Brooks leather saddle for any length of
time?

Nope. And I won't. I have a saddle that fits. I've done 2 warnys on
it, I've done 1,000km in a week on it. I've done the Alpine Classic on
it. It fitted from day one. I've never had a saddle sore or any
numbness on it. It did take some months to find it though.

Quoted message said:

Lots of people talk these saddles down (think of them as too "old school"
I
guess) but have never ridden one. Yes they look less 'cool' and stylish,
yes
they are heavier, but to argue about their comfort with any credibility,
tell me about your riding experience in terms of years or '000s of kms.

In the last 4 years I've ridden ~75,000km. That enough? I also work
with around 15 or so road racing and event riders (as their coach) and
I listen and pay attention to their feedback on various things, not
least of which is comfort.

Sorry. My intentions were not clear. I don't want to cast any doubts on your
cycling experience, which as you say is substantial. I was referring to
riding experience _using a leather saddle_, which you admit you don't have.

<snip other stuff about soft tissue>

Quoted message said:

Or just find a saddle that fits in the first place. YMMV ....

Yes it does! I had a number of plastic saddles, including one that I thought
was very good. But I went back to the Brooks after a 15 year gap and found
that I had really forgotten how good it was (for me at least). Many of my
cycling friends have found the Brooks a solution for commuting and
long-distance tourng. I don't want to get into a saddle-war, and am not
trying to suggest that leather is the answer. But it is one solution for
saddle soreness, that works for many who try it. It did for me.

Now what about a good helmet war? ;-)

--
Cheers
Peter

~~~ ~ _@
~~ ~ _- \,
~~ (*)/ (*)

Peter Signorini said:

Quoted message said:

Or just find a saddle that fits in the first place. YMMV ....

Yes it does! I had a number of plastic saddles, including one that I thought
was very good. But I went back to the Brooks after a 15 year gap and found
that I had really forgotten how good it was (for me at least). Many of my
cycling friends have found the Brooks a solution for commuting and
long-distance tourng. I don't want to get into a saddle-war, and am not
trying to suggest that leather is the answer. But it is one solution for
saddle soreness, that works for many who try it. It did for me.

That's very true, and for some people, the flat saddle is ok, but a lot
of us have pronounced pereniums, and they simply don't work with
saddles that don't have cutout areas. It's more dependant on what
shape your soft tissues are than where your sit bones are, I think.

Quoted message said:

Now what about a good helmet war? ;-)

Euan's too easy to bait 🙂

Peter Signorini said:

sinus said:

I'd advise not to try any fix yourself until you've sorted out the bike
shop. That may void the warranty. There may already be damage due to it
being loose to start with which could require part replacement. The
crank arm may have already been damaged at the interface with the bb
axle.

Oh, yes - warranty of course, I should have mentioned that. Let the shop do
the work for you.

In this case (he needed bystanders advice to put it back on) taking it
back to the shop is probably the best suggestion. Especially as if
that's loose, what else might be too? Pedals, headset, stem ... And any
damaged parts should be replaced by the LBS at their expense..

Quoted message said:

My comments about getting a crank tool were in reference to you developing
the skills and equipment to look after your own bike. The warranty on parts
is usually only one year. After that you choose: get a shop to do
everything, pay for it and be a bit lacking in independence on the road, or
get some tools, play about with your bike (it's not rocket science after
all) and gain the satisfaction of being to look after most of your
maintenance.

Sure, and that's great advice for the long run, but not for an
inexperienced bloke who's crank fell off after 90 minutes of riding!

Peter Signorini said:

and am not trying to suggest that leather is the answer.

Leather is always the answer!

<frigging cows will learn to stop standing on my feet>