Leg Strength

Ride more. Cycling is primarily an endurance sport rather than a strength sport. In all likelihood, your legs are already 'strong enough' to do the job, and you just need to improve your endurance.

Here's a tip: try riding in a slightly lower gear and pedalling faster. Using a lower gear will require less force to be applied to the pedals to maintain the same speed, and may reduce the leg burning to some extent. A typical endurance cadence (pedal rpm) is about 85-95 rpm, which can feel fast for many beginners, but will help in the long run.

Thanks
So ideally it's a balance between a fast cadence and comfortable breathing. I seem to try to do whatever is needed to keep my speed at a certain point... whether this means increasing on decreasing gears... Often I just go with what feels more comfortable...

losse said:

Thanks
So ideally it's a balance between a fast cadence and comfortable breathing. I seem to try to do whatever is needed to keep my speed at a certain point... whether this means increasing on decreasing gears... Often I just go with what feels more comfortable...

Yes, but to Frenchy's point: High cadence riding for most people doesn't feel comfortable at first. Go out and settle into what's comfortable and then count pedal strokes. I find it easier to count each downstroke, ie. left = 1, right = 2, left = 3, right = 4. Do it for 30 seconds and you'll get your cadence. Compare that number with Frenchy's suggestion. I'll bet you're way low, which would mean you're riding with lot's of force. That high force wipes out your legs without so much taxing your heart/lungs. As I've taken this advice to heart, I've found my riding has improved, and the high cadence feels better and better. Your idea that its a balance between cadence and breathing is basically right, but don't assume that what feels comfortable now is the correct balance. Measure it and adjust to get in or near that 80-85 rpm range.

Of course not everybody uses a high cadence style - look at Armstrong and Ulrich. Totally different approaches. I watch Lance sometimes and wonder. It's like he's trying to wear out his bottom bracket, but the results clearly speak for themselves. At any rate, I'd definitely give the high cadence style a good long try. From what I've read it works better for most people in the long run and it certainly has for me.

Best regards,
J

So basically what you are suggesting is to increase my cadence which will feel uncomfortable from a cardio standpoint, which means that it will come down to improving my cardio on the bike? I'm a firm believer of the high/low cadence concepts we've discussed here too.. it makes sense that a longer stroke will affect the muscle more than a shorter stroke...

i'll give it a shot at my next workout. Thanks for the advice guys

losse said:

Often I just go with what feels more comfortable...

In general, that's a good approach for experienced cyclists (no offense intended if you do fall into that category, I'm just sayin'...). In your example, since your legs are very uncomfortable at the end of the ride, you might try spinning a little faster and see if that doesn't lessen the burning and fatigue. I don't know how fast you spin, but 85-95 rpm is generally considered the typical range.

From what I understand, slow twitch muscle fibers are the primary motor for endurance events, and that type of muscle builds up over one's cycling career. Just guessing here, but maybe those slow cadences are more taxing to the fast twitch fibers and over the years the legs are better able to handle the slower cadences as the slow twitch fibers develop.

losse said:

So basically what you are suggesting is to increase my cadence which will feel uncomfortable from a cardio standpoint, which means that it will come down to improving my cardio on the bike? I'm a firm believer of the high/low cadence concepts we've discussed here too.. it makes sense that a longer stroke will affect the muscle more than a shorter stroke...

i'll give it a shot at my next workout. Thanks for the advice guys

Yes. I'm saying based on your original comment about your legs being toast while your breathing & heart rate are fine, that you probably should increase your cadence which will cause you to put out more pedal strokes at a lower intensity per stroke. This should push your breathing/heart rate up and perhaps relieve some of the leg burning with a net increase in overall speed/power.

And yes, you will then want to increase your aerobic fitness which over time will let you maintain that spin in bigger and bigger, which is to say, faster and faster gears.

Good luck!
J

jjjtttggg said:

Of course not everybody uses a high cadence style - look at Armstrong and Ulrich. Totally different approaches. I watch Lance sometimes and wonder. It's like he's trying to wear out his bottom bracket, but the results clearly speak for themselves. At any rate, I'd definitely give the high cadence style a good long try. From what I've read it works better for most people in the long run and it certainly has for me.

Best regards,
J

High cadences suck for me. I've tried them. They just don't work. They're fine if I just want to go out and get some exercise and work my cardio system. I also find they can be easier on the knees. However, if I want SPEED I need a lower cadence and higher gearing.

Doctor Morbius said:

High cadences suck for me. I've tried them. They just don't work. They're fine if I just want to go out and get some exercise and work my cardio system. I also find they can be easier on the knees. However, if I want SPEED I need a lower cadence and higher gearing.

You Ulrich! Me Armstrong!!!!🙂 Just kidding. As always I think, what works best for each person is . . . well . . . exactly that which works best for that person. Deep! Profound!!! Genius!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

J

I noticed when I climb in big gears, leg extension is fairly minimal. My pedal strokes are more like quarter reps.
Last year I experimented with high and low cadence and I found that bigger gears and lower cadence made me breathe harder. There have been times when I've had to literally use maximum effort.
Spinning doesn't make me breathe nowhere near as hard and is the easier option.

OK POK OK...my 0.02

Try some high cadence like what has been suggested here... then....mix in your workouts with some intervals...that way you can also build up your leg strength/cardio the whole entire caboo.

By interval ..I mean you go out and go really hard/fast pace that you can maintain for an interval of time (say 1 minute or 2 ) then you go slow for an interval (the same 1 or 2 minute) to recover...repeat and repeat...soon you can sustain it longer and gain some leg strength too as well.

Oh, BTW, counting cadence is a royal pain....get yourself a cycle computer with cadence...that way you can just only focus on your ride.

Cheers!!! 😎

Losse,

Do you want to improve leg strength or endurance? It seems by reading your post you want to improve endurance. If so, the try the high cadence workouts. But if you want to improve strength, I would say that the lower cadence workouts would be better since they require more muscular strength to complete....

L

If a person wants to really improve the STRENGTH in their legs, they should join a gym and train like a powerlifter. They could also do sprints on the bike and become a good sprinter or become a track cyclist.

If they want to increase their ENDURANCE and/or POWER they should train on the bike for road races or time trials. It really is about that simple.

Powerlifters, track cyclists and sprinters have strength.

Road cyclists and Time Trialers have power.

The two terms are NOT interchangeable.

Mind you, even sprinters have endurance. I read this amazing case of a points jersey sprinter overtaking a polka dot climber in the mountains - almost unheard of in cycling. 🙂
But, yes, I agree with you. The most outstanding TDF riders seem to excell in time trials and climbing. The sprinters and pure climbers always seem to fall short at time trials and Basso's problem is he doesn't time trial as well as he climbs.

Doctor Morbius said:

If a person wants to really improve the STRENGTH in their legs, they should join a gym and train like a powerlifter. They could also do sprints on the bike and become a good sprinter or become a track cyclist.

If they want to increase their ENDURANCE and/or POWER they should train on the bike for road races or time trials. It really is about that simple.

Powerlifters, track cyclists and sprinters have strength.

Road cyclists and Time Trialers have power.

The two terms are NOT interchangeable.

Carrera said:

But, yes, I agree with you. The most outstanding TDF riders seem to excell in time trials and climbing. The sprinters and pure climbers always seem to fall short at time trials and Basso's problem is he doesn't time trial as well as he climbs.

I just posted that because so many posters in this thread are using strength and power interchangeably. They aren't.

And while powering up hills in big gears and a low cadence may produce some wee strength gains for a while, they will never yeild the profound strength gains one can make by performing a good powerlifting squat routine. There is no comparison in terms of bang for the buck in terms of producing strength.

Rudy said:

Try some high cadence like what has been suggested here... then....mix in your workouts with some intervals...that way you can also build up your leg strength/cardio the whole entire caboo.

By interval ..I mean you go out and go really hard/fast pace that you can maintain for an interval of time (say 1 minute or 2 ) then you go slow for an interval (the same 1 or 2 minute) to recover...repeat and repeat...soon you can sustain it longer and gain some leg strength too as well.

1) Intervals can be done at any cadence, so there's really no relation there. 2) As Dr. M has said riding a bike will not make your legs stronger since the force required to push down a bike pedal (even in the highest gear) is still far below that required to....say...stand up.

Try one legged squats ... no need for weights. If you can do one you rule!!

Carrera said:

Mind you, even sprinters have endurance. I read this amazing case of a points jersey sprinter overtaking a polka dot climber in the mountains - almost unheard of in cycling. 🙂
But, yes, I agree with you. The most outstanding TDF riders seem to excell in time trials and climbing. The sprinters and pure climbers always seem to fall short at time trials and Basso's problem is he doesn't time trial as well as he climbs.

NO one competing in the Tour de France is a true sprinter (events of ~ 2 minutes) or has any business following a structured resistance training program.

DM is talking about training for the explosive cycling events.

Like I mentioned in my original post, I would like to have more strength at the end of my bike runs... Compared to running where I am burned out in my legs and in my cardio, at the end of a 20k bike, my cardio is fine but my legs are on fire. I'd like to ideally peak in my legs and cardio just like I do when I run... I don't know if this means that I have to hit the gym and weightlift or get more mileage under my belf at high or low cadence.

I've gotten great feedback though.. it seems I need a combo of all the options mentioned above.

losse said:

Like I mentioned in my original post, I would like to have more strength at the end of my bike runs... Compared to running where I am burned out in my legs and in my cardio, at the end of a 20k bike, my cardio is fine but my legs are on fire. I'd like to ideally peak in my legs and cardio just like I do when I run... I don't know if this means that I have to hit the gym and weightlift or get more mileage under my belf at high or low cadence.

I've gotten great feedback though.. it seems I need a combo of all the options mentioned above.

If you're legs are burned out at the end of a ride, it has nothing to do with strength. On the bike intervals will do wonders to fix that.