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General fitness, health and nutrition
Published
26 December 2004
Last activity
28 December 2004
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Tom Collins
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  1. I'm starting the Atkins diet after the first of the year. One of my
    motivations (besides the obvious of it would be nice to lose some weight) is
    a contest at work with some fellow employees, where I could actually win
    some money.

    I'm wondering what kind of stumbling blocks I will encounter. There are some
    things I will miss, and others I won't. For the things I will miss, I guess
    find a low carb substitute, like the Carb Countdown milk. The diet portion
    doesn't have me too worried since I've always loved meat and don't mind
    veggies.
    What does have me a little worried a little more is exercise. I know to
    really get the weight loss in full gear, I need to exercise. I'm the type of
    person who will start exercising the first week, but will start making
    excuses after that. I do have a coworker that exercises during lunch almost
    every day that has agreed to let me tag along. This should help some.

    Now that I've listed what I can foresee, can you guys (and gals) help me
    with other areas I may have difficulties? I figure forewarned is forearmed.

    A couple more questions please:
    Can I assume that the closer you get to your ideal weight, the slower the
    weight comes off? That's what I've always heard.
    I'm 6'2", 220lbs, with a small frame. My goal is 180 (my last adult weight
    where I was not overweight). I know results can vary from one person to
    another, but can someone give me an idea of what to expect? The contest will
    last 4 months and it would be nice to reach my goal by then. Is this too
    optimistic?

    Thanks for any help you can give me!

    --

    Tom Collins
    tom_collins[at]bellsouth.net
    (replace the [at] to email me)

  2. Quoted message said:

    things I will miss, and others I won't. For the things I will miss, I
    guess
    find a low carb substitute, like the Carb Countdown milk. The diet portion
    doesn't have me too worried since I've always loved meat and don't mind
    veggies.

    Quoted message said:

    I'm 6'2", 220lbs, with a small frame. My goal is 180 (my last adult weight
    where I was not overweight). I know results can vary from one person to
    another, but can someone give me an idea of what to expect? The contest
    will
    last 4 months and it would be nice to reach my goal by then. Is this too
    optimistic?

    Forget about it. Based on your knowledge about low-carbing chances of
    success are close to zero.

    Mirek

  3. Mirek Fídler wrote:
    ||| things I will miss, and others I won't. For the things I will miss,
    ||| I guess
    ||| find a low carb substitute, like the Carb Countdown milk. The diet
    ||| portion doesn't have me too worried since I've always loved meat
    ||| and don't mind veggies.
    ||
    ||| I'm 6'2", 220lbs, with a small frame. My goal is 180 (my last adult
    ||| weight where I was not overweight). I know results can vary from
    ||| one person to another, but can someone give me an idea of what to
    ||| expect? The contest will
    ||| last 4 months and it would be nice to reach my goal by then. Is
    ||| this too optimistic?
    ||
    || Forget about it. Based on your knowledge about low-carbing chances of
    || success are close to zero.
    ||

    I agree. And this reasons are all wrong anyway. Already looking for the
    easy way out, too. Milk. heh.

  4. In article <[email hidden]>,

    Tom Collins' tom_collinsatbellsouth.net said:

    The contest will
    last 4 months and it would be nice to reach my goal by then. Is this too
    optimistic?

    Thanks for any help you can give me!

    Hmm. Let's see. You want to lose weight primarily for money, not because
    you care about your health. Before you even start, you're planning to find
    substitutes for carby foods that you think you can't live without. And,
    you're an expert at making excuses not to exercise.

    I predict you will lose a significant amount of weight in the next few
    months, and then gain it all back, plus more, shortly after the contest is
    over.

    --
    Michelle Levin
    http://www.mindspring.com/~lunachick

    I have only 3 flaws. My first flaw is thinking that I only have 3 flaws.

  5. Low carb diets don't work for idiots.

    HTH

    --
    You take stupid to a new level. -- MFW

    "Tom Collins" <tom_collins[at]bellsouth.net> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    I'm starting the Atkins diet after the first of the year. One of my
    motivations (besides the obvious of it would be nice to lose some weight)
    is
    a contest at work with some fellow employees, where I could actually win
    some money.

    I'm wondering what kind of stumbling blocks I will encounter. There are
    some
    things I will miss, and others I won't. For the things I will miss, I
    guess
    find a low carb substitute, like the Carb Countdown milk. The diet portion
    doesn't have me too worried since I've always loved meat and don't mind
    veggies.
    What does have me a little worried a little more is exercise. I know to
    really get the weight loss in full gear, I need to exercise. I'm the type
    of
    person who will start exercising the first week, but will start making
    excuses after that. I do have a coworker that exercises during lunch
    almost
    every day that has agreed to let me tag along. This should help some.

    Now that I've listed what I can foresee, can you guys (and gals) help me
    with other areas I may have difficulties? I figure forewarned is
    forearmed.

    A couple more questions please:
    Can I assume that the closer you get to your ideal weight, the slower the
    weight comes off? That's what I've always heard.
    I'm 6'2", 220lbs, with a small frame. My goal is 180 (my last adult weight
    where I was not overweight). I know results can vary from one person to
    another, but can someone give me an idea of what to expect? The contest
    will
    last 4 months and it would be nice to reach my goal by then. Is this too
    optimistic?

    Thanks for any help you can give me!

    --

    Tom Collins
    tom_collins[at]bellsouth.net
    (replace the [at] to email me)

  6. "Luna" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    In article <[email hidden]>,

    Tom Collins' tom_collinsatbellsouth.net said:

    The contest will
    last 4 months and it would be nice to reach my goal by then. Is this too
    optimistic?

    Thanks for any help you can give me!

    Hmm. Let's see. You want to lose weight primarily for money, not because
    you care about your health. Before you even start, you're planning to


    find

    Quoted message said:

    substitutes for carby foods that you think you can't live without. And,
    you're an expert at making excuses not to exercise.

    I predict you will lose a significant amount of weight in the next few
    months, and then gain it all back, plus more, shortly after the contest is
    over.

    --
    Michelle Levin
    http://www.mindspring.com/~lunachick

    I have only 3 flaws. My first flaw is thinking that I only have 3 flaws.

    I said the money is ONE OF my motivations, not my primary one. How many of
    you started a diet for the sole reason of health, and not so that you'd look
    better or get more sex? How many of you exercise just to burn calories and
    not for bodybuilding, strength training, or toning. My primary goal is to
    lose weight. The money isn't even that much. But to win the contest with the
    money & the bragging rights, is a motivator for me.

    I don't see a problem with finding substitutions for some carby foods. I
    haven't tried to Carb Countdown yet, but have read reports that most people
    like it. I also don't have a problem with drinking diet sodas. If you do see
    a problem with this, then please spell it out. All you did was make a vague
    reference to it like it was a bad thing.

    I am an expert at making excuses not to exercise. I already know this to be
    a problem. I'm working on motivation the best I can.

    If the diet works, then I have no plans to drop it after the contest. I just
    bought Dr. Atkins's book today and obviously haven't had time to read it
    all, but plan to finish it before I start the diet. What I have found out so
    far is that the diet doesn't look too hard to start with and is even easier
    when you're in maintenance mode.

    I wrote here for 2 reasons: 1) To find out about any potential potholes in
    the road I may encounter that I haven't already foreseen. 2) For morale
    support.
    So for I haven't got anything but negativity. Is this all this NG has to
    offer?

  7. Tom Collins wrote:
    || "Luna" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    || news:[email hidden]...
    ||| In article <[email hidden]>,
    ||| "Tom Collins" <tom_collins[at]bellsouth.net> wrote:
    |||
    |||| The contest will
    |||| last 4 months and it would be nice to reach my goal by then. Is
    |||| this too optimistic?
    ||||
    |||| Thanks for any help you can give me!
    |||
    ||| Hmm. Let's see. You want to lose weight primarily for money, not
    ||| because you care about your health. Before you even start, you're
    ||| planning to find substitutes for carby foods that you think you
    ||| can't live without. And, you're an expert at making excuses not to
    ||| exercise.
    |||
    ||| I predict you will lose a significant amount of weight in the next
    ||| few months, and then gain it all back, plus more, shortly after the
    ||| contest is over.
    |||
    ||| --
    ||| Michelle Levin
    ||| http://www.mindspring.com/~lunachick
    |||
    ||| I have only 3 flaws. My first flaw is thinking that I only have 3
    ||| flaws.
    ||
    || I said the money is ONE OF my motivations, not my primary one. How
    || many of you started a diet for the sole reason of health, and not so
    || that you'd look better or get more sex? How many of you exercise
    || just to burn calories and not for bodybuilding, strength training,
    || or toning. My primary goal is to lose weight. The money isn't even
    || that much. But to win the contest with the money & the bragging
    || rights, is a motivator for me.
    ||
    || I don't see a problem with finding substitutions for some carby
    || foods. I haven't tried to Carb Countdown yet, but have read reports
    || that most people like it. I also don't have a problem with drinking
    || diet sodas. If you do see a problem with this, then please spell it
    || out. All you did was make a vague reference to it like it was a bad
    || thing.
    ||
    || I am an expert at making excuses not to exercise. I already know
    || this to be a problem. I'm working on motivation the best I can.
    ||
    || If the diet works, then I have no plans to drop it after the
    || contest. I just bought Dr. Atkins's book today and obviously haven't
    || had time to read it all, but plan to finish it before I start the
    || diet. What I have found out so far is that the diet doesn't look too
    || hard to start with and is even easier when you're in maintenance
    || mode.
    ||
    || I wrote here for 2 reasons: 1) To find out about any potential
    || potholes in the road I may encounter that I haven't already
    || foreseen. 2) For morale support.
    || So for I haven't got anything but negativity. Is this all this NG
    || has to offer?

    Okay.....go to www.atkins.com and read about the rules on induction. That
    will take two weeks during which time you'll finish reading the book (some
    will say read the entire thing first but I don't think that is necessary,
    but you should read the book for your own benefit). The first week can be
    real hell, so I suggest you just focus on getting through that. What
    problems which may arise along the way is such an individual thing that
    you'll just have to deal with them as they come up. But if you hang out
    here enough, you'll see these issues discussed.

  8. In article <[email hidden]>, "Tom Collins"
    <tom_collins[at]bellsouth.net> says...

    Quoted message said:


    "Luna" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    In article <[email hidden]>,

    Tom Collins' tom_collinsatbellsouth.net said:

    The contest will
    last 4 months and it would be nice to reach my goal by then. Is this too
    optimistic?

    Thanks for any help you can give me!

    Hmm. Let's see. You want to lose weight primarily for money, not because
    you care about your health. Before you even start, you're planning to


    find

    Quoted message said:

    substitutes for carby foods that you think you can't live without. And,
    you're an expert at making excuses not to exercise.

    I predict you will lose a significant amount of weight in the next few
    months, and then gain it all back, plus more, shortly after the contest is
    over.

    --
    Michelle Levin
    http://www.mindspring.com/~lunachick

    I have only 3 flaws. My first flaw is thinking that I only have 3 flaws.

    I said the money is ONE OF my motivations, not my primary one. How many of
    you started a diet for the sole reason of health, and not so that you'd look
    better or get more sex? How many of you exercise just to burn calories and
    not for bodybuilding, strength training, or toning. My primary goal is to
    lose weight. The money isn't even that much. But to win the contest with the
    money & the bragging rights, is a motivator for me.

    I don't see a problem with finding substitutions for some carby foods. I
    haven't tried to Carb Countdown yet, but have read reports that most people
    like it. I also don't have a problem with drinking diet sodas. If you do see
    a problem with this, then please spell it out. All you did was make a vague
    reference to it like it was a bad thing.

    I am an expert at making excuses not to exercise. I already know this to be
    a problem. I'm working on motivation the best I can.

    If the diet works, then I have no plans to drop it after the contest. I just
    bought Dr. Atkins's book today and obviously haven't had time to read it
    all, but plan to finish it before I start the diet. What I have found out so
    far is that the diet doesn't look too hard to start with and is even easier
    when you're in maintenance mode.

    I wrote here for 2 reasons: 1) To find out about any potential potholes in
    the road I may encounter that I haven't already foreseen. 2) For morale
    support.
    So for I haven't got anything but negativity. Is this all this NG has to
    offer?

    Welcome to the group, Tom! We all started low-carbing for our own
    reasons, and those of us who STAYED low-carbing also did it for our own
    reasons. Personally, I started out because I wanted to lose weight. I
    was so astounded (and THRILLED) at how much better I felt that I
    continue to stay with it (not to mention I still want to lose 22 lbs,
    but that's slow-going for me).

    There's nothing wrong in finding substitutes for high-carb items,
    depending on your attitude. Lots of people drink Carb Countdown, for
    instance, and I've heard mostly good things about it. Most of us have
    found that sticking to the basics, for the most part, is the best recipe
    for success. Many people who are unfamiliar with low-carb specifics
    think that you either a) eat nothing but meat, fat and cheese; or be)
    think you can eat mostly manufactured low-carb products and still lose
    weight. Manufactured low-carb products are often pricey and not
    particularly good. Most of them tout "net carbs" of much less than the
    total carb figure, which can be misleading. For instance, some low-carb
    bars have a total of, say, 25 carbs/bar with maybe 6 gms of fiber. If
    they use a sugar-alcohol to sweeten it, the impact of the sugar alcohol
    can vary quite a bit from one person to the next, so claiming a "net
    carb" of 4 might work for one person, but it might be closer to the 19
    carbs (after deducting the fiber) for someone else. 19 carbs for a
    single bar is pretty hard on a carb budget of 20 gms/day for the first
    two weeks! The key is moderation. It's better to get a good handle on
    the new way of eating, however, before trying a lot of substitutes.

    I just posted some low-carb tips that you might be interested in. I
    post it once a week.

    It's true that the heavier you are, generally speaking, the faster you
    will lose weight -- as you get closer to goal, the weight loss slows.
    Mine has pretty much stalled, but I've also had a difficult time
    exercising very often in the last few months and I'm very sedentary in
    ANY case -- exercise can and DOES make a BIG difference.

    I think people are bracing themselves now for the post-holiday onslaught
    of newbies who will quickly tire of the new way of eating, stop going to
    the gym, etc. Traffic will pick up considerably over the next month,
    then taper off again. If you go INTO it thinking it's a temporary
    thing, though, you are less likely to succeed. This is more a way to
    CONTROL your appetite and weight than a quick weight-loss gimmick. As
    some have said, the impressive initial loss CANNOT be sustained because
    it IS mostly water loss. Each molecule of glycogen in the liver is
    bound to 4-5 molecules of water. As the glycogen store is used up, the
    water is shed. Once it is depleted, THEN the real fat loss begins and
    will will mostly likely be 1-2 lbs per week (sometimes more for men).
    It's not magic, it's just the way it works. When people stop low-
    carbing a couple of things happen: 1) lots of carbs causes more
    cravings and makes a person less likely to resist temptation because the
    body is SCREAMING for more and more carbs; 2) as the glycogen store in
    the liver refills, the water weight QUICKLY gets added back on. It's
    not an immediate FAT gain, but people who are unaware of this assume
    that low-carbing is a farce and that it RUINED their bodies. Again,
    it's just the way the body works. You can burn glycogen (carbs) for
    fuel or you can burn fat -- it's up to you.

    BTW, the first few days can be very hard on a person as the body fights
    making the adjustment in primary fuel sources -- after about 4 days,
    however, you should be feeling an enjoyable surge of energy.

    --
    Saffire
    205/147/125 - 5'1.5"
    Atkins since 6/14/03
    Progress photo: http://photos.yahoo.com/saffire333

  9. Thank you. I actually have about 2 weeks before I start the diet and plan to
    have the book done by then. I assume that the web site you mentioned is
    pretty the same as Dr. Atkins's (New, Revised, & Improved version) book.
    This is the type of info I was looking for, "The first week can be real
    hell...". Now I won't be discouraged when it gets tougher than I originally
    planned for.

    Also, I know this isn't an exercise NG, but if anyone has any suggestions
    for me (other than "just stick it out" or "get in a routine"😉 I'm open to
    hear them.

    Thanks again.

    --

    Tom Collins
    tom_collins[at]bellsouth.net
    (replace the [at] to email me)

  10. Tom Collins wrote:
    || Thank you. I actually have about 2 weeks before I start the diet and
    || plan to have the book done by then. I assume that the web site you
    || mentioned is pretty the same as Dr. Atkins's (New, Revised, &
    || Improved version) book. This is the type of info I was looking for,
    || "The first week can be real hell...". Now I won't be discouraged
    || when it gets tougher than I originally planned for.

    You'll find that going into ketosis can really send you for a loop (it is
    not harmful). Your bodily systems may seem out of whack for a bit, but
    things return to normal soon. Some find the feel better than ever, too. It
    really depends on where you start from, so to speak.

    ||
    || Also, I know this isn't an exercise NG, but if anyone has any
    || suggestions for me (other than "just stick it out" or "get in a
    || routine"😉 I'm open to hear them.

    Well, walking on a regular basis is a great place to start. You can work on
    building up speed and distance, but being consisent about it is most
    important. If walking is too easy, then swimming, cylcing, running are all
    options, depending on what you prefer. Of course, activities you really
    enjoy are big winners too (tennis, racketball, basketball, etc.). And then
    there is weight training. I think all diets should include it as one of at
    least two forms of exercise. Just my personal opinion, though. In fact,
    you can effectively lose weight without exercise, but exercise is good for
    you and can speed weight loss and help you to look better once you become
    normal weight.

    Warning: Exercise can be really hard while adjusting to a LC WOE (way of
    eating) during induction. It is best not to push too hard during that time.

  11. In article <[email hidden]>,

    Tom Collins' tom_collinsatbellsouth.net said:


    I wrote here for 2 reasons: 1) To find out about any potential potholes in
    the road I may encounter that I haven't already foreseen. 2) For morale
    support.
    So for I haven't got anything but negativity. Is this all this NG has to
    offer?

    I think we _were_ pointing out some major potholes. Specifically, your
    attitude. If your primary motivation is actually not this contest, you did
    a sucky job at making that point, because it sure as heck looked like it
    was. I really don't know much about Carb Countdown milk-like products, but
    they may be ok. That's not the point. The point is attitude. Major life
    changes require major sacrifices, and to make those sacrifices you first
    have to look at your life and the things you think you "can't live without"
    and say to yourself "Yes, I can live without this." It's not just about
    carbs, it's about changing perceptions and attitude.

    --
    Michelle Levin
    http://www.mindspring.com/~lunachick

    I have only 3 flaws. My first flaw is thinking that I only have 3 flaws.

  12. "Tom Collins" <tom_collins[at]bellsouth.net> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:


    "Luna" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    In article <[email hidden]>,

    Tom Collins' tom_collinsatbellsouth.net said:

    The contest will
    last 4 months and it would be nice to reach my goal by then. Is this
    too
    optimistic?

    Thanks for any help you can give me!

    Hmm. Let's see. You want to lose weight primarily for money, not because
    you care about your health. Before you even start, you're planning to


    find

    Quoted message said:

    substitutes for carby foods that you think you can't live without. And,
    you're an expert at making excuses not to exercise.

    I predict you will lose a significant amount of weight in the next few
    months, and then gain it all back, plus more, shortly after the contest
    is
    over.

    --
    Michelle Levin
    http://www.mindspring.com/~lunachick

    I have only 3 flaws. My first flaw is thinking that I only have 3 flaws.

    I said the money is ONE OF my motivations, not my primary one. How many of
    you started a diet for the sole reason of health, and not so that you'd
    look
    better or get more sex? How many of you exercise just to burn calories and
    not for bodybuilding, strength training, or toning. My primary goal is to
    lose weight. The money isn't even that much. But to win the contest with
    the
    money & the bragging rights, is a motivator for me.

    I don't see a problem with finding substitutions for some carby foods. I
    haven't tried to Carb Countdown yet, but have read reports that most
    people
    like it. I also don't have a problem with drinking diet sodas. If you do
    see
    a problem with this, then please spell it out. All you did was make a
    vague
    reference to it like it was a bad thing.

    I am an expert at making excuses not to exercise. I already know this to
    be
    a problem. I'm working on motivation the best I can.

    If the diet works, then I have no plans to drop it after the contest. I
    just
    bought Dr. Atkins's book today and obviously haven't had time to read it
    all, but plan to finish it before I start the diet. What I have found out
    so
    far is that the diet doesn't look too hard to start with and is even
    easier
    when you're in maintenance mode.

    I wrote here for 2 reasons: 1) To find out about any potential potholes in
    the road I may encounter that I haven't already foreseen. 2) For morale
    support.
    So for I haven't got anything but negativity. Is this all this NG has to
    offer?

    I've only read a few of the responses, and I have to agree.

    Let's get to basics.

    All of us "wise" low carb people started somewhere. We might have picked up
    an Atkins or South Beach book or something (Atkins, myself, although after
    success over the last many months, I've modified it somewhat to my
    lifestyle... which is what Atkins suggested)

    Now, let's see.

    You should never put a timeline on it. Different people react to a change
    in eating habits differently. There's no way to predict the outcome for
    you, personally.

    I sense that you see it as a diet rather than a way of life. It's up to
    you, but if you want to really control your weight, you might have to commit
    yourself to it forever. Its about the mechanics of the human body, not
    "what can I get away with". You can't get away with nuthin. Your body
    knows.

    Low-carb dieting is not magic. It just works based on the human metabolism.
    I would suggest trying to eat higher-carb foods in the morning, and lowering
    the carb intake later in the day. I think your last meal of the day,
    hopefully before sunset, should consist of nothing but protein and fat.

    But that's just what works for me. Everyone is different.

    I apologize for anything I have said that might replicate any other answers
    here.

  13. Roger Zoul said:

    You'll find that going into ketosis can really send you for a loop (it is
    not harmful).

    Many leading edge cardiologists would severely disagree with you. Two
    points. One, stay out of research. Two, stay out of biochemistry.

  14. Roger Zoul said:
    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    You'll find that going into ketosis can really send you for a loop (it is
    not harmful).

    Mu:

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    Many leading edge cardiologists would severely disagree with you. Two
    points. One, stay out of research. Two, stay out of biochemistry.

    Travis Newbury said:

    And Many AGREE with her.

    lol

  15. Roger Zoul said:
    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    You'll find that going into ketosis can really send you for a loop (it is
    not harmful).

    Mu:

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    Many leading edge cardiologists would severely disagree with you. Two
    points. One, stay out of research. Two, stay out of biochemistry.

    Travis Newbury said:

    And Many AGREE with her.

    Mu:

    lol

    Travis Newbury said:

    Oh yea, I forgot, you are the only one in this group qualified enough to
    make statements like these.

    my bad...

    It just blew right by you, didn't it? You were so hopped up to make a cute
    response, it blew right by your head, or right thru it, one or both.

  16. : Oh yea, I forgot, you are the only one in this group qualified enough to
    : make statements like these.
    :
    : my bad...

    Just killfile him like the rest of us and forget about him.

    Pat in TX
    :

  17. :
    : Were you with her every moment? Just because you saw her miss a meal
    : doesn't prove she did the plan correctly. Since you're a beginner
    yourself,
    : how can you assess her skil at doing LC? My point: be careful in trying
    to
    : draw conclusions about whether or not a plan works. Different people are
    : different and many are unsuccessful at dieting - no matter what plan they
    : follow.

    Hey! A logical person! Rare, these days.

    Pat in TX

  18. : However, some of you still doubt my primary motivation. The amount of
    money
    : I'll win isn't a whole lot. It won't even make a dent in my budget either
    : way. I am a competitive person though and I see this as a good time to
    : start.

    Nah, your primary motivation is ego. You said so yourself: "bragging
    rights!"

    I
    :I agreed to a short time commitment. I'll reevaluate after that.

    Great! Now do it the right way, without all of the substitutes until you get
    about 3-4 weeks into the diet.

    :
    : One of you said I don't know you, but you're wrong. I've always been a
    study
    : of people, and while I may not know you individually, I do know you as a
    : group. While most of you won't admit it, one of the major reasons you
    wanted
    : to lose weight was to look better. Maybe for a present/future partner,
    maybe
    : for your career. Some of you wanted to be in better shape in order to
    : perform a physical activity. Very few of you did this solely for pure
    health
    : reasons.

    Oh, I like this argument! It's nearly as good as the one that goes "no
    matter what you say...."
    Get a grip, man! Many of the people here are diabetics. You didn't know
    that, even!

    : Attacking someone for one of their motivations is introducing negativity
    : into their mindset.

    There was NO attack--just people pointing out or rather reflecting your own
    words back at you. Be honest, at least. You are the one who brought in
    "bets", "bragging rights", "money", "competition", etc. That was you, not
    anyone here.

    : A lot of you aren't going to like that last statement, but I don't care.
    I'm
    : a strait shooter. I'm truthful to both myself and others I talk with. That
    : doesn't mean I try to be hurtful, but it does mean that I won't listen to
    : anyone trying to puff up their ego by putting down others. I don't have
    the
    : time to waste. That also doesn't mean I won't listen to another point of
    : view as long as it's polite. I'm a very secure person and know that I can
    be
    : wrong sometimes. And when I am wrong I'll freely admit it and then move
    on.
    : It's that simple.

    You're certainly not being strait (sic) here. You're telling us you "know"
    us better than we know ourselves. You're acting like you've been wounded
    and are fighting back. You ask for criticism and then don't like it when you
    get it. That's pure ego talking.

    :
    : Some of you still see a problem with my wanting to find substitutions.
    O.K.,
    : what I see is that it's alright to substitute this "way of eating" for
    that
    : "way of eating" (after all that's what Atkins is all about), but it's not
    : alright to substitute this food item for another food item. This logic
    : doesn't make any sense to me. To me, finding a substitute for something I
    : really like seems like a good idea. It seems like it would be a smaller
    : step. Most other things I don't care enough about to worry about it.

    People here see a problem with it because they have been on the diet longer
    than you and have the experience to share with you. They are speaking from
    experience, whereas you are not. You can learn the easy way by listening to
    people with experience or you can learn the hard way. If you want to learn
    the hard way--without asking for the input of people with experience--then
    why are you here?

    Pat in TX

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