strength gain

shming123 said:

Does anyone here take protein powder (whey protein, or other supplements) to gain muscle strength or size? During off-season training and weight lifting, is it possible to gain muscle strength, but not size? Or is size gain kind of inevitable? What does the protein powder help with?

I started using whey protein powder about 4 month ago to help loose some weight. Athough I have not lost the weight (maybe 2 pounds) in this time period 🙁 I have slimmed down and noticed a increase in streghth and muscle tone.

I'm no expert but from what I've been told the extra protein boosts muscle repair/building after a workout. This will cause an increase in size and/or density of the muscle depending on your workout. I do not do any significant weight training and when I do I keep the reps in the 20-25 range to avoid size gain. I also do yoga daily which helps lengthen the muscles also.
Hope that helped a little

It is quite easy to gain strength without gaining weight, you just have to adopt the right training protocol.

Now in terms of protein intake and muscle gain here is the deal.

1. If you do exhaustive weight training you will cause damage to the muscle fibres, add protein after exercise and your body will add muscular mass as insurance against the next time you try to tear it down.

This is the whole basis of bodybuilding style training but unfortunately its now pretty much the only way anyone in the west trains!!!

2. If you were to avoid training to failure you won' tear up your muscles and therefore your body won't freak out and try to add muscle. In this case extra protein after training won't have much impact at all and will either be stored as fat, used for energy or excreted.

Clausen, unfortunately your program of 20-25 reps for avoiding muscle size increase won't increase your strength, only your local muscular endurance.

for strength gain you need to do a low number of reps (1-5) and high weight but avoid failure to avoid muscle microtrauma.

Also once you have reached adulthood it is physically impossible to "lengthen" a muscle unless you have surgery to change the origin and insertion at the muscle/bone interface. Yoga can help with flexibility but not much else.

body weight is largely bones + muscle. muscles grow due to workload. bodyfat is a relatively small percentage of bodyweight.

having reached, for examnple, 100 lb bench press, work toward more reps per set.

if you can do, say, 50 reps per set with 100 lb barbell when calm, think of your potential when enraged or frightened and flooded with adrenaline.

PS BTW, involuntarily voiding the bladder and bowels when frightened or enraged is a reflexive protective function of the body. if you pee our pants in a mooment of stress it is not an index of your courage.

vlad said:

body weight is largely bones + muscle. muscles grow due to workload. bodyfat is a relatively small percentage of bodyweight.

having reached, for examnple, 100 lb bench press, work toward more reps per set.

if you can do, say, 50 reps per set with 100 lb barbell when calm, think of your potential when enraged or frightened and flooded with adrenaline.

If you can do 100lb for 50 reps in the bench press then you need to have your head examined and your training program rewritten. Doing such high reps with such a low weight won't help your strength or your muscle mass much at all.

I agree with Duckwah on both post.

I've been around world class powerlifters like Curtis Leslie and others and through the years I have seen some top level powerlifters that have varying body types from skinny to huge bodybuilder looks. I have seen some real skinny guys deadlift well over 600 lbs and they look more like a basketball player than a weightlifter.

Powerlifters are only concerned about strength not how they look. Typically their training methods are low rep sets and the sets are broken up by long periods of rest between sets. Bodybuilders who are more concerned with muscle size have a more rapid pace and some like me have just a few seconds of rest between sets. At that pace you cannot do maximum lifts and therefore strength gains are less likely.

As for the protein, I use whey protein as my primary source. First, because its BV rating is higher than most protein sources and second because I simply don't have the time to just sit and eat meat all day like in my youth.

Basic rule for training athlete is 1.5 grams of protein per pound of bodyweight.
For a strength/bodybuilding athlete weighing 180 that would be 270 grams of protein intake per day while training. Let's say that the average chicken breast fillet (the size of your hand) is equivalent to 30 grams of protein. You would have to eat 9 chicken breast per training day to keep up as a strength/bodybuilding athlete. Who has time or money to eat 9 chicken breast per day?

I used to eat 8 meals a day and literally my meals would almost run together and that is a sick feeling. That's why I feel it is humorous when I hear newbies state their fears of getting too big because first I know they are not going to eat right to get that big in the first place unless they are a genetic freak of nature which I have been around a few of those as well. Even my friends that are pro bodybuilders eat almost all day and it is all high quality foods. The only way I can keep up the pace and maintain the muscle I have is to use supplements. I go through a 5 lb container of whey protein about every two weeks as a supplement to a large consumption of chicken and lean beef.

Consider your daily protein intake level per pound of bodyweight
Consider the BV (biological value) ratings of your protein sources
Consider your training goals and recovery time
Consider your daily work, training and meal schedules

A good rule of thumb is to load your protein starting immediately after your training and taper off as the day goes. The window of opportunity exist mostly after training when the body begins to recover and diminishes as time continues. Whey protein is a very quick acting protein and is a great source to drink as you leave the gym or the bike.

Best wishes

Felt_Rider said:

Powerlifters are only concerned about strength not how they look. Typically their training methods are low rep sets and the sets are broken up by long periods of rest between sets. Bodybuilders who are more concerned with muscle size have a more rapid pace and some like me have just a few seconds of rest between sets. At that pace you cannot do maximum lifts and therefore strength gains are less likely.

I disagree with you on this point due to context. Powerlifting does not translate into endurance sports very well at all. Who cares if you can squat 600lbs twice? Is it gonna help you make that hill? Not as much as say... the strength you gain by doing 6x 10 100# squats. The key is muscular endurance.

Check out the German Volume Method. 10 sets of 10. "Lighter" weight. HUGE strength gains after the initial adjustment period. Plus, you last longer. It is a program I swear by, I make more gains when I cycle onto this than anything else I do. No, it might not work for everybody, but it works for me.

As far as the intial post... I hate to say it, but it takes TIME. I was running/ riding/ lifting for a year before my weight actual dropped. In fact, I GAINED 5 lbs somewhere in there... at first... then it DROPPED off. You build the muscle to burn the fat. Dont worry about the scale, worry about your fitness level. When you are performing beyond any previous level, its all good.

triguy98 said:

I disagree with you on this point due to context. Powerlifting does not translate into endurance sports very well at all. Who cares if you can squat 600lbs twice? Is it gonna help you make that hill? Not as much as say... the strength you gain by doing 6x 10 100# squats. The key is muscular endurance.

I was not speaking on how it relates to cycling and I suppose I should have put my standard disclaimer stating such.

I either wrote this poorly or you are misreading my statement as how strength does not necessarily relate to muscular size. Which is related to the initial question is strength related to muscular growth. If you read my post I was answering a question apart from cycling because the question seemed general and not specific to cycling.

Now if you want my thoughts on strength training as it relates to cycliing please read the following threads and you will see that I pretty much agree with your statement:

cyclingforums.comshowpost.phpOpen ↗

cyclingforums.comshowpost.phpOpen ↗

best regards