Ugly Thoughts

[email hidden] (Bill B) wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Twas Thinking. There have been some homely bents made in the past[Re-bike,Bike-E etc] and a lot
of butt ugly cars like: Ford Pinto,Chevy Chevette[I call it a shy vette:-)], AMC Gremlin[yuck]
and a bunch more. Now get a roof top or trunk rack and vote which homely bent goes with your fav
ugly car.

First Place

Filus on a Thing

Second Place

BikeE on a Thing

Third Place

A certain homemade trike from Toronto on anything 😉

Bill (can make any bent ugly) Meacham

OUCH A certain homemade trike? Not sure you'd call it homemade given that it was done by a shop that
builds very expensive framesets as the only business and it took 8 months due to the long waiting
list for framesets the shop builds.
----------------------------------------

"William Meacham" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

[email hidden] (Bill B) wrote in message

news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Twas Thinking. There have been some homely bents made in the past[Re-bike,Bike-E etc] and a lot
of butt ugly cars like: Ford Pinto,Chevy Chevette[I call it a shy vette:-)], AMC Gremlin[yuck]
and a bunch more. Now get a roof top or trunk rack and vote which homely bent goes with your fav
ugly car.

First Place

Filus on a Thing

Second Place

BikeE on a Thing

Third Place

A certain homemade trike from Toronto on anything 😉

Bill (can make any bent ugly) Meacham

Look if you're gonna defend your trikes against unwarranted criticism I'm gonna have to start
calling you "Fast Wile". ;-)

"Wile E.Coyote" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

OUCH A certain homemade trike? Not sure you'd call it homemade given that it was done by a
shop that

builds

Quoted message said:

very expensive framesets as the only business and it took 8 months due to the long waiting list
for framesets the shop builds.
----------------------------------------

"William Meacham" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

[email hidden] (Bill B) wrote in message

news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Twas Thinking. There have been some homely bents made in the past[Re-bike,Bike-E etc] and a
lot of butt ugly cars like: Ford Pinto,Chevy Chevette[I call it a shy vette:-)], AMC
Gremlin[yuck] and a bunch more. Now get a roof top or trunk rack and vote which homely bent
goes with your fav ugly car.

First Place

Filus on a Thing

Second Place

BikeE on a Thing

Third Place

A certain homemade trike from Toronto on anything 😉

Bill (can make any bent ugly) Meacham

HaHa Skip, I am NOT defending the trike...the damn thing has been up on blocks for 2 weeks and it
broke down twice while riding it many miles from home...last time it came back in a van. As a
Prototype the trike was supposed to give me an idea what could be improved for another version. What
this Prototype has taught me was that I should have bought a TerraTrike. I am however excited about
the "other" prototype, the model engineered and partially assembled in Oregon. This trike is a
winner in every respect (except for the steering) and I'll have that worked out soon. What excites
me the most is that all 3 wheels are to be suspended and both front wheels will have disc brakes.

My criticism was directed at the word "homemade", if the 1st trike was made by my hand the trike
would cave before it left the garage. As it stood, I had it welded by a Professional framebuilder
and went about 25 miles before it caved (both brakes broke and both front wheel hubs shredded). This
was NOT the fault of the welder, this was a design booboo.

It had been my plan to drive the trike into a wall and see how it held together (actually I was
trying to convince my darling wife to drive it into the wall), but the front crashbar broke away
before I got to the wall and then driving down a hill in heavy traffic I looked at my front wheels
and what to my wonderous eyes did I see, but chunks of metal flying off and my brakes falling apart
before my eyes.

I must have broken a world record....I gave a whole new meaning to the phrase "Lean Steer", as my
right front wheel detached itself and was last seen rolling into a park, I leaned as far to the left
as I could while pedaling in order to keep the right front axle from touching the pavement. I went a
city block on a trike missing a front wheel. I'll wager Fast Freddy couldn't do THAT and he'd need
his head examined if he tried it intentionally.

It has always been my goal to design a trike that could withstand my stupidity...so far my stupidity
is winning Stupidity 1, Trike 0 I'd love to suggest that things can only get better, but
realistically things can and probably will get a lot worse before I have trike that "I' feel is safe
for others to pilot.

I figure that just MY saying a trike I designed is WHAT everyone should buy will be enough reason to
send everyone out to buy my trike.

You get Fast Freddy or Sam Wittingham endorsing a new 2 wheel bent and everyone into Speed will line
up to buy the bent they endorse. You get ME endorsing a trike and everyone who is concerned about
being killed as they accidently drive their trike off the edge and fall into the Canyon...followed
by the Anvil will then buy my trike....hmmm confusing cartoon example. What I mean is that IF I can
ride the trike in the same "unusual" way that I ride 2 wheel bents and the trike is able to
withstand the degree of abuse I put it through....then THAT trike will provide far more riding
safety than any trike they will ever need.

Re: Nigel Mansell drove his car into a wall at 200+ mph and survived
it....people would line up to buy the front bumper of any car that allows you to live after smaking
a wall at 200+ mph. I want a trike that can play chicken with a SUV and not have the trike pilot
on life support because the SUV won.

I am half way there, the "side crash bars" on the trike will take far more impact abuse than any
trike on the planet. When the (Dragonflyer-ish rear suspension) goes on, I'll then have a design
problem with the Roll Bar.....but in time I will figure this all out and a trike that I feel good
about will be hatched and released to the heaving masses.

Funny...2 people seeing me on my trikes have come up to me and said...you know seeing you riding
around on your recumbent trike has convinced me to stop riding a Mtb and get a (2) wheeled
recumbent.....I think I was insulted. 3rd chap seeing me going at my trike with my new Angle Grinder
said he is now building his 1st SWB bent...hmmm Seems my Trikes are convincing the Un-Bent to get
into (2) wheel bents. Maybe if I was building a LWB people would be buying trikes!
************************

"skip" <[email hidden]> wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Look if you're gonna defend your trikes against unwarranted criticism I'm gonna have to start
calling you "Fast Wile". ;-)

"Wile E.Coyote" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

OUCH A certain homemade trike? Not sure you'd call it homemade given that it was done by a
shop that

builds

Quoted message said:

very expensive framesets as the only business and it took 8 months due

to

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

the long waiting list for framesets the shop builds.
----------------------------------------

"William Meacham" <[email hidden]> wrote in

message

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

[email hidden] (Bill B) wrote in message

news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

> Twas Thinking. There have been some homely bents made in the past[Re-bike,Bike-E etc] and a
> lot of butt ugly cars like: Ford Pinto,Chevy Chevette[I call it a shy vette:-)], AMC
> Gremlin[yuck]

and

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> a bunch more. Now get a roof top or trunk rack and vote which homely bent goes with your fav
> ugly car.

First Place

Filus on a Thing

Second Place

BikeE on a Thing

Third Place

A certain homemade trike from Toronto on anything 😉

Bill (can make any bent ugly) Meacham

"Wile E.Coyote" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>... <snip>

Quoted message said:

Re: Nigel Mansell drove his car into a wall at 200+ mph and survived
it....people would line up to buy the front bumper of any car that allows you to live after
smaking a wall at 200+ mph. I want a trike that can play chicken with a SUV and not have the
trike pilot on life support because the SUV won.

Physics says "YOU LOOSE". Einsteinian Physis says "YOU LOOSE". SST(Super String Theory) physics says
"YOU LOOSE". I am sorry, but a bike that weighs 30KG can not win a battle with an IC vehicle that
weighs 1800KG. If you find a way to cheat the physics involved let me know a day before you
"convince" the press, because I will be really really rich person in that case.

Quoted message said:

I am half way there, the "side crash bars" on the trike will take far more impact abuse than any
trike on the planet. When the (Dragonflyer-ish rear suspension) goes on, I'll then have a design
problem with the Roll Bar.....but in time I will figure this all out and a trike that I feel good
about will be hatched and released to the heaving masses.

Does the bar look good? or look "good"? You have to bleed the energy somehow, and the only real way
I know of is as heat genererated as deformation of the frame, and a bike just doesn't have the mass
you need. I am not being an ass. If you have a way of making an SUV not be a death sentence I will
buy a trike no prob, but I can't run the numbers any way except that I loose the fight. When you
plug in the numbers for the velocity and mass of me and an SUV, even in an overtaking scenerio, I
loose the energy wars. I don't have the mass sink, to send the energy to, to survive a colision with
something 100 times my mass. If you have a valid way of turning those ergs from damaging me to
damaging my frame or the road I'm on board, but I am a real skeptic. You need to prove it. 3 frames
to the U.S. DOT for analysis, and then NHTSA safety ratings. If they say "well, damn. A bike can
survive a fight with a car", I will send you up to 5K U.S. for said trike. Seriously. My life is
easily worth that. Hell I dont't care if it has a top speed of 16 MPH or so. Now if the top speed is
4 MPH and I can survive a fight with an SUV thats a different story. It needs to be reasonable in
the speed catagory. Even I can design something with a top speed of 5 MPH that can syrvive an suv,
but I can pretty much walk faster.

Thanks Bryan

Quoted message said:

Funny...2 people seeing me on my trikes have come up to me and said...you know seeing you riding
around on your recumbent trike has convinced me to stop riding a Mtb and get a (2) wheeled
recumbent.....I think I was insulted. 3rd chap seeing me going at my trike with my new Angle
Grinder said he is now building his 1st SWB bent...hmmm Seems my Trikes are convincing the Un-Bent
to get into (2) wheel bents. Maybe if I was building a LWB people would be buying trikes!
************************

"skip" <[email hidden]> wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Look if you're gonna defend your trikes against unwarranted criticism I'm gonna have to start
calling you "Fast Wile". ;-)

"Wile E.Coyote" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

OUCH A certain homemade trike? Not sure you'd call it homemade given that it was done by a
shop that

builds

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

very expensive framesets as the only business and it took 8 months due

to

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

the long waiting list for framesets the shop builds.
----------------------------------------

"William Meacham" <[email hidden]> wrote in

message

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

"]news:[email hidden]...
> [email hidden] (Bill B) wrote in message

news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> > Twas Thinking. There have been some homely bents made in the past[Re-bike,Bike-E etc] and
> > a lot of butt ugly cars like: Ford Pinto,Chevy Chevette[I call it a shy vette:-)], AMC
> > Gremlin[yuck]

and

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> > a bunch more. Now get a roof top or trunk rack and vote which homely bent goes with your
> > fav ugly car.
>
>
> First Place
>
> Filus on a Thing
>
> Second Place
>
> BikeE on a Thing
>
> Third Place
>
> A certain homemade trike from Toronto on anything 😉
>
>
>
> Bill (can make any bent ugly) Meacham

[email hidden] (azqaz) wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

"Wile E.Coyote" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>... <snip>

Quoted message said:

Re: Nigel Mansell drove his car into a wall at 200+ mph and survived
it....people would line up to buy the front bumper of any car that allows you to live after
smaking a wall at 200+ mph. I want a trike that can play chicken with a SUV and not have the
trike pilot on life support because the SUV won.

Physics says "YOU LOOSE". Einsteinian Physis says "YOU LOOSE". SST(Super String Theory) physics
says "YOU LOOSE". I am sorry, but a bike that weighs 30KG can not win a battle with an IC vehicle
that weighs 1800KG. If you find a way to cheat the physics involved let me know a day before you
"convince" the press, because I will be really really rich person in that case.

I'd think that, too... but odd things do happen.

I owned a little car, a HMV Freeway. At 750 lbs, one would expect it to lose in a battle with a SUV.
One of these cars, owned by a friend, was motoring along when a 1 ton Chevy PU crossed the center
line. It was not only BIG, but it was also equipped with a snow plow on front.

The FW was flipped off the road. The left front fender, bumper & suspension was damaged, but the
owner got out and walked away. The Chevy had several $K in damage... and both "non-belted"
passengers were injured.

Sooo... if his bike is designed to "bounce" and he has proper seatbelts and shoulder restraints, he
might actually survive. Survivng such an accident would make you a winner.

From his luck with anything mechanical, he should definitaly have someone else try it, though.

Quoted message said:

Chevy had several $K in damage... and both "non-belted" passengers were injured.

Sooo... if his bike is designed to "bounce" and he has proper seatbelts and shoulder restraints,
he might actually survive. Survivng such an accident would make you a winner.

From his luck with anything mechanical, he should definitaly have someone else try it, though.

Without a doubt, the snowplow (which are carried at an angle) diverted the Freeway off the road
INSTEAD of sustaining the direct impact it would have without the plow. Not a valid comparison.

| > Physics says "YOU LOOSE". Einsteinian Physis says "YOU LOOSE". SST(Super String Theory) physics
| > says "YOU LOOSE".

Someone who knows how to spell it says "YOU LOSE". Excuse me, but after seeing this word spelled
wrong so often, and then in upper case ... I ... I just loosed it.

Donn

"Donn Cave" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:1054100703.999917@yasure...

Quoted message said:

| > Physics says "YOU LOOSE". Einsteinian Physis says "YOU LOOSE". SST(Super String Theory)
| > physics says "YOU LOOSE".

Someone who knows how to spell it says "YOU LOSE". Excuse me, but after seeing this word spelled
wrong so often, and then in upper case ... I ... I just loosed it.

Donn

Good observation Donn, but what's an extra o, p, or n among friends?

skipp

"skip" skrev

Quoted message said:

Good observation Donn, but what's an extra o, p, or n among friends?

Rather a lot actually. "o, p, or n" spells "porno". Tsk, tsk. Must be a freudian slip. ;-)

M.

"Mikael Seierup" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"skip" skrev

Quoted message said:

Good observation Donn, but what's an extra o, p, or n among friends?

Rather a lot actually. "o, p, or n" spells "porno". Tsk, tsk. Must be a freudian slip. ;-)

You've been living in Denmark too long. :-)

skip

"Donn Cave" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<1054100703.999917@yasure>...

Quoted message said:

| > Physics says "YOU LOOSE". Einsteinian Physis says "YOU LOOSE". SST(Super String Theory)
| > physics says "YOU LOOSE".

Someone who knows how to spell it says "YOU LOSE". Excuse me, but after seeing this word spelled
wrong so often, and then in upper case ... I ... I just loosed it.

Donn

Ack. Your right. I screwed that up. I lose.

Bryan

p.s. I have a similar peeve when people confuse idea and ideal, so I should be more careful. 😉

Quoted post said:

Originally posted by Wile E.Coyote
Re: Nigel Mansell drove his car into a wall at 200+ mph and survived
it....people would line up to buy the front bumper of any car that allows you to live after smaking
a wall at 200+ mph. I want a trike that can play chicken with a SUV and not have the trike pilot
on life support because the SUV won.

I am not familiar with that particular crash, but in general the secret to crash survival is energy absorbtion. Race cars often glance off walls and such and continue to move, all the while dissipating energy.

With conventional cars, the bumper is just the starting point. The front and rear of the car are designed to colapse while the passenger compartment stays in tact (as much as possible). The front and rear of the car are sacrificed to absorb energy in a crash.

If you design a trike with a lot of heavy tubes to protect it, the trike might survive, but because the structure is not energy absorbing, the rider won't be protected.

John Riley

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> Twas Thinking. There have been some homely bents made in the past[Re-bike,Bike-E etc] and a
> lot of butt ugly cars like: Ford Pinto,Chevy Chevette[I call it a shy vette:-)], AMC
> Gremlin[yuck]

and

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> a bunch more. Now get a roof top or trunk rack and vote which homely bent goes with your fav
> ugly car.

too easy- an E2 on top of a Pontiac Aztec

"rich westerman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:18e8a0e8a124753f2c19f439320fe2e3@TeraNews...

Now get a roof top or trunk rack and vote which homely

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> > bent goes with your fav ugly car.
>

too easy- an E2 on top of a Pontiac Aztec

I was thinking a Blackbent III on one of those Cadillac truck/suv things, but they didn't quite go
together, but the E2 / Aztec seems to be the perfect marriage for this purpose. Hopefully there will
be no offspring.

skip

[email hidden] (Bill B) wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Twas Thinking. There have been some homely bents made in the past[Re-bike,Bike-E etc] and a lot
of butt ugly cars like: Ford Pinto,Chevy Chevette[I call it a shy vette:-)], AMC Gremlin[yuck]
and a bunch more. Now get a roof top or trunk rack and vote which homely bent goes with your fav
ugly car.

How 'bout an EasyRacers EZ-3 Trike mounted on the roof of a 1978 AMC Pacer: a crab trap on top of a
greenhouse.

Butt ugly in form AND function:

Suzuki X7 with a Hypercycle on top....

makes me shudder.

Yours in ugliness Coop

John Riley <[email hidden]> wrote in :"]news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

Wile E.Coyote said:

Re: Nigel Mansell drove his car into a wall at 200+ mph and survived
it....people would line up to buy the front bumper of any car that allows you to live after
smaking a wall at 200+ mph. I want a trike that can play chicken with a SUV and not have the
trike pilot on life support because the SUV won.

I am not familiar with that particular crash, but in general the secret to crash survival is
energy absorbtion. Race cars often glance off walls and such and continue to move, all the while
dissipating energy.

With conventional cars, the bumper is just the starting point. The front and rear of the car are
designed to colapse while the passenger compartment stays in tact (as much as possible). The front
and rear of the car are sacrificed to absorb energy in a crash.

If you design a trike with a lot of heavy tubes to protect it, the trike might survive, but
because the structure is not energy absorbing, the rider won't be protected.

I think the idea here is just the opposite of modern car saftey design. A trike can't provide crush
zones like a car has, because there isn't enough room. However, it can be built so that instead of
being crumpled into a little ball when that SUV rear ends it, the trike can simply be pushed along
and out of the way. A roll cage and bumpers at the front, rear, and sides would take the brunt of an
impact without deforming, moving the entire trike as a unit with minimal damage rather than having
the delicate wheels, frame, and rider get demolished one by one.

It's not a perfect solution, but every little bit helps.

-Bill Hamilton

"rich westerman" <[email hidden]> wrote in news:18e8a0e8a124753f2c19f439320fe2e3@TeraNews:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> > Twas Thinking. There have been some homely bents made in the past[Re-bike,Bike-E etc] and a
> > lot of butt ugly cars like: Ford Pinto,Chevy Chevette[I call it a shy vette:-)], AMC
> > Gremlin[yuck]

and

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> > a bunch more. Now get a roof top or trunk rack and vote which homely bent goes with your
> > fav ugly car.
>

too easy- an E2 on top of a Pontiac Aztec

No fair; the Aztek is so ugly anything would look bad on it. Hell, it casts an aura of Ugly over
everything in a twenty foot radius.

-Bill Hamilton