Zabel confesses too

Video of Zabel's confession is at http://tinyurl.com/26kck6

Video of Aldag's confession is at http://tinyurl.com/2e4d2v

Both require RealPlayer to view, and both are entirely in German. If
you wait for a few hours I wouldn't be surprised if the entire press
conference shows up on YouTube.

J. Spaceman

On May 24, 7:04 am, Jason Spaceman <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

From the article:
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­----
2 More Ex-Telekom Riders Admit to Doping

By NESHA STARCEVIC
The Associated Press
Thursday, May 24, 2007; 6:34 AM

FRANKFURT, Germany -- Eric Zabel and Rolf Aldag, former teammates of
two Tour de France winners, admitted Thursday that they took
performance-enhancing drugs while riding for the Telekom team in the
1990s.

Speaking at a nationally televised news conference, both said they
took EPO. Both apologized and Zabel broke into tears during his
confession.

Aldag is now sporting director of the T-Mobile team, previously known
as Telekom. Zabel, a prominent sprinter, now rides for Milram.

Both were on the Telekom team when its riders won the Tour de France _
Bjarne Riis in 1996 and Jan Ullrich in 1997.

Aldag said he first took the blood booster EPO before the Tour in
1995, while Zabel said he took it in 1996.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­------------

Read it athttp://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/05/24/AR200...

J. Spaceman

Where's Mr. Riis? Will he out himself, or wait for others to do it to/
for him?
Best,
Bill Black

Dans le message de news:[email hidden],
Jason Spaceman <[email hidden]> a réfléchi, et puis a
déclaré :

Quoted message said:

Video of Zabel's confession is at http://tinyurl.com/26kck6

Video of Aldag's confession is at http://tinyurl.com/2e4d2v

Both require RealPlayer to view, and both are entirely in German. If
you wait for a few hours I wouldn't be surprised if the entire press
conference shows up on YouTube.

Quoted message said:

J. Spaceman

Thank you. Bravo to those who open up. Telling hurts, but not telling
hurts even more. Bravo, also to Gerolsteiner and Telekom, for not
dismissing persons who break the code of silence, and I can only hope the
same is for Milram. Our main loss is the inability to say who, among all
racers who say nothing, is a truly natural supertalent.

The Sport is Dead. Long live the sport.
--
Bonne route !

Sandy
Verneuil-sur-Seine FR

Sandy said:

Dans le message denews:[email hidden],
Jason Spaceman <[email hidden]> a réfléchi, et puis a
déclaré :

Quoted message said:

Video of Zabel's confession is athttp://tinyurl.com/26kck6

Quoted message said:

Video of Aldag's confession is athttp://tinyurl.com/2e4d2v

Quoted message said:

Both require RealPlayer to view, and both are entirely in German. If
you wait for a few hours I wouldn't be surprised if the entire press
conference shows up on YouTube.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

J. Spaceman

Thank you. Bravo to those who open up. Telling hurts, but not telling
hurts even more. Bravo, also to Gerolsteiner and Telekom, for not
dismissing persons who break the code of silence, and I can only hope the
same is for Milram. Our main loss is the inability to say who, among all
racers who say nothing, is a truly natural supertalent.

The Sport is Dead. Long live the sport.
--
Bonne route !

Sandy
Verneuil-sur-Seine FR

Odo bolts too. From what's being said seems like they either did it or
were gone.
Bill C

Sandy said:

The Sport is Dead. Long live the sport.

Vive le Sport!!
;-)

Sandy said:

Thank you. Bravo to those who open up. Telling hurts, but not telling
hurts even more. Bravo, also to Gerolsteiner and Telekom, for not
dismissing persons who break the code of silence, and I can only hope the
same is for Milram. Our main loss is the inability to say who, among all
racers who say nothing, is a truly natural supertalent.

The Sport is Dead. Long live the sport.

Why am I the only one to notice that he hasn't opened up?
Are we to believe that this was all in the past, nothing
in the present?

People have commented in the past about how unreasonable
the length of season he's been riding was. I guess aside
from those few instances in the distant past he's been a
supertalent.

Bob Schwartz

Sandy said:

Dans le message de news:[email hidden],
Jason Spaceman <[email hidden]> a réfléchi, et puis a
déclaré :

Quoted message said:

Video of Zabel's confession is at http://tinyurl.com/26kck6

Video of Aldag's confession is at http://tinyurl.com/2e4d2v

Both require RealPlayer to view, and both are entirely in German. If
you wait for a few hours I wouldn't be surprised if the entire press
conference shows up on YouTube.

Quoted message said:

J. Spaceman

Thank you. Bravo to those who open up. Telling hurts, but not telling
hurts even more.

Some things really are better not told - didn't Greg Lemond give us an example
of that.

I doubt that telling is going to help. If history is anything to go by the
officials will scream that this only proves the code of silence and that an
example should be made - these guys will have their palmares questioned, or
revoked, and everyone else will go on - happy they weren't dumb enough to talk
about it.

Quoted message said:

Bravo, also to Gerolsteiner and Telekom, for not
dismissing persons who break the code of silence, and I can only hope the
same is for Milram. Our main loss is the inability to say who, among all
racers who say nothing, is a truly natural supertalent.

Unless I am totally wrong, the truly natural supertalents were doping as well.
Joe Papp took all that [censored] and was still racing in Turkey.

I agree with you that the teams were right to not fire these guys, but we
haven't heard from UCI, ProTour, Prudhomme, or most important Pound, [censored] yet.
They'll probably insist on dismissal. After all, having riders come out and
expose the doping would destroy the adversarial approach to PED enforcement and
without that it's impossible for [censored] Pound to win. Can't win without an enemy
to defeat.

Quoted message said:

The Sport is Dead. Long live the sport.

Well, we'll all keep riding anyway....

Ron

Ron

Effect pedal demo's up at http://www.soundclick.com/ronsonicpedalry

Bob Schwartz said:

Why am I the only one to notice that he hasn't opened up?

Zabel? You mean more than: [summarized translation] "I tried it during
the first week of the Tour 1996. I wanted to try it out but it was
just this once. Jef and I decided I should stop when I noticed I
overheated."

--
E. Dronkert

Sandy said:

Quoted message said:

i don't see the same outpouring for the team docs, guys like lemond or
the soigneur who precipitated this series of events.

You must not read very many messages.

the typical sentiment about guys like lemond, manzano, decanio, this
soigneur is theat they are attention seekers and opportunists seeking
to profit.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

is zabel going to give back his millions and sell his apartment which
houses his collection of historic bikes and live like a $40,000/yr
schmoe ? i doubt it.

Envy is hard to hide, isn't it ?

i make no bones about it. i'd like to be as rich or as admired as
zabel. we all have possible ways to deceive to achive what we could
not otherwise. but i also don't want to be giving teary eyed
confessions about my past conduct either.

In a larger picture, in canada riders, coaches, the gov. body are
critisized for the lack of international results (jeanson aside). when
the belgian and russian riders were laid to waste the cdn riders, and
we're left questioning, are we really so backward in our methods ?
even though our coaches like landry and barras are being hired away by
other countries. in europe everyone mocks he french riders because
they can't get a result in any of their big races.

Dans le message de
news:[email hidden],
[email hidden] <[email hidden]> a réfléchi, et puis a déclaré :

Quoted message said:

Sandy said:

Quoted message said:

i don't see the same outpouring for the team docs, guys like lemond
or the soigneur who precipitated this series of events.

You must not read very many messages.

the typical sentiment about guys like lemond, manzano, decanio, this
soigneur is theat they are attention seekers and opportunists seeking
to profit.

Some writers enjoy voluminous and repetitive posts. You have never seen
that from me. If you have read my comments, you would have noticed nearly
an opposite trend.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

is zabel going to give back his millions and sell his apartment
which houses his collection of historic bikes and live like a
$40,000/yr schmoe ? i doubt it.

Envy is hard to hide, isn't it ?

i make no bones about it. i'd like to be as rich or as admired as
zabel. we all have possible ways to deceive to achive what we could
not otherwise. but i also don't want to be giving teary eyed
confessions about my past conduct either.

So, what have you done ? Bragging requires facts.

Quoted message said:

In a larger picture, in canada riders, coaches, the gov. body are
critisized for the lack of international results (jeanson aside). when
the belgian and russian riders were laid to waste the cdn riders, and
we're left questioning, are we really so backward in our methods ?
even though our coaches like landry and barras are being hired away by
other countries. in europe everyone mocks he french riders because
they can't get a result in any of their big races.

A lot of fun has been made about the French "theory" of racing at two
speeds. Perhaps recent events will lessen how much ridicule it receives. I
recently remarked about two local riders, friends, who quit, having lost all
motivation due to the persistent suspicion of the public - the French
public.

You can make your points without being an ideologue and without
exaggeration, even if these are de rigueur in RBR. Solid thoughts and their
statement can stand the test of time and attack. Don't be tempted to answer
flames in kind.

RonSonic said:

Why should they have said anything? Please use all the words you need to present
the argument.

do you mean zabel and aldag ? when the docs came forward aldag had to
face the question since he's a DS on the team which is supposedly the
clean team after their housecleaning last year.

his bosses don't need a court case and "beyond a reasonable doubt",
they can evaluate the evidence themselves. he can dodge the public,
but he can't dodge his bosses.

zabel wasn't under as much pressure, but just like puerto, eventually
someone would cave and it opens the door for more to come forward.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

is zabel going to give back his millions and sell his apartment which
houses his collection of historic bikes and live like a $40,000/yr
schmoe ? i doubt it.

To whom do you suppose he should give anything back?

the concept was meant to be rhetorical.

Ewoud Dronkert said:

Bob Schwartz said:

Why am I the only one to notice that he hasn't opened up?

Zabel? You mean more than: [summarized translation] "I tried it during
the first week of the Tour 1996. I wanted to try it out but it was
just this once. Jef and I decided I should stop when I noticed I
overheated."

Yeah. How about when he was winning Milan-San Remo in March, taking
the Green jersey in July, winning the World Cup, and then riding
six days? I guess that was all mineral water.

Telekom rode the 1995 Tour as a combination team with 5 riders. In
1996 and 1997 they were the top team in the sport. No [censored] there
was institutionalized doping.

People are comfortable with all sorts of doping. They just don't
want to know about it.

Bob Schwartz

email hidden said:

In a larger picture, in canada riders, coaches, the gov. body are
critisized for the lack of international results (jeanson aside).

But look at Canadian results in other endurance sports such as World
Cup x-c skiing and speed skating.

I think particularly of Beckie Scott who went from Bronze to Gold in
Salt Lake 2002, when the original 1st and 2nd were dq'd for using
Darbepoetin.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beckie_Scott

Doug Taylor said:

email hidden said:

In a larger picture, in canada riders, coaches, the gov. body are
critisized for the lack of international results (jeanson aside).

But look at Canadian results in other endurance sports such as World
Cup x-c skiing and speed skating.

I think particularly of Beckie Scott who went from Bronze to Gold in
Salt Lake 2002, when the original 1st and 2nd were dq'd for using
Darbepoetin.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beckie_Scott

Becki Scott rocks. Though I think she was the person who sent [censored]
Pound off the deep end in recklessly branding people as dopers. At
the press conference after she won her bronze medal she was asked if,
given her strong anti-doping sentiments, she thought the two athletes
ahead of her were doping. She gave an answer that was noncommittal but
suggested she did. Pound went ballistic after that, claiming she was
irresponsble to suggest such a thing, that the athletes had passed the
tests, etc. And a bit over a year later he looked like a naive fool.

PS -- she set up an altitude room in her bedroom.
--
JT
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Curtis L. Russell said:

John Forrest Tomlinson said:

PS -- she set up an altitude room in her bedroom.
--
JT

I've heard that one of those amplifies the effect of drinking. Does it
serve any other purpose?

One more layer of defense against a horny boyfriend.

--
Bill Asher

William Asher said:

Curtis L. Russell said:

John Forrest Tomlinson said:

PS -- she set up an altitude room in her bedroom.
--
JT

I've heard that one of those amplifies the effect of drinking. Does it
serve any other purpose?

One more layer of defense against a horny boyfriend.

Boyfriend was an Olympian too. He was "into it."

--
JT
****************************
Remove "remove" to reply
Visit http://www.jt10000.com
****************************

John Forrest Tomlinson said:

PS -- she set up an altitude room in her bedroom.
--
JT

I've heard that one of those amplifies the effect of drinking. Does it
serve any other purpose?

Curtis L. Russell
Odenton, MD (USA)
Just someone on two wheels...

in message <[email hidden]>, John Forrest

Tomlinson (') said:

Becki Scott rocks. Though I think she was the person who sent [censored]
Pound off the deep end in recklessly branding people as dopers. At
the press conference after she won her bronze medal she was asked if,
given her strong anti-doping sentiments, she thought the two athletes
ahead of her were doping. She gave an answer that was noncommittal but
suggested she did. Pound went ballistic after that, claiming she was
irresponsble to suggest such a thing, that the athletes had passed the
tests, etc. And a bit over a year later he looked like a naive fool.

PS -- she set up an altitude room in her bedroom.

I have to confess that I find it hard to see a moral distinction between
using an altitude tent and using EPO. They're both technical means of
achieving precisely the same advantage - if one is cheating, so is the
other.

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

[ This .sig subject to change without notice ]

Dans le message de news:[email hidden],
Simon Brooke <[email hidden]> a réfléchi, et puis a déclaré :

Quoted message said:

in message <[email hidden]>,

(') said:

guys like zabel and aldag made millions and enjoyed plenty of glory
and they used drugs occsionally or consistenly to achieve those
things.

is zabel going to give back his millions and sell his apartment which
houses his collection of historic bikes and live like a $40,000/yr
schmoe ? i doubt it.

Millions? Out of bike racing?

Wrong sport, mate.

Zabel. Try again. An altitude tent will give you more cerebral oxygenation
ONLY if you leave it.