Wrong way round lighting in Twickers

On 28 Nov 2003 05:23:59 -0800 someone who may be [email hidden] (Dave Kahn) wrote this:-

Quoted message said:

Maybe he thought he needed to swap them over for the return leg of his journey. :-)

A bike like an old fashioned tram. At the terminus change the seats round ready for the return
journey:-)

--
David Hansen, Edinburgh | PGP email preferred-key number F566DA0E I will always explain revoked
keys, unless the UK government prevents me using the RIP Act 2000.

Dave Kahn said:

Cycling through darkest Twickenham last night I saw a bike coming towards me showing a flashing
red light at the front. I wondered what, if anything, he would have on the back so after we'd
crossed I craned the old neck round to have a good look. Flashing yellow. Leaving aside the issue
of whether a flashing yellow light is appropriate for the front, I can't recall having seen anyone
put their lights on the wrong way round before. Maybe he thought he needed to swap them over for
the return leg of his journey. :-)

Are you sure he wasn't riding backwards?

I've seen a white light put on the rear before: most annoying to have that in yer eyeballs when
trying to get a draft!

~PB

Dave Kahn said:

I can't recall having seen anyone put their lights on the wrong way round before.

I met someone on the Bath-Bristol cyclepath a few years ago with a red light on the front of his
bike. He complained about being dazzled by my lights (6W flood aimed at the ground in front of my
bike, 10W spot aimed further ahead), I pointed out that if had displayed a white light on the front
of his bike then I'd have known there was someone coming towards me and would have turned the 10W
light off.

--
Danny Colyer (the UK company has been laughed out of my reply address)
speedy5.freeserve.co.ukdannyOpen ↗ "He who dares not offend cannot be honest." - Thomas Paine

Dave Kahn was sufficiently re-animated to talk about Wrong way round lighting in Twickers

Quoted message said:

Cycling through darkest Twickenham last night I saw a bike coming towards me showing a flashing red
light at the front. I wondered what, if anything, he would have on the back so after we'd crossed I
craned the old neck round to have a good look. Flashing yellow. Leaving aside the issue of whether
a flashing yellow light is appropriate for the front, I can't recall having seen anyone put their
lights on the wrong way round before. Maybe he thought he needed to swap them over for the return
leg of his journey. :-)

I drive when it's cold; there's some person onna bike comes down the road just as I'm trying to back
out. He has a red flashing light on the front. I watch for him now, but he ~damn~ near got knocked
off by me once or twice. The problems are:
1) As I look up the road, I assume that red lights are facing / travelling away from me. Not to
mention that in this case, there are usually plenty more red lights who are stopped at the lights
200 yds up the road, into which he disappears.
2) Cos it's flashing, as previously discussed on this NG, it's very difficult to locate and/or tell
which way he's going due to the lack of a continuous visual cue. So my brain has no reason to
disbelieve (1)

One day, I'll be out of work a bit late and have a chance to grab (well, call) him as he goes past.

Cheers, Jon
--
Why does everything nice I buy at the moment keep @##*%ing breaking? [email hidden] NOT!!
nospam=defblade

"Dave Kahn" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Cycling through darkest Twickenham last night I saw a bike coming towards me showing a flashing
red light at the front. I wondered what, if anything, he would have on the back so after we'd
crossed I craned the old neck round to have a good look. Flashing yellow. Leaving aside the issue
of whether a flashing yellow light is appropriate for the front, I can't recall having seen anyone
put their lights on the wrong way round before. Maybe he thought he needed to swap them over for
the return leg of his journey. :-)

Never seen that, although from other comments it seems not that uncommon. W h y would anyone do
that? It just seems like gobsmacking stupidity. Are they so lacking in intelligence they haven't
managed to pick up a clue about which way round they're supposed to go by observation, or just so
lacking in intelligence that they can't realise why it's important for their own safety that they
conform to the norm?

Rich

Jon Martin said:

he ~damn~ near got knocked off by me once or twice.

You didn't learn the first time?

Quoted message said:

1) As I look up the road, I assume that red lights are facing / travelling away from me.

What about stopped/reversing cars?

Quoted message said:

2) Cos it's flashing, as previously discussed on this NG, it's very difficult to locate and/or
tell which way he's going due to the lack of a continuous visual cue.

In which case it might make you drive a bit more carefully?

Simonb

Simonb was sufficiently re-animated to talk about Wrong way round lighting in Twickers

Quoted message said:

Jon Martin said:

he ~damn~ near got knocked off by me once or twice.

You didn't learn the first time?

As I say (and I say this as a fair weather cyclist and cold/wet weather driver rather than POB or
PIC) he really ~does~ practically disappear. It's like special, high intensity camouflage. It's
actually worse than POBs with no lights at all!

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

1) As I look up the road, I assume that red lights are facing / travelling away from me.

What about stopped/reversing cars?

As I said, most of the cars are stopped at the traffic lights up the road. Anyhow, leaving reversing
lights (whether working or even required as discussed in other posts) out, cars have continuous
lights, so it's possible to see their vector, if any.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

2) Cos it's flashing, as previously discussed on this NG, it's very difficult to locate and/or
tell which way he's going due to the lack of a continuous visual cue.

In which case it might make you drive a bit more carefully?

I certainly have to pull out from the parking more carefully purely because of him. I might mention
that I only claimed to have ~nearly~ collided. As I cover my brakes whilst pulling off the forecourt
(I have to roll backwards), the couple of times I suddenly realised (ie at the moment I could see
~him~ clearly and continuously rather than just his flashing light) I had sufficient time to stop.
How careful should I be! 😉

I feel that rather than being something new and different, calling attention to him, his defiance of
convention is more likely to get him killed than not. Any colour ~but~ red might work to make him
visible and make drivers take care, but red means back end/going away. As I didn't start this
thread, I'd suggest I'm not the only one to think so.....

Cheers

Jon
--
Why does everything nice I buy at the moment keep @##*%ing breaking? [email hidden] NOT!!
nospam=defblade

Simonb criticised:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

1) As I look up the road, I assume that red lights are facing / travelling away from me.

with:

Quoted message said:

What about stopped/reversing cars?

Stopped cars will at least not be travelling towards the OP. Reversing cars are legally required to
display white reversing lights, which offer a pretty good clue to the direction of travel.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

2) Cos it's flashing, as previously discussed on this NG, it's very difficult to locate and/or
tell which way he's going due to the lack of a continuous visual cue.

In which case it might make you drive a bit more carefully?

How do you know that the OP needs to drive more carefully? Flashing lights not backed up by a
continuous light *are* difficult to locate and track. As a motorist, I hate them. As a cyclist, I
hate them even more. When I'm coming up behind someone, I want to see a steady light so that I can
always see where they are. I can't usually rely on street lighting and it's nice to be able to see
someone before they get into range of my front lights.

--
Danny Colyer (the UK company has been laughed out of my reply address)
speedy5.freeserve.co.ukdannyOpen ↗ "He who dares not offend cannot be honest." - Thomas Paine

Simonb criticised:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

1) As I look up the road, I assume that red lights are facing / travelling away from me.

with:

Quoted message said:

What about stopped/reversing cars?

Stopped cars will at least not be travelling towards the OP. Reversing cars are legally required to
display white reversing lights, which offer a pretty good clue to the direction of travel.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

2) Cos it's flashing, as previously discussed on this NG, it's very difficult to locate and/or
tell which way he's going due to the lack of a continuous visual cue.

In which case it might make you drive a bit more carefully?

How do you know that the OP needs to drive more carefully? Flashing lights not backed up by a
continuous light *are* difficult to locate and track. As a motorist, I hate them. As a cyclist, I
hate them even more. When I'm coming up behind someone, I want to see a steady light so that I can
always see where they are. I can't usually rely on street lighting and it's nice to be able to see
someone before they get into range of my front lights.

--
Danny Colyer (the UK company has been laughed out of my reply address)
speedy5.freeserve.co.ukdannyOpen ↗ "He who dares not offend cannot be honest." - Thomas Paine

"Danny Colyer" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Reversing cars are legally required to display white reversing lights,

Are they? Mine passed its MOT recently without working reversing lights. (They are fixed now).

T

"Danny Colyer" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Reversing cars are legally required to display white reversing lights,

Are they? Mine passed its MOT recently without working reversing lights. (They are fixed now).

T

Jon Martin <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

I feel that rather than being something new and different, calling attention to him, his defiance
of convention is more likely to get him killed than not. Any colour ~but~ red might work to make
him visible and make drivers take care, but red means back end/going away. As I didn't start this
thread, I'd suggest I'm not the only one to think so.....

I started this thread and I agree with you. Putting a red light on the front is a really stupid
thing to do, and is probably more dangerous than having no light at all.

--
Dave...

Jon Martin <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

I feel that rather than being something new and different, calling attention to him, his defiance
of convention is more likely to get him killed than not. Any colour ~but~ red might work to make
him visible and make drivers take care, but red means back end/going away. As I didn't start this
thread, I'd suggest I'm not the only one to think so.....

I started this thread and I agree with you. Putting a red light on the front is a really stupid
thing to do, and is probably more dangerous than having no light at all.

--
Dave...

I said:

Quoted message said:

Reversing cars are legally required to display white reversing lights,

To which Tony W responded:

Quoted message said:

Are they? Mine passed its MOT recently without working reversing lights. (They are fixed now).

I shall eat my words at this point, because I've just checked the Road Vehicle Lighting Regulations
[1] and could find no requirement for reversing lamps. In fact they are covered under "Optional
lamps, reflectors, rear markings and devices".

[1] hmso.gov.ukUksi 19891796 en 1.htmOpen ↗

--
Danny Colyer (the UK company has been laughed out of my reply address)
speedy5.freeserve.co.ukdannyOpen ↗ "He who dares not offend cannot be honest." - Thomas Paine

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Reversing cars are legally required to display white reversing lights,

No they are not, where did you get that one from?

I said:

Quoted message said:

Reversing cars are legally required to display white reversing lights,

To which Tony W responded:

Quoted message said:

Are they? Mine passed its MOT recently without working reversing lights. (They are fixed now).

I shall eat my words at this point, because I've just checked the Road Vehicle Lighting Regulations
[1] and could find no requirement for reversing lamps. In fact they are covered under "Optional
lamps, reflectors, rear markings and devices".

[1] hmso.gov.ukUksi 19891796 en 1.htmOpen ↗

--
Danny Colyer (the UK company has been laughed out of my reply address)
speedy5.freeserve.co.ukdannyOpen ↗ "He who dares not offend cannot be honest." - Thomas Paine

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Reversing cars are legally required to display white reversing lights,

No they are not, where did you get that one from?

SimonJ responded to my response to Simonb:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Reversing cars are legally required to display white reversing lights,

with:

Quoted message said:

No they are not, where did you get that one from?

See my reply to Tony W (have I wandered into some strange alternative reality where people don't
have surnames?).

But have you ever seen a motor vehicle reversing *without* at least one white reversing lamp? I
certainly haven't. I have, on one occasion, seen a car reversing with the reversing lamp not lit,
but it was there.

--
Danny Colyer (the UK company has been laughed out of my reply address)
speedy5.freeserve.co.ukdannyOpen ↗ "He who dares not offend cannot be honest." - Thomas Paine

Danny Colyer said:

But have you ever seen a motor vehicle reversing *without* at least one white reversing lamp?

Plenty of them on the road. I believe that a lot of vehicles pre-1976 didn't have them.

--
MatSav