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Why I Love Dogs

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13 August 2005
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David Cohen
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  1. I was bored at work last night, so, I wrote an off-topic, but typical MFW
    off-topic, essay.

    Why I Love Dogs

    Our civilization as it exists today, and, possibly, our very existence as a
    species, is due, in large part, to the ancestors of that tail wagging,
    tongue licking, four legged bundle of energy, lying at your feet: your pet
    dog.

    The story of the domestication of the wolf and evolution into the dog is
    unique in all of human history. While many animals have served us.horse,
    cat, cow, sheep, among others.only the dog CHOSE to do so. As Nobel Laureate
    in Literature Maurice Maeterlinck wrote: "We are alone, absolutely alone on
    this chance planet; and, amid all the forms of life that surround us, not
    one, excepting the dog, has made an alliance with us."

    Hundreds of thousands of years ago, bands of early humans wandered the
    Earth, hunting and gathering, never staying in one place too long. They
    moved a lot because the food moved a lot, and they were not very efficient
    hunters. Additionally, the inevitable by-products of humans.waste, both food
    waste and feces.made staying in one place too long both unpleasant and
    unhealthy. It was a scary world, filled with both imaginary and real
    dangers.animals that hunted them, other humans that warred with them. All of
    these early humans' energy went into their basic survival.

    By sheer chance, as evolution usually works, another species of animal was
    wandering the Earth at the same time. The wolf was a social animal, like
    man; living and moving in groups; expending all their energy in basic
    survival.

    In any large group of organisms, most psychological characteristics exist on
    a spectrum, a bell curve of sorts. Wolves, then and now, have a critical
    distance from possible threats that they are not willing to cross. But, just
    a small percentage of wolves are more fearful of threats, a small percentage
    is "braver", willing to get closer and stay longer than the rest.

    To this equation, we add the principle, from the science of ecology, that
    organisms will adapt and evolve to fill all available niches. And the
    evolution of apes into groups of hunters, tossing waste food and crapping,
    was a whole new ecological niche. And those "braver" wolves were in the
    right place, at the right time, to take full advantage of this new source of
    energy.

    Keep in mind the principle: energy is reproduction. It takes considerable
    energy for animals to reproduce and raise the offspring to independence. In
    times of scarcity of resources, animals will often refrain from reproducing,
    and may actually kill and eat the newborns if they are produced. Anything
    that makes finding and consuming energy.food.easier, allows more energy to
    be expended in reproduction.

    And so, the wolf. The "braver' wolves, who were willing to get closer to the
    humans, to spend more time closer, eating the rich, easily obtained, new
    food source: our waste. These wolves now had an evolutionary advantage: less
    energy was expended finding and obtaining food, more energy was available
    for making baby wolves. And those baby wolves inherited their parents'
    shorter critical distance. And were better fed than the other baby wolves.
    And so, with each succeeding generation, the wolves got shorter and shorter
    critical distances, and produced babies at an accelerated rate, compared to
    the "normal" wolves with the "normal" critical distance. The "braver' wolves
    thrived, the others declined.

    That's what the wolves got out of the initial relationship. But, the humans
    weren't just ignoring this development. Wolves were a frightening predator,
    and humans feared them. Enter the bell curve once again. Most human bands
    did not tolerate the wolves' increasing closeness, and drove them off. But,
    a small percentage of "braver" humans, who, by that sheer chance of
    evolution, were in the proximity of some of those "braver" wolves, DID allow
    the wolves to approach. And, in doing so, without realizing it, they had
    just increased their own reproductive ability. The wolves were eating waste
    products, making the human encampments more pleasant and more hygienic. The
    humans were, therefore, less prone to the diseases that rotting waste can
    breed, and were able to stay in one place longer, taking advantage of a
    favorable environment. That is what the humans got out of the initial
    relationship: an evolutionary reproductive advantage over other, not so
    brave, humans.

    And so, wolves and early man begin their journey together. Millennia after
    millennia, they evolve together, the brave wolves evolving and thriving,
    closer and closer to man, and the brave humans, thriving compared to the
    humans without wolf "hygienic engineers". And then one night, somewhere on
    the planet, it happens: a friendly wolf, sleeping near his human friends,
    hears the approach of a large predator, or of a rival group of humans, and,
    roused from it's sleep, sounds an alarm. A growl, a howl, a bark. Now,
    wolves had a new job: early warning systems. THIS was something the humans
    could understand as beneficial. They may not have connected the decreased
    disease rates to the wolves, but THIS was an obvious good thing, and marked
    the beginning of man's deliberate efforts to encourage the wolf presence.
    Now, not only would the wolf be tolerated, but would be fed some extra food.
    The friendlier the wolf, the more prone to sounding an alarm, the more it
    got fed. Man was engaged, without knowing it, in selective breeding, giving
    additional reproductive advantage to wolves with two characteristics:
    friendliness and alarm sounding tendency. And the wolves were giving these
    particular humans an increased reproductive advantage by making the world a
    little bit safer.

    And together, over additional millennia, the journey continued. Wolves
    evolved as friendlier and more prone to sound an alarm. The "other" wolves,
    with their reproductive disadvantage, were in decline. The humans with the
    wolves flourished, compared to those without.

    Wolves, and dogs, can learn by watching others. Scott and Fuller, as part of
    their groundbreaking research in the 1960's, tested puppies that had watched
    other dogs being taught a behavior, versus puppies that had not watched. The
    puppies that had watched learned the behavior much faster than those that
    had not done so.

    And so then, one day, somewhere on the planet, it happened. A friendly wolf,
    who had watched his human friends hunt many times, seeing that they both
    hunted in a similar manner.stalk, encircle, attack.went along and assisted
    in the hunt. This must have REALLY impressed the men. And, now again, the
    wolf had a new job. Hunting became more efficient; more energy was available
    to make babies. Wolves were more valuable, they got fed more, they made more
    puppies.

    And together, over additional millennia, the journey continued.

    Neotony: the retention of juvenile characteristics into adulthood. Studies
    have clearly demonstrated that humans are attracted to certain features
    shared by babies, puppies, and kittens: large heads in comparison to the
    body, big eyes, flattened faces, and, in puppies, floppy ears. Our ancestors
    in this story were now surrounded by friendly wolves that sounded alarm,
    scared off enemies, and assisted in the hunt. And the humans were
    selectively encouraging those traits by favoring those with these
    characteristics. And now they began to get even more discriminating, by
    favoring puppies that, by the sheer chance of evolution, had physical
    characteristics that appealed to them: shorter muzzles, bigger, rounder
    eyes, and floppier ears. And so, over the millennia, the wolf, which had
    been changed psychologically and emotionally, now began to be changed
    physically. The wolf was becoming the dog.

    People psychologist and famous dog book author, Dr. Stanley Coren wrote: "As
    perpetually juvenile apes, we have created for ourselves a playmate, in a
    perpetually juvenile wolf." The dog is, in many important respects, a wolf
    puppy.

    And together, over additional millennia, the journey continued.

    Fast-forward many thousands of years. The wolf is now recognizable as a new
    species, the dog. Man has established permanent and semi-permanent
    settlements: villages. The village dogs provided sanitation, protection,
    hunting assistance, and companionship. Men had begun to domesticate other
    species, and were keeping small groups of these animals. Some of the village
    dogs showed a natural tendency to include these animals as part of the
    "group" and defended them against predators, including, ironically, their
    own ancestors, the wolf. Humans recognized this as a valuable
    characteristic, and began to selectively breed for it. Bigger, more
    protective, more independent, dogs evolved: the flock guards, the most
    ancient of the breed types. The Anatolian and the Great Pyrenees are good
    modern examples.

    From the village dog and the flock guard, man selectively bred all the breed
    types to follow: the herders, the war dogs, the hunting dogs of various
    types.

    Back to my opening paragraph. Our civilization as it exists today, and,
    possibly, our very existence as a species, is due, in large part, to the
    ancestors of that tail wagging, tongue licking, four legged bundle of
    energy, lying at your feet: your pet dog.

    It is indisputable that mankind would not have reached our current level of
    civilization without the dog. It's contribution to the reproductive
    advantage, by eliminating waste; it's contribution to the hunt; it's
    function in allowing villages to exist; it's protection of man; it's
    advancement of animal husbandry by protecting and herding the domestic
    animals: we would be far less advanced without them.

    Not as indisputable, but an idea I greatly favor, is that by giving [censored]
    sapiens early ancestors an evolutionary advantage, the dog allowed us to
    become the dominant primate of the planet. Without the dog, and his
    ancestor, the wolf, [censored] sapiens might have lost the evolutionary battle to
    the physically stronger Neanderthal. We might have been the ones to become
    extinct. Our very existence might be owed to the dog.

    Next time you're watching your beloved pet dog run around the park, chasing
    chipmunks and pigeons, run the film in your mind backwards in time. See the
    early man, huddled around a fire, listening to the night around him. Feel
    the fear he felt at the unknown out there. Even the fire, despite the
    comfort, was a fearful strange thing that could hurt him. The world was a
    scary place. Now watch as he looks down at the furry figure curled up at his
    feet. See the small smile that comes on his face, as he reaches down to
    stroke the head of his friend. A friend that will help him survive, a friend
    that would die to defend him. A friend that makes the scary world just a bit
    less scary. That is his dog.

    And THAT is why I love dogs.

    David

  2. I can't believe in any god that doesn't value the uniqueness of a dog's
    soul as much as that of a person's.

    Ari

  3. "spodosaurus" <spodosaurus@_yahoo_.com> wrote

    Quoted message said:

    I can't believe in any god that doesn't value the uniqueness of a dog's
    soul as much as that of a person's.

    Indeed. As my favorite .sig says:
    "If there are no dogs in Heaven, when I die, I want to go where they went."

    David

  4. David Cohen said:

    I was bored at work last night, so, I wrote an off-topic, but typical MFW
    off-topic, essay.

    Why I Love Dogs

    Our civilization as it exists today, and, possibly, our very existence as a
    species, is due, in large part, to the ancestors of that tail wagging,
    tongue licking, four legged bundle of energy, lying at your feet: your pet
    dog.

    The story of the domestication of the wolf and evolution into the dog is
    unique in all of human history. While many animals have served us.horse,
    cat, cow, sheep, among others.only the dog CHOSE to do so. As Nobel Laureate
    in Literature Maurice Maeterlinck wrote: "We are alone, absolutely alone on
    this chance planet; and, amid all the forms of life that surround us, not
    one, excepting the dog, has made an alliance with us."

    Hundreds of thousands of years ago, bands of early humans wandered the
    Earth, hunting and gathering, never staying in one place too long. They
    moved a lot because the food moved a lot, and they were not very efficient
    hunters. Additionally, the inevitable by-products of humans.waste, both food
    waste and feces.made staying in one place too long both unpleasant and
    unhealthy. It was a scary world, filled with both imaginary and real
    dangers.animals that hunted them, other humans that warred with them. All of
    these early humans' energy went into their basic survival.

    By sheer chance, as evolution usually works, another species of animal was
    wandering the Earth at the same time. The wolf was a social animal, like
    man; living and moving in groups; expending all their energy in basic
    survival.

    In any large group of organisms, most psychological characteristics exist on
    a spectrum, a bell curve of sorts. Wolves, then and now, have a critical
    distance from possible threats that they are not willing to cross. But, just
    a small percentage of wolves are more fearful of threats, a small percentage
    is "braver", willing to get closer and stay longer than the rest.

    To this equation, we add the principle, from the science of ecology, that
    organisms will adapt and evolve to fill all available niches. And the
    evolution of apes into groups of hunters, tossing waste food and crapping,
    was a whole new ecological niche. And those "braver" wolves were in the
    right place, at the right time, to take full advantage of this new source of
    energy.

    Keep in mind the principle: energy is reproduction. It takes considerable
    energy for animals to reproduce and raise the offspring to independence. In
    times of scarcity of resources, animals will often refrain from reproducing,
    and may actually kill and eat the newborns if they are produced. Anything
    that makes finding and consuming energy.food.easier, allows more energy to
    be expended in reproduction.

    And so, the wolf. The "braver' wolves, who were willing to get closer to the
    humans, to spend more time closer, eating the rich, easily obtained, new
    food source: our waste. These wolves now had an evolutionary advantage: less
    energy was expended finding and obtaining food, more energy was available
    for making baby wolves. And those baby wolves inherited their parents'
    shorter critical distance. And were better fed than the other baby wolves.
    And so, with each succeeding generation, the wolves got shorter and shorter
    critical distances, and produced babies at an accelerated rate, compared to
    the "normal" wolves with the "normal" critical distance. The "braver' wolves
    thrived, the others declined.

    That's what the wolves got out of the initial relationship. But, the humans
    weren't just ignoring this development. Wolves were a frightening predator,
    and humans feared them. Enter the bell curve once again. Most human bands
    did not tolerate the wolves' increasing closeness, and drove them off. But,
    a small percentage of "braver" humans, who, by that sheer chance of
    evolution, were in the proximity of some of those "braver" wolves, DID allow
    the wolves to approach. And, in doing so, without realizing it, they had
    just increased their own reproductive ability. The wolves were eating waste
    products, making the human encampments more pleasant and more hygienic. The
    humans were, therefore, less prone to the diseases that rotting waste can
    breed, and were able to stay in one place longer, taking advantage of a
    favorable environment. That is what the humans got out of the initial
    relationship: an evolutionary reproductive advantage over other, not so
    brave, humans.

    And so, wolves and early man begin their journey together. Millennia after
    millennia, they evolve together, the brave wolves evolving and thriving,
    closer and closer to man, and the brave humans, thriving compared to the
    humans without wolf "hygienic engineers". And then one night, somewhere on
    the planet, it happens: a friendly wolf, sleeping near his human friends,
    hears the approach of a large predator, or of a rival group of humans, and,
    roused from it's sleep, sounds an alarm. A growl, a howl, a bark. Now,
    wolves had a new job: early warning systems. THIS was something the humans
    could understand as beneficial. They may not have connected the decreased
    disease rates to the wolves, but THIS was an obvious good thing, and marked
    the beginning of man's deliberate efforts to encourage the wolf presence.
    Now, not only would the wolf be tolerated, but would be fed some extra food.
    The friendlier the wolf, the more prone to sounding an alarm, the more it
    got fed. Man was engaged, without knowing it, in selective breeding, giving
    additional reproductive advantage to wolves with two characteristics:
    friendliness and alarm sounding tendency. And the wolves were giving these
    particular humans an increased reproductive advantage by making the world a
    little bit safer.

    And together, over additional millennia, the journey continued. Wolves
    evolved as friendlier and more prone to sound an alarm. The "other" wolves,
    with their reproductive disadvantage, were in decline. The humans with the
    wolves flourished, compared to those without.

    Wolves, and dogs, can learn by watching others. Scott and Fuller, as part of
    their groundbreaking research in the 1960's, tested puppies that had watched
    other dogs being taught a behavior, versus puppies that had not watched. The
    puppies that had watched learned the behavior much faster than those that
    had not done so.

    And so then, one day, somewhere on the planet, it happened. A friendly wolf,
    who had watched his human friends hunt many times, seeing that they both
    hunted in a similar manner.stalk, encircle, attack.went along and assisted
    in the hunt. This must have REALLY impressed the men. And, now again, the
    wolf had a new job. Hunting became more efficient; more energy was available
    to make babies. Wolves were more valuable, they got fed more, they made more
    puppies.

    And together, over additional millennia, the journey continued.

    Neotony: the retention of juvenile characteristics into adulthood. Studies
    have clearly demonstrated that humans are attracted to certain features
    shared by babies, puppies, and kittens: large heads in comparison to the
    body, big eyes, flattened faces, and, in puppies, floppy ears. Our ancestors
    in this story were now surrounded by friendly wolves that sounded alarm,
    scared off enemies, and assisted in the hunt. And the humans were
    selectively encouraging those traits by favoring those with these
    characteristics. And now they began to get even more discriminating, by
    favoring puppies that, by the sheer chance of evolution, had physical
    characteristics that appealed to them: shorter muzzles, bigger, rounder
    eyes, and floppier ears. And so, over the millennia, the wolf, which had
    been changed psychologically and emotionally, now began to be changed
    physically. The wolf was becoming the dog.

    People psychologist and famous dog book author, Dr. Stanley Coren wrote: "As
    perpetually juvenile apes, we have created for ourselves a playmate, in a
    perpetually juvenile wolf." The dog is, in many important respects, a wolf
    puppy.

    And together, over additional millennia, the journey continued.

    Fast-forward many thousands of years. The wolf is now recognizable as a new
    species, the dog. Man has established permanent and semi-permanent
    settlements: villages. The village dogs provided sanitation, protection,
    hunting assistance, and companionship. Men had begun to domesticate other
    species, and were keeping small groups of these animals. Some of the village
    dogs showed a natural tendency to include these animals as part of the
    "group" and defended them against predators, including, ironically, their
    own ancestors, the wolf. Humans recognized this as a valuable
    characteristic, and began to selectively breed for it. Bigger, more
    protective, more independent, dogs evolved: the flock guards, the most
    ancient of the breed types. The Anatolian and the Great Pyrenees are good
    modern examples.

    From the village dog and the flock guard, man selectively bred all the breed
    types to follow: the herders, the war dogs, the hunting dogs of various
    types.

    Back to my opening paragraph. Our civilization as it exists today, and,
    possibly, our very existence as a species, is due, in large part, to the
    ancestors of that tail wagging, tongue licking, four legged bundle of
    energy, lying at your feet: your pet dog.

    It is indisputable that mankind would not have reached our current level of
    civilization without the dog. It's contribution to the reproductive
    advantage, by eliminating waste; it's contribution to the hunt; it's
    function in allowing villages to exist; it's protection of man; it's
    advancement of animal husbandry by protecting and herding the domestic
    animals: we would be far less advanced without them.

    Not as indisputable, but an idea I greatly favor, is that by giving [censored]
    sapiens early ancestors an evolutionary advantage, the dog allowed us to
    become the dominant primate of the planet. Without the dog, and his
    ancestor, the wolf, [censored] sapiens might have lost the evolutionary battle to
    the physically stronger Neanderthal. We might have been the ones to become
    extinct. Our very existence might be owed to the dog.

    Next time you're watching your beloved pet dog run around the park, chasing
    chipmunks and pigeons, run the film in your mind backwards in time. See the
    early man, huddled around a fire, listening to the night around him. Feel
    the fear he felt at the unknown out there. Even the fire, despite the
    comfort, was a fearful strange thing that could hurt him. The world was a
    scary place. Now watch as he looks down at the furry figure curled up at his
    feet. See the small smile that comes on his face, as he reaches down to
    stroke the head of his friend. A friend that will help him survive, a friend
    that would die to defend him. A friend that makes the scary world just a bit
    less scary. That is his dog.

    That was nice David, particularly this last paragraph; made me feel
    all warm and cosy, with my own two dogs with me, and my wife's curled
    up with her.

    Thank you.

    Have a great weekend - I am! ;o)

  5. "David Cohen" wrote

    Quoted message said:


    "spodosaurus" <spodosaurus@_yahoo_.com> wrote

    Quoted message said:

    I can't believe in any god that doesn't value the uniqueness of a dog's
    soul as much as that of a person's.

    Indeed. As my favorite .sig says:
    "If there are no dogs in Heaven, when I die, I want to go where they
    went."


    My favorite cartoon along these lines is on the wall of our vet's office.
    It shows a dog asking Saint Peter if they will get their testicles back in
    heaven.

  6. David Cohen said:

    I was bored at work last night, so, I wrote an off-topic, but typical MFW
    off-topic, essay.

    Why I Love Dogs

    Two corrections:

    [1] Dogs are not a "new species" of wolf; they are both members of the
    species Canis lupus. Genetically, they are indistinguishable, and
    only a few possible differences in polymorphisms have been discovered.
    The difference in variety within the species is almost certainly the
    product of sociobiology. I'm sure the late Stephen Gould would
    disagree with the latter.

    [2] As to dogs learning from "observing" the behavior of other dogs, I
    posted on this subject just the other day. Domestic dogs are much
    better than wolves at being *trained*. They can be taught a task by
    humans much more easily than wolves. However, gray wolves are much
    better at working out a problem on their own, largely by a combination
    of observation and intuition. They also prefer to take their cues
    from other canines, rather than humans, even in captivity.

    In "The Company of Wolves," Peter Steinhart tells of three canines
    owned by Harry Frank, a psychology professor at University of
    Michigan: a malamute, a 3/4 wolf hybrid, and a full-bred wolf. In the
    kenneling area, there was a trick door knob that had be pushed inward
    before turning it. The malamute watched Frank operating the knob for
    years and never figured it out. The wolf hybrid saw him do it six or
    seven times and figured out how use its teeth to open the knob. The
    wolf saw the wolf hybrid do it just once, and she instantly knew how
    to open the door ... except she decided it was more efficient to do it
    with her paws.

  7. Come on guys, cats RULE! You know what aliens will think when they
    come to visit, and they see you being led on the leash by your mutts,
    and then see you picking their [censored] and bagging it, just WHO do you
    think they'll think is in charge? And I'm inclined to think they're
    right. If you have a doubt whose boss, just put your smelly mutt in a
    room with "Spot" my cat, and the one who lives rules.

    TBR

    "As democracy is perfected, the office of president represents, more and
    more closely, the inner soul of the people. On some great and glorious day
    the plain folks of the land will reach their heart's desire at last and the
    White House will be adorned by a downright moron."
    H.L. Mencken (1880 - 1956)
    "Anyone with degrees from Yale and Harvard is presumed to be intelligent,
    but George W. Bush has managed to overcome that presumption."

  8. In article <[email hidden]>,

    David Cohen said:

    I was bored at work last night, so, I wrote an off-topic, but typical MFW
    off-topic, essay.

    Why I Love Dogs


    [snip]

    Quoted message said:

    Fascinating and enjoyable read, Cohen. Thanks 🙂.

    --
    Jim Seymour | "It is wrong always, everywhere and
    WARNING: The "From:" address is a | for everyone to believe anything upon
    spam trap. DON'T USE IT! Use: | insufficient evidence."
    [email hidden] | - W. K. Clifford, ca. 1876

  9. JMW said:
    David Cohen said:

    I was bored at work last night, so, I wrote an off-topic, but
    typical MFW off-topic, essay.

    Why I Love Dogs

    I enjoyed reading it, thanks.

    Quoted message said:

    [2] As to dogs learning from "observing" the behavior of other dogs, I
    posted on this subject just the other day. Domestic dogs are much
    better than wolves at being *trained*. They can be taught a task by
    humans much more easily than wolves. However, gray wolves are much
    better at working out a problem on their own, largely by a combination
    of observation and intuition. They also prefer to take their cues
    from other canines, rather than humans, even in captivity.

    In "The Company of Wolves," Peter Steinhart tells of three canines
    owned by Harry Frank, a psychology professor at University of
    Michigan: a malamute, a 3/4 wolf hybrid, and a full-bred wolf. In the
    kenneling area, there was a trick door knob that had be pushed inward
    before turning it. The malamute watched Frank operating the knob for
    years and never figured it out. The wolf hybrid saw him do it six or
    seven times and figured out how use its teeth to open the knob. The
    wolf saw the wolf hybrid do it just once, and she instantly knew how
    to open the door ... except she decided it was more efficient to do it
    with her paws.

    What breeds of dogs are most intelligent?

  10. "David Cohen" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

    Quoted message said:

    Maurice Maeterlinck wrote: "We are alone, absolutely alone on
    this chance planet; and, amid all the forms of life that surround us, not
    one, excepting the dog, has made an alliance with us."

    Let's not forget intestinal bacteria.

  11. DZ said:
    JMW said:
    David Cohen said:

    I was bored at work last night, so, I wrote an off-topic, but
    typical MFW off-topic, essay.

    Why I Love Dogs

    I enjoyed reading it, thanks.

    Quoted message said:

    [2] As to dogs learning from "observing" the behavior of other dogs, I
    posted on this subject just the other day. Domestic dogs are much
    better than wolves at being *trained*. They can be taught a task by
    humans much more easily than wolves. However, gray wolves are much
    better at working out a problem on their own, largely by a combination
    of observation and intuition. They also prefer to take their cues
    from other canines, rather than humans, even in captivity.

    In "The Company of Wolves," Peter Steinhart tells of three canines
    owned by Harry Frank, a psychology professor at University of
    Michigan: a malamute, a 3/4 wolf hybrid, and a full-bred wolf. In the
    kenneling area, there was a trick door knob that had be pushed inward
    before turning it. The malamute watched Frank operating the knob for
    years and never figured it out. The wolf hybrid saw him do it six or
    seven times and figured out how use its teeth to open the knob. The
    wolf saw the wolf hybrid do it just once, and she instantly knew how
    to open the door ... except she decided it was more efficient to do it
    with her paws.

    What breeds of dogs are most intelligent?

    I depends on who you ask, but top honors usually go to Standard
    Poodles. German Shepherds usually come in somewhere in the top three.

  12. JMW said:
    DZ said:

    What breeds of dogs are most intelligent?

    I depends on who you ask, but top honors usually go to Standard
    Poodles. German Shepherds usually come in somewhere in the top three.

    So which is the third?

    Also, which are longest living breeds?

  13. DZ said:
    JMW said:
    DZ said:

    What breeds of dogs are most intelligent?

    I depends on who you ask, but top honors usually go to Standard
    Poodles. German Shepherds usually come in somewhere in the top three.

    So which is the third?

    You sure do ask a lot of Googleable questions for a professional
    researcher ...

    Anyway, here is one list:

    http://www.petrix.com/dogint/1-10.html

    That one puts Border Collies at the top.

    Quoted message said:

    Also, which are longest living breeds?

    I don't know. Google it. Overall, small breeds tend to last longer.

  14. JMW said:
    DZ said:
    JMW said:

    DZ wrote:
    >What breeds of dogs are most intelligent?

    I depends on who you ask, but top honors usually go to Standard
    Poodles. German Shepherds usually come in somewhere in the top three.

    So which is the third?

    You sure do ask a lot of Googleable questions for a professional
    researcher ...

    The lifespan one - yes I'm guilty. But I bundled it with less
    well-measurable intelligence question, which makes sense to ask
    because I assume there are people here who can share unique personal
    perspective on that. I have little experience with dogs.

    Quoted message said:

    Anyway, here is one list:
    http://www.petrix.com/dogint/1-10.html
    That one puts Border Collies at the top.

    Thanks.

  15. "Ranieri" <uh-uh> wrote

    Quoted message said:

    "David Cohen" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

    Quoted message said:

    Maurice Maeterlinck wrote: "We are alone, absolutely alone on
    this chance planet; and, amid all the forms of life that surround us, not
    one, excepting the dog, has made an alliance with us."

    Let's not forget intestinal bacteria.

    Well, of course, that goes without saying.

    Without saying!

    David

  16. Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    >>What breeds of dogs are most intelligent?
    >
    >I depends on who you ask, but top honors usually go to Standard
    >Poodles. German Shepherds usually come in somewhere in the top three.

    So which is the third?

    You sure do ask a lot of Googleable questions for a professional
    researcher ...

    The lifespan one - yes I'm guilty. But I bundled it with less
    well-measurable intelligence question, which makes sense to ask
    because I assume there are people here who can share unique personal
    perspective on that. I have little experience with dogs.

    Quoted message said:

    Anyway, here is one list:
    http://www.petrix.com/dogint/1-10.html
    That one puts Border Collies at the top.

    Conflating obedience with intelligence is a little misleading; breeds like
    Siberian Huskies are really ingenious about problem-solving, not so good at
    doing as they're told. There's an old Iditarod example of a guy trying to take a
    shortcut in the race and his husky team completely ignoring his HAW! orders for
    a couple of hundred yards, giving the team behind them the opportunity to cut
    them off, fall through the thin ice that the huskies noticed and no one else
    did, and die. If you asked at a well-run kennel who the real escape artists and
    thieves were, you'd get a very different list from the above one.

  17. DZ said:
    JMW said:
    DZ said:

    JMW <[email hidden]> wrote:
    > DZ wrote:
    >>What breeds of dogs are most intelligent?
    >
    > I depends on who you ask, but top honors usually go to Standard
    > Poodles. German Shepherds usually come in somewhere in the top three.

    So which is the third?

    You sure do ask a lot of Googleable questions for a professional
    researcher ...

    The lifespan one - yes I'm guilty. But I bundled it with less
    well-measurable intelligence question, which makes sense to ask
    because I assume there are people here who can share unique personal
    perspective on that. I have little experience with dogs.

    From what I have observed about you, you would do well with a dog. I
    can imagine you training a Border Collie for agility trials. The two
    of you would probably have great fun.

    There are few things sadder than a Border Collie who is eager and
    talented but is hampered by a fatass owner who is too slow to guide
    him through the agility course.

  18. T said:
    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    >>>What breeds of dogs are most intelligent?
    >>
    >>I depends on who you ask, but top honors usually go to Standard
    >>Poodles. German Shepherds usually come in somewhere in the top three.
    >
    >So which is the third?

    You sure do ask a lot of Googleable questions for a professional
    researcher ...

    The lifespan one - yes I'm guilty. But I bundled it with less
    well-measurable intelligence question, which makes sense to ask
    because I assume there are people here who can share unique personal
    perspective on that. I have little experience with dogs.

    Quoted message said:

    Anyway, here is one list:
    http://www.petrix.com/dogint/1-10.html
    That one puts Border Collies at the top.

    Conflating obedience with intelligence is a little misleading; breeds like
    Siberian Huskies are really ingenious about problem-solving, not so good at
    doing as they're told. There's an old Iditarod example of a guy trying to take a
    shortcut in the race and his husky team completely ignoring his HAW! orders for
    a couple of hundred yards, giving the team behind them the opportunity to cut
    them off, fall through the thin ice that the huskies noticed and no one else
    did, and die. If you asked at a well-run kennel who the real escape artists and
    thieves were, you'd get a very different list from the above one.

    Not really. Coren rated Doberman Pinschers and German Shepherds very
    high in adaptive intelligence. Having adaptive intelligence, as well
    as working/obedience intelligence, allows them to engage in problem
    solving while avoiding actions that they know will get them in
    trouble.

  19. "David Cohen" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    I was bored at work last night, so, I wrote an off-topic, but typical MFW
    off-topic, essay.

    Why I Love Dogs

    Our civilization as it exists today, and, possibly, our very existence as


    a

    Quoted message said:

    species, is due, in large part, to the ancestors of that tail wagging,
    tongue licking, four legged bundle of energy, lying at your feet: your pet
    dog.

    The story of the domestication of the wolf and evolution into the dog is
    unique in all of human history. While many animals have served us.horse,
    cat, cow, sheep, among others.only the dog CHOSE to do so. As Nobel


    Laureate

    Quoted message said:

    in Literature Maurice Maeterlinck wrote: "We are alone, absolutely alone


    on

    Quoted message said:

    this chance planet; and, amid all the forms of life that surround us, not
    one, excepting the dog, has made an alliance with us."

    Hundreds of thousands of years ago, bands of early humans wandered the
    Earth, hunting and gathering, never staying in one place too long. They
    moved a lot because the food moved a lot, and they were not very efficient
    hunters. Additionally, the inevitable by-products of humans.waste, both


    food

    Quoted message said:

    waste and feces.made staying in one place too long both unpleasant and
    unhealthy. It was a scary world, filled with both imaginary and real
    dangers.animals that hunted them, other humans that warred with them. All


    of

    Quoted message said:

    these early humans' energy went into their basic survival.

    By sheer chance, as evolution usually works, another species of animal was
    wandering the Earth at the same time. The wolf was a social animal, like
    man; living and moving in groups; expending all their energy in basic
    survival.

    In any large group of organisms, most psychological characteristics exist


    on

    Quoted message said:

    a spectrum, a bell curve of sorts. Wolves, then and now, have a critical
    distance from possible threats that they are not willing to cross. But,


    just

    Quoted message said:

    a small percentage of wolves are more fearful of threats, a small


    percentage

    Quoted message said:

    is "braver", willing to get closer and stay longer than the rest.

    To this equation, we add the principle, from the science of ecology, that
    organisms will adapt and evolve to fill all available niches. And the
    evolution of apes into groups of hunters, tossing waste food and crapping,
    was a whole new ecological niche. And those "braver" wolves were in the
    right place, at the right time, to take full advantage of this new source


    of

    Quoted message said:

    energy.

    Keep in mind the principle: energy is reproduction. It takes considerable
    energy for animals to reproduce and raise the offspring to independence.


    In

    Quoted message said:

    times of scarcity of resources, animals will often refrain from


    reproducing,

    Quoted message said:

    and may actually kill and eat the newborns if they are produced. Anything
    that makes finding and consuming energy.food.easier, allows more energy to
    be expended in reproduction.

    And so, the wolf. The "braver' wolves, who were willing to get closer to


    the

    Quoted message said:

    humans, to spend more time closer, eating the rich, easily obtained, new
    food source: our waste. These wolves now had an evolutionary advantage:


    less

    Quoted message said:

    energy was expended finding and obtaining food, more energy was available
    for making baby wolves. And those baby wolves inherited their parents'
    shorter critical distance. And were better fed than the other baby wolves.
    And so, with each succeeding generation, the wolves got shorter and


    shorter

    Quoted message said:

    critical distances, and produced babies at an accelerated rate, compared


    to

    Quoted message said:

    the "normal" wolves with the "normal" critical distance. The "braver'


    wolves

    Quoted message said:

    thrived, the others declined.

    That's what the wolves got out of the initial relationship. But, the


    humans

    Quoted message said:

    weren't just ignoring this development. Wolves were a frightening


    predator,

    Quoted message said:

    and humans feared them. Enter the bell curve once again. Most human bands
    did not tolerate the wolves' increasing closeness, and drove them off.


    But,

    Quoted message said:

    a small percentage of "braver" humans, who, by that sheer chance of
    evolution, were in the proximity of some of those "braver" wolves, DID


    allow

    Quoted message said:

    the wolves to approach. And, in doing so, without realizing it, they had
    just increased their own reproductive ability. The wolves were eating


    waste

    Quoted message said:

    products, making the human encampments more pleasant and more hygienic.


    The

    Quoted message said:

    humans were, therefore, less prone to the diseases that rotting waste can
    breed, and were able to stay in one place longer, taking advantage of a
    favorable environment. That is what the humans got out of the initial
    relationship: an evolutionary reproductive advantage over other, not so
    brave, humans.

    And so, wolves and early man begin their journey together. Millennia after
    millennia, they evolve together, the brave wolves evolving and thriving,
    closer and closer to man, and the brave humans, thriving compared to the
    humans without wolf "hygienic engineers". And then one night, somewhere on
    the planet, it happens: a friendly wolf, sleeping near his human friends,
    hears the approach of a large predator, or of a rival group of humans,


    and,

    Quoted message said:

    roused from it's sleep, sounds an alarm. A growl, a howl, a bark. Now,
    wolves had a new job: early warning systems. THIS was something the humans
    could understand as beneficial. They may not have connected the decreased
    disease rates to the wolves, but THIS was an obvious good thing, and


    marked

    Quoted message said:

    the beginning of man's deliberate efforts to encourage the wolf presence.
    Now, not only would the wolf be tolerated, but would be fed some extra


    food.

    Quoted message said:

    The friendlier the wolf, the more prone to sounding an alarm, the more it
    got fed. Man was engaged, without knowing it, in selective breeding,


    giving

    Quoted message said:

    additional reproductive advantage to wolves with two characteristics:
    friendliness and alarm sounding tendency. And the wolves were giving these
    particular humans an increased reproductive advantage by making the world


    a

    Quoted message said:

    little bit safer.

    And together, over additional millennia, the journey continued. Wolves
    evolved as friendlier and more prone to sound an alarm. The "other"


    wolves,

    Quoted message said:

    with their reproductive disadvantage, were in decline. The humans with the
    wolves flourished, compared to those without.

    Wolves, and dogs, can learn by watching others. Scott and Fuller, as part


    of

    Quoted message said:

    their groundbreaking research in the 1960's, tested puppies that had


    watched

    Quoted message said:

    other dogs being taught a behavior, versus puppies that had not watched.


    The

    Quoted message said:

    puppies that had watched learned the behavior much faster than those that
    had not done so.

    And so then, one day, somewhere on the planet, it happened. A friendly


    wolf,

    Quoted message said:

    who had watched his human friends hunt many times, seeing that they both
    hunted in a similar manner.stalk, encircle, attack.went along and assisted
    in the hunt. This must have REALLY impressed the men. And, now again, the
    wolf had a new job. Hunting became more efficient; more energy was


    available

    Quoted message said:

    to make babies. Wolves were more valuable, they got fed more, they made


    more

    Quoted message said:

    puppies.

    And together, over additional millennia, the journey continued.

    Neotony: the retention of juvenile characteristics into adulthood. Studies
    have clearly demonstrated that humans are attracted to certain features
    shared by babies, puppies, and kittens: large heads in comparison to the
    body, big eyes, flattened faces, and, in puppies, floppy ears. Our


    ancestors

    Quoted message said:

    in this story were now surrounded by friendly wolves that sounded alarm,
    scared off enemies, and assisted in the hunt. And the humans were
    selectively encouraging those traits by favoring those with these
    characteristics. And now they began to get even more discriminating, by
    favoring puppies that, by the sheer chance of evolution, had physical
    characteristics that appealed to them: shorter muzzles, bigger, rounder
    eyes, and floppier ears. And so, over the millennia, the wolf, which had
    been changed psychologically and emotionally, now began to be changed
    physically. The wolf was becoming the dog.

    People psychologist and famous dog book author, Dr. Stanley Coren wrote:


    "As

    Quoted message said:

    perpetually juvenile apes, we have created for ourselves a playmate, in a
    perpetually juvenile wolf." The dog is, in many important respects, a wolf
    puppy.

    And together, over additional millennia, the journey continued.

    Fast-forward many thousands of years. The wolf is now recognizable as a


    new

    Quoted message said:

    species, the dog. Man has established permanent and semi-permanent
    settlements: villages. The village dogs provided sanitation, protection,
    hunting assistance, and companionship. Men had begun to domesticate other
    species, and were keeping small groups of these animals. Some of the


    village

    Quoted message said:

    dogs showed a natural tendency to include these animals as part of the
    "group" and defended them against predators, including, ironically, their
    own ancestors, the wolf. Humans recognized this as a valuable
    characteristic, and began to selectively breed for it. Bigger, more
    protective, more independent, dogs evolved: the flock guards, the most
    ancient of the breed types. The Anatolian and the Great Pyrenees are good
    modern examples.

    From the village dog and the flock guard, man selectively bred all the


    breed

    Quoted message said:

    types to follow: the herders, the war dogs, the hunting dogs of various
    types.

    Back to my opening paragraph. Our civilization as it exists today, and,
    possibly, our very existence as a species, is due, in large part, to the
    ancestors of that tail wagging, tongue licking, four legged bundle of
    energy, lying at your feet: your pet dog.

    It is indisputable that mankind would not have reached our current level


    of

    Quoted message said:

    civilization without the dog. It's contribution to the reproductive
    advantage, by eliminating waste; it's contribution to the hunt; it's
    function in allowing villages to exist; it's protection of man; it's
    advancement of animal husbandry by protecting and herding the domestic
    animals: we would be far less advanced without them.

    Not as indisputable, but an idea I greatly favor, is that by giving [censored]
    sapiens early ancestors an evolutionary advantage, the dog allowed us to
    become the dominant primate of the planet. Without the dog, and his
    ancestor, the wolf, [censored] sapiens might have lost the evolutionary battle


    to

    Quoted message said:

    the physically stronger Neanderthal. We might have been the ones to become
    extinct. Our very existence might be owed to the dog.

    Next time you're watching your beloved pet dog run around the park,


    chasing

    Quoted message said:

    chipmunks and pigeons, run the film in your mind backwards in time. See


    the

    Quoted message said:

    early man, huddled around a fire, listening to the night around him. Feel
    the fear he felt at the unknown out there. Even the fire, despite the
    comfort, was a fearful strange thing that could hurt him. The world was a
    scary place. Now watch as he looks down at the furry figure curled up at


    his

    Quoted message said:

    feet. See the small smile that comes on his face, as he reaches down to
    stroke the head of his friend. A friend that will help him survive, a


    friend

    Quoted message said:

    that would die to defend him. A friend that makes the scary world just a


    bit

    Quoted message said:

    less scary. That is his dog.

    And THAT is why I love dogs.

    David

    What are you saying, Cohen?? You like dogs?? You're kidding right??!!

  20. On Sat, 13 Aug 2005 16:54:44 -0400, JMW <[email hidden]> wrote in
    misc.fitness.weights:

    Quoted message said:


    Anyway, here is one list:

    http://www.petrix.com/dogint/1-10.html


    I like the AKC requirements for the size of a Lab:
    http://www.akc.org/breeds/labrador_retriever/index.cfm

    Size, Proportion and Substance
    Size--The height at the withers for a dog is 22½ to 24½ inches; for a
    [censored] is 21½ to 23½ inches. Any variance greater than ½ inch above or
    below these heights is a disqualification. Approximate weight of dogs
    and [censored] in working condition: dogs 65 to 80 pounds; [censored] 55 to
    70 pounds.

    Buddy is 27½ inches at the withers and was last weighed at 113 but
    he's probably 5 pounds lighter than that now.

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