Why are those tires treaded?

On Wed, 01 Jun 2005 23:43:06 -0600, [email hidden]

Quoted message said:

I trustingly believed other posters that serious pavement
tires were slicks for traction in the automotive world, but
this picture makes me wonder if I'm missing something or
just misled:

http://www.chieftain.com/sports/1117608336/7

I also notice that the tread is V-shaped directional. The
actual newspaper picture is almost twice as big and shows
that the rear tire has the same faintly S-shaped tread
blocks.

???

Carl Fogel

I'm still astonished, but beginning to suspect that they put
treaded tires on a replica just to try to convince me to buy
treaded passenger car tires.

The damned things look as wide and low as normal racing
tires, so now I wonder if they went to the trouble of making
special fake tires, so to speak--the wrong size for ordinary
cars, and useless for racing.

Carl Fogel

Quoted message said:

I trustingly believed other posters that serious pavement
tires were slicks for traction in the automotive world, but
this picture makes me wonder if I'm missing something or
just misled:

http://www.chieftain.com/sports/1117608336/7

I also notice that the tread is V-shaped directional. The
actual newspaper picture is almost twice as big and shows
that the rear tire has the same faintly S-shaped tread
blocks.

I used to crew an SCCA car and I never saw anything like
that 'parade tire' raced.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

Quoted message said:

On Wed, 01 Jun 2005 23:43:06 -0600, [email hidden]

Quoted message said:

I trustingly believed other posters that serious pavement
tires were slicks for traction in the automotive world, but
this picture makes me wonder if I'm missing something or
just misled:

http://www.chieftain.com/sports/1117608336/7

I also notice that the tread is V-shaped directional. The
actual newspaper picture is almost twice as big and shows
that the rear tire has the same faintly S-shaped tread
blocks.

???

Carl Fogel

I'm still astonished, but beginning to suspect that they put
treaded tires on a replica just to try to convince me to buy
treaded passenger car tires.

It's possible they put the treaded tire on for the photo opp.

Quoted message said:

The damned things look as wide and low as normal racing
tires, so now I wonder if they went to the trouble of making
special fake tires, so to speak--the wrong size for ordinary
cars, and useless for racing.

They look like real racing rain tires to me, not fakes.

Matt O.

A Muzi said:

I used to crew an SCCA car and I never saw anything like
that 'parade tire' raced.

You guys must never have raced in the rain.

Matt O.

Quoted message said:

I trustingly believed other posters that serious pavement
tires were slicks for traction in the automotive world, but
this picture makes me wonder if I'm missing something or
just misled:

Quoted message said:

http://www.chieftain.com/sports/1117608336/7

That looks like a wet weather racing tyre to me. I'm not aware of any
major form of motorsports where they don't use slicks for maximum grip
on a dry paved surface. In F1 the tyres have several grooves on them,
but that's only because the governing body wanted to diminish the
traction of the tyres starting in about 1998.

-as

Matt O'Toole said:

[email hidden] wrote:
It's possible they put the treaded tire on for the photo opp.

Quoted message said:

The damned things look as wide and low as normal racing
tires, so now I wonder if they went to the trouble of making
special fake tires, so to speak--the wrong size for ordinary
cars, and useless for racing.

They look like real racing rain tires to me, not fakes.

Thing is, AFAIK, Indy cars don't race in the rain. Has that changed?

Quoted message said:

Thing is, AFAIK, Indy cars don't race in the rain. Has that changed?

They don't race on ovals in the rain, but IIRC the IRL has some street
and/or road circuit races this year, so they /might/ race in the wet on
those.

--
Dave Larrington - <http://www.legslarry.beerdrinkers.co.uk/>
uck Wa

Quoted message said:

I trustingly believed other posters that serious pavement
tires were slicks for traction in the automotive world, but
this picture makes me wonder if I'm missing something or
just misled:

http://www.chieftain.com/sports/1117608336/7

I also notice that the tread is V-shaped directional. The
actual newspaper picture is almost twice as big and shows
that the rear tire has the same faintly S-shaped tread
blocks.

???

Carl Fogel

IRL never runs in the rain, those are photo-op tires. Racing slicks are
so soft that they would pick up a lot of ugly junk off the road and
they have more rolling resistance than the street tires you see. Many
race teams in IRL and other series will keep the car on relatively
skinny street tires to make it easier to push the car on and off the
trailer and to and from the pits.

Cam

"Salus populi suprema lex esto." - Cicero

Quoted message said:

I trustingly believed other posters that serious pavement
tires were slicks for traction in the automotive world, but
this picture makes me wonder if I'm missing something or
just misled:

http://www.chieftain.com/sports/1117608336/7

???

The photo and accompanying caption shows a racing car on a New York
City street. Anyone who's ever been there can attest that only
taxicabs are allowed to run slick tires.
-------------------------------
John Dacey
Business Cycles, Miami, Florida
Since 1983
Comprehensive catalogue of track equipment: online since 1996.
http://www.businesscycles.com

Cam said:

Quoted message said:

I trustingly believed other posters that serious pavement
tires were slicks for traction in the automotive world, but
this picture makes me wonder if I'm missing something or
just misled:

http://www.chieftain.com/sports/1117608336/7

I also notice that the tread is V-shaped directional. The
actual newspaper picture is almost twice as big and shows
that the rear tire has the same faintly S-shaped tread
blocks.

???

Carl Fogel

IRL never runs in the rain, those are photo-op tires. Racing slicks are
so soft that they would pick up a lot of ugly junk off the road and
they have more rolling resistance than the street tires you see. Many
race teams in IRL and other series will keep the car on relatively
skinny street tires to make it easier to push the car on and off the
trailer and to and from the pits.

And furthermore, they can choose tires with a larger diameter to allow
the car to pass safely over potholes.

Cam

In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden]
says...

Quoted message said:

I trustingly believed other posters that serious pavement
tires were slicks for traction in the automotive world, but
this picture makes me wonder if I'm missing something or
just misled:

http://www.chieftain.com/sports/1117608336/7

I also notice that the tread is V-shaped directional. The
actual newspaper picture is almost twice as big and shows
that the rear tire has the same faintly S-shaped tread
blocks.

Rain tires.
-------------
Alex

"John Dacey" wrote: (clip)Anyone who's ever been there can attest that only
taxicabs are allowed to run slick tires.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
In California, where I live, a tire worn below the gauge bars in the tread
is considered worn out and unsafe. Slicks are probably illegal on New York
streets. However, I can't imagine a cop pulling this car over and giving
him a fixit ticket.

Owner/driver/crew of B-Sedan and F-Vee. Slicks only.

"A Muzi" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I used to crew an SCCA car and I never saw anything like that 'parade
tire' raced.

Carl Fogel said:

Quoted message said:

I trustingly believed other posters that serious pavement tires
were slicks for traction in the automotive world, but this picture
makes me wonder if I'm missing something or just misled:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

http://www.chieftain.com/sports/1117608336/7

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I also notice that the tread is V-shaped directional. The actual
newspaper picture is almost twice as big and shows that the rear
tire has the same faintly S-shaped tread blocks.

Quoted message said:

I'm still astonished, but beginning to suspect that they put treaded
tires on a replica just to try to convince me to buy treaded
passenger car tires.

Quoted message said:

The damned things look as wide and low as normal racing tires, so
now I wonder if they went to the trouble of making special fake
tires, so to speak--the wrong size for ordinary cars, and useless
for racing.

You are looking at a tire that was not raced and one which is used on
dirt tracks for sprint and oval track racers. The original tires used
in the race are not these.

[email hidden]

Cam said:

IRL never runs in the rain, those are photo-op tires. Racing slicks are
so soft that they would pick up a lot of ugly junk off the road and
they have more rolling resistance than the street tires you see.

They do? Why?

--
Benjamin Lewis

Although the moon is smaller than the earth, it is farther away.

Benjamin Lewis said:

Cam said:

IRL never runs in the rain, those are photo-op tires. Racing slicks are
so soft that they would pick up a lot of ugly junk off the road and
they have more rolling resistance than the street tires you see.

They do? Why?

More and softer rubber on the road.

Cam said:

Benjamin Lewis said:

Cam said:

IRL never runs in the rain, those are photo-op tires. Racing slicks are
so soft that they would pick up a lot of ugly junk off the road and
they have more rolling resistance than the street tires you see.

They do? Why?

More and softer rubber on the road.

I could see the material making a difference, but I think it's more
complicated than just the softness, and tread increases rolling
resistance.

--
Benjamin Lewis

Although the moon is smaller than the earth, it is farther away.

the v grooving went in during the early '70's? from independent
computer work then sold to goodyear. the v allows water to spin off
rapidly. racing slicks pick up garabage, garbage embeds in the tire. a
mess. what the picture probabbbley shows is a puncture proof demo tire
meant for rolling down a city street.
and he has such nice eyes!

Quoted message said:

I trustingly believed other posters that serious pavement
tires were slicks for traction in the automotive world, but
this picture makes me wonder if I'm missing something or
just misled:

http://www.chieftain.com/sports/1117608336/7

I also notice that the tread is V-shaped directional. The
actual newspaper picture is almost twice as big and shows
that the rear tire has the same faintly S-shaped tread
blocks.

Those are rain tires, which are often mounted on a race car when it's
going to be at public show events since they aren't as readily damaged
as the slicks.

The main reason for the presence of tread on such a tire is that it
increases the effective ground pressure, slightly raising the
hydroplaning speed. (Tread design has some effect on the issue as
well, but I'm pretty sure that the last literature I saw cited this as
the primary mechanism involved.) Although the same number of square
inches of tire casing are involved in ground contact (at a given
pressure) for both the slick and the treaded tire, the voids in the
tread cause the surface area in contact with the ground to be smaller
with the treaded tire, thus raising the PSI for the interface. ISTR
that Pirelli documented this back in the '70s, but it's probably been
done more than once.

Since the hydroplaning speed for a bicycle tire is already well beyond
the possible vehicle speed in any reasonable set of circumstances,
tread on a bike tire is irrelevant for this issue. The same is not
true for a race car.
--
Typoes are a feature, not a bug.
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